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Author Topic: We need to find out where Stevenbucks lives.  (Read 6228 times)
praxeologist
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March 04, 2011, 04:49:31 PM
 #21

I'm with kiba on this.

Why don't you make use of your new-found knowledge about Stevenbucks to see if this is enough to persuade him to repay you?

Probably more worth his time than actually dealing with the courts, but how anyone can be against him trying to get his stuff back is beyond me.

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kiba
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March 04, 2011, 04:50:18 PM
 #22

That I would take somebody to court to reclaim my property?

I eat up my loss and move on. You go sue somebody.

I can't do business with somebody who would sue in anger.

demonofelru
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March 04, 2011, 04:54:40 PM
 #23

Enjoy your idealism. I want my 40 BTC back. It's not my fault the state has a monopoly on civil force.

Idealism?  Huh

I am spooked by your actions.
That I would take somebody to court to reclaim my property?

I'm sorry but I highly doubt you will get anything, first I don't know where you live but unless you can show your state has jurisdiction over him you will most likely have to travel to Florida.  When you get there if he shows up you'll have a hell of a time convincing a judge that he owes you any money at all, along with how much.  If he doesn't show up you MIGHT get a default judgement.  Even if you somehow convince the judge that they are worth $1 each you get a judgement for $40 you pay a filing fee of maybe $25.  After you get the judgement good luck getting the $40 as well it could take a LONG time and money to find a way to get your money from the $40 judgement.

Names do not matter; however, if you insist...id...
ribuck
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March 04, 2011, 04:59:01 PM
 #24

Even in anarcho-capitalist societies there will be courts

Courts are good. In a Voluntarist society there will be courts. But courts backed by violence are bad. In a voluntarist society there will not be courts backed by violence.

If someone invokes the force of the state, they strengthen the power of the state by doing so, and they must not be surprised when that power is turned against them (or against Bitcoin) in the future.

If people focus their energy on dispute avoidance, the power of the state is diminished and the force of the state is less likely to be turned against them in the future.
kiba
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March 04, 2011, 05:03:40 PM
 #25

Even in anarcho-capitalist societies there will be courts

Courts are good. In a Voluntarist society there will be courts. But courts backed by violence are bad. In a voluntarist society there will not be courts backed by violence.

If someone invokes the force of the state, they strengthen the power of the state by doing so, and they must not be surprised when that power is turned against them (or against Bitcoin) in the future.

If people focus their energy on dispute avoidance, the power of the state is diminished and the force of the state is less likely to be turned against them in the future.

This is a matter of tradeoff. If you trust every joe, bob, and dick off the street and rely on the courts to compensate for your losses than there will be much violence in the world. On the other hand, if you're careful and eat your losses, than there will be little conflict in the world.


praxeologist
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March 04, 2011, 05:04:38 PM
 #26

Even in anarcho-capitalist societies there will be courts

Courts are good. In a Voluntarist society there will be courts. But courts backed by violence are bad. In a voluntarist society there will not be courts backed by violence.

If someone invokes the force of the state, they strengthen the power of the state by doing so, and they must not be surprised when that power is turned against them (or against Bitcoin) in the future.

If people focus their energy on dispute avoidance, the power of the state is diminished and the force of the state is less likely to be turned against them in the future.

All law rests on the use of coercion/force. What you are saying is pure Tolstoyan-pacifist fantasy. What matters is what sort of actions are essentially "human" or part of the process of societal cooperation and which are not, then how those which are not should be treated.

Whether he uses state courts or not is irrelevant. He does so in self-defense, since the state claims a monopoly over this area (the whole world in fact). I do urge him to only use state courts as a threat, but if one has to resort to it there is nothing wrong with it per se.

Anonymous
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March 04, 2011, 05:07:18 PM
 #27

I don't care about the state. I don't care where it might go. All I have control of is my own identity and property to the extent that I can afford. All I can afford is a crooked monopoly. I will accept what I can get.

I am not going to grow a neckbeard and make my life a pain in the ass because I will only use "free" means.

This thread:

kiba
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March 04, 2011, 05:11:27 PM
 #28

Well, your choice; my non-cooperation.

Anonymous
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March 04, 2011, 05:13:00 PM
 #29

Well, your choice; my non-cooperation.
I might lose some potential products and services from you in the future. However, I prefer to retain the tangible I have now.
demonofelru
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March 04, 2011, 05:13:59 PM
 #30

Although I feel for you how can you prove that
      
      Art, Greg  
      gregart@bellsouth.net
      1322 Briarwood Drive
      Rockledge, Florida 32955
      United States
      +1.3214035822      Fax --

Is the one you lent money I have no problem actively pursuing what is yours but this brings up another problem you could be suing a completely random person.  You would have to of coure prove that he is the person in question as well only chance you have is him not showing up.

Names do not matter; however, if you insist...id...
Anonymous
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March 04, 2011, 05:30:43 PM
 #31

I am just going to phone him. The court fee is $35.
demonofelru
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March 04, 2011, 05:34:43 PM
 #32

Well I wish you luck Atlas not meaning to be critical but I was in a similar situation where I was out about $2,500 I spent $800 more and nothing to show for it so be careful.

Names do not matter; however, if you insist...id...
Anonymous
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March 04, 2011, 05:36:18 PM
 #33

: (

Thank you.
bitdragon
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March 04, 2011, 05:42:55 PM
 #34

Is this out of principle or the real deal?
My feeling is that it is going to take up time to go file a small claim. for 40 bucks? You can make that in a few hours work or much much less and maybe provide some value in the process to someone.

Sounds like an absolute waste of time and resonates with anger? This calibrates to less than 175 on Hawkins Scale of Consciousness (http://www.amazon.com/Power-vs-Force-Determinants-Behavior/dp/1561709336).

In the long run, such a state of mind is destructive and will bring you more and more trouble.

One can try courage and empowerment and this will yield far greater results for you and everyone else.
http://www.your-emotional-wellness.com/PowerVsForce.html

You are free to do whatever you feel like though,

let us know how it goes and how much your time ends up being worth at the end.


Anonymous
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March 04, 2011, 05:48:28 PM
 #35

Is this out of principle or the real deal?
My feeling is that it is going to take up time to go file a small claim. for 40 bucks? You can make that in a few hours work or much much less and maybe provide some value in the process to someone.

Sounds like an absolute waste of time and resonates with anger? This calibrates to less than 175 on Hawkins Scale of Consciousness (http://www.amazon.com/Power-vs-Force-Determinants-Behavior/dp/1561709336).

In the long run, such a state of mind is destructive and will bring you more and more trouble.

One can try courage and empowerment and this will yield far greater results for you and everyone else.
http://www.your-emotional-wellness.com/PowerVsForce.html

You are free to do whatever you feel like though,

let us know how it goes and how much your time ends up being worth at the end.


I am going to read this book but I am skeptical about organisms changing the supposed "energy" levels around them. Sounds like potential pseudo-science to me.
Garrett Burgwardt
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March 04, 2011, 06:06:04 PM
 #36

Courts are always backed by violence, though not explicitly. In the customary Somali law, the Xeer, you are backed by a group of people, usually familial but not necessarily. This group of people insures you and promises to help that person out. If you break the law, it is almost always a fine you must pay. Your family group will pay the fine for you, if you can't pay yourself. If you abuse this, they can kick you out and you are uninsured. This means that nobody will come to your aid, and thus are essentially an outlaw, or someone not protected by the laws, and for your own safety it is a good idea to leave.
Anonymous
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March 04, 2011, 06:15:24 PM
 #37

I'm a political nihilist so therefore I don't really have any preference. Things will get better as we allow our current systems to fail. I am not going to let my subjective preferences or anybody elses eliminate the practical.
kiba
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March 04, 2011, 06:21:13 PM
 #38

I'm a political nihilist so therefore I don't really have any preference. Things will get better as we allow our current systems to fail. I am not going to let my subjective preferences or anybody elses eliminate the practical.

My actions are necessary practical.

Anonymous
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March 04, 2011, 06:41:58 PM
 #39

I'm a political nihilist so therefore I don't really have any preference. Things will get better as we allow our current systems to fail. I am not going to let my subjective preferences or anybody elses eliminate the practical.

My actions are necessary practical.
You think you can change things. You think you can directly change people through your boycott.
JohnDoe
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March 04, 2011, 06:55:30 PM
 #40

I think Atlas is the one we should be making an example of. No sane person would lend money to a random stranger, a gambling addict no less.

I, for one, hope you don't get your 40 BTC back and learn a valuable lesson instead.
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