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Author Topic: Does Wells Fargo see the writing on the wall?  (Read 2087 times)
gortonc (OP)
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January 14, 2014, 10:36:46 PM
 #1

What do you think; does this portend a preemptive strike by Wells Fargo, or a pivot?

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/cf57a59c-7d39-11e3-a579-00144feabdc0.html
SirBitsalot
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January 14, 2014, 10:38:14 PM
 #2

It's up the men in suits.
Kungfucheez
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January 14, 2014, 10:43:56 PM
 #3

You mean the news article we have to register at a website to see?
SirBitsalot
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January 14, 2014, 10:45:20 PM
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You mean the news article we have to register at a website to see?
Lol I just noticed that! -_- c'mon OP
gortonc (OP)
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January 14, 2014, 10:51:51 PM
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You mean the news article we have to register at a website to see?
Lol I just noticed that! -_- c'mon OP

Hmm... to access the site I just had to answer an innocuous survey question??!! I never registered.

Here is the text:

 Stephen Foley and Camilla Hall in New York

Wells Fargo has convened a group of finance executives, virtual currency experts and representatives from the US government to discuss “rules of engagement” with Bitcoin, amid concern about the money laundering risks of the new currency.

The bank, the largest in the US by market value, has emerged as one major financial institution interested in dealing with a potential new Bitcoin economy. But regulatory uncertainty has deterred banks from offering services to virtual currency start-ups.

Wells’ anti-money laundering chief, Jim Richards, has launched a group to examine how it might safely offer Bitcoin-related services or banking arrangements to virtual currency entrepreneurs, according to people familiar with the initiative.

Wells chief executive John Stumpf said it was the bank’s practice to examine financial innovations.

“We have made enormous investments as a company and as an industry in a payments system that is secure, and we need to be sure we are up to speed with what other things are going on and their risks and rewards,” he said.

“We want to make sure we understand what it is, what it does and what it does not . . . . The world is changing and will continue to change. Whether Bitcoin will be a big part of that, who knows?”

The difficulty in persuading financial institutions to offer bank accounts has become one of the biggest difficulties facing Bitcoin entrepreneurs in the US.

Wells’ public-private group, comprising more than a dozen members, was scheduled to meet in San Francisco on Tuesday to debate the security issues surrounding banking and Bitcoin.

One possible aim would be to produce a set of anti-money laundering principles for established financial institutions to follow when dealing with virtual currency start-ups, according to a person familiar with the event.

Last year, US authorities seized a Wells Fargo bank account belonging to Mark Karpeles, founder of Bitcoin exchange Mt.Gox, and alleged that he failed to declare he was operating a money transmitting business when he opened the account in May 2011.

Earlier in 2013, the US Treasury declared that Bitcoin businesses must register as money services businesses and impose anti-money laundering checks on customers, just like traditional banks. Most of the 50 US states also impose their own regulations on money services businesses.
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Increased trading in the decentralised virtual currency has begun to attract the attention of regulators

Banks worried that they would be held responsible for any money laundering breaches at Bitcoin companies that failed to meet these stringent standards and before each of the states had clarified their own approaches to Bitcoin.

Last month the Congressional Research Service circulated a report on virtual currencies for policy makers, setting out a list of areas where the legal and regulatory approach to Bitcoin remains unclear. These range from national tax issues, because Bitcoin profits are not recorded within the traditional financial system, to concerns among individual states.

“Bitcoin raises a number of legal and regulatory concerns including its potential for facilitating money laundering, its treatment under federal securities law, and its status in the regulation of foreign exchange trading,” the report said.

And it added: “State authorities moving in the direction of regulating virtual currencies are sometimes discovering problems in applying existing laws to the technological currencies.”
SirBitsalot
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January 14, 2014, 11:01:05 PM
 #6

Basically what I read is that Wells Fargo doesn't like Bitcoins because nobody can control them. IMO that's the exact reason why people should LOVE Bitcoins... keep the government out of it! Everything they touch turns to ashes
LiteCoinGuy
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January 14, 2014, 11:06:21 PM
 #7

what? this is huge! one of the biggest banks wants to make bitcoin more mainstream and work with it  Shocked !



"The bank, the largest in the US by market value, has emerged as one major financial institution interested in dealing with a potential new Bitcoin economy. But regulatory uncertainty has deterred banks from offering services to virtual currency start-ups."

Wells chief executive John Stumpf said it was the bank’s practice to examine financial innovations.

“We have made enormous investments as a company and as an industry in a payments system that is secure, and we need to be sure we are up to speed with what other things are going on and their risks and rewards,” he said.

“We want to make sure we understand what it is, what it does and what it does not . . . . The world is changing and will continue to change. Whether Bitcoin will be a big part of that, who knows?”



info: Wells Fargo is the second largest bank in deposits, home mortgage servicing, and debit cards.

AmericanBit
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January 14, 2014, 11:08:50 PM
 #8

You mean the news article we have to register at a website to see?
Lol I just noticed that! -_- c'mon OP

I would of paid a satoshi to read that article over giving them my email address...
SirBitsalot
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January 14, 2014, 11:13:54 PM
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You mean the news article we have to register at a website to see?
Lol I just noticed that! -_- c'mon OP

Id would of paid a satoshi to read that article over giving them my email address...
They're notorious for being huge spams, so I heard.
slowlyslowly
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January 14, 2014, 11:22:29 PM
 #10

I see this as all positive for bitcoin. It is only be the men in suits who might be able to find a way that keeps the regulators happy ( over money laundering etc) and also makes them some margin somewhere. (they might not be able to make fees directly off transactions with bitcoin but I see the men in suits getting acceptance for a "special, new  bank account type ". The fees to open and hold such an account will be "expensive' ie will approach the level of fees visa/mastercard charge etc. ie they will make bitocin a peer to peer visa equivalent. I dont like fees but and happy for some level if bitcoin gets made legit by regulators as I still see so many other benefits to using bitcoin that I will continue with it 
Ragnarly
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January 14, 2014, 11:25:39 PM
 #11

Wells Fargo is researching how they can do business using Bitcoin.
Carlton Banks
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January 15, 2014, 12:24:17 AM
 #12

Banks can exploit the market for people that don't want the risk of securing large BTC holdings themselves. Big investment sorts, and maybe rich middle class people also. Wells Fargo could easily fill those type of shoes.

And they can convincingly set their own high standards of accountability. The new HD wallets will let them define which chain of addresses they will and will not use with each customer. They can't do a great deal better than that, seeing as they can't change how the protocol works.

But I wonder if it might be too tempting to leverage the BTC they have on deposit to patch up their sketchy balance sheet. All the banks have bad debts, and they're not writing them off yet for one pretty big reason: it would bankrupt them. The debts of all these banks are bigger than their (still very considerable) assets. The trouble is the debts are vast in comparison. So, they're using dodgy accounting practices to make-believe they are still solvent; either over-estimate the value of the debts, or just sequester them off-balance sheet (i.e. pretend they'll actually be paid off by who owes them, or pretend they don't exist)

Putting your BTC into a big bank might be about as secure as Input.io or MyBitcoin.com in the long run. You might end up saving the shareholders and the bondholders investments, and losing yours to some smallprint legal clause.

Vires in numeris
BittBurger
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January 15, 2014, 02:02:59 AM
 #13

Bitcoin ws created to bypass the corrupt banking system.

Not be assimilated into it.

Naturally the arrogant american business people are going to try and find ways to make money off it while taking a large rod up their ass willingly to regulators.  Begging for their approval and asking how Bitcoin can be molded to comply with the corrupt banking system.  But how that is going to jive with the unregulated nature of Bitcoin .... I don't know.

This quote in particular made me want to vomit:

"“Wells Fargo could remake the Bitcoin business in the US overnight,” said Ryan Singer. “They have the expertise, knowledge and clout necessary to deal with concerns about AML compliance and banking risk. If they are truly getting close to being ready to experiment with bitcoin, then every bitcoin startup should be lining up to learn more."

Ryan Singer is, in my opinion, an anathema to the Bitcoin community.  This guy needs to be condemned for his nonsense.  This is not some new technology that Wells Fargo can "introduce" to the world, and "remake".  This is a technology that is intended to bypass their corrupt control of peoples money, and make their entire business model obsolete.  It truly requires some arrogance for them to not even see that yet.  I also love that the head of money laundering prevention called the meeting. Wells Fargo got caught red handed laundering hundreds of millions of dollars not too long ago..... Spare me this "play nice assimilation with regulators" bullshit.  Please.

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knight22
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January 15, 2014, 02:13:15 AM
 #14

Banks will get involved one way or the other, it's just a matter of time. It will probably be the ultimate test for bitcoin as we know it today.

gortonc (OP)
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January 15, 2014, 02:15:12 AM
 #15

I agree. IMHO this looks like preparation for a preemptive strike against Bitcoin. Things is about to get interesting.
gortonc (OP)
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January 15, 2014, 03:06:13 AM
 #16

Seems Reuters has picked up the story.  No need to register here Wink:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/01/14/us-wellsfargo-bitcoin-idUSBREA0D1LL20140114
BTCisthefuture
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January 15, 2014, 03:11:08 AM
 #17

Coindesk also has an article on it, no need to register as well.

http://www.coindesk.com/wells-fargo-summit-bitcoin/

Hourly bitcoin faucet with a gambling twist !  http://freebitco.in/?r=106463
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January 15, 2014, 03:50:38 AM
 #18

These banks and rich people they have to get their dirty hands on everything. They want to try to push bitcoin out with something they mandate is more "legitimate"
 

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January 15, 2014, 04:25:26 AM
 #19

Wells Fargo pump and dump in 3....2....
BitcoinBarrel
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January 15, 2014, 04:26:19 AM
 #20

I think the whole idea of money laundering is a bit extreme to be honest..

The definition being:

Quote
concealing the source of illegally gotten money

Which can be accomplished no matter what the medium of exchange whether cash, coins, gold, cars, etc.

If anything, Bitcoin is more favorable to the legal system for the very fact that when they do catch criminals and gain access to their computers they can easily trace their wallets and other purchases via the Blockchain.




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