HashCoins - Blockchain technologies that work

[Bicknellski]

Remember the names of the people pushing yet another over priced product, for a fee, and it fails to be delivered on time to any specification mentioned by HashCoins you make sure to not believe it the next time the same people spin some other dubious fabricator.

What amount of money are you going to spend on something that can't even break even? The denial in this thread is palatable. Avoid this product and company until they produce a unit that is reviewed by someone other than Adam Allcock preferable someone that doesn't buy and sell product ratings.

[1714974202]

1714974202

[1714974202]

1714974202

[1714974202]

1714974202

[1714974202]

1714974202

[Hakkane]

Remember the names of the people pushing yet another over priced product, for a fee, and it fails to be delivered on time to any specification mentioned by HashCoins you make sure to not believe it the next time the same people spin some other dubious fabricator.

What amount of money are you going to spend on something that can't even break even? The denial in this thread is palatable. Avoid this product and company until they produce a unit that is reviewed by someone other than Adam Allcock preferable someone that doesn't buy and sell product ratings.

If you are going to make such bold statements suggesting I'm receiving some kind of fee or that the miners are overpriced, I suggest you support that statements with proofs or detailed arguments. Otherwise people will think you are just trolling or that you have a personal interest different than helping people.

Maybe you are one of those fortunate people with access to free electricity. The rest of us have to look at efficiencies if we want to play this game. Particularly, a single Triton board pointed to a pool like Clevermining will generate 0.0054 BTC per day. Transformed to the world of bitcoin miners, is like having a 510 Gh/s miner that consumes 144 Watts. In other words, is like having a 0.28 W/Ghs miner. Do you still think they are overpriced?

[jadefalke]

Remember the names of the people pushing yet another over priced product, for a fee, and it fails to be delivered on time to any specification mentioned by HashCoins you make sure to not believe it the next time the same people spin some other dubious fabricator.

What amount of money are you going to spend on something that can't even break even? The denial in this thread is palatable. Avoid this product and company until they produce a unit that is reviewed by someone other than Adam Allcock preferable someone that doesn't buy and sell product ratings.

If you are going to make such bold statements suggesting I'm receiving some kind of fee or that the miners are overpriced, I suggest you support that statements with proofs or detailed arguments. Otherwise people will think you are just trolling or that you have a personal interest different than helping people.

Maybe you are one of those fortunate people with access to free electricity. The rest of us have to look at efficiencies if we want to play this game. Particularly, a single Triton board pointed to a pool like Clevermining will generate 0.0054 BTC per day. Transformed to the world of bitcoin miners, is like having a 510 Gh/s miner that consumes 144 Watts. In other words, is like having a 0.28 W/Ghs miner. Do you still think they are overpriced?

you miss one important point: that 510 Gh/s 0.28W Miner does not exist. If it would exist it would lead the Industry Chart. almost ALL Company's fail to achieve
the w/ghs  the projected. Some of them dramatically. Also long as we don't see them IRL i vote that it is another Unicorn.

[notlist3d]

Remember the names of the people pushing yet another over priced product, for a fee, and it fails to be delivered on time to any specification mentioned by HashCoins you make sure to not believe it the next time the same people spin some other dubious fabricator.

What amount of money are you going to spend on something that can't even break even? The denial in this thread is palatable. Avoid this product and company until they produce a unit that is reviewed by someone other than Adam Allcock preferable someone that doesn't buy and sell product ratings.

If you are going to make such bold statements suggesting I'm receiving some kind of fee or that the miners are overpriced, I suggest you support that statements with proofs or detailed arguments. Otherwise people will think you are just trolling or that you have a personal interest different than helping people.

Maybe you are one of those fortunate people with access to free electricity. The rest of us have to look at efficiencies if we want to play this game. Particularly, a single Triton board pointed to a pool like Clevermining will generate 0.0054 BTC per day. Transformed to the world of bitcoin miners, is like having a 510 Gh/s miner that consumes 144 Watts. In other words, is like having a 0.28 W/Ghs miner. Do you still think they are overpriced?

you miss one important point: that 510 Gh/s 0.28W Miner does not exist. If it would exist it would lead the Industry Chart. almost ALL Company's fail to achieve
the w/ghs  the projected. Some of them dramatically. Also long as we don't see them IRL i vote that it is another Unicorn.

They are yet to show a Zeus which isn't that impressive, but I don't think they have shown a single one.  Only one they have sold in BTC has A1 level efficiency which is not good.

It is also interesting how many low level activity people they get to by orders.  With all orders I've seen being to low level accounts, makes me wonder ... just is a odd thing to keep happening.

Jade is spot on with the chip.  They should be shipping any day with Q1 ending.  But no company has this chip currently.  Some are working on it very hard, but I think other bigger companies will have the chips needed done far before hashcoin would ever have their own.

[Hakkane]

you miss one important point: that 510 Gh/s 0.28W Miner does not exist. If it would exist it would lead the Industry Chart. almost ALL Company's fail to achieve
the w/ghs  the projected. Some of them dramatically. Also long as we don't see them IRL i vote that it is another Unicorn.

And then we go to another very interesting debate: Do you really think that we, the private miners, will have access to the next-gen ASICs of the big manufacturers?

That ASICs exist, I don't have any doubt. Companies as KNC and Bitfury have develop new efficient asics. Any news about the release of a final consumer miner? No, in spite they announce in their webpage their brand new technologies. These companies nowadays run their business raising millions of dollars from private capital ventures. Those are long-term investments, so I guess their plan is to produce miners to mine with them privately. They no longer need purchases to be viable. And what about other companies as Bitmain? It has been a long time since they started selling the S5, and what is their brand new miner? A revised S4, even less efficient than the S5. I'm sure they have more efficient asics developed and mining for themselves, but as long as there is a demand of 0.5 W/Ghs we won't touch them.

So I think we will only see next-gen miners from small or medium companies that need preorders and actual purchases to have balanced bills. Companies as Sfards, Hashcoins and others. Both if they develop their own technologies or license technologies from others.

Besides this interesting debate, due to my particular mining requirements (home miner in a small apartment, mid-priced electricity) the Triton is the only solution suitable for me. And the Avalon 4.1, maybe. I took a risk buying them, all of us take our own risks, but after studying the company, I think they will honor my purchase.

[Biffa]

OK lets take the Apollo miner to start with. Here is something that was basically a couple of hashfast boards strapped into a PC case. Not hard, should be able to sell loads right?

Check this forum, its got some of the most prolific home and small business community miners around, and how many enthusiasts got an Apollo? None, zilch, nada.

OK check ebay, check ebay history, see how many Apollo miners got sold there once they became inefficient, can you guess? Not one. Check the for sale forum here, none there either.

The only person who got an Apollo that I trust recieved it was Dogie, but what I don't believe is that there is anyone else other than a handful of shills and puppet accounts that got anything SHA256 related.

Add to that the chip specs for their high end miners are fantasy land fabrications and None of it adds up.

What does add up is that every person who says they got a rebadged scrypt miner from these guys which is most people who say they got one, or cloud mining (*cough* ponzi *cough*) in lieu of hardware gives hope to suckers, and they don't need many suckers to keep going and making money, just a couple a month who give them a few grand.

Thats why we advise caution and not sending money to some company that promises something thats too good to be true, because it damages the reputation of other bitcoin hardware companies that and the very ecosystem itself. We aren't doing this because we have a grudge or a vendetta against HashCoins, ffs, I'd be first in line as would most of the experienced people on this board, if there really was a machine with the specs of a Uranus actually out there and running.

[Hakkane]

They are yet to show a Zeus which isn't that impressive, but I don't think they have shown a single one.  Only one they have sold in BTC has A1 level efficiency which is not good.

It is also interesting how many low level activity people they get to by orders.  With all orders I've seen being to low level accounts, makes me wonder ... just is a odd thing to keep happening.

Jade is spot on with the chip.  They should be shipping any day with Q1 ending.  But no company has this chip currently.  Some are working on it very hard, but I think other bigger companies will have the chips needed done far before hashcoin would ever have their own.

I admit the issue of the Zeus concerns me as well. Maybe it is true they never developed it, maybe they sold it mainly to non-users of this forum. I don't imagine owners of Chinese data centers (or Russians, as it looks like it is one of their target markets) posting their experience here. But the rest of the data looks correct and legit: more than one year selling gear, they participate in conferences, no threads of angry users, 2 testing units sent to Dogie, realistic price labels on their miners... But in the other hand a lot of noise, a lot of concerned people that have not purchased miners from them. Sometimes I think in this forum people participate in a race to be the first to make a scam accusation on every new thing that moves around.

Please, don't be confused, I don't pretend to be an attorney of the company. I'm just indicating the reasons that took me to buy hardware from them, as I have been accused of taking fees from the company. If I'm finally scammed (I hope not) I will be the first to create a thread titled "Hashcoins have ***ed us!!!". At this point I only pretend to probe that I am a final consumer as the rest. I don't have a Hero condition as many here, but I have a good posting history to support me. And if I can add more proofs I would be happy to do it (don't ask me for my Social Security Number or my wallet private keys, of course   )

EDIT--> To Biffa: May your concerns be appropriate. May my reasons be appropriate as well. The good news is that we will know relatively soon how the company works  . Everybody take their risks when buying a miner, even if you buy from Antminer you don't know if Bitcoin value will drop a 90% the following day. Each one takes different degrees of risk depending on how much money they can risk or the particular needs of the user. In my case, I live in a tiny apartment: I can't manage a big and noisy miner producing tons of heat. I can't host a mining operation with a mess of cables from the PSU as I have frequent visits of friends and landlords and I don't like questions about it. $2200 in 4 boards is a bunch of money, but I can afford it and if I loose it, my life will not be compromised

[notlist3d]

They are yet to show a Zeus which isn't that impressive, but I don't think they have shown a single one.  Only one they have sold in BTC has A1 level efficiency which is not good.

It is also interesting how many low level activity people they get to by orders.  With all orders I've seen being to low level accounts, makes me wonder ... just is a odd thing to keep happening.

Jade is spot on with the chip.  They should be shipping any day with Q1 ending.  But no company has this chip currently.  Some are working on it very hard, but I think other bigger companies will have the chips needed done far before hashcoin would ever have their own.

I admit the issue of the Zeus concerns me as well. Maybe it is true they never developed it, maybe they sold it mainly to non-users of this forum. I don't imagine owners of Chinese data centers (or Russians, as it looks like it is one of their target markets) posting their experience here. But the rest of the data looks correct and legit: more than one year selling gear, they participate in conferences, no threads of angry users, 2 testing units sent to Dogie, realistic price labels on their miners... But in the other hand a lot of noise, a lot of concerned people that have not purchased miners from them. Sometimes I think in this forum people participate in a race to be the first to make a scam accusation on every new thing that moves around.

Please, don't be confused, I don't pretend to be an attorney of the company. I'm just indicating the reasons that took me to buy hardware from them, as I have been accused of taking fees from the company. If I'm finally scammed (I hope not) I will be the first to create a thread titled "Hashcoins have ***ed us!!!". At this point I only pretend to probe that I am a final consumer as the rest. I don't have a Hero condition as many here, but I have a good posting history to support me. And if I can add more proofs I would be happy to do it (don't ask me for my Social Security Number or my wallet private keys, of course   )

I will bet there is not a big data center of Zeus macines.... this is a silly thing to say.  Zeus was never sent to dogie, I believe they said they were going to do a blade or something and just never happened (please correct me if I'm wrong Dogie). 

If they shipped them a picture would have ended up here or somewhere else.  There simply just is not a Zeus out there.   If you find the data center of them please take a picture for us.

The two miners they shipped they bought chips.   They will not be the first one with next gen chips.  On Ares it appears to be slapped with their sticker on another unit.  Go back and see they had to get chips blacked out so we could not see where they got the chips from.

[TheRealSteve]

Sometimes I think in this forum people participate in a race to be the first to make a scam accusation on every new thing that moves around.

I have outlined in the past how a company can prevent being labeled a scam - unfortunately, 'scam' is the default position a company will find themselves in because so many companies turned out to be thus.  Even if they're not outright take-the-money-and-run, they'll have been take-the-money-and-delay-delay-delay-excuse-delay-promises-delay-excuse-underdeliver-point-to-terms 'scams'.  Sure, that's technically not 'scamming', but it's far from being honest.

And as far as that goes - HashCoins unfortunately have everything going against them, and they're hardly new.  Whether it's posting renders instead of actual images, stating one date but delivering a long time after, claiming certain hash rates with cgminer screenshots that were proven to be altered, slapping badges on existing miners and selling them at a premium, sending review units but with strings attached, selling miners ostensibly based on existing boards and only wanting to explain the difference if you pay $100,000, copy/pasting the KnC terms and conditions and so forth and so on.

Yes, of course, I don't blame them for not wanting to interact on this forum either with everybody just yelling 'scam' - but they really shouldn't be expecting any different; while at the same time, they can remedy it with just a few posts.  If they're unwilling, so be it.  It's when they're unable that people will just continue thinking something's amiss.

I'm sure they have something - just what that something is, whether if lives up to the claims, and whether you'll actually get it in a reasonable amount of time, remains to be seen.

[dogie]

Check this forum, its got some of the most prolific home and small business community miners around, and how many enthusiasts got an Apollo? None, zilch, nada.

There were a few independent reports on the original batch of Apollos which was a looooooong time ago. Their second batch (the one I reviewed) was much later.

I will bet there is not a big data center of Zeus macines.... this is a silly thing to say.  Zeus was never sent to dogie, I believe they said they were going to do a blade or something and just never happened (please correct me if I'm wrong Dogie).

I never received anything, no.

[Hakkane]

OK lets take the Apollo miner to start with. Here is something that was basically a couple of hashfast boards strapped into a PC case. Not hard, should be able to sell loads right?

Check this forum, its got some of the most prolific home and small business community miners around, and how many enthusiasts got an Apollo? None, zilch, nada.

OK check ebay, check ebay history, see how many Apollo miners got sold there once they became inefficient, can you guess? Not one. Check the for sale forum here, none there either.

I will bet there is not a big data center of Zeus macines.... this is a silly thing to say.  Zeus was never sent to dogie, I believe they said they were going to do a blade or something and just never happened (please correct me if I'm wrong Dogie).  

If they shipped them a picture would have ended up here or somewhere else.  There simply just is not a Zeus out there.   If you find the data center of them please take a picture for us.

That it is not completely true. Some examples I found on a simple Google search:

- https://bitcointa.lk/threads/hashfast-0-7-th-hashcoins-apollo-miner-for-sale.337630/ Someone selling his Apollo miner on a different forum, overpiced, but selling it.

- http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/HashCoins-Zeus-3-5-TH-s_50016105616.html A malaysian distributor reselling Zeus in batches of 50 on Alibaba

- http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/HashCoins-Zeus-3-5-TH-s_50015407806.html . An australian distributor reselling Zeus in batches of 3 on Alibaba

Can they be scams as well? They can, but as Alibaba acts as an escrow I see it pointless. Are they using mining chips from other companies? No doubt, they are probably simple OEMs, but actually I don't care as long as they sell a functional miner. Are out there many previous gen miners? Clearly not: maybe they manufactured few units, or sold them in bulk to few costumers, or simply they werent able to sell them due to high prices and they are using the stock for the cloud mining facility apparently they own.

Is everything a big and long term elaborated scam? It may be as you are the experts and me the poor scammed costumer. Or maybe not and I will recieve my orders. At this point we don't know: there are points that suggest they are legit, and points that suggest they have no real activity. At this point we can't discern it, so maybe is pointless keep discussing it. So by my side, I will just wait and update in this thread any news about my orders. But...

unfortunately, 'scam' is the default position a company will find themselves in because so many companies turned out to be thus.  

... I simply reject that idea, I don't aprove that. Personally I find it destructive for the community. Do we have to be cautionous? Of course! But accusing of scam any new company of user just because they arrive with something new favors only the stablished companies. In the time I've been here (28 posts) I have been already acussed 2 times. one in this thread and other one just because I wrote a guide of the Prospero X-1.5 miner.

Following that principle, I should mistrust users that accuse companies of scam, because they can be scamming in turn the company. I should mistrust reviews and opinions because they can be attemps to manipulate new users. I should mistrust the whole Bitcoin Talk because it could be an elaborated manipulation to stablish a duopoly Bitmain-Spoondolies. Very destructive attitude

[notlist3d]

I will bet there is not a big data center of Zeus macines.... this is a silly thing to say.  Zeus was never sent to dogie, I believe they said they were going to do a blade or something and just never happened (please correct me if I'm wrong Dogie).  

If they shipped them a picture would have ended up here or somewhere else.  There simply just is not a Zeus out there.   If you find the data center of them please take a picture for us.

That it is not completely true. Some examples I found on a simple Google search:

- https://bitcointa.lk/threads/hashfast-0-7-th-hashcoins-apollo-miner-for-sale.337630/ Someone selling his Apollo miner on a different forum, overpiced, but selling it.

- http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/HashCoins-Zeus-3-5-TH-s_50016105616.html A malaysian distributor reselling Zeus in batches of 50 on Alibaba

- http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/HashCoins-Zeus-3-5-TH-s_50015407806.html . An australian distributor reselling Zeus in batches of 3 on Alibaba

Can they be scams as well? They can, but as Alibaba acts as an escrow I see it pointless. Are they using mining chips from other companies? No doubt, they are probably simple OEMs, but actually I don't care as long as they sell a functional miner. Are out there many previous gen miners? Clearly not: maybe they manufactured few units, or sold them in bulk to few costumers, or simply they werent able to sell them due to high prices and they are using the stock for the cloud mining facility apparently they own.

Is everything a big and long term elaborated scam? It may be as you are the experts and me the poor scammed costumer. Or maybe not and I will recieve my orders. At this point we don't know: there are points that suggest they are legit, and points that suggest they have no real activity. At this point we can't discern it, so maybe is pointless keep discussing it. So by my side, I will just wait and update in this thread any news about my orders. But...

Can they be scams?  Yes... they are still using stock photos.  Can you find pictures of a Zeus that is not stock photo? Find one out in wild.... I have not seen one.  I would love to be wrong and see it.

I don't see why you are so angry over questions being asked.  Instead of a page long answer find pictures of Zeus that is not stock.  Or better yet find one single review Zeus.  Just one review that shows it working and I will say I was wrong.

[Bicknellski]

"The lady doth protest too much, methinks" - Queen Gertrude.

I don't see why you are so angry over questions being asked.  

Again bottom line. Overpriced. No working models to be had and independently verified. Pre-orders. Ouch.

Avoid this company save yourself the hassle there are actual units shipping for less currently available. Insanity prevails in some minds I guess.

These repeated attempts at shill marketing in the hardware section are really easy to pick out compared to 'honest' fabricator threads especially now NOTHING can ROI.

http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-shill-marketing.htm

Employees engaged in a shill marketing setup register one or more accounts on an Internet service, a message board for example. Usually one of the shill marketers will ask an innocent sounding question. "I was interested in buying product X. Has anyone heard anything about it?" This is the classic setup.

Another user, possibly the same person using a different account login, will answer the first question by praising the product. "Oh yeah, I started using product X a month ago and I love it. I use it all the time. It's the best product in the whole world!"

Variants on these forums are the

"HELP ME I AM NEWB AND MY BFL/TECHNOBIT/ANTMINER/AVALON UNIT AIN'T WORKING"

then Miracle of Miracles the unit is fixed with a snip of code, firmware update or "Did you try restarting it?"

or you as you see here in this thread 2 times now

"I AM A NEWB I JUST ORDERED THE GREAT NEW ADVANCED HASCOINS BOX O' FANS."

You are not fooling anyone guys not just in this thread but a significant number of hardware threads this is going on right now.

No one is buying these pre-orders and giving this person the benefit of the doubt is not how it works given the YEARS of BULLSHIT that have passed through these forums. Nope no one is buying your pre-order no matter how many pretty pictures you post and you'd better have something to review and the right people to review it or at the very least using a REAL NAME and not be an anon with 30 posts.

Just go buy a hardly used BCT account and try again you won't be the first person to try that tact.

[TheRealSteve]

... I simply reject that idea, I don't aprove that. Personally I find it destructive for the community. Do we have to be cautionous? Of course! But accusing of scam any new company of user just because they arrive with something new favors only the stablished companies. [...] Very destructive attitude

Perhaps so, but a realistic one.

Anybody can come on here (or the web at large) and say "We've got a great new product!  Here's the specs, here's a nice render, and here's our site where you can order it - using anything but covered payment methods - for the equivalent of a good chunk of money, and we'll get it to you!*
*at some point in the future (there may be delays for which we can't be held accountable, please see our terms)"

Should the default position at that point be to presume that it is a legit company with a legit offering, and not comment on it unless actually having placed an order?  Or should the position be that they should put forth more detailed information and - if push comes to shove - send out a unit for review (doesn't have to be a freebie - I've never liked that approach - just have it mailed back ... and presumably without NDAs attached) if they want to be taken seriously?

To tie that into your Prospero X1.5 post - imagine if your post only read "I received one, it's working fine".. how much weight would you lend to such a post, compared to the one you made?
( as an aside, I didn't see anybody accusing you of being a scammer in there - maybe the one that complained about the title and the pointing to BA's site came accross as such, but that poster didn't read your post very clearly.  Maybe you're referring to a PM, though. )

Just to clarify, my default stance isn't "they're a scam until proven otherwise" - mine is that they should at least provide information that they easily can.  In the case of HashCoins / Uranus, if they have a unit in hand by now, taking a few more pictures doesn't hurt; it doesn't necessarily prove anything, but you have to wonder why they won't take such minimal steps.  But there's plenty of others who do take that stance, and thus a company will find themselves labeled a scam.  Is that unjustified?   Maybe so - but, again, easily addressed.

Of course if they don't particularly care what people say, as long as their customers are happy, fair enough - but then this thread should be a non-issue to both them and said customers.

[Biffa]

I will bet there is not a big data center of Zeus macines.... this is a silly thing to say.  Zeus was never sent to dogie, I believe they said they were going to do a blade or something and just never happened (please correct me if I'm wrong Dogie).  

If they shipped them a picture would have ended up here or somewhere else.  There simply just is not a Zeus out there.   If you find the data center of them please take a picture for us.

That it is not completely true. Some examples I found on a simple Google search:

- https://bitcointa.lk/threads/hashfast-0-7-th-hashcoins-apollo-miner-for-sale.337630/ Someone selling his Apollo miner on a different forum, overpiced, but selling it.

- http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/HashCoins-Zeus-3-5-TH-s_50016105616.html A malaysian distributor reselling Zeus in batches of 50 on Alibaba

- http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/HashCoins-Zeus-3-5-TH-s_50015407806.html . An australian distributor reselling Zeus in batches of 3 on Alibaba

Can they be scams as well? They can, but as Alibaba acts as an escrow I see it pointless. Are they using mining chips from other companies? No doubt, they are probably simple OEMs, but actually I don't care as long as they sell a functional miner. Are out there many previous gen miners? Clearly not: maybe they manufactured few units, or sold them in bulk to few costumers, or simply they werent able to sell them due to high prices and they are using the stock for the cloud mining facility apparently they own.

Is everything a big and long term elaborated scam? It may be as you are the experts and me the poor scammed costumer. Or maybe not and I will recieve my orders. At this point we don't know: there are points that suggest they are legit, and points that suggest they have no real activity. At this point we can't discern it, so maybe is pointless keep discussing it. So by my side, I will just wait and update in this thread any news about my orders. But...

LOL, use your logic, the Zeus was a miner with 5 Hashfast boards in it, boards and chips from a company that went bankrupt over 6 months ago, a company that couldn't even supply its own customers let alone a third party. You think there are 1000's of Zeus miners sitting in a warehouse waiting to be sold by two unverified scam accounts on alibaba? LOL sorry but this is so "scraping the bottom of the barrel" that I can't even believe you tried it. Either you are just blindly trying to justify throwing away your money, or you are part of the problem.

[TheRealSteve]

a miner with 5 Hashfast boards in it, boards and chips from a company that went bankrupt over 6 months ago, a company that couldn't even supply its own customers let alone a third party. You think there are 1000's of Zeus miners sitting in a warehouse waiting to be sold by two unverified scam accounts on alibaba?

In defense of that proposal - keep in mind that HashFast liquidated assets (or still are, no idea).
Their boards (well, their chips with maybe updated boards) ended up being used in e.g. Pepper Mining's Habanero (you can poke at MrTeal on that ) and Bitcrane's T-110 and T-720.
From bankruptcy documents, they certainly claimed to have plenty of assets left over to build miners; don't recall if "1000's" applies, though

[Hakkane]

I don't see why you are so angry over questions being asked.  Instead of a page long answer find pictures of Zeus that is not stock.  Or better yet find one single review Zeus.  Just one review that shows it working and I will say I was wrong.

No, I'm not angry at all, don't worry! We are just debating But this debate it's driving me to act as the attorney of Hashcoins, and that is far far away from my intentions. Hashcoins will have to prove they are legit, and in my case this will happen once I recieve the boards I ordered. If I recieve them I will be very happy, I'll share pics here, I'll write a nice review and even I will order more boards. If not, I will publish that here, I will create a thread "Hashcoins  have ****ed us!!!!" and I will make good use of the European Union laws of costumers protection.

But yes, there is one that have made me angry:

Bicknellski, your behaviour is far beyond the acceptable even for a forum, where you can hide behind your nickname to defame people. I have been using arguments, including a proof of purchase, even offering to include more proofs of identity, relating to my posting history where you can find long and high quality threads (maybe the hashrate analysis was too complex to you?). But you have ignored all the arguments and took the easy way of trolling: not mentioning my name, speaking in generic about shill marketing like including me on that and even using a quotation from Hamlet to dress your post with style. And the concerning thing is that you are a Hero member of the forum that run a guide of Trustworthyness that claims to be ethic. You are trolling a newbie user, what makes you twice evil. If I was you I would be ashamed to use my condition to such things.

At this point, I am not sure if you are simply a troll that eventually is a hero member and eventually tries tu run a company guide. Or maybe you have a secret agenda and particular economic interests in this forum. Maybe you are a happy HC costumer that wants to prevent more people to buy and thus prevent an increse of demand and thus of prices. Or more simply, you are in this forum not to help people, but to manipulate them to drive them to buy gear from a particular company (no need to mention which) where you have economic interests. In any case, refusing to use arguments makes me thing you have something behind the scenes

[dogie]

In defense of that proposal - keep in mind that HashFast liquidated assets (or still are, no idea). Their boards (well, their chips with maybe updated boards) ended up being used in e.g. Pepper Mining's Habanero (you can poke at MrTeal on that ) and Bitcrane's T-110 and T-720. From bankruptcy documents, they certainly claimed to have plenty of assets left over to build miners; don't recall if "1000's" applies, though

Not the first time its happened, won't be the last. When you put down such a huge chunk of money upfront in huge batches of chips, its not surprising that some companies simply don't have the money to turn them into miners once they arrive. Even ASICMiner did that on BE200, all the miners we saw sold over a 12 month period were from the same batch!

[Bicknellski]

Bicknellski, your behaviour is far beyond the acceptable even for a forum <snip>

Let me stop you there.

You are now on ignore you add no value to these forums if you continue to support a company that has no product to be reviewed you are suspect and people have a clear right to call anyone out that is trying to bullshit the community that this is somehow a good deal or smart deal. Do not buy from these people that is the best advice to be given here.

Keep pushing this company all you like but no one is going to buy this product. This is NOT a GOOD deal for anyone.

Pre-order. No thanks.
Over priced. No thanks.
Newb pushing product. No thanks.
No product available for review. No thanks.
Dogie didn't even get a review unit even though he signed and NDA. No thanks.

Those are the facts.

And all the respect in the world to TheRealSteve but if this whole product hinges on Hashfast chips being salvaged via liquidation you are really grasping at some very very very fine straw there. Why not buy an Antminer used? Shit why not from the scammers at Avalon with their overpriced no way to ROI quiet units that Dogie is trying to sell everyone on? Really is anyone buying this? Holy crap.

Here is a suggestion anyone still thinking about buying miners:

I have some miners for sale
2 X SP20's
4 X Neptunes
8 x Antminer S3's
6 x Antminer S2's

Location NY willing to do local pickup or deliver in the NY Metro Area

Please get the irony of me sending people to buy miners in a thread called... "Turning off miners"

[TheRealSteve]

dogie: you've got an inner quote tag too many

And all the respect in the world to TheRealSteve but if this whole product hinges on Hashfast chips being salvaged via liquidation

For what it's worth, 'this product' in this context would have been Apollo/Zeus.  No idea what they're supposed to be using in whatever the Uranus will end up being.  The HashFast Golden Nonce is 28nm.  Afaik the only claim to a 20nm chip is KnCMiner's Neptune.