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Author Topic: GMO miner B2: 7NM mining within reach?  (Read 1909 times)
cuteman
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June 06, 2018, 10:20:35 AM
 #21

24TH/1950W so about 80W/TH, but the miner costs $1999 and ships by the end of October, though sales start in June. I'd still personally take the S9i at its reduced price for a much lower $/TH cost sacrificing just a bit of efficiency, but nice to see that GMO has something working out the board that beats Bitmain for now.

I would agree, because BM price is 4 times less now, for S9i  -  and  taking $100 coupon in account, which I have a few, I would better order S9s for delivery in a few weeks.



Some people just might not want to (or be able to) operate a single 2KW miner.

By the way, this miners would need a 2,200 Watt PSU - which can cost much more than Bitmain's atandart APW3++.

Does anybody know how much a good PSU of 2200 Watts costs?



JUST RELEASED !!!  



GMO has just made a public presentation of their 7NM miner!

Quote
Being the first bitcoin mining device developed in Japan, the B2 is also the first miner to use 7nm semiconductor chips, enabling it to achieve performance and efficiency gains over devices that are already on the market. Bitmain’s Antminer S9 uses a 16nm chip, while Halong Mining’s DragonMint T1 features a 10nm chip produced by Samsung.

GMO believes the release of this miner is the first step in supplanting Bitmain — which currently manufacturers an estimated 80 percent of all ASIC miners — as the dominant force in the industry.

“I respect Bitmain, but we will top them,” GMO CEO Masatoshi Kumagai reportedly said.

https://www.ccn.com/gmo-unveils-japans-first-ever-bitcoin-mining-rig/

Interesting:
the B2’s 7nm chips were produced in Taiwan, most likely by TSMC, which also supplies China-based mining giant Bitmain with most of its chips.   Huh Huh
They are planning to supplant Bitmain, using the same manufacturer as Bitmain uses  Grin Grin Grin
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June 06, 2018, 10:23:41 AM
 #22

Does anybody know how much a good PSU of 2200 Watts costs?

look for an expansion board to connect on some good server PSU, with lot of 6pin connectors
You will need at least 10 6-pin connectors to connect all the boards, like on the antminer
and server PSUs are the best choice, cause they are build to run 24/7

the price is around 0,15$ per W, a 2,200 W PSU will cost around 330$

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June 06, 2018, 10:44:24 AM
 #23

Yea, not alot of people think about the extra cost of the PSU
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June 06, 2018, 12:21:11 PM
 #24

look for an expansion board to connect on some good server PSU, with lot of 6pin connectors
You will need at least 10 6-pin connectors to connect all the boards, like on the antminer
and server PSUs are the best choice, cause they are build to run 24/7

the price is around 0,15$ per W, a 2,200 W PSU will cost around 330$

They have stated on twitter already  "$1999 PSU included" which can be seen here:  https://twitter.com/gmominer/status/1004317442267439107

Looking at the cost of operation 10% or more savings on electric is huge. Power rates do change, and that 10% could be the difference between an RoI/Profit with a longer outlook as difficulty rises. I personally do not have facilities paying $.03-$.04/kwh, in the summer time I pay a whopping $.0857/kwh. The extra efficiency looks pretty enticing to small fries like myself looking at a 2 year road map. I assume there are others out there feeling the exact same way.
cuteman
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June 06, 2018, 01:08:08 PM
 #25

Looking at the cost of operation 10% or more savings on electric is huge. Power rates do change, and that 10% could be the difference between an RoI/Profit with a longer outlook as difficulty rises. I personally do not have facilities paying $.03-$.04/kwh, in the summer time I pay a whopping $.0857/kwh. The extra efficiency looks pretty enticing to small fries like myself looking at a 2 year road map. I assume there are others out there feeling the exact same way.

We can simply use calculator to compare profitability, and can see that ROI for B2 is 100 days more than with S9i :



That is, while efficiency of B2 is 15% more than of S9i,  but high price makes it 30% less attractive for ROI.
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June 06, 2018, 02:05:42 PM
 #26

We can simply use calculator to compare profitability, and can see that ROI for B2 is 100 days more than with S9i :

[...]

That is, while efficiency of B2 is 15% more than of S9i,  but high price makes it 30% less attractive for ROI.

I agree on the surface that the GMO B2 does not look as appealing, but if you run the same calculations accounting for difficulty adjustment over 2 years, the B2 is the only one that can give a RoI in 1.5yrs and remain profitable after that. Assuming a $50 internet connection monthly, a 10% rise in BTC price monthly (Only way the calculator would show either profitable) with a power cost at $0.09/kwh. It is not as straight forward as 10% price increase a month though. These new GMO miners "Should" ship in October, which I interpret as it being delivered some time around December. So with 5 Months of missing s9 profit ($410?) it would not matter longer term.

It would make sense to have hardware that will remain profitable for a longer time than hardware that in the near future will not be profitable for smaller miners like myself. Assuming it does not have 4 months of delays it makes sense over other options.

-I could easily be wrong and missing something that a more experienced miner may see.
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June 06, 2018, 04:37:56 PM
 #27

And assuming it doesn't fall apart or catch on fire a long time before it pays itself off.

10% monthly increase on BTC sure would be nice, instead of the 20% overnight dumps we've been getting lately.

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philipma1957
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June 06, 2018, 10:09:10 PM
 #28

With coupons I ordered 2x s9i's for 1265 to my door

I will be mining 28th in about 14 days

If I buy the B2 for 1999 plus shipping I will be at 2200  and have to wait until Say oct 20 to mine 4 month head start.  and my power deal is 0 for power split the coins.

So there is no way for this gear to be better then the s9i in my case.

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June 07, 2018, 05:10:06 AM
 #29

You guys are not accounting for Mining decentralization by buying anything other than Bitmain........Can't we put value on that?
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June 07, 2018, 08:22:58 AM
 #30

You guys are not accounting for Mining decentralization by buying anything other than Bitmain........Can't we put value on that?

well, ASIC = ASIC - there is no decentralization here, all the same story
real decentralization you have on ASIC proof coins, even the best decentralization You can find in the CPU only coins, they are rare, but the best decentralized

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June 07, 2018, 09:17:37 AM
 #31

well, ASIC = ASIC - there is no decentralization here, all the same story
real decentralization you have on ASIC proof coins, even the best decentralization You can find in the CPU only coins, they are rare, but the best decentralized

I would say that it is still decentralized but not decentralized as much. Currently, there are miners that are turned off because difficulty is too high. If it keeps going higher, eventually only the cheapest miners will own all the hashrate. If it gets to the point 10 big miners control everything, maybe we should sell some btc because the risk of a 51% attack gets bigger.

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Thetaj
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June 07, 2018, 09:27:59 AM
 #32

well, ASIC = ASIC - there is no decentralization here, all the same story
real decentralization you have on ASIC proof coins, even the best decentralization You can find in the CPU only coins, they are rare, but the best decentralized

Having mined through the Monero Botnet AND the ETH botnet of 2016, I'd disagree with you. But I guess everyone's gotta have that illusion somehow.

No, what I'm talking about is Manufacturer decentralization.

GMO WILL be the first major manufacturer from another country that is not China.

They may not be the last if rumours are to be believed.
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June 07, 2018, 10:13:47 AM
 #33

Having mined through the Monero Botnet AND the ETH botnet of 2016, I'd disagree with you. But I guess everyone's gotta have that illusion somehow.

No, what I'm talking about is Manufacturer decentralization.

GMO WILL be the first major manufacturer from another country that is not China.

They may not be the last if rumours are to be believed.

Agree with you, speaking on manufacture decentralization

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June 07, 2018, 10:26:28 AM
 #34

Having mined through the Monero Botnet AND the ETH botnet of 2016, I'd disagree with you. But I guess everyone's gotta have that illusion somehow.

No, what I'm talking about is Manufacturer decentralization.

GMO WILL be the first major manufacturer from another country that is not China.

They may not be the last if rumours are to be believed.

Does it matter if new entrants come in? U would buy this product over an S9? The numbers dont make sense to do so. Only people bad at math would buy this or a halong TI.

Selling 100 dollar coupons (8units expire 11th June, 14 units expire 1st july) and 125 dollar coupon (2 unit exp 30th June). Selling at 20% of value
philipma1957
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June 07, 2018, 12:21:30 PM
 #35

this product  is designed in a stupid manner.

a 1950 watt miner  in the same shape and size as the s9 or t1 is pretty much an exercise in stupidity.

Owning the s9
Owning the avalon 841
Owning the t1

They all are close to 1300-1500 watts

trying to cool 1950 watts  in about the same space and size is going to be harder.

also if you have 30 amp pdus  3x 1950 = 5850 watts which will over load the pdu

but if it does 0.08 watts it is good for a guy with limited power.

Ie a smaller miner  maybe a guy with a 30 amp pdu   as he can have 2 of them and 1 s9

1950
1950
1350
5250  watts is a good load for a 30 amp pdu

gives him 24 + 24 + 14 = 62th

while 4x s9i = 4 x 14th = 56th
using 4x 1350 = 5400 watts

I know of a few guys that prepaid  data centers  for 10kwatts a month for 12
 months.

5 of these = 9750 watts and do 5 x 24 = 120th

7  s9i =  9450 watts and do 7 x 14 = 98th

I am not sure that  22th  over the space of a year will earn  the difference  you paid extra.

I also think these use 13  pcie jacks.  so 1950/12 = 162.50 watts a hashboard jack

the s9i is 1350/9  150 per jack

see photo



My guess is  this is not going to be so good

They were better off  making it do 14.00 th  and 1100 watts

I mine alt coins with https://simplemining.net...
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June 07, 2018, 02:30:31 PM
 #36

for some reason my topic on it got deleted totally. Or I cant seem to find it anymore lol

Probably because it's still speculation that they have more than just a prototype. They could have run it at the presentation to show it was legit. On top of that, their photos show a hash board that has a completely different layout and less than half the chips that they show in renderings here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TcVtEXbjik
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June 07, 2018, 04:45:38 PM
 #37



I am not sure that  22th  over the space of a year will earn  the difference  you paid extra.

I also think these use 13  pcie jacks.  so 1950/12 = 162.50 watts a hashboard jack

the s9i is 1350/9  150 per jack



My guess is  this is not going to be so good

They were better off  making it do 14.00 th  and 1100 watts

I wanted to talk about that a little bit. They have 4 PCI connectors per board because of the power-draw. I do not think these will work at any place +/- 40° from the equator. At least not without serious cooling problems. From what my friend told me about the presentation, they can be daisy-chained like the avalons so you won't need alot of splitters.

Also, 1990W is apparently the figure AT THE WALL with their PSU. I think that has already been clarified. 2k is already including the PSU. Unfortunately for everyone, MOQ is 100 units. Also..........apparently they had alot of help from TSMC, which in proxy means lol, they ripped off bitmain alot.
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June 07, 2018, 05:22:47 PM
 #38

GMO is using TSMC as well also don't forget GMO coming in has a lot more money than all these other players. Even bitmain so it's not like they are coming to the game short handed.

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philipma1957
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June 07, 2018, 05:48:06 PM
 #39

GMO is using TSMC as well also don't forget GMO coming in has a lot more money than all these other players. Even bitmain so it's not like they are coming to the game short handed.

Okay so let us say that GMO is bigger $$$

they still went in the wrong direction here.

Most miners even 1000 unit miners have space to spare
They are short with cheap power
They are short with cooling issues.

I can run 3x my current amount of miners and still have space left over
I have lots of space.
Packing all the power into a small box is dumb and asks for trouble.

Forcing a use of a 2200 watt psu and pulling 1990 watts against it is meh.

Running a 12th doing 995 watts is so easy to manage.

Well Since I can't get these until October it is not a worry for me.

I mine alt coins with https://simplemining.net...
I see BTC as the super highway and alt coins as taxis and trucks needed to move transactions.
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June 07, 2018, 06:41:45 PM
Merited by BobLawblaw (1)
 #40

I've been saying exactly that for three years, since S7 rolled out, but it looks like that kind of high-dense chipsinked package is becoming everyone's de-facto standard (except Avalon, thankfully).

There's no good reason not to build KW/sub-KW miners. Site density stopped being an issue back when people started using shelves instead of racks.

1.4KW is already difficult in that case size, without adding half again to it. Especially since all evidence points to smaller nodes having more issues with heat density in the dies, so the chips probably can't be allowed to run continuously at 120C die temperatures without a high risk of roasting before the machine's expected end of viability.

Got a new 28-90GH stick miner!
Currently in development - 100+GH USB stick; 800GH 60W pod; 6TH volt-adjustable S1/3/5 upgrade kit
Server PSU interface boards and cables. USB and small-scale miners. Hardware hosting, advice and odd-jobs. Supporting the home miner community since 2013 - http://www.gekkoscience.com
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