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Author Topic: A simple question about wallets.  (Read 378 times)
Spendulus
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June 03, 2018, 09:09:54 PM
 #21

i used FreeWallet.org
Please don't...

With FreeWallet, you are basically handling your coins to an unknown third-party. They don't even let you "export" your private-keys, so they are literally the only ones in control of your coins. Instead, you access your wallet with a login and password. Basically the same as using Paypal (they can block your account, freeze your funds, run with all the coins or anything else they want to do).

Hmm,,, looking at the wikipedia entry,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freewallet

I don't find any of the developers or business names or locations.

There is an extremely brief entry in Github, almost just a placeholder. This notes that source code for the mobile versions is available via a link, and source code for the PC and MAC versions is not publicly available.

However, there is a person with a Github account,

https://github.com/jdogresorg, who maintains this low activity program set. For what that's worth.

Is there a decent business model behind this wallet? I ask this separate from a discussion of the technical merits of the wallet, many flaws of which were above described.
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June 03, 2018, 11:08:41 PM
Merited by Spendulus (1)
 #22

Is there a decent business model behind this wallet? I ask this separate from a discussion of the technical merits of the wallet, many flaws of which were above described.
I think they earn money by offering exchanges between assets and charging a fee. (Or maybe by scamming users in the future)

Still, Freewallet goes against everything about crypto and the idea of being your own bank.

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June 03, 2018, 11:23:51 PM
 #23

Is there a decent business model behind this wallet? I ask this separate from a discussion of the technical merits of the wallet, many flaws of which were above described.
I think they earn money by offering exchanges between assets and charging a fee. (Or maybe by scamming users in the future)

Still, Freewallet goes against everything about crypto and the idea of being your own bank.

I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and assume they have a viable business model.

Next, let me elaborate a bit on your critique. By design a wallet casts a net, which may or may not be in line with accepted "best practices for crypto coin management."

Yes I just made that phrase up. Seems reasonable phrase and point of view, but it would be something that newbies were very, very clueless about.

SO....as one example, let's look at the consequences of a wallet not allowing you your private keys. This means exactly, that you don't have those funds and you don't own crypto, but you have a "promise to pay" from the wallet company. Neither can you of your own volition remove those funds from that wallet. You make a request to the wallet company that they move some of the funds they hold on your behalf.

Pulling out a forgotten phrase, "Can you get Goxxed?!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8vCj4DOsHc
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June 04, 2018, 09:21:57 PM
 #24

I believed what the OP said concern wallet developers is true but with my own research every old wallet developers (I mean wallet created before 2017 high traffic) are not into selling their users data. However, I also believe the whole idea and question was ask due to the Facebook accusation.




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June 04, 2018, 10:28:36 PM
 #25

I believed what the OP said concern wallet developers is true but with my own research every old wallet developers (I mean wallet created before 2017 high traffic) are not into selling their users data. However, I also believe the whole idea and question was ask due to the Facebook accusation.


It's not, it is simply an effort to DEFINE and enumerate the business models.

IF the business model is public service, like Bitcoin Core, let's get those addresses and donate.

IF the business model of a wallet is to sell user data, let's get it right out in the open that's what it is.

If the business model is to profit on coin swaps, purchases and sales, let's state that.

If the business model is not evident...that bothers me and it should bother you.

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June 05, 2018, 02:08:31 AM
Merited by Spendulus (1)
 #26

Much of crypto currency was done by dedicated visionaries, often without a goal of personal gain.

This is true of bitcoin. To the benefit of the world.

But what's with all the wallets? There are hundreds of wallets of various sorts, and with the exception of hardware wallets that are bought, they are all free.

What do the developers get? Why are wallets free?

Consider normal, "typical" android and IOS development. People download "free" apps. Then the developers and marketers steal your data and sell it. It's all about your data. And we all know that.

But what model of development are wallet developers following? That of dedicated shareware developers with no profit in mind? That of the current generation of "steal your private data and give you the app for free?"

What am I missing.

Well... you are missing the Open Source part. Those developers who make the code just as you say
Quote
without a goal of personal gain.

But let me explain how this thing work, if you see the soul of bitcoin you will understand why there are lot of wallets. When bitcoin born it wasn't a coin, it was a white paper and a piece of code called bitcoin core. The white paper explain how it works and the code does the magic (even you can see the download link from the core on the top of this sit.), now the network run the core version 0.16.0 and the question here is; what can i do with the core? or with that program called bitcoin? The answer is data manipulation. Bitcoin core have a lot of tools to obtain network data, and others to manage transaction.  If you take a look to this site, you will understand better the options you have https://github.com/ChristopherA/Learning-Bitcoin-from-the-Command-Line/blob/master/bitcoin-cli-commands-help.md

I will not give you a full lesson about bitcoin, but what you have to learn is that bitcoin works in a network, so if you run that network as a server, you can let other people run commands from bitcoin core, and that's how wallets work, is just a server in which you can install the bitcoin core and make a nice user interface to let the users manipulate their coins. some wallets give you limited access, other ones give you better access, but if you want to have a full access and build your own transactions by using commands you will need to install bitcoin core, at end that's the only way to guarantee no one will have access to your coins.

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[/]
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June 06, 2018, 03:45:29 AM
 #27

i used FreeWallet.org
Please don't...

With FreeWallet, you are basically handling your coins to an unknown third-party. They don't even let you "export" your private-keys, so they are literally the only ones in control of your coins. Instead, you access your wallet with a login and password. Basically the same as using Paypal (they can block your account, freeze your funds, run with all the coins or anything else they want to do).
humm.. you are correct..

But how can i store my USDTs? i just found this wallet , with simple way ( my wife store usdt)

Do you have some advice to use usdt ?


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June 06, 2018, 03:47:24 AM
 #28

i used FreeWallet.org
Please don't...

With FreeWallet, you are basically handling your coins to an unknown third-party. They don't even let you "export" your private-keys, so they are literally the only ones in control of your coins. Instead, you access your wallet with a login and password. Basically the same as using Paypal (they can block your account, freeze your funds, run with all the coins or anything else they want to do).

Hmm,,, looking at the wikipedia entry,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freewallet

I don't find any of the developers or business names or locations.

There is an extremely brief entry in Github, almost just a placeholder. This notes that source code for the mobile versions is available via a link, and source code for the PC and MAC versions is not publicly available.

However, there is a person with a Github account,

https://github.com/jdogresorg, who maintains this low activity program set. For what that's worth.

Is there a decent business model behind this wallet? I ask this separate from a discussion of the technical merits of the wallet, many flaws of which were above described.


Do you know some wallet to use USDt ? Trustable wallet ?

Spendulus
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June 06, 2018, 06:28:49 PM
 #29

Much of crypto currency was done by dedicated visionaries, often without a goal of personal gain.

This is true of bitcoin. To the benefit of the world.

But what's with all the wallets? There are hundreds of wallets of various sorts, and with the exception of hardware wallets that are bought, they are all free.

What do the developers get? Why are wallets free?

Consider normal, "typical" android and IOS development. People download "free" apps. Then the developers and marketers steal your data and sell it. It's all about your data. And we all know that.

But what model of development are wallet developers following? That of dedicated shareware developers with no profit in mind? That of the current generation of "steal your private data and give you the app for free?"

What am I missing.

Well... you are missing the Open Source part. Those developers who make the code just as you say
Quote
without a goal of personal gain.

But let me explain how this thing work, if you see the soul of bitcoin you will understand why there are lot of wallets. When bitcoin born it wasn't a coin, it was a white paper and a piece of code called bitcoin core. The white paper explain how it works and the code does the magic (even you can see the download link from the core on the top of this sit.), now the network run the core version 0.16.0 and the question here is; what can i do with the core? or with that program called bitcoin? The answer is data manipulation. Bitcoin core have a lot of tools to obtain network data, and others to manage transaction.  If you take a look to this site, you will understand better the options you have https://github.com/ChristopherA/Learning-Bitcoin-from-the-Command-Line/blob/master/bitcoin-cli-commands-help.md

I will not give you a full lesson about bitcoin, but what you have to learn is that bitcoin works in a network, so if you run that network as a server, you can let other people run commands from bitcoin core, and that's how wallets work, is just a server in which you can install the bitcoin core and make a nice user interface to let the users manipulate their coins. some wallets give you limited access, other ones give you better access, but if you want to have a full access and build your own transactions by using commands you will need to install bitcoin core, at end that's the only way to guarantee no one will have access to your coins.

Actually I think you missed the entire point of my post and this thread. Please let me reiterate. I start thus:

Much of crypto currency was done by dedicated visionaries, often without a goal of personal gain.

This is true of bitcoin. To the benefit of the world.

But what's with all the wallets?


I certainly didn't miss the "open source part." And I didn't miss the need to respect and use Bitcoins Core. The issue here is not full or limited access, but what the business model of these hundreds of wallets is and whether many can defacto not be trusted.

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