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Author Topic: Understanding Bitcoin security  (Read 941 times)
sporti (OP)
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February 02, 2014, 01:25:13 PM
 #1

echo "Hello World"  Grin  (first post)

Got into Bitcoin just recently. Been reading a lot about it, but I am convinced that I'm only seeing the tip of the iceberg right now. So much to learn.
I would like to understand everything about it, step by step. And even if I am no crypto expert right now, to say something, I would like to understand it all.

So to get there I have some questions/doubts/statements you guys can help me with. I am no noob wannabe hacker, I just want to understand it, and FEEL SAFE

1: If I would have your private key, I could just import them to my wallet and steal your funds

2: Password protection of a desktop, mobile or paper wallet is only to protect the computer, phone, or piece of paper. The actual private key is never password protected

3: If I would be able (I know it's not possible) to import all the private keys in SHA256 to my multibit client, or whatever, I would have access to everyones wallet

4: What happens if 2 people create the same brain wallet? Are you expected to check blockchain to see if the account has 0 transactions?

5: Making money with bitcoin, mining bitcoins, is nothing more than joining a mining pool and helping to bundle/verify transactions into a block and securing it. If your pool has won, you get a small fee wich is how new bitcoins are created.


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byt411
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February 02, 2014, 03:07:22 PM
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echo "Hello World"  Grin  (first post)

Got into Bitcoin just recently. Been reading a lot about it, but I am convinced that I'm only seeing the tip of the iceberg right now. So much to learn.
I would like to understand everything about it, step by step. And even if I am no crypto expert right now, to say something, I would like to understand it all.

So to get there I have some questions/doubts/statements you guys can help me with. I am no noob wannabe hacker, I just want to understand it, and FEEL SAFE

1: If I would have your private key, I could just import them to my wallet and steal your funds

2: Password protection of a desktop, mobile or paper wallet is only to protect the computer, phone, or piece of paper. The actual private key is never password protected

3: If I would be able (I know it's not possible) to import all the private keys in SHA256 to my multibit client, or whatever, I would have access to everyones wallet

4: What happens if 2 people create the same brain wallet? Are you expected to check blockchain to see if the account has 0 transactions?

5: Making money with bitcoin, mining bitcoins, is nothing more than joining a mining pool and helping to bundle/verify transactions into a block and securing it. If your pool has won, you get a small fee wich is how new bitcoins are created.




1. YES.
2. YES, but you can encrypt your private key if you want.
3. YES.
4. Literally impossible.
5. You help verify transactions and you pack them into a "block". By finding a block, the bitcoin system rewards you with 25 BTC which is distributed by the pool. If the pool chooses to, you also get the block's transaction fees.
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February 02, 2014, 04:49:39 PM
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Hello newbie! Have fun here
sporti (OP)
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February 02, 2014, 06:08:06 PM
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Ok thanks but ...

1:: With encrypting a private key, do you mean something like this:

- encrypting your computer filesystem or hard drives
- Running some algorithm on the private key that only you know, and you remember
- Childishly reversing the order of the key, and remembering that you wrote it down in reverse (and the thousands of other things that come to mind)


2:: Does every miner in a pool, while it is verifying transactions, tries to bundle transactions and secure them into a block?
Or is only 1 block / pool suggested for acceptance by the network (every 10 minutes) ?

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February 02, 2014, 06:54:30 PM
 #5

Ok thanks but ...

1:: With encrypting a private key, do you mean something like this:

- encrypting your computer filesystem or hard drives
- Running some algorithm on the private key that only you know, and you remember
- Childishly reversing the order of the key, and remembering that you wrote it down in reverse (and the thousands of other things that come to mind)


2:: Does every miner in a pool, while it is verifying transactions, tries to bundle transactions and secure them into a block?
Or is only 1 block / pool suggested for acceptance by the network (every 10 minutes) ?



1. You can, for example, encrypt the wallet.dat file of Bitcoin-QT with a password.
2. The pool assembles the block. Pool miners try to hash some derived data from that block.

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February 02, 2014, 07:10:12 PM
 #6

echo "Hello World"  Grin  (first post)

Got into Bitcoin just recently. Been reading a lot about it, but I am convinced that I'm only seeing the tip of the iceberg right now. So much to learn.
I would like to understand everything about it, step by step. And even if I am no crypto expert right now, to say something, I would like to understand it all.

So to get there I have some questions/doubts/statements you guys can help me with. I am no noob wannabe hacker, I just want to understand it, and FEEL SAFE

1: If I would have your private key, I could just import them to my wallet and steal your funds

2: Password protection of a desktop, mobile or paper wallet is only to protect the computer, phone, or piece of paper. The actual private key is never password protected

3: If I would be able (I know it's not possible) to import all the private keys in SHA256 to my multibit client, or whatever, I would have access to everyones wallet

4: What happens if 2 people create the same brain wallet? Are you expected to check blockchain to see if the account has 0 transactions?

5: Making money with bitcoin, mining bitcoins, is nothing more than joining a mining pool and helping to bundle/verify transactions into a block and securing it. If your pool has won, you get a small fee wich is how new bitcoins are created.




1. YES.
2. YES, but you can encrypt your private key if you want.
3. YES.
4. Literally impossible.
5. You help verify transactions and you pack them into a "block". By finding a block, the bitcoin system rewards you with 25 BTC which is distributed by the pool. If the pool chooses to, you also get the block's transaction fees.

4. Very possible brain wallet

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February 02, 2014, 11:43:25 PM
 #7

4: What happens if 2 people create the same brain wallet? Are you expected to check blockchain to see if the account has 0 transactions?
4. Literally impossible.

Very possible. If a few million people create brain wallets that are easy to remember, the chances of two people coming up the same private key is high. If two people create the same key, then they share it and can spend each other's bitcoins. Checking the address won't help if you are the first to send money to it.

Read this for more information: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=323055.0

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sporti (OP)
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February 03, 2014, 07:20:29 PM
 #8

Ok thanks gents.

Double private keys are possible as I expected.
Didn't know there were so many sharks listening for known public addresses (that link to easy brain wallets)
Crazy.
nasamanBoy
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February 05, 2014, 11:24:07 AM
 #9

for security view this page
http://bitcoinsecurity.com/
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February 05, 2014, 11:34:06 AM
 #10

4: What happens if 2 people create the same brain wallet? Are you expected to check blockchain to see if the account has 0 transactions?
4. Literally impossible.

Very possible. If a few million people create brain wallets that are easy to remember, the chances of two people coming up the same private key is high. If two people create the same key, then they share it and can spend each other's bitcoins. Checking the address won't help if you are the first to send money to it.

Read this for more information: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=323055.0

+1
Never use some simple words (such as bitcoin, basketball, Justin Bieber) for your brain wallet, or your bitcoin will be lost in a few seconds.  Wink
byt411
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February 05, 2014, 05:00:51 PM
 #11

4: What happens if 2 people create the same brain wallet? Are you expected to check blockchain to see if the account has 0 transactions?
4. Literally impossible.

Very possible. If a few million people create brain wallets that are easy to remember, the chances of two people coming up the same private key is high. If two people create the same key, then they share it and can spend each other's bitcoins. Checking the address won't help if you are the first to send money to it.

Read this for more information: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=323055.0

+1
Never use some simple words (such as bitcoin, basketball, Justin Bieber) for your brain wallet, or your bitcoin will be lost in a few seconds.  Wink

How about pneumonoultramicroscopicvolcanosis? Also, "Justin Bieber" is not a word!
Sonny
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February 05, 2014, 06:21:33 PM
 #12

4: What happens if 2 people create the same brain wallet? Are you expected to check blockchain to see if the account has 0 transactions?
4. Literally impossible.

Very possible. If a few million people create brain wallets that are easy to remember, the chances of two people coming up the same private key is high. If two people create the same key, then they share it and can spend each other's bitcoins. Checking the address won't help if you are the first to send money to it.

Read this for more information: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=323055.0

+1
Never use some simple words (such as bitcoin, basketball, Justin Bieber) for your brain wallet, or your bitcoin will be lost in a few seconds.  Wink

How about pneumonoultramicroscopicvolcanosis? Also, "Justin Bieber" is not a word!

Those Bieber's fans can't really tell if it is a word or not.  Wink
byt411
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February 05, 2014, 07:15:04 PM
 #13

4: What happens if 2 people create the same brain wallet? Are you expected to check blockchain to see if the account has 0 transactions?
4. Literally impossible.

Very possible. If a few million people create brain wallets that are easy to remember, the chances of two people coming up the same private key is high. If two people create the same key, then they share it and can spend each other's bitcoins. Checking the address won't help if you are the first to send money to it.

Read this for more information: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=323055.0

+1
Never use some simple words (such as bitcoin, basketball, Justin Bieber) for your brain wallet, or your bitcoin will be lost in a few seconds.  Wink

How about pneumonoultramicroscopicvolcanosis? Also, "Justin Bieber" is not a word!

Those Bieber's fans can't really tell if it is a word or not.  Wink

It is a holy word to them. "Thank Justin." "Oh my Justin." "Justin shall punish you!"
DannyHamilton
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February 09, 2014, 03:53:00 PM
 #14

So to get there I have some questions/doubts/statements you guys can help me with. I am no noob wannabe hacker, I just want to understand it, and FEEL SAFE

You've gotten some good advice and some very bad advice.  I'll chime in here, although mostly I'll just be agreeing with the good advice you've already received.  At least this will make it a bit easier for others to determine who to listen to in the future and who to ignore.

1: If I would have your private key, I could just import them to my wallet and steal your funds

Absolutely!  He who has the private key, has the bitcoins.

2: Password protection of a desktop, mobile or paper wallet is only to protect the computer, phone, or piece of paper. The actual private key is never password protected

Any type of data can be password protected.  You can password protect the login to your computer as you've suggested, but it is also possible to use encryption systems such as gpg to directly encrypt the private keys.  When you add a password to a wallet such as MultiBit or Bitcoin-Qt, that software uses the password to directly encrypt the private keys that it is storing.  The private keys are then stored on your filesystem in encrypted form.  When you want to perform an action that requires a private key (such as sending some bitcoins), the wallet prompts you for your password and decrypts the private key in memory to use it.  As such, the usable private key cannot be obtained from the filesystem, but a keylogger can still acquire your password to decrypt the private key or a virus could still steal the private key from RAM when the wallet decrypts it.

3: If I would be able (I know it's not possible) to import all the private keys in SHA256 to my multibit client, or whatever, I would have access to everyones wallet

Not sure what you mean by "private keys in SHA256".  SHA256 has nothing to do with private keys.  A private key is just a 256 bit random number.  If you had a computer that was "built from something other than matter and occupied something other than space", created a wallet on that imaginary computer, and imported every possible 256 bit number as a private key, then I suppose in that imaginary universe you could spend everyon's bitcoins.

4: What happens if 2 people create the same brain wallet?

See your question number 1.  If multiple people have the same private keys, then multiple people have access to the same bitcoins.

Are you expected to check blockchain to see if the account has 0 transactions?

No, you are expected not to use brainwallets unless you know what you are doing. It is extremely risky to use a brain wallet, and most knowledgeable people will warn you NOT to do it.  The human mind is wired for patterns.  We just aren't very good at randomness no matter how hard we try.  As such, there is a significant risk that another individual will accidentally choose the same pattern as you do, no matter how ingenious or complex you think your brainwallet is.

5: Making money with bitcoin, mining bitcoins, is nothing more than joining a mining pool and helping to bundle/verify transactions into a block and securing it. If your pool has won, you get a small fee which is how new bitcoins are created.

The pool gets a fee of 25 newly created bitcoins (for the next 3 years or so) plus the total of all transaction fees of all transactions that are included in the block.  That subsidy of 25 newly created bitcoins is reduced by half (and rounded down to the nearest 0.01 microbitcoins) approximately every 4 years until it reaches 0.01 microbitcoins.  Then after approximately 4 years of a 0.01 microbitcoin subsidy, the subsidy goes away completely and no new bitcoins will ever be created.  After that mining is entirely supported by the transaction fees.

Once it has received its block reward, the pool distributes the reward proportionally among the participating miners according to the rules that the pool has established.  Each pool has its own rules on how that reward will be shared.
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February 09, 2014, 04:01:33 PM
 #15

2:: Does every miner in a pool, while it is verifying transactions, tries to bundle transactions and secure them into a block?
Or is only 1 block / pool suggested for acceptance by the network (every 10 minutes) ?

Each pool creates its own blocks and distributes the block headers to the miners to be mined.  The pool can use any criteria it wants to choose and arrange the unconfirmed transactions in its blocks.  The pool creates MANY blocks to be mined simultaneously, each miner will receive a slightly different block to mine.
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