Next coin is highly misunderstood and undervalued on this forum.

[Vannicke]

Okay: something I don't get, as a mathematician / math teacher.

Why are people insisting that only the rich get richer?  As far as I can see, if you have 10'000 NXT you will profit the same percentage as someone with 10'000'000 Nxt.  If the 10'000'000 NXT account makes around 200'000NXT in a certain time period, the 10'000 NXT account will make 200NXT in the same time period.

The only thing that you need to factor for is the 10'000 NXT account will have MUCH higher variance.

This is the exact same thing as POW mined coins, if you spend enough for 500MH/s mining sha256 you'll get a decent flow, but with MUCH higher variance than someone (like myself) who spent WAY more and have 500GH/s mining sha256.

I think that NXT has a future not so much as a cryptocurrency or altcoin as it has a future as a *currency*.  It may take a while to get started, but looking into it, I think it will be much more stable in the long term, specifically BECAUSE it is not dependant on mining power.

Green is not the only thing that makes this coin worth at least a good look.  Regardless of the IPO, and the fact that it may not have been well publicized and managed enough by some token, the NXT project itself looks a lot more sustainable in a long term because there is no "arms race" to mine it.  I also like the fact that enough was invested in it before it began that it started with a value worth more than a few satoshis.

I see NXT as a vehicle for successful investment in the coming months, but I see it as a currency proper in the coming decade.  I can't say I feel the same way about any PoW coin.  Too many people are looking at NXT in the same way they look at other alts, a short term way to make a quick btc.  I hope that at least a few people read this and realize crypto isn't meant to be just for quick money.  Mining is NOT the end all be all of crypto.

Disclaimer: I have invested more than five times the amount I have in NXT in mining hardware, I am not against mining, and I did not get into NXT until about Jan 10, after some source was released.

[xchrix]

vannicke +1
very good post

[hyunsookmom]

What the people do not understand why NxT is being hated so much because of the IPO the devs got them for free and got more then anyone else, but this is not all of it NxT give your free NxtCoins just for holding coins like peercoin "Stake" if other users are sending Nxtcoin through the network.

This means that Rich get richer scam.

Still like it ? I think you are still to rich and need to be fucked more by banksters until you understand that this system is not healthy.

There is a lot wrong with this statement, firstly why shouldnt developers make the most money from it? Plus the opportunity to buy NXT and get a stake was open to all on this forum. Also the price was still pretty low after the stakes were distributed so again people had a chance to buy in.


BUT I'm going to put all that aside and say instead of linking this with corrupt banking system that handles the sweat and tears of money made by real labour and suggest to you the actual situation you are in is this. You have an open opportunity to buy in at still a very low level so here's the truth, no BS.....The developers and early stake holders may get STUPIDLY rich but sadly you can only get VERY rich. Poor you...fucked again.

[toknormal]

Nxt is promising but what's to stop others from making a 100% PoS coin with more people in the IPO? That's my problem with Nxt, is that there are bound to be other clones in the future except with a more distributed IPO, people would look at these coins as fairer and flock to them.

There is nothing "unfair" about NxT. It's distribution was fair, it just wasn't widespread. There's a very big difference.

When you look at it that way, no cryptocurrency's distribution is widespread because the cryptocurrency market in general is tiny. 99.99999% of the world's population has no idea all these coin launches are going on and won't get in on it for months or years, by which time they'll be able to afford only a very tiny amount of whatever coin still prevails.

The fact that a clone appears who's initial distribution is more widespread than NxT's isn't going to make a blind bit of difference because by that time NxT will have a far wider distribution than said clone coin and also a far more established network, technology developer community and investor community. That's not to say it's ultimate success is guaranteed - nothing is guaranteed - but as I said in a previous remark, the initial launch is history and will have progressively less to say about the technology's future.

[RandomPleb]

Although this observation is a bit OT, there seems to be a vast difference in literacy, temperament (with a couple of unfortunate exceptions) and the understanding of really quite simple concepts depending on which side of the NXT fence people are situated.

(In case anyone is unsure, the above was meant as a pro NXT comment)

[Vannicke]

What the people do not understand why NxT is being hated so much because of the IPO the devs got them for free and got more then anyone else, but this is not all of it NxT give your free NxtCoins just for holding coins like peercoin "Stake" if other users are sending Nxtcoin through the network.

This means that Rich get richer scam.

Still like it ? I think you are still to rich and need to be fucked more by banksters until you understand that this system is not healthy.

Yes, I still like it, and I've been plenty fucked by banks, and I'm a teacher, so god knows I'll never be rich on my salary.

The point of cryptocurrencies is not supposed to be making money from nothing (or electricity), but it has that as a side effect.  If the reason that you are into crypto is to make the most Dollar/Pound/Euro/Yuan you can with your rack of 7970s, then you are (in my opinion) only securing the network for now, but not supporting a future where cryptocurrencies can continue to thrive.

I want to support that future, I like the idea of instantly paying a service in Indonesia from Canada, or sending some money to a friend across the country instantly, of being able to access my store of value anywhere, and actually owning the value of my money rather than having a piece of paper that says I am owed that value, while also never increasing the supply of the value and therefore diluting it.  BTC, PPC and NXT communities have some focus on this, and maybe a good number in the LTC community as well, but almost every other altcoin is either a clone for devs to make a quick buck just to let flop, or a coin for early miners to make loads of then dump and fade into disuse.

Let me voice an opinion: mining in BTC was realized to be an arms race that would detriment the coin by tying it to an industry of gross inflation, and so LTC came along to alleviate this by offering a different method of mining where preferential access to superior equipment did not mean access to higher profit.  PPC came along to further that by creating a system that rewarded those who actually invest and use the coin more than miners, who constantly dump newly minted coin, so that the coin could have a more sustainable future with a community of people who want a future with crypto in the long run.  NXT is continuing to evolve the idea of a coin with longevity, stability and versatility by rewarding you specifically for investing in NXT itself.

Those who complain that this is making the rich richer need to realize that it is making the poor richer at the same rate.  Certainly, if you invest more money, than you get more money, but EVERY other investment in crypto works exactly the same way.  If you buy ten 7970's and mine LTC you will make more than the guy who bought only 1 7970.  If you buy a Terraminer, you are going to make more than the guy who got a Jalapeno.  If anything the only reason that some are making more than others in any coin is because you got there later than they did, and certainly early adopters of NXT will too.  But what makes NXT different is you only need to invest in it ONCE.  Buy some of it.  I can't see why miners aren't flocking to PoS coins because of this, your miner will last maybe six months or a year before it becomes obsolete, and you can't use your Dogecoin as a store of value, but five years from now, your NXT will continue to give you more as more people adopt it instead of LESS when more people adopt it.

tl;dr: PoS altcoins are an efficacy to an unhealthy system. NXT will grow with the crypto economy as more people use it, an investment mining coins is profitable for a very short term but depreciates as more use it long term.

[Vannicke]

Although this observation is a bit OT, there seems to be a vast difference in literacy, temperament (with a couple of unfortunate exceptions) and the understanding of really quite simple concepts depending on which side of the NXT fence people are situated.

(In case anyone is unsure, the above was meant as a pro NXT comment)

Damn, had I noticed this sooner, I might have realized the ... ahem ... novel I just posted is probably not going to reach its target audience.  Oh well, hopefully I at least made thought-provoking observations.

[nwbitcoin]

There are a load of communists on this site - wanting everyone to have an equal share regardless of effort.

That experiment failed after 70 years, the only way to make society richer is through individuals taking a risk with opportunities that might or might not work.

I didn't get any free NXT either, but rather than moan about it, I bought some.  Maybe the ones moaning should do the same?

[elbill]

Nxt: Just a scamcoin ; I never buy or use something with an unfair beginning (or closed-source).

you do realise you sound a bit silly here. BITCOINS current disribution is unfair but i bet you hold btc? Nxt is very distributed now. I was an original founder of nxt and ive distributed half of my nxt i had.
The fact is POS is old technology and will slowly phase out. bitcoin will soon become centralised when 3 big companies are the only ones with the hash power to generate the blockchain. What then?
Nxt is the future and has so much more to offer than any altcoin. When april comes around you will wish you had bought nxt @ 0.00008 i promise. and im not saying that to boost current nxt prices. I hold 1.4million nxt and you will have to pry them from my cold dead hands before i sell them.
Anyways sit on fence complaining or join the future movement your move!

Nxt has dozens of arguments against it, has been launched in the worst way possible, and if the development team now disappears you would have something without development that is worth nothing. Closed source, unfair lauch, very uncomfortable java software. questionable security (until they release the entire source code), No, the right thing is NOT buy nxt, no matter how much worth, and a serious exchage should not admit it.

[toknormal]

Nxt has dozens of arguments against it, has been launched in the worst way possible, and if the development team now disappears you would have something without development that is worth nothing. Closed source, unfair lauch, very uncomfortable java software. questionable security (until they release the entire source code), No, the right thing is NOT buy nxt, no matter how much worth, and a serious exchage should not admit it.

Looks like those remarks are being made through gritted teeth given that you're following this topic with something to say 

You're entitled to your opinion but be advised that you definition of "unfair" amounts to nothing more than griping that you didn't get in early enough. Even if you had youd've probably past up the chance of investing in the IPO as being a "scam" given that it was vapourware at that time. And that last point is where the biggest hypocrisy lies in most of the "scamcoin" claims.

A suggestion: get in now, then you'll save yourself from continuously having to come up with justifications why you didn't (like the ones above). We all know what we're getting into and the issues you cite are well established.

It's just that they're dwarfed by the potential upsides.

[hvezdasmrti]

NXT is not being hated due to unfair distribution but because it absolutelly skipped any long-term investment return phase.

IPO = few "investors" got almost all NXTs. It would be OK if their NXT starting price was equal to their deposits - e. g. someone who invested 1 BTC would be able to sell them for e. g. 2 BTC or wait 2 years and take a big risk of no success of NXT or big success and big revenue. However they didnt take any risk and ....

...then was no phase of slowly growth and redistribution, the trust of holders just skipped any fair price distribution and started selling only for oppresive price which should be valid after 2 years since beginnings, but not in alpha-testing phase. Its like bitcoin never costed 0.1 USD, never costed 1USD and started with 100USD price.

[relm9]

Nxt has dozens of arguments against it, has been launched in the worst way possible, and if the development team now disappears you would have something without development that is worth nothing. Closed source, unfair lauch, very uncomfortable java software. questionable security (until they release the entire source code), No, the right thing is NOT buy nxt, no matter how much worth, and a serious exchage should not admit it.

Bitcoin was 'uncomfortable' to use in its early days too, no GUI just command line. There's nothing wrong with Java either, just armchair programmers talk it down because of its stigma with exploits on the web. If Java isn't your thing you can always disable it your browser, as I do. NXT only uses it for the daemon itself.

[Vannicke]

There are a load of communists on this site - wanting everyone to have an equal share regardless of effort.

That experiment failed after 70 years, the only way to make society richer is through individuals taking a risk with opportunities that might or might not work.

I didn't get any free NXT either, but rather than moan about it, I bought some.  Maybe the ones moaning should do the same?

Many here consider crypto easy money, and NXT isn't really intended to be easy money.  While it has proven a good investment for many who got in at the start, I want to see this crypto as a good store of value, and that is something it has that others don't.  How could NXT be more fair than offering everyone profit exactly proportional to what you invest?  If I buy 50'000 and you buy 50, it would be unfair to give you just as much as me for having an account.  If forging is where some people have a hangup about NXT, I suggest reading into it further, because it appears (to me at least) to be much more efficient and fair, and even a bit socialistic in the ideal sense (I use this term hoping people understand socialistic is not communistic).  Whatever effort or investment you put forward yields the same as everyone else.  If the IPO is where people have a hangup about NXT, I ask: why shouldn't the earlybird get the worm?  As far as I can tell there is no room for anyone to complain, because getting in now is still early.  Sure, you won't profit like an IPO investor, but NXT has a lot to it that hasn't even started yet, and will attract more users, and more users, unlike any other coin, makes mining more profitable.  If people realize this, more will use it, so it will increase in value at the same time, which means it will increase in both value and profitability with more adoption.  I think this coin will be more stable and long lasting because of this self reinforcement.

Nxt has dozens of arguments against it, has been launched in the worst way possible, and if the development team now disappears you would have something without development that is worth nothing. Closed source, unfair lauch, very uncomfortable java software. questionable security (until they release the entire source code), No, the right thing is NOT buy nxt, no matter how much worth, and a serious exchage should not admit it.

Yes, there is risk.  Yes, the dev is very protective of the source (I also dislike this), but it takes little research to see that the amount of time and work needed to start this coin would be worth protecting it for a while.  In BCNext's position, I'd probably do the same.

[Wipeout2097]

Ok, this charade got me genuinely intrigued and so did the dotNXT wallet software.

So tell me. Besides your own self-interest of holding Nxt and wanting to pump it, please explain me how is Nxt better than a hybrid PoW/PoS coin without IPO, when mining ends. Is anyone really pro-Nxt without having some and making a speculative bet it will hold?

Then I don't get what kind of people are against Bitcoin and annoyed than Nxt is not valued at bitcointalk !? Besides you're against other alts, against mining (I get the nice PoS but otoh even teens with a decent gaming PC can mine), you're against anyone that mentions the obscure IPO. Now I've read Nxt is closed source and with bad official Java software.

Let's see if you manage to address the points without ad hominems and deflections.

[stylin]

Nxt is promising but what's to stop others from making a 100% PoS coin with more people in the IPO? That's my problem with Nxt, is that there are bound to be other clones in the future except with a more distributed IPO, people would look at these coins as fairer and flock to them.

There is nothing "unfair" about NxT. It's distribution was fair, it just wasn't widespread. There's a very big difference.

When you look at it that way, no cryptocurrency's distribution is widespread because the cryptocurrency market in general is tiny. 99.99999% of the world's population has no idea all these coin launches are going on and won't get in on it for months or years, by which time they'll be able to afford only a very tiny amount of whatever coin still prevails.

The fact that a clone appears who's initial distribution is more widespread than NxT's isn't going to make a blind bit of difference because by that time NxT will have a far wider distribution than said clone coin and also a far more established network, technology developer community and investor community. That's not to say it's ultimate success is guaranteed - nothing is guaranteed - but as I said in a previous remark, the initial launch is history and will have progressively less to say about the technology's future.

I'm not saying Nxt is fair or unfair. Nothing's fair, ever I just disagree with you that Nxt will be the primary 100% PoS coin, the fact is people do get jealous of those first 71 investors and I believe coins like NEM will soon popup and steal the market due to their wider initial distribution. Provided that there are competent people behind these "clones" of Nxt, which theoretically are the same in everything except for more distributed IPO, I just can't see the existing infrastructure of Nxt being a good enough reason for a new investor to choose it if he wanted to get a 100% PoS coin. It's early even for Bitcoin, to say the infrastructure of an alt counts for anything at this point is foolish... But hey that is just my opinion

[stylin]

Nxt is promising but what's to stop others from making a 100% PoS coin with more people in the IPO? That's my problem with Nxt, is that there are bound to be other clones in the future except with a more distributed IPO, people would look at these coins as fairer and flock to them.

There is nothing "unfair" about NxT. It's distribution was fair, it just wasn't widespread. There's a very big difference.

When you look at it that way, no cryptocurrency's distribution is widespread because the cryptocurrency market in general is tiny. 99.99999% of the world's population has no idea all these coin launches are going on and won't get in on it for months or years, by which time they'll be able to afford only a very tiny amount of whatever coin still prevails.

The fact that a clone appears who's initial distribution is more widespread than NxT's isn't going to make a blind bit of difference because by that time NxT will have a far wider distribution than said clone coin and also a far more established network, technology developer community and investor community. That's not to say it's ultimate success is guaranteed - nothing is guaranteed - but as I said in a previous remark, the initial launch is history and will have progressively less to say about the technology's future.

I'm not saying Nxt is fair or unfair. Nothing's fair, ever I just disagree with you that Nxt will be the primary 100% PoS coin, the fact is people do get jealous of those first 71 investors and I believe coins like NEM will soon popup and steal the market due to their wider initial distribution. Provided that there are competent people behind these "clones" of Nxt, which theoretically are the same in everything except for more distributed IPO, I just can't see the existing infrastructure of Nxt being a good enough reason for a new investor to choose it if he wanted to get a 100% PoS coin. It's early even for Bitcoin, to say the infrastructure of an alt counts for anything at this point is foolish... But hey that is just my opinion

Another comment, Bitcoin had a couple year's start ahead of Litecoin so the infrastructure argument is more relevant there.... However Nxt only has a couple months' start on coins like NEM and other soon-to-be-made 100% PoS coins. I just don't think that couple months is enough time to cement Nxt as the leading 100% PoS coin. In fact I believe these 100% PoS coins will continue to be made and remade until one day in the far future when everyone in the entire world will have the opportunity to get into the IPO of a coin. That's why I will never hold more than a little of any PoS coin, because PoS was conceived as an "end-state" adoption... it simply doesn't work as well in beginning stages of adoption.

[hyunsookmom]

Ok, this charade got me genuinely intrigued and so did the dotNXT wallet software.

So tell me. Besides your own self-interest of holding Nxt and wanting to pump it, please explain me how is Nxt better than a hybrid PoW/PoS coin without IPO, when mining ends. Is anyone really pro-Nxt without having some and making a speculative bet it will hold?

Then I don't get what kind of people are against Bitcoin and annoyed than Nxt is not valued at bitcointalk !? Besides you're against other alts, against mining (I get the nice PoS but otoh even teens with a decent gaming PC can mine), you're against anyone that mentions the obscure IPO. Now I've read Nxt is closed source and with bad official Java software.

Let's see if you manage to address the points without ad hominems and deflections.

Its ironic that the biggest support POW coins get is the 'fairness' of mining when actually it is with the current situation where some can afford and understand the technicalities to acquire massively unequal amounts of coins the most loop sided unequal distribution for any newbie to the Cryptocurrency world. Mined coins almost instantly get put on exchanges and a pump starts so large holders can cash out at the inevitable peak.

 In contrast POS is ironically if done properly potentially more fair than POW ie 1$ = an equal % of a new coin. So therefore mining neither serves the purpose of even distribution and at the same time consumes massive amounts of energy in the process....How do you like those apples?

[Isildur23]

Ok, this charade got me genuinely intrigued and so did the dotNXT wallet software.

So tell me. Besides your own self-interest of holding Nxt and wanting to pump it, please explain me how is Nxt better than a hybrid PoW/PoS coin without IPO, when mining ends. Is anyone really pro-Nxt without having some and making a speculative bet it will hold?

Then I don't get what kind of people are against Bitcoin and annoyed than Nxt is not valued at bitcointalk !? Besides you're against other alts, against mining (I get the nice PoS but otoh even teens with a decent gaming PC can mine), you're against anyone that mentions the obscure IPO. Now I've read Nxt is closed source and with bad official Java software.

Let's see if you manage to address the points without ad hominems and deflections.

You can have alt coins with mining on top of Nxt. Actually, very soon you will see one that is quite impressive.

IPO ran for a long time and everyone who wanted to buy did it and got his coins, there were no restrictions and it was quite cheap. Besides, distribution doesn't matter because everyone's ROI is the same, no matter how much he has. And Nxt is protected versus a 90+% attack so distribution is irrelevant.

You can test the decentralised asset exchange in a testnet and soon you will be able to  trade on it.

No other coin can handle as much transations per second as Nxt.

If this is not enough for you, you are just a troll, sorry

[Wipeout2097]

Its ironic that the biggest support POW coins get is the 'fairness' of mining when actually it is with the current situation where some can afford and understand the technicalities to acquire massively unequal amounts of coins the most loop sided unequal distribution for any newbie to the Cryptocurrency world. Mined coins almost instantly get put on exchanges and a pump starts so large holders can cash out at the inevitable peak.

 In contrast POS is ironically if done properly potentially more fair than POW ie 1$ = an equal % of a new coin. So therefore mining neither serves the purpose of even distribution and at the same time consumes massive amounts of energy in the process....How do you like those apples?

PoS is not the matter, the matter is precisely the closed-source IPO'ed Nxt. And btw, how do I know it doesnt include malware??

I'm aware of the advantages of PoS, they were discussed a few times, there are other coins with PoS, that isn't even a Nxt innovation.

Then I get the power usage. Good point. I hope you Nxt holders drive hybrid cars and stay away from SUVs too.

If this is not enough for you, you are just a troll, sorry

Address all the points I made in this thread. Then it will be enough.

I gave the example of someone I made an enthusiast of crypto and didn't have access to the IPO, and after you say it was fair and known by everyone. Do you really want me to take you seriously?

[relm9]

PoS is not the matter, the matter is precisely the closed-source IPO'ed Nxt. And btw, how do I know it doesnt include malware??

Source of 0.4.7 was officially made public last month. Still since it's a Java app, you can decompile the latest version with a few clicks and get all the readable code. The devs do not obfuscate the code, unlike some other competitors (eMunie). Anyway, do you think exchanges like Bter and Vircurex would add it if the client actually had malware... c'mon now.

Anyways, if everything felt right about NXT, price would already be sky high. So the time to get in is now when there's still people dismissing it on silly things like the app being Java based, uncomfortable GUI etc.