MoonShadow (OP)
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February 11, 2014, 08:43:35 PM |
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I've been thinking about this one for some time, and I have an early proposal that I'd like to flesh out with the brainiacs to see if there are any glaring errors that I've made, before I make a formal purposal to the FCC. No, I'm not joking.
My proposal is to carve out a tiny 'band' about 12 kilohertz wide, centered at 27.095 Mhtz. The radio heads will notice straight away that this is in the gap between channel #11 and #12 in the old Citizens' Band in the United States. The reason there is such a gap there at all is because there is still a licensed remote controlled device frequency there. I'm pretty sure that no serious remote controlled devices still use this frequency, since there are newer and more useful remote control bands in the 440 Mhz range. If you have a device that uses this channel, it likely has one of those control pads with the huge pull out antenna. If it has a "rubber ducky" antenna, or is shorter than 2 feet long, it's probably a 440 Mhz channeled device.
I propose that Quadrature Phase Shift Keying be employed, with forward error correction. Between 27.089 Mhz and 27.091 Mhz would be as set of live "keyboard to keyboard" channels, each using a 100 Hz wide spectrum using transmission mode of PSK31 or QPSK31. This yields 20 distinct channels within this 2 kilohertz wide band. Transmittion powers would be limited to 1/2 watt peak envelope power in this section.
In the remaining 10kHtz wide section, between 27.091 and 27.101 would be a set of five 'datagram' channels wherein automatic rules based transmission and encoding would be required. Each of these channels would be 2KHtz wide, and require the use of QPSK1000. Within these channels, node to node or node to many broadcasts would be permitted; but a basic set of crash avoidance rules, similar to packet radio, would be expected of all players. A single packet broadcast would be limited to 20 seconds, including preamble data and payload data, followed by a short postcode to let all other nodes know that the transmission is complete. This should be large enough of a packet size that a normal sized transaction could fit into a single packet. Other forms of datagrams would be permitted as well. Peak Envelope Power in this section would be limited to 2 watts. Packets do not require a destination node address, and any node listening that hears a datagram (such as a bitcoin transaction) can act upon that datagram depending upon it's configuration. Alternatively, packets can contain gps directional information, and nodes would be permitted to "digipete" datagrams that it sees if it lays within 15% of the great circle path between the sender's gps code and the destination node's expected GPS code and/or the repeating node is within 100 kilometers of the destination node's expected GPS code. This service would be "bursty" by design, and network protocols that require that content-less datagrams be broadcast (for the purpose of maintaining a virtual "circut" or persistant data connection, for example) are prohibited.
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"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."
- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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drrussellshane
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February 11, 2014, 08:55:11 PM |
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Very interesting!
I have enjoyed your posts for years, and this thread is the sort of reason why.
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Buy a TREZOR! Premier BTC hardware wallet. If you're reading this, you should probably buy one if you don't already have one. You'll thank me later.
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MoonShadow (OP)
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February 11, 2014, 09:11:14 PM |
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Thank you. I expect that I'll be fleshing out a blockchain datacasting proposal as well in the near future, based upon Digital Radio Mondiale. The idea being that disconnected nodes can listen for blockchain updates from any number of DRM broadcasters across the medium or shortwave bands (or even DRM+ channels in the FM band, if that ever happens) as well as broadcast both their own transactions to whomever may be listening. The current purposal would also permit, with some modifications, an Electrum server within a 100 klick range to respond to requests. It's extremely unlikely that the FCC would permit encrypted datagrams, but since no Bitcoin network objects require encryption as such, that should be okay.
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"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."
- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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MoonShadow (OP)
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February 11, 2014, 09:20:45 PM |
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Alternately, the PSK31 channels could be interlaced with the QPSK1000 channels, permitting 12 datagram channels and (with one PSK31 channel at the farthest 100 Hz on either side of each datagram channel) 24 live keyboard channels. I doubt that a proper QPSK1000 signal is going to step on a full 2KHtz wide spectrum, but I rounded up the spaces so that they would fit well. Interlacing would be a more efficient use of the spectrum anyway.
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"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."
- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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MoonShadow (OP)
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February 11, 2014, 10:12:32 PM |
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Notablely, there is a 4.8 Mhtz wide gap of useful spectrum in the GRMS/FRS band, situated between the simplex channels and the paired repeater input channels. Between 462.7250 Mhtz (channel 22) and 467.5500 Mhtz. And the channel spacing between the GRMS center frequencies are 125 Khtz wide but the channel is only permitted a 25 Khtz FM signal; which leaves at least 50Khtz of useful spectrum between each channel. I don't know what these gaps are there for, but I'd wager that the 4.8 Mhtz gap is already allocated for something, I just don't know what.
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"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."
- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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MoonShadow (OP)
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February 11, 2014, 10:26:04 PM |
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I chose a total bandwidth of 12 Khtz wide, even though the space is probably 20 KHtz wide, because 12KHtz is the common passband of generic computer soundcards. This would permit a station using consumer grade computer gear to listen to the entire band at the same time, while still being able to distingish between individual datagrams with overlapping broadcast times. Better soundcards can listen to wider slices of spectrum, but I'm shooting for cheap here.
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"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."
- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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MoonShadow (OP)
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February 12, 2014, 09:13:51 PM |
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Bump.
Still looking for commentary from the radio geeks.
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"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."
- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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RodeoX
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The revolution will be monetized!
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February 12, 2014, 09:21:24 PM |
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Me likey likey!  I'm watching this. Please do update if a test is run. |
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Nagle
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February 12, 2014, 10:14:17 PM |
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27MHz is still used for some industrial radio control. There's been some interest from the quadrotor crowd, who want more range, but they seem to be using 35MHz instead. The only big problem with 27MHz seems to be spillover from CB.
The receiver should probably just suck up the whole band and receive all the channels simultaneously, looking for packets of interest. Then no configuration is necessary. That will require a software-defined radio, but there are cheap chips for that now. There are boards available, but they usually won't go as low as 27MHz, because they're intended for cable TV.
The problem with all this is that it will take a reasonably good antenna to have any range, and nobody will put up big antennas any more.
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BitDreams
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February 12, 2014, 11:21:43 PM |
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Please copy the U.S. Post Office research department. Those ponies will need some beacons for the ride.
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MoonShadow (OP)
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February 13, 2014, 03:23:01 PM |
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Please copy the U.S. Post Office research department. Those ponies will need some beacons for the ride.
If you are calling my idea a throwback, that's part of the point. Using less desirable spectrum in a novel manner is more likely to get approved than to attempt the same thing in the UHF or microwave bands. As to the issue about interference from overpowered CB's, that's part of the reason for choosing very narrow bandwidths and phase shift keying has proven itself to be a very noise resilient mode on the shortwave ham bands. PSK is so very different than AM or SSB spatter noise that it's often distingishable even in an otherwise noisy environment. A quarter watt is a lot for PSK31 when your groundwave only has an expected radio horizen of about 10 miles. |
"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."
- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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BitDreams
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February 13, 2014, 05:44:27 PM |
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I believe it is a great idea and am enthused further by the interest shown by the U.S. Post Office targeting the 'underserved' and your idea complicates that wonderfully. If you could somehow get a nod from the post office acknowledging how your proposal is aligned with their research I think it would be fantastic. As advanced as the US is in many regards, our broadband infrastructure is lacking and your goals and the Post Office goals compliment each other well. If it was my decision to make, each Post Office in the US would be outfitted with repeaters using your solution. http://www.uspsoig.gov/sites/default/files/document-library-files/2014/rarc-wp-14-007.pdf |
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Nagle
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February 13, 2014, 06:51:21 PM |
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This is what's called a "wireless mesh network". It's been done before. Dewayne Hendricks used to have a company called "Tetherless Access" which, about 20 years ago, was going to build distributed radio networks something like this. He turned out to be all talk and no hardware. Then in the mid-1990s there was Ricochet Networks, which put little repeater nodes on street lights. These standalone units forwarded packets until they reached a station with a wired connection to the Internet. Worked in the 900 MHz band. That worked fine, and was deployed in several cities. I used to use their system. You could get internet access at about 15Kb/s, later upgraded to about 50Kb/s. So that went out when DSL came in. More recently, there's Freifunk, a low-cost wireless network for rural areas being used in Zaire. The basic problems are this: - To get much range, at least one end of each link must have a decent antenna, up high in clear space and aimed in the right direction. It's better if both ends do. Building networks this way in rural areas works fine, if you can get line of sight to the next station. - Short-range ad-hoc wireless mesh networks have been successful, but they need a lot of nodes in a small area. There are WiFi booster systems which network in this way. That works fine, too. - What doesn't work are sparsely distributed indoor antenna devices. Now, doing this in a lower band might work, but would take more RF power than Part 15 gear. The biggest headache is simply antenna location. If you can get people to put a whip antenna on their roof, this can work. |
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MoonShadow (OP)
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February 14, 2014, 01:37:49 AM |
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Now, doing this in a lower band might work, but would take more RF power than Part 15 gear.
Yes, it would take more power than a Part 15 device is permitted. My suggested power limits are way over Part 15 limits, which is why I need to have a proposal at all. If I could use Part 15 power limits and make it work, I wouldn't need the blessing of the FCC. This was the root problem of a great many of the mesh networks that have been tried before, Part 15 device power levels just can't get any useful distance. Combined with the fact that 2.45 GHz is an awful band for range anyway, and 900 Mhz isn't a whole lot better. There is a corrolary between interference and range; because (generally speaking) the lower the frequency, the lower the attenuation rate of the ground wave. This is why a legal limit CB transceiver can communicate over the visible horizon, and anything over 30 Mhz generally cannot. Since such bands can travel farther via groundwave, you are more likely to experience manmade interference regardless of the current reflectivity of the ionosphere. BTW, the first 6 channels of the 2.45 Ghz wifi band overlaps a ham radio band, and some hams use Part 95 power limit rules to make some truely awesome mesh networks from commercial gear. http://www.broadband-hamnet.org/ |
"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."
- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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MoonShadow (OP)
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February 18, 2014, 07:54:56 AM |
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bump
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"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."
- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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bitpop
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February 18, 2014, 09:50:22 AM |
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I'll run a node
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MoonShadow (OP)
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February 19, 2014, 10:08:38 PM |
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The filing isn't quite done, but I have the frequency allocation proposal finished. It's filling number with the FCC is 0158-EX-PL-2014, if anyone is interested. I filed it as an experimental license application, because there really wasn't a better method. The FCC doesn't have a method for suggesting completely new ideas.
I'm thinking of calling it a "slow mesh" until I have a better name for it. Any ideas?
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"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."
- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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EricKennedy
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February 19, 2014, 10:22:51 PM |
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What would be the expected use cases ? To be able to transmit transactions in areas where you cannot get any cell signal ?
Like buying some goods from a traveler in remote mountains ?
Let's say I want to pay with bitcoins, I build the transaction and broadcast it to the network using my portable CB.
How will a node acknowledge and prove to me the transaction has been correctly transmitted to the Bitcoin network ?
Without non taintable proof, I cannot finish the transaction and take the good.
I like very much the idea of backup channels, to be able to use cryptos even if govt shut down the cell towers etc.
Eric
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MoonShadow (OP)
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February 19, 2014, 10:53:13 PM |
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What would be the expected use cases ? To be able to transmit transactions in areas where you cannot get any cell signal ?
Like buying some goods from a traveler in remote mountains ?
That would be a use case, but certainly not the only one. Let's say I want to pay with bitcoins, I build the transaction and broadcast it to the network using my portable CB.
How will a node acknowledge and prove to me the transaction has been correctly transmitted to the Bitcoin network ?
That would require a back channel, if you needed to know. Such a back channel could be a datacast stream from a DRM station (if you're patient) or an alternative service, such as Iridium Burst. Without non taintable proof, I cannot finish the transaction and take the good.
Not with a full client, no. The white paper does describe a 'light' style client with a reduced security model that could do offline transactions with limitations. For example, the device would need to be able to communicate with the other light client, which is one use case of my proposal. Additionally, the light client would need occasional access to a gateway node, in order to update it's wallet.dat; otherwise it would eventually run out of spendable inputs.
I like very much the idea of backup channels, to be able to use cryptos even if govt shut down the cell towers etc.
It's not really intended as a 'fallback' method. It's intended as a primary communications method between portable, hardware based light clients; i.e. the kind that are not simply an app on a smartphone. Additionally, it's intended as an efficient & mostly automatic digital communications mode. Imagine if you had a device that could send and receive texts to/from people that you have already met IRL to a distance of 5+ miles radius in a single hop, but could also use multi-hop methods to cross a moderate sized city. Without any kind of ongoing licesnsing or service fees. A pocket sized device that is a cross between a texting FRS radio and a hardware wallet, that may or may not have a cell service data plan of it's own. There are other use cases for a 'slow mesh' as well. |
"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."
- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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Nagle
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February 20, 2014, 02:26:13 AM |
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The filing isn't quite done, but I have the frequency allocation proposal finished. It's filling number with the FCC is 0158-EX-PL-2014, if anyone is interested. I filed it as an experimental license application, because there really wasn't a better method. The FCC doesn't have a method for suggesting completely new ideas. That's how the FCC does do new ideas. Digital AM radio and digital cellular telephony started under experimental licenses. You usually get two years, with a possible 5 year extension. If you propose a geographical limit on your stations, it's more likely to be approved, because applications are checked against a database of every other licensed service for conflicts. If you don't limit, you'll get a conflict with any other 27MHz station in the US. |
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