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Author Topic: Satoshi's 20,000 BTC?  (Read 3596 times)
Elwar
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October 05, 2011, 11:42:11 AM
 #1

Why are people saying that Satoshi has 20,000 BTC held up that he could dump at any time?

According to this video there are no huge spikes early on in the blockchain:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9q3UtmhR9G8

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October 05, 2011, 01:19:14 PM
 #2

Satoshi probably has ten times that amount, or more.

As for people being afraid about it, it's the same reason children fear the bogeyman under the bed; utterly irrational.

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October 05, 2011, 01:23:56 PM
 #3

Satoshi probably has ten times that amount, or more.

As for people being afraid about it, it's the same reason children fear the bogeyman under the bed; utterly irrational.

Of course. Just like the boogeyman, Satoshi doesn't actually exist. There's a small group of early adoptors though, who all have 300k+ bitcoins, who could all singlehandedly wreck bitcoin at any moment they choose. If you have to be affraid of it or not is another question though.

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October 05, 2011, 01:28:04 PM
 #4

Satoshi probably has ten times that amount, or more.

As for people being afraid about it, it's the same reason children fear the bogeyman under the bed; utterly irrational.

Of course. Just like the boogeyman, Satoshi doesn't actually exist. There's a small group of early adoptors though, who all have 300k+ bitcoins, who could all singlehandedly wreck bitcoin at any moment they choose. If you have to be affraid of it or not is another question though.

It's not the early adopters holding large amounts of BTC that it's rational to worry about. After all, these people generally have a very strong incentive to continue holding it. The people that it's rational to worry about are those who have large amounts of USD and could singlehandedly wreck Bitcoin whenever they want.

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October 05, 2011, 01:36:46 PM
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Satoshi probably has ten times that amount, or more.

As for people being afraid about it, it's the same reason children fear the bogeyman under the bed; utterly irrational.

Of course. Just like the boogeyman, Satoshi doesn't actually exist. There's a small group of early adoptors though, who all have 300k+ bitcoins, who could all singlehandedly wreck bitcoin at any moment they choose. If you have to be affraid of it or not is another question though.

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October 05, 2011, 01:55:02 PM
 #6

Satoshi probably has ten times that amount, or more.

As for people being afraid about it, it's the same reason children fear the bogeyman under the bed; utterly irrational.

Of course. Just like the boogeyman, Satoshi doesn't actually exist. There's a small group of early adoptors though, who all have 300k+ bitcoins, who could all singlehandedly wreck bitcoin temporarily at any moment they choose. If you have to be affraid of it or not is another question though.

but they could only do it once.

after that, the 300,000 coins would have been distributed more evenly thereby giving up the power to do it again.

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October 05, 2011, 02:30:17 PM
 #7


but they could only do it once.

after that, the 300,000 coins would have been distributed more evenly thereby giving up the power to do it again.



That is like saying that you can only kill a person once. After killing me, you'd never have the power to do it again. Does that make me the winner or the loser?

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October 05, 2011, 02:40:34 PM
 #8


but they could only do it once.

after that, the 300,000 coins would have been distributed more evenly thereby giving up the power to do it again.



That is like saying that you can only kill a person once. After killing me, you'd never have the power to do it again. Does that make me the winner or the loser?

i already decided a while ago which one you were actually.

but silly me took you off 'ignore' for this thread.
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October 05, 2011, 03:22:04 PM
 #9

There's a small group of early adoptors though, who all have 300k+ bitcoins, who could all singlehandedly wreck bitcoin at any moment they choose.

Selling off 300K BTC would drive the price down sharply - I wonder how low? maybe to $1, maybe lower.

I don't think it would wreck Bitcoin though. Bitcoin remains an excellent method of payment irrespective of the value of a Bitcoin, so long as it has some value and there are exchanges. Given the size of the the existing network, it will always have a non-zero value and therefore remain useful as a method of payment.

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October 05, 2011, 03:31:26 PM
 #10

it would crash for that week...  maybe 2 weeks...  but it would recover to an extent...   it's not something that one should worry about long term for bitcoins...  as I repeatedly have stated 10,000 times before...   we print more every month than the early adopters most likely have total.

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October 05, 2011, 06:04:05 PM
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it would crash for that week...  maybe 2 weeks...  but it would recover to an extent...   it's not something that one should worry about long term for bitcoins...  as I repeatedly have stated 10,000 times before...   we print more every month than the early adopters most likely have total.


Fiat money is regularly used by the mass of the population every day. BTC is, for the moment, regularly used only by a small cabal of nerds and drug dealers. There is quite a difference in what each can support.

I agree with error that this is a market anyone with a lot of USD could crash overnight; however, that doesn't negate the risk posed by early hoarders either as we know nothing concrete concerning their long term intentions or ethics. Investing in BTC is, at the end of the day, incredibly risky, but so is investing in any fiat currency long term.
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October 05, 2011, 06:18:33 PM
 #12

There's a small group of early adoptors though, who all have 300k+ bitcoins

It does not appear from the video that there is any early adopter holding a huge amount of Bitcoins.

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October 05, 2011, 06:21:23 PM
 #13

There's a small group of early adoptors though, who all have 300k+ bitcoins

It does not appear from the video that there is any early adopter holding a huge amount of Bitcoins.
Afaik, satoshi has 1.6 million bitcoins.

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October 05, 2011, 07:19:02 PM
 #14

There's a small group of early adoptors though, who all have 300k+ bitcoins

It does not appear from the video that there is any early adopter holding a huge amount of Bitcoins.
Afaik, satoshi has 1.6 million bitcoins.

I doubt it,   if he horded that many bitcoins it would be worth 50 dollars each,  not 5.


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October 05, 2011, 07:36:56 PM
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Afaik, satoshi has 1.6 million bitcoins.
That's highly implausible - there were a couple of peers in the network right from the start, so even if there were only 3 people on average mining for the first year, each would not have made much more than 800k.

Also, this is more or less a one-time card "he" could play and Bitcoin is so thinly traded anyway that everybody using it as a currency must be prepared for huge short-term price changes.

Although this topic pops up every once in a while, it is really a non-issue.
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October 05, 2011, 07:44:25 PM
 #16

Although this topic pops up every once in a while, it is really a non-issue.

I still say its an issue because there is no work being done by those problem hoarders. The bitcoin equation right now is that the poor do the work for the rich...and that just holds bitcoin down. If Satoshi exists and has that many coins, or anyone with that many, should be spending those coins on infrastructure that gives bitcoins an economy. They would have less coins, but likely be worth more....but they dont care. Thats quite apparent from their lack of action over bitcoin's decline.
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October 05, 2011, 07:47:54 PM
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I still say its an issue because there is no work being done by those problem hoarders. The bitcoin equation right now is that the poor do the work for the rich...and that just holds bitcoin down. If Satoshi exists and has that many coins, or anyone with that many, should be spending those coins on infrastructure that gives bitcoins an economy. They would have less coins, but likely be worth more....but they dont care. Thats quite apparent from their lack of action over bitcoin's decline.

If you don't like it, don't use Bitcoin.
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October 05, 2011, 07:49:14 PM
 #18

Satoshi probably has ten times that amount, or more.

As for people being afraid about it, it's the same reason children fear the bogeyman under the bed; utterly irrational.

Of course. Just like the boogeyman, Satoshi doesn't actually exist. There's a small group of early adoptors though, who all have 300k+ bitcoins, who could all singlehandedly wreck bitcoin at any moment they choose. If you have to be affraid of it or not is another question though.

It's not the early adopters holding large amounts of BTC that it's rational to worry about. After all, these people generally have a very strong incentive to continue holding it. The people that it's rational to worry about are those who have large amounts of USD and could singlehandedly wreck Bitcoin whenever they want.

Yep the government need not spend millions on ATI cards. All they have to do is this :

1. Drive down the price
2. Miners quit
3. Network is weak
4. Government can attack it and mess it up without spending a lot of money
5. Huh
6. Profit for the government !
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October 05, 2011, 08:05:04 PM
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yet another reason why we need a new system that punishes people that hoard.

i firmly believe that you should not be able to make money simply by having money, it just does not make sense to me. and others think the same, the Christians thought it was usury and the Islam people do too. i think it is a broken system, and needs to be stopped inside the currency its self. although i don't know how loaning would work. but i always go by the principal of save instead of get credit for it. for a rough example

take a 165k house for 360 months loan or 30 years at 7% interest. you would pay about 1100 a month. however if you took that 1100 a month and stashed it away every month for 150 months, you could buy that house right up front, and not give any money to the banks.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_banking
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usury

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October 05, 2011, 08:12:11 PM
 #20

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I still say its an issue because there is no work being done by those problem hoarders.
...
they dont care. Thats quite apparent from their lack of action over bitcoin's decline.
Bitcoin declining? Au contraire - it's still growing nicely at a pretty steady 50 BTC every 10 minutes Wink

Seriously though, there's absolutely no way you can back up this statement - you don't know what Satoshi or any other "hoarder" does for Bitcoin.

The more BTC one has, the higher his/her incentive to help Bitcoin succeed. Apart from this natural tendency there's nothing you can do really to force people to contribute or determine what they have to do with their money.
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