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Author Topic: Fork Bitcoin with a new Core that has no miner's fees.  (Read 129 times)
BADecker
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July 20, 2018, 03:48:06 PM
 #1

How about forking Core so that there are no miner's fees? Would anybody use it? Has it been done? Would it work? How long would it take to catch on?

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July 22, 2018, 02:10:25 PM
 #2

It's not going to work and it would be just a matter of time until miners stop mining it. Miners may start getting block rewards at first but once that's over, they won't be getting anything so they'll stop mining and that will give us a vulnerable network, not to mention the spam attacks that could occur etc.


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BrewMaster
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July 22, 2018, 03:30:07 PM
 #3

How about forking Core
you meant to say fork "bitcoin" right?!

Quote
so that there are no miner's fees?
fee is not a consensus rule it is set by the users and miners. in other words bitcoin has no fee it is miners that reject 0 fee transactions and it is nodes that don't relay 0 fee transactions and it is users that pay fee. if they decide to do otherwise it will BE otherwise!

 if you run a node then just set minrelaytxfee to 0 and if you are  a miner then stop rejecting  0 fee transactions. now you have bitcoin with no fee but  consequences...


... once that's over, ...
it won't be over for many years!

BTCCavalletto
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July 23, 2018, 08:30:26 AM
 #4

FORK or Garstro Advisor came first in my eyes today seeing your post. But after studying it is a social platform supporting reaurants and dinning etc. It has a low hype. It has not started yet it will start from sept 03 2018 to October 31 2018. I will suggest you research before you invest in this project.
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July 23, 2018, 08:31:30 AM
 #5

As far as I know it has not been done yet. And I think since some people get paid for mining it, it's their job and they'd lose it if that happens. That way a source of earning for a number of people would be eliminated which would gradually affect the community.
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July 23, 2018, 08:35:46 AM
 #6

Forking a chain is not a good things to do because it leads to panic to new holder that do not know what they are doing or they can actually do.

So in the case you wnat to start your own coin, feel free, it's not so difficult right now, there are a plenty of great developers out there, but do it with your own community, and not try to gain extra visibility forking another because it just let others dump
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July 23, 2018, 11:57:37 AM
 #7

Bitcoin's median transaction fee lowest since 2011. I haven't really heard much on the idea, but hoping to see if it will work or not.
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July 23, 2018, 12:02:01 PM
 #8

Fork Bitcoin is coming new and without the miner fee it looks really good to me. But they have not seen much about how they are doing. If anyone knows, then share it. I would like to know more about Fortk Bitcoin Miner's Fee.
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July 23, 2018, 12:13:38 PM
 #9

As BrewMaster already pointed out, the fee you pay with your transaction is not defined in the consensus rules.
It is a voluntary fee to priorize your transactions over others.


A simple PoW chain without any fees won't work. Fees are used inside the ecosystem to counteract spam attacks.
You would need a different approach to get your network secured against spam attacks. Simply removing fees won't lead to a healthy network.

As long as you don't have any other viable solution against spam attacks (and other frequent attack vectors), your idea will fail.

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July 23, 2018, 12:25:28 PM
 #10

in my personal opinion, miners fee is one of the important things in blockchain, because without miners no one can mine a single hash to create an transaction. this is like a maintenance fee, without maintenance, the savings of the project had to use to cover up the fee in all transactions, and this one of the reasons why new projects falls.

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July 23, 2018, 12:45:24 PM
 #11

There are bitcoin cash and bitcoin gold if we are talking about forks but haven't heard of forks where you don't have to pay the miners, rather they are trying to come up with cores that will help the miners more, like SegWit.
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July 23, 2018, 12:49:47 PM
 #12

Forking a chain is not a good things to do because it leads to panic to new holder that do not know what they are doing or they can actually do.

So in the case you wnat to start your own coin, feel free, it's not so difficult right now, there are a plenty of great developers out there, but do it with your own community, and not try to gain extra visibility forking another because it just let others dump


Bitcoin gets forked all the time and people don't even know about it, it's not a big deal at all imo.
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July 23, 2018, 01:01:54 PM
 #13

How about forking Core
you meant to say fork "bitcoin" right?!

Quote
so that there are no miner's fees?
fee is not a consensus rule it is set by the users and miners. in other words bitcoin has no fee it is miners that reject 0 fee transactions and it is nodes that don't relay 0 fee transactions and it is users that pay fee. if they decide to do otherwise it will BE otherwise!

 if you run a node then just set minrelaytxfee to 0 and if you are  a miner then stop rejecting  0 fee transactions. now you have bitcoin with no fee but  consequences...


... once that's over, ...
it won't be over for many years!

This is the best answer yet. You don't need to fork Bitcoin, you can already start mining or relaying transactions with no fee. But without a proper incentives structure, nobody would be doing it, because it takes resources to mine and to relay transactions and you want to be rewarded for your effort.

This is one of the main explanations why socialism doesn't work. In theory, if everyone would work for the benefit of others and would only consume what they need, you would be able to have a socialist utopia. But we are humans and incentives matter. And if you build a system with the wrong incentives, it will crumble.

This is why bitcoin is such a great thing. It allows complete strangers to work together for a common goal, because their incentives are aligned and the punishment for non-compliance is swift. 
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July 23, 2018, 01:41:13 PM
 #14

It would be too difficult to move away from Core.   A forked coin will never compete with bitcoin.  The OG bitcoin has too large of a dominance and adoption rate.  People would be hesitant to trust a new coin when they can trust a coin that's been around for 10 years.

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July 23, 2018, 01:41:23 PM
 #15

We have LN making sure we don't have to deal with rogue miners, and with global deployment people will not have much incentive to cash out to the mainchain anymore.

Bitcoin's mainchain is to transfer digital Gold, which people gladly pay any fee for, where the second layer will make sure people can utilize Bitcoin's money aspect.

On top of that, miners are pretty much shooting themselves in the foot with their big block nonsense, because the smaller the blocks are, the higher their fee income will be, which throughout the years will be their main source of income. Killing off higher fee income with larger blocks means killing off potential income.

Try send zero (0) fee transactions through BCash, the miners will ignore your transaction all day long, especially if it is only $1-$2 worth. Enough block space but no will to pick up transactions that could have been from people paying for a cup of coffee somewhere. Roll Eyes

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July 23, 2018, 01:44:13 PM
 #16

Bitcoin cores are focusing more on miner's fee since its their right. I haven't heard of forks where they ignore miners' fees but it is very unlikely to get introduced,
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July 24, 2018, 02:03:16 PM
 #17

People have already said that it's impossible for the most part, but even if we assume that it is, I don't think it will be very attractive. Plenty of coins that can do essentially the same things as Bitcoin but with lower fees have been in the market for a while now, but that obviously isn't enough to get them to switch. Fees are also dirt cheap under normal conditions (which improvements are trying to maintain indefinitely) that paying them is essentially negligible, and that you may as well have a way to help your transactions confirm faster.

Bottom line is that Bitcoin is popular for the sum of its parts, not just individual parts.

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July 24, 2018, 02:20:38 PM
 #18

How about forking Core
you meant to say fork "bitcoin" right?!
There are two versions of Bitcoin.  There is Bitcoin Core.  And there is Bitcoin Cash.  This guy proposes to fork Core.  Bitcoin Cash already has near zero fees. 

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July 24, 2018, 02:57:50 PM
 #19

How about forking Core
you meant to say fork "bitcoin" right?!
There are two versions of Bitcoin.  There is Bitcoin Core.  And there is Bitcoin Cash.  This guy proposes to fork Core.  Bitcoin Cash already has near zero fees. 

there are many altcoins out there called a lot of names that include bitcoin such as bitcoin core, bitcoin cash, bitcoin dark, bitcoin gold,... what OP is talking about is bitcoin. it doesn't have any trailing words.

as for BCash fee, it doesn't have near zero fees it has the exact same fee and fee mechanism as bitcoin meaning minimum fee is 1 satoshi/byte and when blocks are full it grows as it grew a couple of months ago when someone spam attacked Bcash for 2 days for fun Wink

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July 25, 2018, 12:50:29 PM
 #20

bitcoin can not stand without fees which are the second reason why miners work cpu (the first reason is the mining itself of bitcoins). If there are no more coins to be undermined, only the fees will be the incentive. They can't be there.

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