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Author Topic: Canceling all cards, closing accounts, and moving to bitcoin  (Read 2159 times)
AmpEater
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March 23, 2011, 06:23:39 PM
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So I just got off the phone with the chase credit card devision, I let them know I was done with my card and I'd like my account closed.  Turns out I had $80 USD in rewards that are being sent to me as a check. This means I'm $80 closer to paying off the next card!

I had thought, like so many before me I'm sure, that I'd only use credit cards for "emergencies" or to ease buying large items on the internet.  Turns out human nature and "plastic money" dont mix, especially when one occasionally enjoys using the internet while drinking Smiley  It didnt take long for me to rack up more debt than I could pay down in a month, then in 2 months, etc. You know the story.

So I'm breaking the cycle.  I'm paying down cards one by one and cutting them up.  

Obviously I need an alternative, a positive-balance only, exchange-for-cash-able medium for digital fund transfer.  Paypal is an obvious choice, but like so many others I've had problems with them freezing my account for nothing, siding with fraudulent buyers more than once (out of hundreds/thousands of transactions, to be fair). Not a great place to keep money.  So....Bitcoin to the rescue!

I pay my electricity/heat bill and house payments in cash.  
I own my own vehicles and bikes (ebikes), do not ever intend to finance a vehicle  
I have gardened in the past and intend to grow much of of own food this coming year...plus I can buy groceries in cash
I trade on the internet, buy and sell lots of electronics/mechanical items/tools

So....what am I missing? Why do I need credit cards? Why do I need a checking account?  Can't cash + bitcoin do everything I need? What do I need to think of other than much strong wallet backup/security procedures?  How many would need to do the same before that core community attracted new buisness all itself?
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theGECK
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March 23, 2011, 06:26:03 PM
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The only benefit credit cards/checking account gives you is the protections the card can give you on your purchases, and the ability to hold large sums of money without worrying about it getting stolen in your account. If you don't do either of these things, cash is better, since it has been proven you spend less with cash.

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Jered Kenna (TradeHill)
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March 23, 2011, 07:08:07 PM
 #3

Awesome man, track it with a blog or at least this post.
It should be an interesting journey.

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RodeoX
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March 23, 2011, 07:21:20 PM
 #4

You go AmpEater! It wasn't until I saw how easy it is to get into debt with a card that I got serious. Now I use cash for almost everything.
  • I would also add:
    I don't do deals. I make deals and contracts, I almost never sign them.
    I avoid fees or long term payments. Netflix, not cable. prepaid phones, not service plans. etc.
    I don't buy things that require my "information". Unless your coming to my birthday party, you won't need to know me.
 

Lastly, I let them know why I'm dropping them. Last week I emailed PayPal to tell them Bitcoins just made them obsolete. Cool


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FatherMcGruder
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March 23, 2011, 07:37:57 PM
 #5

So....what am I missing?
Do you have an employer?

Use my Trade Hill referral code: TH-R11519

Check out bitcoinity.org and Ripple.

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Scorpion
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March 23, 2011, 07:41:27 PM
 #6

I need to do the same thing, I will cut all my CC's and pay off my debts. I'll never again buy anything I can't afford - time to stop being a slave to banks and the Fed.
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March 23, 2011, 07:52:05 PM
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Personally I'm too risk-averse to keep any significant* sums in BTC. Too much volatility at the moment for me to consider it a savings account. I see it as a high-risk investment.

*significant is a personal definition, of course. For me around 50% of my monthly income seems about the max I'm willing to have in BTC at any given time.

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Jered Kenna (TradeHill)
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March 23, 2011, 07:56:12 PM
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Personally I'm too risk-averse to keep any significant* sums in BTC. Too much volatility at the moment for me to consider it a savings account. I see it as a high-risk investment.

*significant is a personal definition, of course. For me around 50% of my monthly income seems about the max I'm willing to have in BTC at any given time.

It's scary, at least it's stable enough that if you want to buy or sell something in it then convert it to fiat you're not going to lose 20% in half a day. I anticipate that it's going to stay volatile for quite a while too.

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AmpEater
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March 23, 2011, 08:13:23 PM
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So....what am I missing?
Do you have an employer?

Self employed....mostly I work on my numerous electric vehicle projects and sell one occasionally to keep the cycle going.  Sometimes I'll buy large lots of parts wholesale, use some and sell the others on ebay/forums.  Buy other failed projects cheaply, etc, etc

Plus I intend to roll my numerous hobbies into at least one legitimate buisness in the near term. Probably something to do with electric vehicles Smiley But I've got other ideas sloshing around too.

"suit and tie" style jobs are for suckers

I need to do the same thing, I will cut all my CC's and pay off my debts. I'll never again buy anything I can't afford - time to stop being a slave to banks and the Fed.

Amen brother!  Its not so hard, just 1 card at a time.  Pay it off, cut it up. Pay it off, cut it up.  Also....go throw some seeds in the dirt! Squash, pumpkins, swiss chard, peas all practically grow themselves.   You wont know what to do with it all (get a few chickens).  

Personally I'm too risk-averse to keep any significant* sums in BTC. Too much volatility at the moment for me to consider it a savings account. I see it as a high-risk investment.

*significant is a personal definition, of course. For me around 50% of my monthly income seems about the max I'm willing to have in BTC at any given time.

Its only volatile short term.....long term the swings dont matter so much, so long as you have the same basic amount.  The dollar swings around versus other currencies but you don't go trading them all for Euros when there is a dip.
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March 23, 2011, 08:20:04 PM
 #10

The dollar swings around versus other currencies but you don't go trading them all for Euros when there is a dip.

It swings, but nothing like as much as BTC. The risk of total loss is much higher with BTC in my opinion, which is why I don't want to have any more funds tied up in BTC than I'm willing to risk losing altogether.

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FatherMcGruder
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March 23, 2011, 08:34:58 PM
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Self employed....mostly I work on my numerous electric vehicle projects and sell one occasionally to keep the cycle going.  Sometimes I'll buy large lots of parts wholesale, use some and sell the others on ebay/forums.  Buy other failed projects cheaply, etc, etc

Plus I intend to roll my numerous hobbies into at least one legitimate buisness in the near term. Probably something to do with electric vehicles Smiley But I've got other ideas sloshing around too.
Awesome! I dare you to sell one for bitcoins.

Use my Trade Hill referral code: TH-R11519

Check out bitcoinity.org and Ripple.

Shameless display of my bitcoin address:
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Jered Kenna (TradeHill)
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March 23, 2011, 08:55:29 PM
 #12

Self employed....mostly I work on my numerous electric vehicle projects and sell one occasionally to keep the cycle going.  Sometimes I'll buy large lots of parts wholesale, use some and sell the others on ebay/forums.  Buy other failed projects cheaply, etc, etc

Plus I intend to roll my numerous hobbies into at least one legitimate buisness in the near term. Probably something to do with electric vehicles Smiley But I've got other ideas sloshing around too.
Awesome! I dare you to sell one for bitcoins.

Yeah, I bet you can sell that sort of thing for btc. Might as well if you're going to live off it.

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gigabytecoin
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March 24, 2011, 03:50:07 AM
 #13

The dollar swings around versus other currencies but you don't go trading them all for Euros when there is a dip.

It swings, but nothing like as much as BTC. The risk of total loss is much higher with BTC in my opinion, which is why I don't want to have any more funds tied up in BTC than I'm willing to risk losing altogether.

Me, neither.

I would not condone investing more than 5 or 10% of your current "savings" - and then expect to lose it whenever the CIA/FBI/whomever decides to shut us down with a supercomputer or any other of the plethora doomsday scenarios available on this forum.
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March 24, 2011, 04:39:03 AM
 #14

The dollar swings around versus other currencies but you don't go trading them all for Euros when there is a dip.

It swings, but nothing like as much as BTC. The risk of total loss is much higher with BTC in my opinion, which is why I don't want to have any more funds tied up in BTC than I'm willing to risk losing altogether.

Me, neither.

I would not condone investing more than 5 or 10% of your current "savings" - and then expect to lose it whenever the CIA/FBI/whomever decides to shut us down with a supercomputer or any other of the plethora doomsday scenarios available on this forum.

I wouldn't condone keeping more than you immediately need in dollars. Ben doesn't even need a supercomputer to destroy that.

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Cryptoman
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March 24, 2011, 04:42:54 AM
 #15

Some folks can chose to go further than just cancelling credit cards... some folks can chose defaulting and not paying it back. Think about it... one person defaults on 10k of credit card debt and thanks to miracle of fractional reserve banking bammm... 100k of fiat money disappears... 100 than 1000 people default on 10k debt each bammm... and we are talking about some serious money disappear just as quickly as they were brought into the existence... one million people default on 10k each and Ben must wake up in the middle of the might and run to do another TARP, QE, whatever is the name he comes up with. Now let's imagine that people start defaulting not on 10k credit cards but on 1mil mortgages en mass... oh... wait... it's already happening.

I would say that defaulting on debt is an act of civil disobedience and soon probably will be classed in US at least as "internal terrorism"... So, on a second thought do not do it and do not tell anyone that you've heard this from me, lol.

Very interesting perspective, and of course you're absolutely right.  What would happen if everyone stopped making debt payments, quit their job and stopped paying taxes all at once?  Can we destroy every government and central bank at the same time?  Is this an idea we can take viral?  Cool

"A small body of determined spirits fired by an unquenchable faith in their mission can alter the course of history." --Gandhi
FatherMcGruder
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March 24, 2011, 12:01:26 PM
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What would happen if everyone stopped making debt payments, quit their job and stopped paying taxes all at once?  Can we destroy every government and central bank at the same time?  Is this an idea we can take viral?  Cool
Watch out for scabs.

Use my Trade Hill referral code: TH-R11519

Check out bitcoinity.org and Ripple.

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Jered Kenna (TradeHill)
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March 24, 2011, 04:09:04 PM
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Some folks can chose to go further than just cancelling credit cards... some folks can chose defaulting and not paying it back. Think about it... one person defaults on 10k of credit card debt and thanks to miracle of fractional reserve banking bammm... 100k of fiat money disappears... 100 than 1000 people default on 10k debt each bammm... and we are talking about some serious money disappear just as quickly as they were brought into the existence... one million people default on 10k each and Ben must wake up in the middle of the might and run to do another TARP, QE, whatever is the name he comes up with. Now let's imagine that people start defaulting not on 10k credit cards but on 1mil mortgages en mass... oh... wait... it's already happening.

I would say that defaulting on debt is an act of civil disobedience and soon probably will be classed in US at least as "internal terrorism"... So, on a second thought do not do it and do not tell anyone that you've heard this from me, lol.

Very interesting perspective, and of course you're absolutely right.  What would happen if everyone stopped making debt payments, quit their job and stopped paying taxes all at once?  Can we destroy every government and central bank at the same time?  Is this an idea we can take viral?  Cool

Isn't that criminal? Not saying I care or think you'd get convicted but if you buy something on credit without the intent to pay it back isn't it fraud or what not? I mean I like the idea but figure the risks should be put out there.

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Cryptoman
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March 24, 2011, 05:12:37 PM
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Very interesting perspective, and of course you're absolutely right.  What would happen if everyone stopped making debt payments, quit their job and stopped paying taxes all at once?  Can we destroy every government and central bank at the same time?  Is this an idea we can take viral?  Cool

Isn't that criminal? Not saying I care or think you'd get convicted but if you buy something on credit without the intent to pay it back isn't it fraud or what not? I mean I like the idea but figure the risks should be put out there.

Personally, I consider contracts between myself and financial institutions to be binding, and I would never default on a loan or credit card debt.  After all, I freely entered into the agreement.  My plan is to pay off all debt (I only have a mortgage for about 25% of home value) and then quit my regular job and move to an area with low property and sales taxes.  With no mortgage or other debt to service and no expensive commute to work, I won't need much of an income, especially if I grow some of my own food.  What little money I need I will obtain by working or trading for cash and/or Bitcoin.  My taxable income will be negligible, so I will be in that vast class of people that puts nothing into the system but still gets all the benefits of living in a modern welfare state.  The very same class of leeches that I supported with my tax dollars for so many years, the people that politicians fawn over with their class-warfare rhetoric.  If enough people did this, we could bankrupt government in a hurry and begin building a post-political future based on peaceful interaction rather than coercion. 

"A small body of determined spirits fired by an unquenchable faith in their mission can alter the course of history." --Gandhi
Jered Kenna (TradeHill)
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March 24, 2011, 07:10:44 PM
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Very interesting perspective, and of course you're absolutely right.  What would happen if everyone stopped making debt payments, quit their job and stopped paying taxes all at once?  Can we destroy every government and central bank at the same time?  Is this an idea we can take viral?  Cool

Isn't that criminal? Not saying I care or think you'd get convicted but if you buy something on credit without the intent to pay it back isn't it fraud or what not? I mean I like the idea but figure the risks should be put out there.

Personally, I consider contracts between myself and financial institutions to be binding, and I would never default on a loan or credit card debt.  After all, I freely entered into the agreement.  My plan is to pay off all debt (I only have a mortgage for about 25% of home value) and then quit my regular job and move to an area with low property and sales taxes.  With no mortgage or other debt to service and no expensive commute to work, I won't need much of an income, especially if I grow some of my own food.  What little money I need I will obtain by working or trading for cash and/or Bitcoin.  My taxable income will be negligible, so I will be in that vast class of people that puts nothing into the system but still gets all the benefits of living in a modern welfare state.  The very same class of leeches that I supported with my tax dollars for so many years, the people that politicians fawn over with their class-warfare rhetoric.  If enough people did this, we could bankrupt government in a hurry and begin building a post-political future based on peaceful interaction rather than coercion. 

The big difference between them and you is you're supporting yourself. If you support yourself and live off the grid like that I don't care if you put money in as taxes.
When all you do is take that's a little different.

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