PBmining - legit?

[tempestb]

Seriously, how can you trust a mining-service who hasn't proofed the mining of at least single block on blockchain but uses a tumbler-service to pay out it's customers ? 

Because they promise people free money later if they invest new money now.

[MrsDoublehelix]

Because they promise people free money later if they invest new money now.

thank you for your honest opinion. At least you and my two tomcats support me not to ride a dead horse (aka ponzi). If they smell a dead mouse..., well it's dead I hope so

[pabpete]

Well I won a free 20ghs so who knows I'm not at any loss XD.

[Syke]

I'm also using them. At the moment i have 20GH/s and It's mining really fine, i'll see how the pay out will go this weekend. The price looks really low so If everything goes good might buy more hash in the  future. Though It's only plans..

Excellent choice. The more you pay them, the longer they will can keep this ponzi running.

[MrsDoublehelix]

Well I won a free 20ghs so who knows I'm not at any loss XD.

congratiolations on this fine shot. I made much worse investmests like buying some bi-fury/twinfury hardware according to my husband. Somehow .. there isn't a free free lunch for all or is it, puppy ?

[tzortz]

Give it up. It is a ponzi for sure.

[ChuckBuck]

PBmining or "Ponzi backed" mining.

Has a nice ring to it!   

[captgnh]

Unbelievable. I read this whole thread all the way through. I bought a contract with PB Mining for 200 GHs just last week. No one has presented any proof, but circumstantial evidence sounds interesting. Could be a ponzi scheme, but could also be legit. I have not heard anything about what will happen if the price of Bitcoin starts to go back up. How does this look with Bitcoin selling at $1000.00 or more a coin? Surely on a five year contract they would be counting on the value to climb, we all are. There is a lot of money involved now. Money can be traced these days. There is always some kind of paper trail. It looks like I'm in for the long haul now. I guess I will keep my fingers crossed and hope for the best.

[brian_23452]

Paying 1 BTC now to get 0.5-.6 BTC later is a losing move.  It doesn't matter what bitcoin does, it can go up, it can go down, it can stay exactly the same as it is, you willingly, of your own free will, gave them money now, to get less than that back at some point in the future.  It doesn't have to be a Ponzi scheme, you lost money on this deal either way. 

[captgnh]

Paying 1 BTC now to get 0.5-.6 BTC later is a losing move.  It doesn't matter what bitcoin does, it can go up, it can go down, it can stay exactly the same as it is, you willingly, of your own free will, gave them money now, to get less than that back at some point in the future.  It doesn't have to be a Ponzi scheme, you lost money on this deal either way. 

I don't happen to agree with you. The Bitcoin I spent on this mining contract costs me approx. $435. If, for the sake of argument, the price of Bitcoin goes up to $600 or $700 or higher, the value of the Bitcoin I am mining goes up as well and it becomes a much more attractive value. That is simple arithmetic. Maybe PB Mining is counting on this as well. According to everything I read, the general ongoing acceptance of Bitcoin worldwide and Wall Street's new involvment, I would say that's a given. Only time will tell. So far I have not lost a dime. I am certainly making more on my investment than a savings account, money market fund or the stock market. If, and it is a big if, I get ripped off, I will deduct it from my taxes and move on. I don't feel like playing the safe game. It gets you even less.

[gagalady]

PBmining or "Ponzi backed" mining.

Has a nice ring to it!   

I could say they are legit because I'm using them and already got my first payment so i got no complains so far but their site is pretty new If i'm not wrong so It's your choice to use them or not but from my experience i would recommend them.

[ChuckBuck]

PBmining or "Ponzi backed" mining.

Has a nice ring to it!   

I could say they are legit because I'm using them and already got my first payment so i got no complains so far but their site is pretty new If i'm not wrong so It's your choice to use them or not but from my experience i would recommend them.

You get payments now.  Will you continue to in Year 2 through 5?  Or will you be "forced" to reinvest?  Or will they just up and vanish one day in year 2 through 5?

Something you'll have to ask at some point with basically a 5 year contract.

The main thing is if you can find out if they actually have mining equipment.  So far there's been no proof given yet.

[Domino]

PBmining or "Ponzi backed" mining.

Has a nice ring to it!   

I could say they are legit because I'm using them and already got my first payment so i got no complains so far but their site is pretty new If i'm not wrong so It's your choice to use them or not but from my experience i would recommend them.

You get payments now.  Will you continue to in Year 2 through 5?  Or will you be "forced" to reinvest?  Or will they just up and vanish one day in year 2 through 5?

Something you'll have to ask at some point with basically a 5 year contract.

The main thing is if you can find out if they actually have mining equipment.  So far there's been no proof given yet.

Indeed, this is true for all cloudmining sites.
With cloud mining, you don't need to do maintenance yourself, but you need to trust the site owners.

[ChuckBuck]

PBmining or "Ponzi backed" mining.

Has a nice ring to it!   

I could say they are legit because I'm using them and already got my first payment so i got no complains so far but their site is pretty new If i'm not wrong so It's your choice to use them or not but from my experience i would recommend them.

You get payments now.  Will you continue to in Year 2 through 5?  Or will you be "forced" to reinvest?  Or will they just up and vanish one day in year 2 through 5?

Something you'll have to ask at some point with basically a 5 year contract.

The main thing is if you can find out if they actually have mining equipment.  So far there's been no proof given yet.

Indeed, this is true for all cloudmining sites.
With cloud mining, you don't need to do maintenance yourself, but you need to trust the site owners.

I know Cloudhashing.com is legit, have bought thousands of miners, have a few datacenters around the world.

Too bad their rates suck.

[brian_23452]

Paying 1 BTC now to get 0.5-.6 BTC later is a losing move.  It doesn't matter what bitcoin does, it can go up, it can go down, it can stay exactly the same as it is, you willingly, of your own free will, gave them money now, to get less than that back at some point in the future.  It doesn't have to be a Ponzi scheme, you lost money on this deal either way. 

I don't happen to agree with you. The Bitcoin I spent on this mining contract costs me approx. $435. If, for the sake of argument, the price of Bitcoin goes up to $600 or $700 or higher, the value of the Bitcoin I am mining goes up as well and it becomes a much more attractive value. That is simple arithmetic. Maybe PB Mining is counting on this as well. According to everything I read, the general ongoing acceptance of Bitcoin worldwide and Wall Street's new involvment, I would say that's a given. Only time will tell. So far I have not lost a dime. I am certainly making more on my investment than a savings account, money market fund or the stock market. If, and it is a big if, I get ripped off, I will deduct it from my taxes and move on. I don't feel like playing the safe game. It gets you even less.

You completely miss the point.  If bitcoin goes down, you lose money obviously.  If bitcoin stays the same, you lose money.  If bitcoin goes up, you make money yes, but a lot less money than you would have made if you cut out the middle man and just bought the bitcoin directly.  You can't seem to understand this.  They may or may not be a scam but it makes no difference.  They don't have to be a scam for it to be a terrible deal.  They could be exactly what they say they are and it is still a terrible deal.
I'll say it one more time: 

Paying 1btc now to get .5 btc at some point in the future is not ever, under any circumstances, a good business decision. 
It completely baffles me how some people can actually think that is a good deal. 

[tempestb]

Paying 1btc now to get .5 btc at some point in the future is not ever, under any circumstances, a good business decision. 
It completely baffles me how some people can actually think that is a good deal. 

You're mostly correct, there is some upper level Bitcoin price that it can rise to where Mining produces more profit than holding.  That's because the miner becomes unprofitable to run after a period of time when the electricity exceeds the miner's ability to produce coins.  However if the value of Bitcoin rises, the miner can run longer and produce more Bitcoins.  So in theory instead of earning only 1 Bitcoin, it could earn 1.1 Bitcoin if the value is large enough to make it worthwhile to keep running. 

The other thing, is that some people simply aren't good at holding.  It takes patience and confidence.  Mining sort of forces people to hold, but in a different way.  So that if the value of the coin rises, they gain the FIAT by the slow return on mining vs cashing out the Bitcoins now for a smaller profit.

[brian_23452]

Paying 1btc now to get .5 btc at some point in the future is not ever, under any circumstances, a good business decision. 
It completely baffles me how some people can actually think that is a good deal. 

You're mostly correct, there is some upper level Bitcoin price that it can rise to where Mining produces more profit than holding.  That's because the miner becomes unprofitable to run after a period of time when the electricity exceeds the miner's ability to produce coins.  However if the value of Bitcoin rises, the miner can run longer and produce more Bitcoins.  So in theory instead of earning only 1 Bitcoin, it could earn 1.1 Bitcoin if the value is large enough to make it worthwhile to keep running. 

The other thing, is that some people simply aren't good at holding.  It takes patience and confidence.  Mining sort of forces people to hold, but in a different way.  So that if the value of the coin rises, they gain the FIAT by the slow return on mining vs cashing out the Bitcoins now for a smaller profit.

None of that applies to a 5 year mining contract, since they are under contract to continue to provide the hashing power for 5 years whether it is economical to do so or not.  This is simply basic math, the total proceeds from hashing for the entire 5 year contract come to be less than what it costs to purchase. 

[tempestb]

None of that applies to a 5 year mining contract, since they are under contract to continue to provide the hashing power for 5 years whether it is economical to do so or not.  This is simply basic math, the total proceeds from hashing for the entire 5 year contract come to be less than what it costs to purchase. 

I don't think that's correct.  The current cost of a gh on PBMining is 0.0056.  https://tradeblock.com/mining/a/702307c1fb

It's profit by August forward.  Assuming current BTC price remains constant.  This is better than holding.

(Assuming not a ponzi for the purpose of this discussion only.)


I've already explained the apex where mining is worth more than holding, but you need a value around $4,000 for that to work out.  Which isn't likely.
 

[brian_23452]

None of that applies to a 5 year mining contract, since they are under contract to continue to provide the hashing power for 5 years whether it is economical to do so or not.  This is simply basic math, the total proceeds from hashing for the entire 5 year contract come to be less than what it costs to purchase. 

I don't think that's correct.  The current cost of a gh on PBMining is 0.0056.  https://tradeblock.com/mining/a/702307c1fb

It's profit by August forward.  Assuming current BTC price remains constant.  This is better than holding.

(Assuming not a ponzi for the purpose of this discussion only.)


I've already explained the apex where mining is worth more than holding, but you need a value around $4,000 for that to work out.  Which isn't likely.
 

Nevermind, I think I see why people buy these things, they don't get basic math.  According to the calculator YOU linked to, 1gh/s purchased at 0.0056btc will never return 0.0056btc.  Ever.  I do see where you made your mistake, if you run the calculator starting in April it will eventually return more than 0.0056btc.  But of course April is already over.  Starting now, since pgmining doesn't seem to offer a time machine on their website, you can expect to get around 0.004 btc back by August. 
Regarding your second point, you keep saying that if the price of btc goes up it  makes this a profitable move.  It doesn't.  Obviously the dollar value of the btc you get back would go up in value, but then so does the dollar value of the cost you paid.  One last time, paying 0.0056btc now to get 0.004btc later is not a good deal!  And makes no difference what the btc is worth in dollars.  But Im a very generous person.  If you think it is such a good deal, I promise to give you 0.004btc in august for every 0.0056btc you give me now.  Any reputable escrow service you wish to use. 

[captgnh]

None of that applies to a 5 year mining contract, since they are under contract to continue to provide the hashing power for 5 years whether it is economical to do so or not.  This is simply basic math, the total proceeds from hashing for the entire 5 year contract come to be less than what it costs to purchase. 

I don't think that's correct.  The current cost of a gh on PBMining is 0.0056.  https://tradeblock.com/mining/a/702307c1fb

It's profit by August forward.  Assuming current BTC price remains constant.  This is better than holding.

(Assuming not a ponzi for the purpose of this discussion only.)


I've already explained the apex where mining is worth more than holding, but you need a value around $4,000 for that to work out.  Which isn't likely.
 

Nevermind, I think I see why people buy these things, they don't get basic math.  According to the calculator YOU linked to, 1gh/s purchased at 0.0056btc will never return 0.0056btc.  Ever.  I do see where you made your mistake, if you run the calculator starting in April it will eventually return more than 0.0056btc.  But of course April is already over.  Starting now, since pgmining doesn't seem to offer a time machine on their website, you can expect to get around 0.004 btc back by August. 
Regarding your second point, you keep saying that if the price of btc goes up it  makes this a profitable move.  It doesn't.  Obviously the dollar value of the btc you get back would go up in value, but then so does the dollar value of the cost you paid.  One last time, paying 0.0056btc now to get 0.004btc later is not a good deal!  And makes no difference what the btc is worth in dollars.  But Im a very generous person.  If you think it is such a good deal, I promise to give you 0.004btc in august for every 0.0056btc you give me now.  Any reputable escrow service you wish to use. 

The dollar value of the cost I paid does not go up. It remains the same. If the BTC I am mining goes up so does my profit. Perhaps you need to re-think your argument. It is flawed. According to you, no one mining is making any money. What would happen if everyone stopped? If I listened to people like you, I would do nothing but purchase coins. Then what? Without miners, you have nothing. So get over it.