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Author Topic: A very clear Merit Abuse among 4 higher ranked account | DT, please take a look.  (Read 393 times)
Jrashid
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September 19, 2018, 10:34:16 AM
Merited by qwk (4), Coolcryptovator (1)
 #1

Case- 1
Abuser
kobilica
B!gSmoke


kobilica received 50 merits in less than 24 hours from B!gSmoke. Again, he/she sent B!gSmoke. 31 merits instantly after getting the merits. Have a look at the image attached below.



It's a clear and easily detectable merit abusing.

Case- 2
Abuser
kryptopojken
B!gSmoke


kryptopojken sent 49 merits to B!gSmoke and got back 32 merits right after 1 minute. We don't need to think twice that B!gSmoke is the big abuser. See the attached image below.



Case- 3
This one is not exchange. Still the same user B!gSmoke is there.
Abuser
HardwarePal
B!gSmoke


HardwarePal sent 23 merits to B!gSmoke within 2 minutes on a single post. Link to merited post. Also, check the image below.

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kobilica
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September 19, 2018, 01:29:17 PM
 #2

I have known for B1gsmoke 2 years, and I trust him. We talk daily about crypto and other trading events in other chat rooms.

So, I see no problem with sending him all the merit I had. It's like I vouch for him. Is this a problem? Vouching for a friend?

Me personally, I don't care much for merit points, and I see no issue with sending them to a friend.

But because how system works, we needed to do feedback loop so I could send him all the merit, which means I get the merit points I don't care much about, anyway; but it's a nice bonus.


Last, it was not stated in original thread that such things are disallowed, so my conscience is clear.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2818350.0

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September 19, 2018, 01:36:24 PM
 #3

Well, and its the same with all the other accounts that were involved. So, IMO its a little harsh to nukle all of our "trust" down just because we shared our merit points with each other, despite its nowhere stated that we ain't allowed to do so!

It's not like we scammed anyone or did harm anyone! But killing our reputations that we build over years because of it is like I said a little bit far-fetched!
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September 19, 2018, 02:03:18 PM
Merited by The Pharmacist (1)
 #4

So, I see no problem with sending him all the merit I had. It's like I vouch for him. Is this a problem? Vouching for a friend?
IMO its a little harsh to nukle all of our "trust" down just because we shared our merit points with each other
Well, sharing merit is definitely frowned upon and I (and others) reserve the right to penalize it with negative trust.
With me, it's usually not such a big issue, since I tend to delete negative trust ratings after a while when I see no more need for it.
See it as a kind of "timeout" for your trust.

Also, there's a little more to the story than just what you see from the merit statistics:
Quote from: Trust summary for kryptopojken
This user's password was reset recently.
Quote from: Trust summary for B!gSmoke
This user's email address was changed recently.
Quote from: Trust summary for HardwarePal
This user's password was reset recently.
This user recently woke up from a long period of inactivity.

These, combined with the merit trading, are usually clear warning signs of abuse.

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September 19, 2018, 02:28:56 PM
 #5

So, I see no problem with sending him all the merit I had. It's like I vouch for him. Is this a problem? Vouching for a friend?
IMO its a little harsh to nukle all of our "trust" down just because we shared our merit points with each other
Well, sharing merit is definitely frowned upon and I (and others) reserve the right to penalize it with negative trust.
With me, it's usually not such a big issue, since I tend to delete negative trust ratings after a while when I see no more need for it.
See it as a kind of "timeout" for your trust.

Well, then It should be stated in the original Merit Thread in the rules section; It's very new system, and it's a farce to penalize someone for doing something that isn't actually restricted, don't you think?. If I had known it in before I obviously never had done it because I don't want to harm my trust by any means. And to be fair, "and I am not demanding it by any means", I just want to appeal to your fairness that this was a one-time "mistake" (imo its still no mistake cause it's not stated anywhere that we actually did something wrong but I accept it since we talked about it and you made your point clear.) and you could let us go with just a "yellow card" instead of a red one (harming our trust).


Quote
Also, there's a little more to the story than just what you see from the merit statistics:
Quote from: Trust summary for kryptopojken
This user's password was reset recently.
Quote from: Trust summary for B!gSmoke
This user's email address was changed recently.
Quote from: Trust summary for HardwarePal
This user's password was reset recently.
This user recently woke up from a long period of inactivity.

These, combined with the merit trading, are usually clear warning signs of abuse.

So what is wrong about changing my email? Are assuming that I just logged in to send merits?
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September 19, 2018, 02:39:12 PM
 #6

it's a farce to penalize someone for doing something that isn't actually restricted, don't you think?
I tend not to let "fairness" come into the equation of my trust rating calculations.

And to be fair, "and I am not demanding it by any means", I just want to appeal to your fairness that this was a one-time "mistake"
[...]
you could let us go with just a "yellow card" instead of a red one (harming our trust).
That's most likely what I'll do.
Instead of a "yellow card", I call a little "timeout".

So what is wrong about changing my email? Are assuming that I just logged in to send merits?
That's usually what it indicates, yes.

All free men, wherever they may live, can use Bitcoin, and, therefore, as a free man, I take pride in the words "Ich bin ein Bitcoiner!"
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September 19, 2018, 03:06:53 PM
 #7

it's a farce to penalize someone for doing something that isn't actually restricted, don't you think?
I tend not to let "fairness" come into the equation of my trust rating calculations.

That actually doesn't answer my question, you still penalizing someone for doing something that isn't restricted by the rules. So, could you, to spare your precious time as well as of all the others update the original thread and add that it is restricted to send and share merits within your friends! Thank you!

Quote
And to be fair, "and I am not demanding it by any means", I just want to appeal to your fairness that this was a one-time "mistake"
[...]
you could let us go with just a "yellow card" instead of a red one (harming our trust).
That's most likely what I'll do.
Instead of a "yellow card", I call a little "timeout".

So, just out of curiosity could you tell me how long this is usually going to last, because as you can see in my post history, I opened an ANN Thread not that long ago and I doubt that anyone is going to trust me as long as I got this mark on me, thus I ask myself to remove the thread an open it again once you've removed it?

Quote
So what is wrong about changing my email? Are assuming that I just logged in to send merits?
That's usually what it indicates, yes.
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September 19, 2018, 04:53:35 PM
Last edit: September 19, 2018, 05:08:28 PM by Coolcryptovator
 #8

Thanks to OP for exposed this case. Its look really they are abusing merit system. They already got tagged as well.

I have known for B1gsmoke 2 years, and I trust him. We talk daily about crypto and other trading events in other chat rooms.
Well, crpto and other trading is allow with friends and family. Who told you merit trading is allow ?  

So, I see no problem with sending him all the merit I had. It's like I vouch for him. Is this a problem? Vouching for a friend?
Of course there is huge problem. Your answer is given by admin;
While we will not be directly moderating this, I encourage people to give merit to posts that are objectively high-quality, not just posts that you agree with.


because we shared our merit points with each other, despite its nowhere stated that we ain't allowed to do so!
Your answer given also above.

It's not like we scammed anyone or did harm anyone! But killing our reputations that we build over years because of it is like I said a little bit far-fetched!
Obviously its harm for forum. What about you are killing forum reputation ?

On addition I am suspecting 3 account are compromised. Accounts changed email address/password recently.



HardwarePal made last post on April 28, 2017. Look like he/she woke up only for merit trading  Grin

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September 19, 2018, 10:19:55 PM
 #9

I can confirm with original identity this account isn't hacked & so isn't b1gsmokes (and others). Just a baseless speculation trying to throw dirt at me and others.

Anyway, back to point:

From original merit thread:

Quote
You get merit points when someone sends you some for one of your posts. Additionally, when someone sends you merit points, half of those points can be sent by you to other people.

Lets translate that to our case:

Quote
bigsmoke get merit points when kobilica sends him for one of his posts. Additionally, when bigsmoke sends kobilica points, half of those points can be sent to bigsmoke.

We have issue here, this is what happened & it is allowed, as described in official thread. It's 100% logically permitted by rules.

I agree that it's in gray zone, but gray zone is gray, not black. So what mods are doing is executing unwritten/imagined rules.


Second, there was NO trading done. I got no money/crypto or other non-BTT goods from this transaction. Another baseless speculation.
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September 20, 2018, 04:59:14 AM
 #10

We have issue here, this is what happened & it is allowed, as described in official thread. It's 100% logically permitted by rules.
With that statement you have just admitted to what you did. Whether rules or not allow it is irrelevant.


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September 20, 2018, 08:07:58 AM
 #11

We have issue here, this is what happened & it is allowed, as described in official thread. It's 100% logically permitted by rules.
With that statement you have just admitted to what you did. Whether rules or not allow it is irrelevant.



So, with that statement, you have just admitted that it is irrelevant if you follow the rules or not you get penalized. That's just mod abuse!

Do you think that's fair? I wonder how you would react to it if that would happen to you!
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September 20, 2018, 08:16:42 AM
Merited by qwk (1)
 #12

I agree that it's in gray zone, but gray zone is gray, not black. So what mods are doing is executing unwritten/imagined rules.

I don't believe there are any moderators involved.  This is an issue of trust between a user and other community members as a result of their actions.

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September 20, 2018, 08:24:21 AM
 #13

I agree that it's in gray zone, but gray zone is gray, not black. So what mods are doing is executing unwritten/imagined rules.

I don't believe there are any moderators involved.  This is an issue of trust between a user and other community members as a result of their actions.

Listen, and I repeat myself here, it is nowhere stated in the original merit thread that you ain't allowed to share your merits with your friends, so we get penalized for doing something that isn't restricted. And they are even admitting it as you can see from the post above.

We have issue here, this is what happened & it is allowed, as described in official thread. It's 100% logically permitted by rules.
With that statement you have just admitted to what you did. Whether rules or not allow it is irrelevant.
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September 20, 2018, 08:59:14 AM
 #14

We have issue here, this is what happened & it is allowed, as described in official thread. It's 100% logically permitted by rules.
With that statement you have just admitted to what you did. Whether rules or not allow it is irrelevant.

And btw, Lauda, since you are a member of an "Escrow Team" like stated here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1938190 could it be, that it is for your interest that you nuke my/our reputation down cause we just started an Escrow Service on our own?

I think yes! That case is pretty clear. Time to get Mods involved!
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September 20, 2018, 09:02:06 AM
 #15

We have issue here, this is what happened & it is allowed, as described in official thread. It's 100% logically permitted by rules.
With that statement you have just admitted to what you did. Whether rules or not allow it is irrelevant.



Yes, I admit playing by the rules and getting falsely punished for it.
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September 20, 2018, 09:13:51 AM
 #16

Instead of a "yellow card", I call a little "timeout".
So, just out of curiosity could you tell me how long this is usually going to last
Solely my discretion.
There have been instances in the past where I deleted a negative after only one or two days.
In other cases, it took as long as three years.

I tend to go over my trust ratings from time to time, look into their respective references, look up an up-to-date post history of the rated user and make up my mind.
It helps if you keep reminding me of doing so after a while (say, a month or two), but please refrain from bugging me constantly about it, that'd just be annoying and might actually lead to a less favorable outcome.

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September 20, 2018, 12:52:27 PM
 #17

And btw, Lauda, since you are a member of an "Escrow Team" like stated here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1938190 could it be, that it is for your interest that you nuke my/our reputation down cause we just started an Escrow Service on our own?

I think yes! That case is pretty clear. Time to get Mods involved!
0 history of valid trades and "this user's email address was changed recently" = "escrow service"? Classic pajeet. Roll Eyes

Solely my discretion.
There have been instances in the past where I deleted a negative after only one or two days.
In other cases, it took as long as three years.

I tend to go over my trust ratings from time to time, look into their respective references, look up an up-to-date post history of the rated user and make up my mind.
It helps if you keep reminding me of doing so after a while (say, a month or two), but please refrain from bugging me constantly about it, that'd just be annoying and might actually lead to a less favorable outcome.
There is no reason to revoke your rating on these two users, especially not if they are providing an "escrow service". This just transformed from a 'merit abuse' to a 'high risk' case.

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September 23, 2018, 09:58:38 AM
 #18

And btw, Lauda, since you are a member of an "Escrow Team" like stated here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1938190 could it be, that it is for your interest that you nuke my/our reputation down cause we just started an Escrow Service on our own?

I think yes! That case is pretty clear. Time to get Mods involved!
0 history of valid trades and "this user's email address was changed recently" = "escrow service"? Classic pajeet. Roll Eyes

Loose assumptions, we got a history just not in this forum! Yet you gotta start somewhere. As if you started with a trade history with your "escrow service"

Quote
Solely my discretion.
There have been instances in the past where I deleted a negative after only one or two days.
In other cases, it took as long as three years.

I tend to go over my trust ratings from time to time, look into their respective references, look up an up-to-date post history of the rated user and make up my mind.
It helps if you keep reminding me of doing so after a while (say, a month or two), but please refrain from bugging me constantly about it, that'd just be annoying and might actually lead to a less favorable outcome.
There is no reason to revoke your rating on these two users, especially not if they are providing an "escrow service". This just transformed from a 'merit abuse' to a 'high risk' case.

Loose assumptions all over the place. You can't prove anything here but I don't take it personally since you are scared of a new contender. I feel ya!
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September 23, 2018, 10:00:32 AM
 #19

Instead of a "yellow card", I call a little "timeout".
So, just out of curiosity could you tell me how long this is usually going to last
Solely my discretion.
There have been instances in the past where I deleted a negative after only one or two days.
In other cases, it took as long as three years.

I tend to go over my trust ratings from time to time, look into their respective references, look up an up-to-date post history of the rated user and make up my mind.
It helps if you keep reminding me of doing so after a while (say, a month or two), but please refrain from bugging me constantly about it, that'd just be annoying and might actually lead to a less favorable outcome.

Alright. Gotcha. Thx for the heads up anyway. Did you at least consider changing the original merit thread as I suggested?
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September 23, 2018, 10:06:20 AM
 #20

new contender
new contender
new contender
new contender
new contender


Classical pajeet move, insinuate some malicious nonsense when you get caught. Cheesy

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