Writing a welcome message

[malevolent]

And... something should be done about the off-site links in the Marketplace sections.

What do you mean specifically? Ebay links with no mention of accepting BTC? (dealt with when reported) Other marketplaces accepting Bitcoin which make transacting more convenient but attract scammers with their (often locked) self-moderated threads? (a warning bar will show up but people need to keep flagging these accounts) Something else?

[1714945526]

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[1714945526]

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[hilariousetc]

That's one of the things that should be linked to for further reading but it probably doesn't need to be given straight away.

The rate-limit error page:


Simply change that to this:

The last posting from your IP was less than <time> seconds ago. Please try again later. The thing you were trying to post was saved as a draft. This limit decreases substantially as your account becomes more established.

Code:

The last posting from your IP was less than <time> seconds ago. Please try again later. The thing you were trying to post was saved as a [url=https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=drafts]draft[/url]. This limit decreases substantially as your account [url=https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2766177.0]becomes more established[/url].

Yeah, it would be helpful to link to it there. The more times we give people this info the more people will be aware/educated about the rules and have it drilled into them. As I've said before, for most Meta is usually the last place people go hence why people don't know most of the rules and even then there's a lot of info thrown at them with multiple guides/stickies hence why it would be good to condense it and link to them for further reading.

And... something should be done about the off-site links in the Marketplace sections.

What do you mean specifically? Ebay links with no mention of accepting BTC? (dealt with when reported) Other marketplaces accepting Bitcoin which make transacting more convenient but attract scammers with their (often locked) self-moderated threads? (a warning bar will show up but people need to keep flagging these accounts) Something else?

Probably means the autobuy links. Probably at least 95% of them are scams. In these instances that's why I think a landing page with a warning would be helpful. Surprisingly a lot of people get scammed by these. Not sure why people would randomly trust these users but they do.

[actmyname]

Probably means the autobuy links. Probably at least 95% of them are scams. In these instances that's why I think a landing page with a warning would be helpful. Surprisingly a lot of people get scammed by these. Not sure why people would randomly trust these users but they do.

Any autobuy link should be prefaced with some kind of disclaimer.

I would even just say that all non-bitcointalk URLs in the Marketplace child boards should have the landing page, with particular emphasis on how ranks don't equate to trust. I believe part of the factor is still that Newbies are unaware of two major differences in this forum: scams are not moderated, and rank titles mean nothing. Until this is displayed in bold letters when you sign into the forum or until there's something to lead people towards this realization, I don't think Newbie problems are going to end easily. A slew of new scam accusations popped up as well regarding off-site deals via external messaging channels - though users should know better - concerning that hole in knowledge and I'm sure that it's more prevalent in the cases that aren't publicized.

[wrzvrflw]

Probably means the autobuy links. Probably at least 95% of them are scams. In these instances that's why I think a landing page with a warning would be helpful. Surprisingly a lot of people get scammed by these. Not sure why people would randomly trust these users but they do.

Any autobuy link should be prefaced with some kind of disclaimer.

I would even just say that all non-bitcointalk URLs in the Marketplace child boards should have the landing page, with particular emphasis on how ranks don't equate to trust. I believe part of the factor is still that Newbies are unaware of two major differences in this forum: scams are not moderated, and rank titles mean nothing. Until this is displayed in bold letters when you sign into the forum or until there's something to lead people towards this realization, I don't think Newbie problems are going to end easily. A slew of new scam accusations popped up as well regarding off-site deals via external messaging channels - though users should know better - concerning that hole in knowledge and I'm sure that it's more prevalent in the cases that aren't publicized.

I'm a newbie and can absolutely confirm this. I got scammed (here's my report https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5300411.msg55837909 ) and although I agree that I should have used escrow to protect myself better, I was kind of shocked how things about scams are handled in this forum. In my case it wasn't an autobuy link but messaging directly with this scammer, found with a Google search and with apparently no negative feedback (but multiple positive ones). Getting in touch with the scammer on Telegram was much more convenient and quick for me, instead of registering on this forum (which I didn't need to do, since his contact details are publicly available).

After he scammed me, I registered to open a scam report, but in my case I registered only AFTER being scammed. So imho any disclaimer you guys are discussing should appear not only when you register but also when browse as a public guest. I feel it's really easy for a newbie to take the same route I took.

Additionally I expected the scammer to get at least be banned quickly and was astonished that despite countless reports and proof (even crisp video proof at one point) no action was going to be taken. In other communities I take part of, scammers like that don't last longer than a day - especially not if they barely provide any conclusive proof in their defense when there is a growing number of reports and unsolved question marks.

[Upgrade00]

So imho any disclaimer you guys are discussing should appear not only when you register but also when browse as a public guest. I feel

IIRC, the newbie warning flag is shown to newbies and members below a certain number of days logged in, but for this to appear the member needs to already have active flags. Not sure how effective it is at this time and more policies to protect members from scam would always be welcome; Maybe a warning at the top of certain boards (visible to guests and members) where trades are more likely to happen.

Additionally I expected the scammer to get at least be banned quickly and was astonished that despite countless reports and proof (even crisp video proof at one point) no action was going to be taken.

Scams are not moderated, so the mods cannot take actions against scam posts or members who make them. There has been lots of discussion about whether to moderate scams and the consensus seems to oppose it as it could give users a feeling of faux security that any unhandled case isn't a scam.

The DT system is in place to warn against scams, but as all systems, it's not a 100% efficient.

[actmyname]

Bump again.I've had the pleasure of conversing with a few new members and they would have greatly appreciated a warning about scams not being moderated on the forum. I think this is the most important thing to deal with right now.

The common justification for "no false sense of security" is absolutely demolished by the fact that people have no idea that there is a lack of security in the first place: how are Newbies expected to deal with all of the random forum mechanics we've fit onto here when they first join the forum? Hell, if the idea was to prevent there from being a false sense of security then you might as well place a scammer warning in front of every single user: that's how we operate in our heads on the forum anyway when it comes to trust - assume everyone (new) is untrustworthy before any transaction.

How about that welcome message?

[jamyr]

Bump again.I've had the pleasure of conversing with a few new members and they would have greatly appreciated a warning about scams not being moderated on the forum. I think this is the most important thing to deal with right now.

The common justification for "no false sense of security" is absolutely demolished by the fact that people have no idea that there is a lack of security in the first place: how are Newbies expected to deal with all of the random forum mechanics we've fit onto here when they first join the forum? Hell, if the idea was to prevent there from being a false sense of security then you might as well place a scammer warning in front of every single user: that's how we operate in our heads on the forum anyway when it comes to trust - assume everyone (new) is untrustworthy before any transaction.

How about that welcome message?

**Taking the stage, deep breaths. . . .**

Welcome Message!(sample)

Yey, you've made it. Let me welcome you to the largest, bitcoin forum. This is a community-driven forum which aims to be a platform for bitcoin users to exchange ideas and thoughts about the industry. This forum achieved its current prestige by being reasonably strict, and with the help of the community, bitcointalk continues to educate, promote and nurture the minds of bitcoin-ers.

Like you, each and every member here was a Newbie once. Whilst some are smart enough to avoid common pitfalls and dodge awkward conversations, there are those who unfortunately have to deal with these sticky situations. Imagine moving to a new place, or country, or a new school with a different atmosphere, language and norms. In order for you to get the most out of every discussion, a newbie must have a basic understanding of the subject/board/stuff. Lucky for you because it will be easy as 1-2-3. Before you ask this and that, or request for an unpaid advice, take a look at the Pinned posts, (those posts in the beginning of every board, and they have a "pin" icon to make it easier to identify.

Being familiar with the content of the Pinned posts would accelerate your awareness of what to do, and what not to do. This will also lessen the risk of you being schooled which often involves a unique but can be unpleasant tone from "tenured" members of the community. Well, if ever you get that, just do not take it personal, instead, think of it as an accent of bitcointalk members.

(brain lagged)
to be continued or not. . .

 

[Pmalek]

Snip

This message of yours looks like an introduction where the main points are missing. It's good as an intro, but it doesn't get to the essence of things. The aim of the welcome message should be to guide those who sign up and inform them about what they are allowed and not allowed to do. Your welcome message points them towards other pinned messages instead of mentioning the main points, such as spamming, copy-pasting, scamming, etc.   

[jamyr]

If nothing else, the current draft of the welcome message should be used as a placeholder for reasons described above.

Something is better than merely having this idea in the air for literal years. How many scams could have been prevented in that time because people do have a false sense of security?

Bump.

Hey, I think they've heard.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=help

if you go to that link you would see a very good introduction.

[malevolent]

Hey, I think they've heard.

No, that's some default user readme that comes with SMF, and lacks a lot of information users should be well aware of, such as ranks, merits, the Trust systems, the proliferation of scams, forum culture, rules, etc.

[jamyr]

Hey, I think they've heard.

No, that's some default user readme that comes with SMF, and lacks a lot of information users should be well aware of, such as ranks, merits, the Trust systems, the proliferation of scams, forum culture, rules, etc.

It looks kinda new, but even if its not, arent those what a welcome message must contain?

[malevolent]

It looks kinda new, but even if its not, arent those what a welcome message must contain?

No, most of the info there is pretty obvious to anyone who is not new to the Internet, and would only serve to increase the likelihood that the new user doesn't even bother to read the whole thing if he sees how long it is. If it were new the logging and registration sections would at least mention CAPTCHAs, the Copper Membership, evil IP addresses, data retention policy, etc.

[rosenbauer02]

There is still no welcome message to newbie but I am not new actually been registered and been away for a while and forget my account.

Anyway, I was gonna thought that writing a welcome message for newbie is very important. Just highlight the rulings especially about permban in which most of the time I have observe it here specifically in this section.

Anyway, if they are not here for bounty hunting then that would better and low chances they will going to violate rulings in the forum. Mostly bounty hunters turn to cheaters when they able to realize that money is not really going to be earn the fast and easy way. Bounty hunters are everywhere in the forum and I guess when we will going to put a ration between bounty hunters and users that are here to learn will be having a huge difference. Probably in my estimte would be 9 bounty hunters out of 10 users here in the forum which means 90% were bounty hunters.

[actmyname]

It looks kinda new, but even if its not, arent those what a welcome message must contain?

I would probably like a warning about the disconnect/non-relation between ranks and the trustworthiness of a user. Probably another caveat would be to never trust anyone blindly, and a few nudges towards the sticky threads.

As it currently stands, a Newbie would have to wander into the Meta board and notice the "Unofficial rules" thread to get started on learning about the forum.

[hilariousetc]

It looks kinda new, but even if its not, arent those what a welcome message must contain?

I would probably like a warning about the disconnect/non-relation between ranks and the trustworthiness of a user. Probably another caveat would be to never trust anyone blindly, and a few nudges towards the sticky threads.

As it currently stands, a Newbie would have to wander into the Meta board and notice the "Unofficial rules" thread to get started on learning about the forum.

Meta is usually the last place newbs go hence why they need to be directed to the rules upon sign-up. I'd also like to see some warnings in certain boards that maybe are only displayed to newbies/Juniors and they go away when you achieve Member rank or something (or you can just turn them off in the settings) but I think these warnings would be good reminders to people to use caution and will at least save some users from being scammed.

[jamyr]

Found this entitled:
Newbie Readme by tysat

Also this post by Anonymous Guest.

[actmyname]

up

If you're not going to disable signature campaigns, can you make the default signature link to the forum rule thread?

[LoyceV]

can you make the default signature link to the forum rule thread?

I like it! How about doing this only for the first 7 days for new accounts or the first 5 posts (whatever comes first)? Copper Members should of course be able to instantly change it.

[actmyname]

To be, or not to be, that is the question

Will it exist or not?

[PowerGlove]

That's a really well-written welcome message! I think it strikes a very nice balance (i.e. instructional/foreboding/inspiring) and I think it's a real shame that 4 years worth of new members haven't been exposed to it...

In my opinion, by giving theymos a lot of ill-considered feedback, the community really shot itself in the foot on this one.