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Author Topic: Cultural Appropriation and Acceptable Racism  (Read 451 times)
coins4commies
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October 27, 2018, 09:46:44 PM
 #21

I can't help but guess your pillars of identity on the basis that you automatically think the entire concept of privilege is "stupid".   Probably proves my point. Thinking this is stupid is highly indicative of privilege.

Or perhaps he supports equality of opportunity and has the good sense to know equality of outcome is impossible.

No one has suggested equality of outcome but nice strawman.

Oh but you have. You telling people to check their privilege shows very clearly you do not beleive in outcome of opportunity, because you think certain people should have limited opportunities to make up for the ones you think have more. It is at the very core nature of this privilege argument.
Checking privilege doesn't limit anyone's opportunity.  Its simply asking someone to acknowledge the struggles of those who do not share their identity.  Its a demand for courtesy.  its not saying "you don't get _________ because you have privilege".

check noun
\ˈchek
\
Definition of check

(Entry 1 of 3)

1 : exposure of a chess king to an attack from which he must be protected or moved to safety with his king in check

2a : a sudden stoppage of a forward course or progress : arrest the outbreak of war in 1939 gave a sudden check to the sculptor's work— Herbert Read

b : a checking of an opposing player (as in ice hockey)

3 : a sudden pause or break in a progression the invaders coming in without a check

4 archaic : reprimand, rebuke

5 : one that arrests, limits, or restrains : restraint against all checks, rebukes, and manners, I must advance— William Shakespeare


Yes, it has most definitely resulted in "you don't get _________ because you have privilege." Is it asking or is it demanding? Pick one. You can't even follow your own standards within a single paragraph.

Why would you use the noun?  You have to be intentionally dishonest to claim we are using check as a noun.  It is clearly a command.  IF someone says "check your privilege" , there is no way a native speaker would think that "check" is a noun.  Basic sentence structure and context but the noun definition fits your argument so fuck it.   Pretend to have no understanding of basic english.

to examine (something) in order to determine its accuracy, quality, or condition, or to detect the presence of something.

.....
Checking privilege doesn't limit anyone's opportunity.  Its simply asking someone to acknowledge the struggles of those who do not share their identity.  Its a demand for courtesy.  its not saying "you don't get _________ because you have privilege".

That's one of the stupidest rationalizations I have ever heard.

Because statistically, individual variability is orders of magnitude higher than variability attributable to visible groupings such as skin color.

Your demand for courtesy is an insult.
That is because race is not real and is a social construct.  This doesn't mean racism doesn't exist and hasn't had real effects and perhaps you don't know about the systemic racism that has taken place in the US because you had the privilege to not need to know.  You would have to check your privilege to take the time to research practices that systemically penalized people based on race.  It would be uncomfortable and life is a lot more pleasant to just pretend it doesn't exist. 
IndeecV
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October 27, 2018, 10:56:29 PM
 #22

We in Russia have been shocked by the tolerance of the West for a long time. The problem is that the west does not create equality, but tilts the scales in the other direction. They allow shit on their heads, if only they are not considered racists.
About 170 nationalities live in our country. And although many have prejudices, racism has never been a big problem.
Spendulus
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October 28, 2018, 05:46:13 PM
Last edit: October 28, 2018, 06:49:32 PM by Spendulus
 #23

.....
Checking privilege doesn't limit anyone's opportunity.  Its simply asking someone to acknowledge the struggles of those who do not share their identity.  Its a demand for courtesy.  its not saying "you don't get _________ because you have privilege".

That's one of the stupidest rationalizations I have ever heard.

Because statistically, individual variability is orders of magnitude higher than variability attributable to visible groupings such as skin color.

Your demand for courtesy is an insult.
That is because race is not real and is a social construct.  This doesn't mean racism doesn't exist and hasn't had real effects and perhaps you don't know about the systemic racism that has taken place in the US because you had the privilege to not need to know.  You would have to check your privilege to take the time to research practices that systemically penalized people based on race.  It would be uncomfortable and life is a lot more pleasant to just pretend it doesn't exist.  

Then again, it could be because you have simply fallen for one of the stupidest social constructs ever promulgated by maniacs of the left.

This is far more likely than your being right. The reason I say this is that my first answer to your ridiculous assertions was quite scientific.

Because statistically, individual variability is orders of magnitude higher than variability attributable to visible groupings such as skin color.

It's actually irrefutable.

But you missed that entirely and went on with the lecturing. And I'll repeat my former conclusion.

Your demand for courtesy is an insult.

Particularly when you haven't the slightest clue what I know or don't know.
coins4commies
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October 29, 2018, 05:24:28 AM
 #24

.....
Checking privilege doesn't limit anyone's opportunity.  Its simply asking someone to acknowledge the struggles of those who do not share their identity.  Its a demand for courtesy.  its not saying "you don't get _________ because you have privilege".

That's one of the stupidest rationalizations I have ever heard.

Because statistically, individual variability is orders of magnitude higher than variability attributable to visible groupings such as skin color.

Your demand for courtesy is an insult.
That is because race is not real and is a social construct.  This doesn't mean racism doesn't exist and hasn't had real effects and perhaps you don't know about the systemic racism that has taken place in the US because you had the privilege to not need to know.  You would have to check your privilege to take the time to research practices that systemically penalized people based on race.  It would be uncomfortable and life is a lot more pleasant to just pretend it doesn't exist.  

Then again, it could be because you have simply fallen for one of the stupidest social constructs ever promulgated by maniacs of the left.

This is far more likely than your being right. The reason I say this is that my first answer to your ridiculous assertions was quite scientific.

Because statistically, individual variability is orders of magnitude higher than variability attributable to visible groupings such as skin color.

It's actually irrefutable.

But you missed that entirely and went on with the lecturing. And I'll repeat my former conclusion.

Your demand for courtesy is an insult.

Particularly when you haven't the slightest clue what I know or don't know.
So are you denying the history of systemic racism? because that is also irrefutable but of course you can't attribute individual differences to one single pillar of identity. 

Both (the absence of race and the history of racism) are irrefutable. No one ever challenged what you are saying about individual variability.  In fact, its actually part of the point of talking about privilege in general.  We should see people as individuals and there are so many pillars of someones identity that may or may not come with privilege. 

The thing with skin color though is that I can see it and know it about you right away.  If I see a white person, I know that they nor their immediate family have been denied basic services or freedoms because of their race.  That is white privilege and doesn't mean that they haven't had those things denied, it just means it hasn't been because of race. 

An good example would be a white trans female.   They obviously have a tough experience because they lack male privilege and cis privilege even though they still have white privilege. 

You can't just call something stupid because YOU don't understand it.  A lot of research has been done on people like this.
Quote
The research by L. Taylor Phillips, a PhD student at Stanford Graduate School of Business, and Brian Lowery, the Walter Kenneth Kilpatrick Professor of Organizational Behavior at Stanford GSB, found that whites exposed to evidence of racial privilege responded by claiming their own personal hardships. Those surveyed didn’t deny the existence of racial privileges held by whites as a group, they just came up with other reasons — namely, personal obstacles — why they should be considered differently from that overall group.
Spendulus
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October 29, 2018, 11:27:27 AM
Last edit: October 29, 2018, 12:00:59 PM by Spendulus
 #25

.... If I see a white person, I know that they nor their immediate family have been denied basic services or freedoms because of their race....
NO YOU DO NOT KNOW THAT.

....
An good example would be a white trans female.   They obviously have a tough experience because they lack male privilege and cis privilege even though they still have white privilege.  ....

No, there is nothing "obvious" about what goes on in the mind, or the life, of such a person. You are making things up to assume otherwise.
criza
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October 29, 2018, 02:56:14 PM
 #26

First and foremost, cultural appropriation is kind of tricky and misaligning. When you first hear or read about it, it seems that it is positive and 'appropriate'. Cultural appropriation seems right since it is the act of taking the cultural ways of other people that is of course not your kind of culture just to be part of them but when you read between the lines, you may find it an offensive one and can also lead to acceptable racism. I think that acceptable racism is inapproriate since there is no such thing as 'acceptable' racism. Racism itself is a negative thing, and whatever word or group of words you add onto it, it will still for me unacceptable.  If you are just choosing what to show racism then selectiveness should never prevail in this instance.

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Spendulus
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October 29, 2018, 03:36:39 PM
 #27

First and foremost, cultural appropriation is kind of tricky and misaligning. When you first hear or read about it, it seems that it is positive and 'appropriate'. Cultural appropriation seems right since it is the act of taking the cultural ways of other people that is of course not your kind of culture just to be part of them ....

There's some variation between countries and cultures on this, but in the US as a traditional melting pot of cultures ....
coins4commies
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October 30, 2018, 12:19:20 AM
 #28

.... If I see a white person, I know that they nor their immediate family have been denied basic services or freedoms because of their race....
NO YOU DO NOT KNOW THAT.

....
An good example would be a white trans female.   They obviously have a tough experience because they lack male privilege and cis privilege even though they still have white privilege.  ....

No, there is nothing "obvious" about what goes on in the mind, or the life, of such a person. You are making things up to assume otherwise.

I see now that the way the first quote is written can be interpreted two different ways and that you must have interpreted it as "because of their race I know that they have not been denied basic services or freedoms" instead of what the "because of your race" part of my post really meant that no one has told them "you cannot have X because you are white" and X is basic services or freedoms.

Privilege is not about what goes on in the minds of people but its about how society makes things more dificult for people with certain identities.  Have you ever had to go to school or work on a major christian holiday?  That is christian privilege. 
Spendulus
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October 30, 2018, 04:18:48 PM
 #29

....
Privilege is not about what goes on in the minds of people but its about how society makes things more dificult for people with certain identities.  Have you ever had to go to school or work on a major christian holiday?  That is christian privilege. 
In your mind only, that is privilege....
coins4commies
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October 31, 2018, 05:48:00 AM
 #30

Your refusal to approach this with an open mind is what we refer to as white fragility.  You keep saying this is all made up and refuse to even consider the notion of "checking your privilege" as something that is based on reality. 

Here is an amazing paper on the topic.  Any open minded person would read it and critic the concept of privilege based on good reasoning instead of just denial.  Surely, the worlds' top academic institutions would not blindly embrace something that wasn't even real.
https://medschool.duke.edu/sites/medschool.duke.edu/files/field/attachments/explaining_white_privilege_to_a_broke_white_person.pdf
Spendulus
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November 16, 2018, 11:02:44 PM
Last edit: November 16, 2018, 11:15:32 PM by Spendulus
 #31

Your refusal to approach this with an open mind is what we refer to as white fragility. ....

Actually, I'm a one legged mulatto bastard orphan child, that grew up to be a hermaphrodite, but don't worry. Each of my separate personalities has a unique sexual identity.

What in the world caused you to presume I was either white or fragile?

You have amazing capability for an entity with a brain capable of only two bit operations...well, compared to your brethren with one-bit processors. Can you explain the operation of input and output operations with a two bit processor, and the limitations thereof?
coins4commies
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November 18, 2018, 02:48:04 AM
 #32

I never said you were white.  I have no idea what anyone's identity is on the internet.
Quote
Internalized oppression is a concept in social justice in which an oppressed group comes to use against itself the methods of the oppressor.

Its not surprising that the dominant identity has tendencies that often manifest themselves in minorities.
Spendulus
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November 18, 2018, 05:07:38 AM
 #33

I never said you were white.  I have no idea what anyone's identity is on the internet.
Quote
Internalized oppression is a concept in social justice in which an oppressed group comes to use against itself the methods of the oppressor.

Its not surprising that the dominant identity has tendencies that often manifest themselves in minorities.

The problem with you is that you read a bunch of total shit and believed it, and repeat it with minor variations.

That's assuming you are human. The other case is you are a simple rule based algorithm, with three hundred pieces of grammar that can be intermixed and selected based on key words, and auto pasted.

I favor the latter option, but welcome you to prove you are human.
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