[2018-10-15] Circle's sometimes head-scratching deals take shape

[gentlemand]

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2018/10/12/circles-head-scratching-deals-take-shape-as-cryptocurrency-bet.html

An interesting wee article about Circle's vision for the future.

One of the main things I've taken away from this is that they appear to have little interest in cryptocurrencies themselves, they're primarily betting on more traditional markets moving on to crypto enabled rails.

[DooMAD]

I'm pretty much convinced at this stage that Circle don't have a "vision" and simply lurch from one disaster to the next, heh.  Their first attempt at an exchange was a failure.  I stopped using Polo as soon as they got involved, but everything I hear sounds like it's a worse service than it used to be.  I think it's a company where I'm going to do everything humanly possible to avoid dealing with them.

[gentlemand]

I'm pretty much convinced at this stage that Circle don't have a "vision" and simply lurch from one disaster to the next, heh.  Their first attempt at an exchange was a failure.  I stopped using Polo as soon as they got involved, but everything I hear sounds like it's a worse service than it used to be.  I think it's a company where I'm going to do everything humanly possible to avoid dealing with them.

The thing is that places like this operate on time scales that us twitchy cryptokiddies can barely wrap our heads around. They're going to be looking at 10-15 years ahead.

That being the case it doesn't matter what us lot think of Poloniex. It's in the plan for a generation that hasn't arrived here yet. I still don't understand why it's the same old heap of shit it's always been though.

There's certainly plenty of track record for VC cluelessness. I'd still wait a substantial amount of time before declaring total failure.

[BitHodler]

I still don't understand why it's the same old heap of shit it's always been though.

What did you expect? That it would be entirely different by now? No way. It looks like they are intentionally not doing anything with Poloniex, possibly to get rid of lower range retail users?

It may be that Poloniex was only taken over because it would directly become a regulated exchange, and that alone is worth plenty. If they really wanted to turn it into a crypto powerhouse they would put more effort into it.

It wouldn't surprise me if Poloniex as brand will be ditched at a later point, all to merge that platform into what the financial institutions backing Circle are likely working on, which is a trading desk.

[figmentofmyass]

That being the case it doesn't matter what us lot think of Poloniex. It's in the plan for a generation that hasn't arrived here yet. I still don't understand why it's the same old heap of shit it's always been though.

There's certainly plenty of track record for VC cluelessness. I'd still wait a substantial amount of time before declaring total failure.

whatever they're planning for poloniex, i suspect the changes will be drastic, possibly including a rebranding. as far as i can tell, they've just been running at status quo since the purchase. that might make sense when you consider their plans---SEC/FINRA broker-dealer registration and ATS licensing. this is just an interim period. there's really no point drastically changing anything right now before any of that has materialized.

as allaire points out in the article, this SeedInvest acquisition ties into the previous acquisition of poloniex. they're betting on the "tokenized security" industry becoming a thing, and it looks like they'll be one of the first fully licensed platforms in the game.

[bbc.reporter]

Take it from our position, we take risks by bagholding ICO tokens, altcoins and scamcoins and hope that they will pump because there might be a possibility to catch the market's growth.

Circle and other companies take their risks in buying exchanges and other companies in the cryptospace to catch that growth.

[DooMAD]

Take it from our position, we take risks by bagholding ICO tokens, altcoins and scamcoins and hope that they will pump because there might be a possibility to catch the market's growth.

Circle and other companies take their risks in buying exchanges and other companies in the cryptospace to catch that growth.

Similar, perhaps, but it's not exactly a direct comparison.  If they buy a company, they're in direct control of that companys direction.  When you buy altcoins, you're mostly at the mercy of the developers and the direction they choose to take the altcoin in.

If they do have big plans for Polo, as figmentofmyass alluded to, it's still baffling why they would buy something and let it fall apart while they move other strategic pieces into position, rather than just building something from scratch to coincide with the rest of the plan coming together.

[gentlemand]

If they do have big plans for Polo, as figmentofmyass alluded to, it's still baffling why they would buy something and let it fall apart while they move other strategic pieces into position, rather than just building something from scratch to coincide with the rest of the plan coming together.

Yup. It makes no sense.

And it's not as if Poloniex was dripping with regulation for them to swan straight into which would be the main reason to buy an ongoing concern. At the very most it might have some money transmitter licences in a few states which any old donkey can get for a fraction of Poloniex's price tag.

Circle as its own brand was much better run and far less despised when they were selling BTC to the public. I don't get why they didn't revive that.

[1Referee]

Circle as its own brand was much better run and far less despised when they were selling BTC to the public. I don't get why they didn't revive that.

It may be far fetched, but couldn't the big boys backing Circle be out to take over a large exchange solely to "control" the assets connected to it, all to use them as a vote to steer development of various 'vote sensitive' projects into a certain direction? Ethereum has proven to be 'attackable' that way as long as you have enough coins voting for you.

Bitfinex has already abused its EOS holdings to upvote itself, and it's out to become a block producer as well. https://www.bitfinex.com/eos

[squatter]

If they do have big plans for Polo, as figmentofmyass alluded to, it's still baffling why they would buy something and let it fall apart while they move other strategic pieces into position, rather than just building something from scratch to coincide with the rest of the plan coming together.

How did they let it fall apart? Poloniex had already lost the vast majority of its volume by summer/fall of last year. It was a ghost town. I don't think it's declined significantly since Circle took over. They just haven't, well, done anything with it yet.

The timing does seem off. Maybe they ran into regulatory roadblocks. Maybe they just timed things badly and/or overpaid because they were caught up in the hype last year like everyone else. I do think that launching a totally unknown exchange seems difficult in this environment -- it's a really saturated market. I also wonder how valuable Poloniex's database might be for launching new products.

[bbc.reporter]

If they do have big plans for Polo, as figmentofmyass alluded to, it's still baffling why they would buy something and let it fall apart while they move other strategic pieces into position, rather than just building something from scratch to coincide with the rest of the plan coming together.

Yup. It makes no sense.

And it's not as if Poloniex was dripping with regulation for them to swan straight into which would be the main reason to buy an ongoing concern. At the very most it might have some money transmitter licences in a few states which any old donkey can get for a fraction of Poloniex's price tag.

Circle as its own brand was much better run and far less despised when they were selling BTC to the public. I don't get why they didn't revive that.

Maybe the costs are cheaper and it would be easier to buy an exchange than start and market another one from scratch. Poloniex is still a known exchange that have loyal users in spite of the bad service.

I reckon Circle does not want to be become directly an altcoin exchange. They need Poloniex to be that for them.

[gentlemand]

Maybe the costs are cheaper and it would be easier to buy an exchange than start and market another one from scratch. Poloniex is still a known exchange that have loyal users in spite of the bad service.

I reckon Circle does not want to be become directly an altcoin exchange. They need Poloniex to be that for them.

I can only assume they know more about this type of thing than any of us ever will, because from the outside it looks totally batty.

400 million dollars buys a lot of skills, marketing and staff to be applied wherever and however you wish. It's undeniable that Poloniex was racking up huge numbers once upon a time. Perhaps the deal was put into motion while it was still huge.

Then again internet-related VC spending has a long track record of laying out vast sums just when users clear off for good. Myspace is now a ghost town. Friendreunited made the founders rich and then vanished. Crypto is possibly even more fickle.

Time will tell I suppose and people like this might have some major vision even if it's unappetising to us lot. Or they're fucking clueless. Stuff like 21.co burning $100 million to sell a few hundred tarted up Raspberry Pi's would not have impressed me if I'd funded them.

There's a book to be written about the VC world because I certainly don't understand most of it.

[bbc.reporter]

@gentlemand. As I already mentioned. We should take it from our position and experiences in speculating. We baghold cryptocoins and tokens with the hope that they would pump. Companies speculate in other companies.

What other explanation is there? It is about taking risks and making money, I reckon.

[gentlemand]

@gentlemand. As I already mentioned. We should take it from our position and experiences in speculating. We baghold cryptocoins and tokens with the hope that they would pump. Companies speculate in other companies.

What other explanation is there? It is about taking risks and making money, I reckon.

There's risks and then there's certain suicide. Alot of VC stuff defies description and that's in the supposedly legit business world let alone the crypto stuff. Most peoples dogs would sneer at what they're willing to luzz money at.