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Author Topic: btc need institutional money. institutional money don't need 80% crashes  (Read 247 times)
bitcoinsc (OP)
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November 29, 2018, 10:48:47 PM
 #1

btc need institutional money. institutional money don't need 80% crashes. maybe when btc becomes stable money .like in 2 years we get the big players investing but it's too hurtful to invest if ur really stacking. 100k lost to 30k that's depreciation with out the wear n tear and no car too.

Ethereum and Uniswap.
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November 29, 2018, 10:55:15 PM
Last edit: November 29, 2018, 11:35:42 PM by franky1
 #2

blah blah investors blah

btc as a currency detached from fiat. EG users buy bread, milk, toilet roll. dont need to worry about what institutions want
for the last 6 years i have been paying rent, buying food and transport and the prices have been moving from
$100->$1200->$250>$500->$300->$900->$6000->$4000
and im still able to pay rent, buy food and transport

also 100k losing 80% is 20k... not 30k

also ~6k losing 80% = $1500
price didnt go down that low. it didnt even go into the the $2k range.

even last years $20k CORRECTED down to ~$6k which is not even 75% and as i just said was a correction from a temporary spike. not a crash from a stable price.

sems op neds to refine a few things if he wants to talk economics. like atleast state facts not exaggerations
investors love low prices on deflationary currencies. its called DISCOUNT

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Please do your own research & respect what is written here as both opinion & information gleaned from experience. many people replying with insults but no on-topic content substance, automatically are 'facepalmed' and yawned at
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November 29, 2018, 11:24:09 PM
 #3

Who says BTC doesn't have institutional money?? Big money betting is ongoing in the crypto market at this current situation and majority of that funds come from institutions. Probably well known companies don't invest in bitcoin openly due to regulatory issues, that's why we are unable to take the names, but that certainly doesn't prove that institutions don't invest in here! They do, just not openly!


bitcoinsc (OP)
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November 30, 2018, 12:44:11 AM
 #4

blah blah investors blah

btc as a currency detached from fiat. EG users buy bread, milk, toilet roll. dont need to worry about what institutions want
for the last 6 years i have been paying rent, buying food and transport and the prices have been moving from
$100->$1200->$250>$500->$300->$900->$6000->$4000
and im still able to pay rent, buy food and transport

also 100k losing 80% is 20k... not 30k

also ~6k losing 80% = $1500
price didnt go down that low. it didnt even go into the the $2k range.

even last years $20k CORRECTED down to ~$6k which is not even 75% and as i just said was a correction from a temporary spike. not a crash from a stable price.

sems op neds to refine a few things if he wants to talk economics. like atleast state facts not exaggerations
investors love low prices on deflationary currencies. its called DISCOUNT

I was using an estimate. but sure 80% drop from 100k to 20k is even worst. if I was an institutional investor that would be insane. u can pay off taxes with that money. ur better off with heavy ass gold than digitize gold

Ethereum and Uniswap.
btc-room101
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November 30, 2018, 01:22:50 AM
 #5

Current figures are a market-cap has gone from $720 billion to $68 billion, the money simply evaporated, e.g. vanished.

Some players lost as much as $168Million USD (NOVOGRATZ) at some trading houses ( institutional  investors ), simply meaning lots of people went bankrupt. Game Over. For many people they will be lawyering up for years fighting about how 'investing' in BITCOIN was insane, ... In summary most 'institutional investors' will fear BTC for a long time and all crypto. Then again, like warren-buffet says, by greedy when other are fearful. ( IMHO bitcoin will mean-revert to $1400, so now is NOT the time to buy, just like GOLD, it must go back to $1k, before its next climb )

Now for the GOOD-NEWS, since 1800's the USA has gone bankrupt like 3 times, and defaulted on its DEBT, virtually every asset on the planet earth in the history of mankind has at one time had a draw-down of 90%, and those that haven't will, this is the nature of human hysteria, and the greed-fear cycle of humanity.

Bitcoin high trading at $21k in later 2017, now bouncing at $3100, that's like a an 86% loss year-2-date, but this is not abnormal, had you bought GOLD in 1978 and HODL until 1982, you too would have lost 84% of your wealth.

History say's BUY-LOW and SELL-HIGH folks, HODL is a game for morons, fools, and idiots.
franky1
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November 30, 2018, 01:26:09 AM
 #6

I was using an estimate. but sure 80% drop from 100k to 20k is even worst. if I was an institutional investor that would be insane. u can pay off taxes with that money. ur better off with heavy ass gold than digitize gold

funny you mention that.
institutions love investment loss..
its tax deductable. meaning they have to pay less tax, thus they are happy

what you dont realise is they are happy to have tax deductions 2018. and with a low price can begin 2019 at a low = instant great start. then when the price of btc goes up due to
the "next gen asic rush"
the "ETF basket obtaining rush"
and the "btc recovery correction"

2019 will be great for them

so for now this price is called "yay great, discount discount discount"

and next rebut i predict the daily 'volatility'
institutions get bored of 0.5% movements. they love 5% 10% swings.. its more money, without having to get their feet dirty having to do any actual work

I DO NOT TRADE OR ACT AS ESCROW ON THIS FORUM EVER.
Please do your own research & respect what is written here as both opinion & information gleaned from experience. many people replying with insults but no on-topic content substance, automatically are 'facepalmed' and yawned at
franky1
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November 30, 2018, 01:30:08 AM
 #7

Current figures are a market-cap has gone from $720 billion to $68 billion, the money simply evaporated, e.g. vanished.

(facepalm)
seriously..
market cap is an empty number.. there is no $$$

i can make a blockchain with 5 trillion coins. i can sell one coin for just $1
yep $1 once
and that booms to make the market cap $5trillion.
yet the only $$$$ existing in the network is $1

bitcoin does not have billions of $ stored up
no $ evaporated
they never existed in the first place

the market cap is a empty number made from taking the current bitcoin price and multiplying it by coins.
its not a balance sheet of bank accounts of $$

I DO NOT TRADE OR ACT AS ESCROW ON THIS FORUM EVER.
Please do your own research & respect what is written here as both opinion & information gleaned from experience. many people replying with insults but no on-topic content substance, automatically are 'facepalmed' and yawned at
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November 30, 2018, 01:46:08 AM
Last edit: November 30, 2018, 02:18:53 AM by franky1
 #8

Bitcoin high trading at $21k in later 2017, now bouncing at $3100, that's like a an 86% loss year-2-date

now ur exaggerating
firstly the number of people that bought at $21k......... 0
the number of people buying around $20k very very small amount. probably 5 people bot trading
and those bot traders were selling as fast as they were buying. so no 400% loss.. more like 1% loss

the $20k did not last long. large percentage of traders were not active on that time period so stop even trying to make out the $20k was a stable price that lasted long enough to cause community wide losses today. it affected not even 1% of the community

the thing you should be looking at is the long period of prices remaining above $5800 which everyone had ample oppertunity to take advantage of
EG 12 months of prices remaining over ~$5800 baseline. if you just do 1% profit a day =365% profit a year
smart traders never buy  at a high. so pretending loads of tradrs or institutions bought right at the tip.. thats a laugh.
sorry but nah traders buy make a 1% sell. and repeat as fast as possible. if the price is going up they buy make 1% sell
repeat repeat repeat.
if the price jumps up more then 1% before they sell then hold off and then as soon as it goes down they sell.
EG if a price moves up 7% instantly. they sell when it starts to move down thus ending up 6% profit by the time they sell

they dont buy at $18k se 20k and just hold.  and then see 19k 18k17k16k15k14k before asking should they sell. they would have sold as soon as 20k turn down. meaning selling at 19k.. meaning 1k profit

i think you need to challenge yourself to some lessons of economics

just because a chart shows a market touched $20k does not mean everyones purchase price was 20k
i have coins from 2012. i never would value them at $20k

i grabbed data of the day it went to $20k
on that day when prices were above 19k. meaning a 19-20=5% shift
i can count 15 EASY bot oppertinites to make a total of 15% (there could be more. but i counted just the easy ones)

so lets say that over all the exchanges. 750k was the combined day volume.
thats not 750k people. thats not even 750k coins. thats at most 50k coins bot-trading repeatedly 15 times.

them 50k coins would not have bought at 20k and held on for 12 months and decide to sell finally at the mid $3k range
they would have sold in the 19k range making at worse 1% loss
500coins = only a dozen million $$ not hundreds of millions not billions


I DO NOT TRADE OR ACT AS ESCROW ON THIS FORUM EVER.
Please do your own research & respect what is written here as both opinion & information gleaned from experience. many people replying with insults but no on-topic content substance, automatically are 'facepalmed' and yawned at
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November 30, 2018, 02:01:35 AM
 #9

Though I'm pretty sure there's already institutional money into bitcoin(most likely traded through OTC markets), bitcoin doesn't necessarily need institutional money. Sure, having institutional money can definitely help bitcoin in terms of liquidity and helping it find it's sort of "stable" price probably sooner, but it doesn't necessarily need them. Stability will come in time, as more money goes in into bitcoin from the people.

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btc-room101
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November 30, 2018, 02:13:51 AM
 #10

Though I'm pretty sure there's already institutional money into bitcoin(most likely traded through OTC markets), bitcoin doesn't necessarily need institutional money. Sure, having institutional money can definitely help bitcoin in terms of liquidity and helping it find it's sort of "stable" price probably sooner, but it doesn't necessarily need them. Stability will come in time, as more money goes in into bitcoin from the people.

Who are these people you talk of?

In africa everybody has a mobile phone, and they can have phone-credit, which is like money, and you can buy coke or cigarettes with your mobile, and/or top up with cash as you wish,

All of Asia has the same,

Why would the people adopt btc? Its not easy to use,

Who are these people you talk of?

Post Jan 2017, BTC went from $1k to $21k, but that was mainly because the banks let morons buy BTC (INVEST) with credit-card debt, as the little morons had no actual cash on hand, then in Dec 2017, the banks quit letting idiots buy BTC with credit-cards, and the parabolic ramp-up of BTC during 2017, crashed back to earth,

Now as we go forward, ... who are these 'people' you speak of?

Most suckers got fleeced in 2017, and with the FED-FIAT door closed ( but powell may reopen ), and the credit-card door closed forever for crtypo ( banks are seeing an 80% default on btc purchases )

Please pray-tell who are these people? R U talking of white people in USA who are bankrupt?
bitcoinsc (OP)
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November 30, 2018, 02:37:49 AM
 #11

u are right banks close credit purchases on crypto. it created a network effect. come holiday season we are all broke. we need the credit card to push bitcoin to $15000. but it's less likely to happen. debt to bitcoin like debt to holiday gifts. sad


Though I'm pretty sure there's already institutional money into bitcoin(most likely traded through OTC markets), bitcoin doesn't necessarily need institutional money. Sure, having institutional money can definitely help bitcoin in terms of liquidity and helping it find it's sort of "stable" price probably sooner, but it doesn't necessarily need them. Stability will come in time, as more money goes in into bitcoin from the people.

Who are these people you talk of?

In africa everybody has a mobile phone, and they can have phone-credit, which is like money, and you can buy coke or cigarettes with your mobile, and/or top up with cash as you wish,

All of Asia has the same,

Why would the people adopt btc? Its not easy to use,

Who are these people you talk of?

Post Jan 2017, BTC went from $1k to $21k, but that was mainly because the banks let morons buy BTC (INVEST) with credit-card debt, as the little morons had no actual cash on hand, then in Dec 2017, the banks quit letting idiots buy BTC with credit-cards, and the parabolic ramp-up of BTC during 2017, crashed back to earth,

Now as we go forward, ... who are these 'people' you speak of?

Most suckers got fleeced in 2017, and with the FED-FIAT door closed ( but powell may reopen ), and the credit-card door closed forever for crtypo ( banks are seeing an 80% default on btc purchases )

Please pray-tell who are these people? R U talking of white people in USA who are bankrupt?

Ethereum and Uniswap.
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November 30, 2018, 02:52:46 AM
 #12

Why would the people adopt btc? Its not easy to use,

...
I'm not going to disagree with you here as bitcoin is definitely not easy to use if you're not tech-savvy enough, but take note that we're talking about a 10 year old technology here. Bitcoin will move forward, and with time, people will be creating solutions on how to make bitcoin easy enough for your grandparents. Bitcoin, in it's current state, isn't it's final version. And there is no final version. It will just be improving continuously. It will take time. We shouldn't be focusing too much on price in the first place.

Also, bitcoin isn't just for payments. It is also for store-of-value. While I know it's quite ironic because the price is volatile as heck, for now, we're talking about store-of-value for people living in countries that are facing economic crisis. The 80-90% crash of bitcoin is nothing for the Venezuelans who faced 800,000%+[1] inflation rates on their local fiat currency.

Price stability will take time. I'm pretty sure gold didn't find it's "stable" price in 10 years.


[1] https://tradingeconomics.com/venezuela/inflation-cpi

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November 30, 2018, 03:13:06 AM
 #13

Who says BTC doesn't have institutional money?? Big money betting is ongoing in the crypto market at this current situation and majority of that funds come from institutions. Probably well known companies don't invest in bitcoin openly due to regulatory issues, that's why we are unable to take the names, but that certainly doesn't prove that institutions don't invest in here! They do, just not openly!

Indeed, I think there are spinoff/shell companies that keep cryptocurrency positions off the books of major investment banks. Still, I don't think they have major exposure. I think cryptocurrency trading is still a very small part of any Wall Street institution's business.

Anyway, regarding the OP's point, increased institutional adoption is certainly one way that prices could recover but it's not necessary. Growing adoption by individual users and retail investors will drive the price up just the same.

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November 30, 2018, 03:40:40 AM
 #14

first of all bitcoin has never needed "institutional money". this is some trend that started this year where people get excited (for no reason) when there is talk about ETFs, regulations, government,... and then thing "institutional investors" are the only way bitcoin can go up. this mentality didn't even exist a year ago!

secondly, institutional investors love that 80% drop. it is YOU who don't like it and don't know how to make profit from when price drops. they know well enough how to make a ton of money from drops like this. Wink

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