Evil IP and deleted posts by mods.

[TheBeardedBaby]

Another idea here.
Can we add a system same as the Evil IP but for the bad reports (when someone reported you and your posts get deleted by the mods)?
Example: you have 100 of your posts reported (by someone) and deleted  by moderator, you have to pay a fee to be able to post and the fee increase if more posts are deleted.
It can be activity(or merit) dependent so people who have been here for years and have some/many posts deleted won't be affected that much.

This will add some weight to the reports, because now they are just nothing, wasting of time to both Mods and those reporting.

I  prefer actually those with many bad reports deleted posts by the mods to get banned instead, but I know this will never happen.
So this is the alternative solution.
What you guys think??

Edit: when I'm tired my English gets even worse, sorry about the misleading "bad reports" the real meaning was a deleted posts by mods.

[jackg]

I'm not sure your post makes sense.

There's a bit of ambiguity to me:
1. Is a bad report one where you report someone and it gets flagged as bad
OR
2. Where you get reported and have your psots deleted.

The second is already in place with the autoban function (as far as I'm aware) if people make a few posts and are a new user and they get deleted within a certain time limit, they get autobanned. It's nice to look at on the seclog (although I'm not entirely sure if that is what it is or not - could just be hilariousandco clicking his smite button on a load of newb profiles and changing the type of ban to a fancier one )...

The first is probably a bad idea as theymos seems to want to encourage people to report a lot (as it says on the report to moderator page that it's alright to not have a high percentage).

[Onuohakk]

Well the idea is not such a bad one but this would be a priceless tool in the hands of trollers and they would constantly be abusing the report button just to get under the skin of there victim and also this would be annoying for the moderators.

   this won't be good for some newbie who enters here for the purpose to learn with this implemented it would make them scarred to make post and this would affect there zeal in the long run.

   The  payment method to get back to be able to post won't go well for the image of the forum. The forum is very must established I don't think she needs any one's funds desperately

  Button line having a post deleted is quite a balance way to handle the situation and to maintain a good conducive forum

[elastiman]

I propose blocking accounts for a short time like a week or so. Or that they can't report any more

[kvipcn]

I'm not sure your post makes sense.

There's a bit of ambiguity to me:
1. Is a bad report one where you report someone and it gets flagged as bad
OR
2. Where you get reported and have your psots deleted.

The second is already in place with the autoban function (as far as I'm aware) if people make a few posts and are a new user and they get deleted within a certain time limit, they get autobanned. It's nice to look at on the seclog (although I'm not entirely sure if that is what it is or not - could just be hilariousandco clicking his smite button on a load of newb profiles and changing the type of ban to a fancier one )...

The first is probably a bad idea as theymos seems to want to encourage people to report a lot (as it says on the report to moderator page that it's alright to not have a high percentage).

Hahahahahahaha... I think what he is trying to say is that, there should be a system where people who get their posts deleted by mod on the forum will be charged a fine and this fine increases with the number of posts that will be deleted.

[Steamtyme]

Can we add a system same as the Evil IP but for deleted posts? 

I adjusted this to be what I believe Iasenko was going for. I'm not sure if they meant only as a result of being reported or just total deleted posts in general.

The second is already in place with the autoban function (as far as I'm aware) if people make a few posts and are a new user and they get deleted within a certain time limit, they get autobanned. It's nice to look at on the seclog (although I'm not entirely sure if that is what it is or not - could just be hilariousandco clicking his smite button on a load of newb profiles and changing the type of ban to a fancier one )...

I believe that is only for Newbies. The idea here I believe is to have a level of punishment for all members.


Overall I would have to say I disagree with the idea as it stands. Just for example I have had quite a few posts deleted, for whatever reason, some of them as a result of providing coaching for a reported post. I do that from time to time hoping they will see it read it and learn, full well knowing my post will also be deleted once things are handled.

There is also the question of some boards having differences of opinion on what constituted going OT or is just a good addition to overall discussion. I don't feel genuine users should be punished just because of shitposting spammers.

Now if this were more tied into how many posts are deleted or reported and deleted in a certain timeframe that may narrow it down to the intended group. Perhaps also more of a limit as opposed to a punishment, such as only being able to make 14 posts/week for 2 months. The types of things that would possibly cut into the income earnings if that's why they are here, or to at least stifle the spamming. This could allow members to change habits should they want to contribute to the forum or provide a barrier to earning for those that just want to make money.

[TheBeardedBaby]

I'm not sure your post makes sense.

There's a bit of ambiguity to me:
1. Is a bad report one where you report someone and it gets flagged as bad
OR
2. Where you get reported and have your psots deleted.

The second is already in place with the autoban function (as far as I'm aware) if people make a few posts and are a new user and they get deleted within a certain time limit, they get autobanned. It's nice to look at on the seclog (although I'm not entirely sure if that is what it is or not - could just be hilariousandco clicking his smite button on a load of newb profiles and changing the type of ban to a fancier one )...

The first is probably a bad idea as theymos seems to want to encourage people to report a lot (as it says on the report to moderator page that it's alright to not have a high percentage).

Sorry for the misleading post, yesterday evening when I posted it seemed logical (i've been driving quite a lot and I was tired as hell) , but after reading it today, it was really misleading so I've edited it to be more clear.

The whole idea if you report someone's posts and those get deleted nothing else happens to him and he can have 1000000 deleted posts but still spamming.
If we put Evilness to the IP based on deleted posts by mods I think big part of those bots, which posts get deleted often can be reduced a lot.  
Regarding the autoban function I had a discussion with a mod sometime ago:

It's not autoban...

OK, this is what I see in the modlog:

Autoban user: N/A in topic #0 by member #782523
...
...
Autoban user: N/A in topic #0 by member #2067403

What it is then?

It just means banned. The log only ever shows as nuked or Autoban, I guess its' a limitation in SMF.

Thanks TheQuin, The message came at the moment I reported them so that's why I thought that they were autobanned. Thanks both of you for the help, and sorry LoyceV for the off-topic.

~
Hahahahahahaha... I think what he is trying to say is that, there should be a system where people who get their posts deleted by mod on the forum will be charged a fine and this fine increases with the number of posts that will be deleted.

Thank you for decrypting what I meant.

I adjusted this to be what I believe Iasenko was going for. I'm not sure if they meant only as a result of being reported or just total deleted posts in general.

You got the idea, yeah. I changed the OP too.

Just for example I have had quite a few posts deleted, for whatever reason, some of them as a result of providing coaching for a reported post. I do that from time to time hoping they will see it read it and learn, full well knowing my post will also be deleted once things are handled.

I also have some posts deleted, but I'm not sure if those posts were actually reported because I often post guidelines in threads which get deleted.
That's why I proposed to be Activity/merit dependent, in your case, the deleted posts will not be taken in consideration, based on your received merit.

[Thirdspace]

If we put Evilness to the IP based on deleted posts by mods I think big part of those bots, which posts get deleted often can be reduced a lot.   

it would implicate normal users unfairly the evilness should cling to the user not the IP
many non-bot users (on the same subnet with dynamic IP) may get punished at the same time unintentionally

and I think blocking posts is more appropriate than imposing fines
a few factors such as merit, rank and post numbers can be used to trigger the block
then there should be block time + cooldown time, calculated based on repetitive acts
if another post of the user gets deleted within cooldown time, both timers would be doubled

[Veleor]

If we put Evilness to the IP based on deleted posts by mods I think big part of those bots, which posts get deleted often can be reduced a lot.   

I think it will be a useful feature to show the "deleted posts count" in the users profiles because this statistic on bpip.org is not correct. It happens that dozens of messages have been deleted but the data on bpip.org doesn't change.
Bounty managers could also take into account the parameter of deleted messages when they are recruiting people to signature campaigns. Possibly this will encourage bounty hunters to write meaningful posts and don't break the rules otherwise they risk being in the "blacklist".

[coinlocket$]

I think this is not a good feature, they will encourage the revenge to search on old post history for a specific member only to create damage on one account.

To get a valid use of Evil IP we just need to enable the retroactivity so a lot of spammers/abusers will be afflicted.

[The Cryptovator]

Your main thread is not clear to me, I am not sure if its because of my weak English.

The whole idea if you report someone's posts and those get deleted nothing else happens to him and he can have 1000000 deleted posts but still spamming.

Yes thats the point I think and it has been discussed before. They should punished for their spam post. I can't remember but I think I asked this questionHow many good report to ban a user. They should be ban instead of ask for fee. There should a limit and time period like YouTube copyright strike based on rank. I am not agree to parmaban for spam if rank above Jr. Member.    

I think this is not a good feature, they will encourage the revenge to search on old post history for a specific member only to create damage on one account.

Exactly, I am agree with you.

[TheBeardedBaby]

I think something should be done for all those wasted reports, people just got their spam posts deleted and at the end there are no actions taken to make this stop.
People are already giving up on reporting because the only positive impact is to increase their personal report scores, the spammers just keep spamming.
Bots can just create a new account and there you go again, fighting the machine is worthless.

Ok, no need to pay fees, but at least to be listed the Evilness of the IP their posting from.

[jackg]

I thought that was already being done?

Banned iPs get a sprinkling of evil points don’t they? And why not charge people59 have their account unbanned. A 0.01 penalty for copy-pasting will do the forum quite well...

[TryNinja]

I thought that was already being done?

Banned iPs get a sprinkling of evil points don’t they? And why not charge people59 have their account unbanned. A 0.01 penalty for copy-pasting will do the forum quite well...

Evil points only affect people when they are going to register a new account. If you already have an account, it doesn't matter if you have 10mil evil points.

OP is suggesting a way of temporary blocking people from making posts until they pay for their EP (and while already having an account).

[TheBeardedBaby]

I thought that was already being done?

Banned iPs get a sprinkling of evil points don’t they? And why not charge people59 have their account unbanned. A 0.01 penalty for copy-pasting will do the forum quite well...

You have evilness only for banned accounts.
But quite often people (sry, bots) don't get banned at all, only the spam posts get deleted. I was thinking for some sort of penalty for wasting the Mods attention with 100 deleted posts for example.

I'll ask Vod to make a list with the users with the most deleted posts. It won't be 100% accurate but it will give us the current situation.

[jackg]

I thought that was already being done?

Banned iPs get a sprinkling of evil points don’t they? And why not charge people59 have their account unbanned. A 0.01 penalty for copy-pasting will do the forum quite well...

You have evilness only for banned accounts.
But quite often people (sry, bots) don't get banned at all, only the spam posts get deleted. I was thinking for some sort of penalty for wasting the Mods attention with 100 deleted posts for example.

I'll ask Vod to make a list with the users with the most deleted posts. It won't be 100% accurate but it will give us the current situation.

10 posts deleted in a yearly is quite a lot. I think 100 is too high.
Make them have less if a chance to spam the forum... and that’s a good idea though. Maybe we could have a list of the thousand worst or something.

[bitarmor]

The idea of evil IPs and paid memberships is already enough. I wonder why you think deleted posts should attract a fee; not that its a bad idea but a ban should be sufficient after being warned severally about your off-topic posts

[TheBeardedBaby]

It depends, I have around 11 posts removed so far (a bit over an year on the forum now), but in this list are posts removed from self-moderated threads (just went trough my PM history). So those removed posts in the self-moderated threads are also listed in the modlog, seems like it, this will be a bit of an issue then.

The idea of evil IPs and paid memberships is already enough. I wonder why you think deleted posts should attract a fee; not that its a bad idea but a ban should be sufficient after being warned severally about your off-topic posts

Because it will be automated, so less work for the mods in the fight with the bots. If we get them banned, this would be the perfect solution of course, but the reality is different, most of them escape the ban and just continue spamming.

[bitarmor]

I really do not want to believe there are bots on this forum. 
Thinking of it; whomever must have built them must have really put in much work to it.
I am a dev and the thought of building a bot to navigate this forum really scares me. 

[jackg]

I really do not want to believe there are bots on this forum. 
Thinking of it; whomever must have built them must have really put in much work to it.
I am a dev and the thought of building a bot to navigate this forum really scares me. 

. A posting bot for a specific thread actually wouldn’t be too difficult to make... Id it’s navigating the forum, that’s a separate issue though. All you’re doing when you post is communicating with a computer, that being done by another computer is clearly going to be much faster once the development is done.
I imagine a lot of copy and pasters do manual work and only a few bots exist (that probably control a lot of accounts though).