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Author Topic: There should be a public general elections on the DTs  (Read 936 times)
gwsukabokepjepang
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January 31, 2019, 07:12:25 PM
 #61

Just explain why you think that users should lose money to scams and then provide feedback when they can be protected with proactive feedback.

omg, i said that the DT feedback can't be trusted. Default escrow should be in place to prevent scams.

I am not blaming the DT, i am not a fan of the trust system that's all.
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January 31, 2019, 07:13:51 PM
 #62

omg, i said that the DT feedback can't be trusted. Default escrow should be in place.

I am not blaming the DT, i am not a fan of the trust system that's all.
Why can DT feedback not be trusted? If there are obvious signs of a scam, shouldn't that be publicized accordingly?

Moreover, there are escrows in place if people look for them. However, centralization of escrow services isn't exactly what you want.

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January 31, 2019, 07:17:03 PM
Last edit: February 01, 2019, 05:01:14 PM by suchmoon
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 #63

It's the only way!

It's not.

And it wouldn't help idiots like you who ignore warnings anyway. You could do it on your own by building your own trust list to include only users who post trust feedback based on their own trades. Right now you're doing pretty much the opposite - you're including users who share your dislike for some other users.

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January 31, 2019, 07:17:37 PM
Last edit: January 31, 2019, 07:31:55 PM by khaled0111
 #64

Quote
why this thread only DT members are replying? Where are the members and newbies?
Hi!

Quote
As i said, how can i trust you guys, did you buy the item? simple answer.

If not, then there is no such business in the world that allow customers to anyhow give feedback without buying items!
Obviously you are confusing rating/reviews with the trust system.
DTs tag members based on many factors. Feedbacks left from "customers" is one of these factors.
DTs identify scammers and tag them as a preventive mesure.
Though, positive trust should be given to a member after he makes successful deals.

In fact, your first question prooves how active DT members are, thus you can be sure if you open an accusation thread, they will take the necessary acts.
Now, would you trust newbies that didn't make the effort even to reply here?!

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gwsukabokepjepang
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January 31, 2019, 07:29:37 PM
 #65

omg, i said that the DT feedback can't be trusted. Default escrow should be in place.

I am not blaming the DT, i am not a fan of the trust system that's all.
Why can DT feedback not be trusted? If there are obvious signs of a scam, shouldn't that be publicized accordingly?

Moreover, there are escrows in place if people look for them. However, centralization of escrow services isn't exactly what you want.

how is account selling a scam? I read that it's legal.
This thread is about preventing more after me to always use escrow!

And not to read DT's trusted feedback, just like how they gang up on me.
How is that fair?

Ok, i will repeat and will repeat many times, there is no such thing in this world as customers giving feedback without buying items.
And continue doing this, more will get scammed.
It will always create the illusion that this person is unfairly treated by DT.

TRUST ME!
i got red trust because you all gang on me, just like how VINSIN got red trust when all DT gang on him!

Quote
why this thread only DT members are replying? Where are the members and newbies?
Hi!

You are full member with 200+ merits.

Quote
As i said, how can i trust you guys, did you buy the item? simple answer.

If not, then there is no such business in the world that allow customers to anyhow give feedback without buying items!
Obviously you are confusing rating/reviews with the trust system.
DTs tag members based on many factors. Feedbacks left from "customers" is one of these factors.
DTs identify scammers and tag them as a preventive mesure.
Though, positive trust should be given to a member after he makes successful deals.


same mate. how is this different?
Feedbacks left from "customers" is one of these factors. As far as i can see, there are no customers feedback till me.

+ some even don't want to give positive trust after successful deal.

Any reason why i am the only newbie in this thread when most are DT?

Reputation section isn't really popular, most members only visit Bitcoin Discussion, Economics & Alternate cryptocurrencies sections. Besides, i doubt newbies are familiar with this forum systems (DT, merit, unique rules, etc.)

That means the forum must be turned into marketplace where the forum have full information (such as buyer, seller, escrow, data, sold item/service, price, etc.) and it's tall-order. You need to convince theymos to add such huge feature.

It's the only way! I know it's not easy and takes time, but well, he can always ask for public donations and i will donate.
theymos can keep certain information.
I do hope he can consider.

Money isn't problem as this forum have lots of money, but the real problem is theymos manage this forum system/feature mostly by himself and AFAIK don't really trust others for this matter.

thats the problem, i thought DT can be trusted? Forum this big requires a lot manpower, why binance have lots of employees?
Even Binance, i believe, hold billions of dollars. I salute CZ that he can handle this trust.
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January 31, 2019, 07:36:53 PM
 #66

how is account selling a scam? I read that it's legal.
Where did you read that? The rules?

No one has stated that account selling is outright scamming. No one.

However, account trading is equivalent to trading reputation/trust. It is not trustworthy behavior. Recall that a high rank on the forum should be a privilege, not a right.

This thread is about preventing more after me to always use escrow!
Users have been advocating for use of an escrow all the time. Ever see that Prevention is better than a cure thread? It's stickied.

And not to read DT's trusted feedback, just like how they gang up on me.
How is that fair?
I don't understand this statement. Can you reword it or clarify what you mean by this?

Ok, i will repeat and will repeat many times, there is no such thing in this world as customers giving feedback without buying items.
And continue doing this, more will get scammed.
Proactive feedback prevents scams from taking place in the first place. Meaning: instead of a scammer being ousted after they take (arbitrary)  1 BTC, they can be ousted after they take 0 BTC.

It will always create the illusion that this person is unfairly treated by DT.
Only if the feedback is untrue.



What did i do wrong?
I can't participate in signature campaigns?
And build some trust for some deals to earn side income?
Everyone needs money!
Ok even that i said i want buy accounts that have trust if can, no trust is okay,
so that at least i can participate in signature campaigns.
You can absolutely participate in signature campaigns. When you earn the privilege.

Generally, the post quality of users increases with time and experience. Spam is a cancer upon the forum.

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January 31, 2019, 07:41:44 PM
 #67

And not to read DT's trusted feedback, just like how they gang up on me.
How is that fair?
I don't understand this statement. Can you reword it or clarify what you mean by this?

DT trusted feedback is like a gang! Once have 1 red, all red will come.

Ok, i will repeat and will repeat many times, there is no such thing in this world as customers giving feedback without buying items.
And continue doing this, more will get scammed.
Proactive feedback prevents scams from taking place in the first place. Meaning: instead of a scammer being ousted after they take (arbitrary)  1 BTC, they can be ousted after they take 0 BTC.

Proactive feedback, you have not been in buyer shoes when buying accounts. Because all account sellers have red trust no matter what.



What did i do wrong?
I can't participate in signature campaigns?
And build some trust for some deals to earn side income?
Everyone needs money!
Ok even that i said i want buy accounts that have trust if can, no trust is okay,
so that at least i can participate in signature campaigns.
You can absolutely participate in signature campaigns. When you earn the privilege.

Generally, the post quality of users increases with time and experience. Spam is a cancer upon the forum.
[/quote]

how do you know i will spam?
i thought there is already a time limit in place?

And thats the problem, by the time i get to certain rank, bounty is already over!
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January 31, 2019, 07:51:23 PM
 #68

Please quote properly. This is getting very difficult.

DT trusted feedback is like a gang! Once have 1 red, all red will come.
I meant the "And not to read DT's trusted feedback" part. It seems very abrupt.

Proactive feedback, u have not been in buyer shoes when buying accounts. Because all account sellers have red trust no matter what.
Okay. But I haven't been saying anything about account sellers, have I? At least in regards to my opinion about proactive feedback.

how do you know i will spam?
i thought there is already a time limit in place?

And thats the problem, by the time i get to certain rank, bounty is already over!
There are always going to be bounties, for one.

By spam, I don't mean posting numerous replies within a short interval. What I am referring to is the lack of substance in posts. For example, there are a ridiculous number of threads in the Bitcoin Discussion and Economics sections that have no substance whatsoever. The replies are even more useless, for example just rephrasing "buy high sell low, you can't really tell the price" in 200 characters to fit their campaign criteria.

how many DT have bought account? Maybe for some legit reasons?

that's why they don't understand, they are not in customer shoes at all.

And they generalized all account buyers will spam.
Perhaps there are some account buyers that don't spam. Perhaps there are some that do contribute to the forum. Example: Avirunes.

But for the majority of users - I'm willing to say over 90% - account trading only makes the forum suffer. Given a fixed time, the more accounts you have, the worse your post quality.

Why do you think that when account farmers are ousted, their accounts have horrendous post history?

And i don't see any high ranked members or very few participating in signatures anymore.
There are at least 50 users in the ChipMixer campaign.

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January 31, 2019, 10:26:35 PM
Merited by suchmoon (4), The Pharmacist (2), LoyceV (1)
 #69

how do you know i will spam?
i thought there is already a time limit in place?
TBH, we don't know that you will spam... However, history has shown that the vast majority of users who buy accounts solely for participating in sig campaigns end up spamming/shitposting

The sequence of events goes something like this:
1. User buys an account to participate in sig campaigns, because they want to make money from the forum
2. Given that making money is their top priority here, this means that they would be trying to maximise the number of posts they make
3. This inevitably leads to making shitposts to try and get their post count up to hit the maximum (or at least the campaign minimum) to get paid.

This has a negative effect on the forum as a whole, as instead of meaningful and insightful discussions... we get countless threads like "What do you think Bitcoin price will do?", "How did you find out about Cryptocurrency?", "Is now bear market?", "Is now bull market?", "What do you use Cryptocurrency for?", "What is best wallet?"... all filled with complete trash answers just echoing what the 20 posts before them say, simply so people can make money. Undecided

Because of this, some DT members tag bought/sold accounts... as they consider that activity as untrustworthy. Reputation and Trust are not things that should be bought, they should be earned.

Likewise, participating in campaigns on this forum is a privilege to be earned, not a right. Contrary to popular opinion, just because you have an email address and can create an account here does not automatically grant you the right to come here, join a campaign and start earning money.

You made the fatal mistake of believing that the forum owes you something... when you have contributed nothing. You also don't seem to grasp the fact that this place isn't really a democracy. It is a "private" system that is owned by Theymos. Theymos, as the owner, has created a set of rules. The fact that you don't like these rules is your problem, it is not a fault of the system. There is nothing forcing you to be here. There is also nothing stopping you from setting up your own forum with the systems/rules that you want. However, if you do want to stay, then the onus is on you to accept these rules and work within them.

You are also free to petition Theymos to change the rules, but he is under no obligation to make any changes, simply because you don't like the way things work here.


Quote
And thats the problem, by the time i get to certain rank, bounty is already over!
Yeah, because there will be no more bounties... ever... oh wait, sorry... that is my fantasy world where the entire Altcoin section has been removed from this forum. Roll Eyes

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February 01, 2019, 02:13:45 AM
 #70

the forum did not owe me anything, yes.

And i find it suspicious that the admin starts to delete some of my feedback.
http://prntscr.com/mf15mp
http://prntscr.com/mf15s8
http://prntscr.com/mf15wo

Its okay, i am just saying that lots of people will get scammed if you continue with this trust system.
You can continue to defend it. I am just trying to stop people like VINSIN from scamming more people.

No point, i wasted lots of my time giving feedback and this is what i get.
I will remove my "untrusted" feedback.

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February 01, 2019, 02:28:52 AM
 #71

And i find it suspicious that the admin starts to delete some of my feedback.

Your posts are getting deleted because you're breaking the rules. Tends to be a common trait among those who whine a lot about how unfair this forum is to them.

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February 01, 2019, 04:51:43 AM
 #72

Its okay, i am just saying that lots of people will get scammed if you continue with this trust system.
You can continue to defend it. I am just trying to stop people like VINSIN from scamming more people.
Why do you think that other people would do the same as you and ignore all of those (Default) Trust ratings that indicate that VINSIN is not to be trusted? Huh

This is something that still confuses me... he had MULTIPLE red trust ratings... and you still went ahead and traded with them... WHY? Huh Huh Huh


Quote
No point, i wasted lots of my time giving feedback and this is what i get.
I will remove my "untrusted" feedback.
Why would you do that? That is probably the worst thing you could do. Undecided

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February 01, 2019, 06:01:56 AM
 #73

Its okay, i am just saying that lots of people will get scammed if you continue with this trust system.
You can continue to defend it. I am just trying to stop people like VINSIN from scamming more people.
Why do you think that other people would do the same as you and ignore all of those (Default) Trust ratings that indicate that VINSIN is not to be trusted? Huh

This is something that still confuses me... he had MULTIPLE red trust ratings... and you still went ahead and traded with them... WHY? Huh Huh Huh

you can ask 2 others before me, with just 6 sally transactions, why they traded with him too. It's not about the red trust.
I feel there is something genuine with him that's why.
He will continue to scam with this method. He is smart!

Quote
No point, i wasted lots of my time giving feedback and this is what i get.
I will remove my "untrusted" feedback.
Why would you do that? That is probably the worst thing you could do. Undecided

Why should i help? I already waste my time trying to prove a point, but you guys ignore me.

And even my feedback got deleted.

And my genuine feedback is placed on untrusted section.
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February 01, 2019, 06:14:47 AM
 #74

I am just trying to stop people like VINSIN from scamming more people.

If only we had some sort of system where users could leave ratings for other users based on their experiences in dealing with them, and then other forum members could read what they had written, and decide whether or not they wanted to trade with or trust them... Some sort of a "truster system", perhaps... Just thinking out loud.

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February 01, 2019, 06:15:21 AM
 #75

And my genuine feedback is placed on untrusted section.
Once you educate yourself on the systems of the forum, clarity will come forth to your mind.

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February 01, 2019, 06:20:27 AM
 #76

I am just trying to stop people like VINSIN from scamming more people.

If only we had some sort of system where users could leave ratings for other users based on their experiences in dealing with them, and then other forum members could read what they had written, and decide whether or not they wanted to trade with or trust them... Some sort of a "truster system", perhaps... Just thinking out loud.

see, i would prefer this kind of improvement feedback.
Many people, brainstorming on how to improve the system, is better.
Nothing wrong with that right?

I am not whining, but trust me even though i got -10, VINSIN will continue to scam more people!
I just want to prevent that from happening even further, but you DT gang up against me,
what can i do?

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February 01, 2019, 06:25:44 AM
 #77

I am just trying to stop people like VINSIN from scamming more people.

If only we had some sort of system where users could leave ratings for other users based on their experiences in dealing with them, and then other forum members could read what they had written, and decide whether or not they wanted to trade with or trust them... Some sort of a "truster system", perhaps... Just thinking out loud.

see, i would prefer this kind of improvement feedback.
Many people, brainstorming on how to improve the system, is better.
Nothing wrong with that right?

Actually I was being sarcastic. My apologies for being too subtle about it.

I am not whining, but trust me even though i got -10, VINSIN will continue to scam more people!
I just want to prevent that from happening even further, but you DT gang up against me,
what can i do?

There's a few things you can do:

1. Start over with a brand new account.
2. Don't trade with somebody who has a deep red trust rating.
3. Use a bit more discretion if you do proceed in future trades, or better yet: don't trade at all, especially when it comes to accounts.

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gwsukabokepjepang
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February 01, 2019, 06:53:05 AM
 #78

I am just trying to stop people like VINSIN from scamming more people.

If only we had some sort of system where users could leave ratings for other users based on their experiences in dealing with them, and then other forum members could read what they had written, and decide whether or not they wanted to trade with or trust them... Some sort of a "truster system", perhaps... Just thinking out loud.

see, i would prefer this kind of improvement feedback.
Many people, brainstorming on how to improve the system, is better.
Nothing wrong with that right?

Actually I was being sarcastic. My apologies for being too subtle about it.

I am not whining, but trust me even though i got -10, VINSIN will continue to scam more people!
I just want to prevent that from happening even further, but you DT gang up against me,
what can i do?

There's a few things you can do:

1. Start over with a brand new account.
2. Don't trade with somebody who has a deep red trust rating.
3. Use a bit more discretion if you do proceed in future trades, or better yet: don't trade at all, especially when it comes to accounts.


All i can say is he will continue to scam more people.
If you don't believe, come back again next month with a proof of his sally transactions.
TalkStar
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February 01, 2019, 09:04:40 AM
 #79

All i can say is he will continue to scam more people.
If you don't believe, come back again next month with a proof of his sally transactions.
I don't know how could you think "VINSIN" will continue his scam. But i can assure you here in the bitcointalk it will be so much tough for him mate.

Active DT team and trustworthy members are always here to keep our users safe from scammers. There's no way if you don't give him money for free.  

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February 01, 2019, 06:22:46 PM
 #80

I don't really understand the logic behind selecting DT members or having an election in the first place. It's very easy you see, you spend some time on the forum, find a few members who you consider trustworthy or reliable or rational and then add them to your list? You can remove everyone else from the list that you don't trust. Instead of changing the system, change your trust settings babe.


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