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Author Topic: Is Merit Requirement Per Rank Excessive?  (Read 746 times)
akamit
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Merit: 535


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April 12, 2019, 03:39:38 PM
Merited by Sutters Mill (1)
 #1

Source: LoyceV's Merit Data Analysis
According to Loyce's weekly data we can see Merit Sources and other members are distributing sMerits to the quality posts and the numbers are quite impressive as I've thought to be.

Total number of users who gave away 1 or more sMerit: 19903
Sample
Code:
1. 13111 Merit sent by suchmoon (#234771) to 989 unique users in 3212 transactions
     2. 8962 Merit sent by dbshck (#153634) to 809 unique users in 3319 transactions
     3. 6272 Merit sent by Foxpup (#55384) to 295 unique users in 2275 transactions
     4. 5810 Merit sent by chimk (#1202061) to 602 unique users in 2624 transactions
     5. 3947 Merit sent by qwk (#24140) to 439 unique users in 2663 transactions
     6. 3595 Merit sent by TMAN (#98986) to 372 unique users in 1024 transactions
     7. 3483 Merit sent by LoyceV (#459836) to 867 unique users in 2793 transactions
     8. 3464 Merit sent by bones261 (#452769) to 681 unique users in 2177 transactions
     9. 3366 Merit sent by QuestionAuthority (#72795) to 205 unique users in 238 transactions
    10. 3245 Merit sent by Vod (#30747) to 534 unique users in 1229 transactions
    11. 2760 Merit sent by Flying Hellfish (#79608) to 218 unique users in 595 transactions
    12. 2528 Merit sent by paxmao (#1192397) to 699 unique users in 1806 transactions
    13. 2456 Merit sent by EFS (#140584) to 366 unique users in 1025 transactions
    14. 2281 Merit sent by JayJuanGee (#252510) to 603 unique users in 2265 transactions
    15. 2164 Merit sent by frodocooper (#988740) to 254 unique users in 1187 transactions
    16. 2051 Merit sent by DarkStar_ (#507936) to 470 unique users in 773 transactions
    17. 2039 Merit sent by Welsh (#84521) to 297 unique users in 722 transactions
    18. 1870 Merit sent by OgNasty (#18321) to 961 unique users in 1562 transactions
    19. 1743 Merit sent by Halab (#1053119) to 204 unique users in 806 transactions
    20. 1665 Merit sent by BobLawblaw (#569455) to 156 unique users in 1054 transactions
    21. 1614 Merit sent by xandry (#382413) to 337 unique users in 1208 transactions
    22. 1520 Merit sent by DdmrDdmr (#1582324) to 380 unique users in 1351 transactions
    23. 1494 Merit sent by LFC_Bitcoin (#379487) to 356 unique users in 1283 transactions
    24. 1488 Merit sent by Jet Cash (#698159) to 442 unique users in 871 transactions
    25. 1457 Merit sent by vapourminer (#33156) to 705 unique users in 1363 transactions
    26. 1348 Merit sent by Micio (#115423) to 97 unique users in 548 transactions
    27. 1291 Merit sent by The Pharmacist (#487418) to 398 unique users in 860 transactions
    28. 1145 Merit sent by theymos (#35) to 161 unique users in 211 transactions
    29. 1137 Merit sent by krogothmanhattan (#1000199) to 268 unique users in 686 transactions
    30. 1117 Merit sent by Vlad2Vlad (#112208) to 66 unique users in 195 transactions
    31. 1014 Merit sent by mindrust (#176777) to 280 unique users in 513 transactions
    32. 993 Merit sent by ETFbitcoin (#359716) to 262 unique users in 791 transactions
    33. 982 Merit sent by teramit (#158960) to 243 unique users in 418 transactions
    34. 878 Merit sent by Globb0 (#244243) to 133 unique users in 312 transactions
    35. 851 Merit sent by o_e_l_e_o (#1188543) to 267 unique users in 652 transactions
    36. 850 Merit sent by micgoossens (#1067333) to 129 unique users in 794 transactions
    37. 840 Merit sent by infofront (#41175) to 181 unique users in 825 transactions
    38. 832 Merit sent by achow101 (#290195) to 155 unique users in 397 transactions
    39. 825 Merit sent by Last of the V8s (#479624) to 208 unique users in 816 transactions
    40. 771 Merit sent by mprep (#51173) to 233 unique users in 462 transactions
    41. 743 Merit sent by joniboini (#1275282) to 162 unique users in 480 transactions
    42. 720 Merit sent by xhomerx10 (#120694) to 185 unique users in 579 transactions
    43. 688 Merit sent by malevolent (#23092) to 168 unique users in 307 transactions
    44. 626 Merit sent by cAPSLOCK (#35501) to 98 unique users in 259 transactions
    45. 592 Merit sent by 600watt (#88912) to 173 unique users in 478 transactions
    46. 574 Merit sent by hilariousetc (#397737) to 147 unique users in 293 transactions
    47. 573 Merit sent by jbreher (#28719) to 125 unique users in 434 transactions
    48. 570 Merit sent by theymos_away (#349090) to 107 unique users in 133 transactions
    49. 556 Merit sent by esmanthra (#1764764) to 143 unique users in 331 transactions
    50. 541 Merit sent by sapta (#347141) to 89 unique users in 128 transactions
.......
.......
.......
 19854. 1 Merit sent by 3philong (#1065792) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19855. 1 Merit sent by 3dyx (#1130468) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19856. 1 Merit sent by 3dianle (#1218380) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19857. 1 Merit sent by 3dOOm (#2288758) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19858. 1 Merit sent by 3btc (#69960) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19859. 1 Merit sent by 3acaga (#1232502) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19860. 1 Merit sent by 360llqzc (#1300924) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19861. 1 Merit sent by 2tang (#1003532) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19862. 1 Merit sent by 2drive (#1304704) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19863. 1 Merit sent by 2andahalfBTC (#1142164) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19864. 1 Merit sent by 27aume (#1001865) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19865. 1 Merit sent by 24Kt (#936906) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19866. 1 Merit sent by 2342q6tegw (#1212678) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19867. 1 Merit sent by 214missy (#1285563) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19868. 1 Merit sent by 212fox (#1342293) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19869. 1 Merit sent by 1pool Ltd. (#2062862) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19870. 1 Merit sent by 1melyun (#543052) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19871. 1 Merit sent by 1cyrax00 (#964210) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19872. 1 Merit sent by 1chempion123 (#1346880) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19873. 1 Merit sent by 1cak (#1136856) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19874. 1 Merit sent by 1amCrypt0 (#933826) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19875. 1 Merit sent by 1CryptoSmurf (#1352746) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19876. 1 Merit sent by 19nataliya12 (#1873934) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19877. 1 Merit sent by 19dimasik77 (#881779) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19878. 1 Merit sent by 19Nov16 (#921267) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19879. 1 Merit sent by 17buratin (#1187494) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19880. 1 Merit sent by 13ex07 (#1207068) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19881. 1 Merit sent by 13Charlie (#76987) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19882. 1 Merit sent by 12retepnat34 (#1053271) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19883. 1 Merit sent by 10yearsolder (#1094878) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19884. 1 Merit sent by 10BTCaDay (#396522) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19885. 1 Merit sent by 100kk (#1316426) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19886. 1 Merit sent by 100eth (#1324600) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19887. 1 Merit sent by 100bitcoin (#239632) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19888. 1 Merit sent by 0virtual (#1244555) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19889. 1 Merit sent by 0Alvaren0 (#2020991) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19890. 1 Merit sent by 01bits (#1629161) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19891. 1 Merit sent by 01BTC (#1756786) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19892. 1 Merit sent by 00DKM@ (#1311705) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19893. 1 Merit sent by .nuke (#89670) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19894. 1 Merit sent by .anto. (#548049) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19895. 1 Merit sent by -kirito (#1747828) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19896. 1 Merit sent by -ck (#19971) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19897. 1 Merit sent by -Kaizer- (#60550) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19898. 1 Merit sent by -Blockcuan- (#2545116) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19899. 1 Merit sent by $Talker (#1043705) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19900. 1 Merit sent by $@to$h! (#1183184) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19901. 1 Merit sent by $$$ (#525995) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19902. 1 Merit sent by #Bentley (#1232592) to 1 unique users in 1 transactions
 19903. -104 Merit sent by deMerit (Bitcoin Forum) (#0) to 15 unique users in 16 transactions

Merit per day of the week
Monday 48824 (13.73%)
Tuesday 51085 (14.36%)
Wednesday 49706 (13.97%)
Thursday 63080 (17.73%)
Friday 52370 (14.72%)
Saturday 45925 (12.91%)
Sunday 44601 (12.54%)
Total: 355591


Now to my question, Is merit requirement per rank excessive?
We can see lots of hate, disappointment towards the merit system almost daily.
The reason is, users are not ranking up (except some) and they are accusing Merit sources, DT. Saying they are not fair, they are distributing to their pals only, etc etc.
But the above stats show that everyone is doing their job perfectly and the numbers are the evidence of the work done on a weekly basis.

However, after all the works by merit distributors, it is true that the users are not ranking up even if he/she is a quality poster.
There are probably two reasons for this, (1) Merit Requirement Per Rank Excessive (2) Merit Sources are low in number in comparison with the members this forum has.

Merit Requirements Per Rank.
Jr Member: 1
Member: 10 (x10 required from Jr. to member)
Full Member: 100 (x90 required from member to full)
Sr. Member: 250 (x150 required from full to senior)
Hero Member: 500 (x250 required from senior to hero)
Legendary: 1000 (x500 required from hero to legendary)

Beside my base question, I also want to point out one more thing. "Day by day peoples make themselves better or worse?" My point for Senior to Hero to Legendary.

Please correct me if I'm wrong or if you think my points are valid then share your opinion.


Not sure if it has been discussed before. Let me know if it is discussed before, I will lock this thread right away.

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1558694537
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bitcoin revo
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Activity: 1175
Merit: 1049



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April 12, 2019, 03:46:22 PM
 #2

Obviously I'm biased with my rank, but I don't see any reason why riding the good life as a Senior Member for a few more months than your activity says you should matters - unless you're solely here for signature campaigns (in which case I kindly ask for one to GTFO).

Also, yes, it has been discussed more than its fair share.
suchmoon
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Merit: 3218


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April 12, 2019, 03:53:45 PM
 #3

After 5+ years I'm still not sure why people care so much about ranks and other badges. If it's for money-making purposes (e.g. sig campaigns) - the forum doesn't control that. If the ranks would be easier to attain then there would be more users competing for the same campaigns and then it's up to each manager how they deal with that. Some managers already have merit requirements.

mjglqw
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Activity: 952
Merit: 656


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April 12, 2019, 03:53:57 PM
 #4

Nope. I don't think so. I think the merit requirements per rank is already is in their sort of "sweet spot" whereas it isn't excessively high, and at the same time, not too easy. Ignore those people who are complaining. They aren't receiving merits? Simple. It's highly likely simply because they don't deserve it. It's pretty much like janitors complaining why they aren't being promoted to a manager position in a company even if they know little to nothing.

Yes, 1000 is definitely A LOT of merits for a certain rank(legendary). But it isn't called "legendary" for no reason. It should be very hard to attain in the first place. It isn't even excessively difficult to attain to be honest, it's just going to take a while.

Quickseller
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Merit: 1569


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April 12, 2019, 03:56:04 PM
Merited by bones261 (2), LoyceV (1), bitcoin revo (1), Sutters Mill (1)
 #5

I am currently the 95th most merited person on the forum and in the just under 16 months since the merit system was introduced, I have not yet received sufficient merit required to become a hero member. I was around when a lot of sMerit was airdropped to everyone and a lot of merit was being given out by a lot of people. There are more merit sources now, but much fewer people are now giving out merit.

The above means less than 95 people have become hero members, I know only a small handful of people have become legendary. I don’t know off hand how many have become senior members but I am pretty sure it isn’t many.

Based on the above, I think the merit system needs to be tinkered with a little bit.

NOTBanned from displaying signatures until May 20, 2022, 11:26:45 PM
Don’t Plagiarize, it’s dishonest and you *will* get caught
stompix
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April 12, 2019, 04:04:30 PM
 #6

No.
And I personally think that theymos should increase the jr requirement to at least 3 or 5 and member to 25.
That should get rid of a lot of merit sales and shares as it will simply become too expensive and far to easy to spot.

Also, I would love to see merit decay, even if it's only for the airdrop merit.
I saw in the last days in China bans mining topics a lot of people with ranks from hero to jr that had no clue how mining works, how bitcoins are mined, how transactions work, but still felt the need to spread their knowledge...
Burning 1/2/5 whatever airdop merits per activity period, that would be so nice!!!!!

DireWolfM14
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Merit: 543



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April 12, 2019, 04:15:01 PM
 #7

I am currently the 95th most merited person on the forum and in the just under 16 months since the merit system was introduced, I have not yet received sufficient merit required to become a hero member. I was around when a lot of sMerit was airdropped to everyone and a lot of merit was being given out by a lot of people. There are more merit sources now, but much fewer people are now giving out merit.

The above means less than 95 people have become hero members, I know only a small handful of people have become legendary. I don’t know off hand how many have become senior members but I am pretty sure it isn’t many.

Based on the above, I think the merit system needs to be tinkered with a little bit.

I don't see that as a big deal.  After 16 months, and you're almost a self-made Hero Member.  That seems like a reasonable time frame. 

I had zero experience with cryptocurrency when I joined the forum a year ago, and that last time I did any coding was over 25 years ago.  I try to be helpful, courteous (mostly,) and share what I learn, and despite my lack of technical knowledge I was able to attain Sr. Member status in about 11 months. 

I don't know what a reasonable time frame for ranking up is, but it's bound to take some of us longer than others.  Some of the members that rank up quickly are spending many hours a day on the forum, and making hundreds of posts a week.


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Quickseller
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April 12, 2019, 04:25:23 PM
 #8

I am currently the 95th most merited person on the forum and in the just under 16 months since the merit system was introduced, I have not yet received sufficient merit required to become a hero member. I was around when a lot of sMerit was airdropped to everyone and a lot of merit was being given out by a lot of people. There are more merit sources now, but much fewer people are now giving out merit.

The above means less than 95 people have become hero members, I know only a small handful of people have become legendary. I don’t know off hand how many have become senior members but I am pretty sure it isn’t many.

Based on the above, I think the merit system needs to be tinkered with a little bit.

I don't see that as a big deal.  After 16 months, and you're almost a self-made Hero Member.  That seems like a reasonable time frame. 

I had zero experience with cryptocurrency when I joined the forum a year ago, and that last time I did any coding was over 25 years ago.  I try to be helpful, courteous (mostly,) and share what I learn, and despite my lack of technical knowledge I was able to attain Sr. Member status in about 11 months. 

I don't know what a reasonable time frame for ranking up is, but it's bound to take some of us longer than others.  Some of the members that rank up quickly are spending many hours a day on the forum, and making hundreds of posts a week.


I am nearly a self made “hero” but that is me. There are only 94 people with more merit than I have. There are hundreds of thousands of people who use the forum every month, most probably won’t participate continuously for 16 months, but I would expect for at least thousands to have enough activity to be a hero.

I would also point out that I had extensive knowledge about bitcoin when the merit system was introduced, which probably increased the amount of merit I received. This would not be the case for the average person.

NOTBanned from displaying signatures until May 20, 2022, 11:26:45 PM
Don’t Plagiarize, it’s dishonest and you *will* get caught
LoyceV
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April 12, 2019, 04:27:58 PM
Last edit: April 12, 2019, 04:38:21 PM by LoyceV
Merited by Foxpup (3)
 #9

The above means less than 95 people have become hero members
It's much less: many of those (less than) 95 users had a high rank already and didn't rank up.
My weekly Merit update isn't finished yet, but here's a sneak preview with this morning's data:
17 users earned 1000+ Merit
76 users earned 500+ Merit
204 users earned 250+ Merit
607 users earned 100+ Merit
7336 users earned 10+ Merit
27732 users earned 1+ Merit

Ranking up is no longer for everyone, and I think that's a good thing. I haven't seen too many good users who are being limited by Merit, but if you find them, please report their posts their good posts here.

There are hundreds of thousands of people who use the forum every month, most probably won’t participate continuously for 16 months, but I would expect for at least thousands to have enough activity to be a hero.
I don't think it's realistic to expect thousands of users to earn more Merit than Activity. And I think you're off on the total number of real users, hundreds of thousands of active posters doesn't mean they're all unique users. I expect many alt accounts, and ranking up more than one account is virtually impossible (empirical evidence here).

Quote
I would also point out that I had extensive knowledge about bitcoin when the merit system was introduced, which probably increased the amount of merit I received. This would not be the case for the average person.
I'm pretty sure your red trust discourages people from meriting you, otherwise you'd probably have had much more by now.

Steamtyme
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April 12, 2019, 04:40:45 PM
 #10

The above means less than 95 people have become hero members, I know only a small handful of people have become legendary. I don’t know off hand how many have become senior members but I am pretty sure it isn’t many.

Rank up thread - This thread documents users who have ranked up, usually updated weekly I believe.

Legendary - 11
Hero - 43
Senior - 108
Full - 183

I don't know that we need to change the requirements. So what if you don't get to Hero in under 2 years. You can still actively participate in all aspects of the forum. There are also a lot of resources out there to gain merit, even coming to Meta and bitching about it.

The key is as long as people can review your posts and find something objectively good you will receive some merit. I would keep the requirements where they are but might consider adding some more sources for a more concentrated effect. I'm sure we could see statistically where merit doesn't flow, perhaps we could find out first if the board has anything merit worthy. Next maybe nominate a source who frequents that area, better yet who only really frequents that area. Some local boards could benefit.

Quote
I would also point out that I had extensive knowledge about bitcoin when the merit system was introduced, which probably increased the amount of merit I received. This would not be the case for the average person.
I'm pretty sure your red trust discourages people from meriting you, otherwise you'd probably have had much more by now.

I would have to agree with that. It probably doesn't help that QS does tend to have a differing opinion with quite a few of the most generous merit givers. Which can lead to overlooking a quality post due to disagreeing with the message.

Coolcryptovator
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April 12, 2019, 04:45:00 PM
 #11

I believe according to activity merit requirement if fine. I have joined this forum after implementation of merit system and now I am the top 57th merited user all time. But unfortunately still I am Sr. Member due to lack of activity even I have earned 604 merit. I think merit should increase for Jr. Member. I believe most of contributor earning enough merit. But its true day by day merit distribution is decreasing because of spent airdrop merit. Whoever can't earn merit he will not able to distribute smerit if a user already spent his/her smerit. So its very important to increase merit source regularly. And also need increase monthly budget of source. Then merit system will be remain fresh always. Admin should assign merit source consistently like every three month 10/15 merit source.

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DireWolfM14
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April 12, 2019, 04:45:47 PM
 #12

~but I would expect for at least thousands to have enough activity to be a hero.~

That's why the merit system was implemented.  You now need to actually contribute to the forum rather than just stay logged-in for the requisite time period and spew enough off-topic shitposts to rank up.  Again, I don't know what's an acceptable number of members that the community thinks should be ranking up, but as Loyce's data shows 76 members were able to earn enough merit to reach hero.  

Now, I don't know what your idea of a "Hero" is, but I've always used the word in an rather exclusive manner.  Not to mention "Legendary."

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Quickseller
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April 12, 2019, 05:00:34 PM
Last edit: April 12, 2019, 05:13:01 PM by Quickseller
Merited by bones261 (1)
 #13

The above means less than 95 people have become hero members
It's much less: many of those (less than) 95 users had a high rank already and didn't rank up.
My weekly Merit update isn't finished yet, but here's a sneak preview with this morning's data:
17 users earned 1000+ Merit
76 users earned 500+ Merit
204 users earned 250+ Merit
607 users earned 100+ Merit
7336 users earned 10+ Merit
27732 users earned 1+ Merit

Ranking up is no longer for everyone, and I think that's a good thing. I haven't seen too many good users who are being limited by Merit, but if you find them, please report their posts their good posts here.
I agree ranking up probably isn’t for everyone, such as those who don’t have a grasp of how bitcoin works, at least past full member status. The forum is after all a place where people can learn about bitcoin. A lot of people also earn some money while learning (such is what I did). I never needed the money, but I probably wouldn’t have taken the time to learn as much as I have if I wasn’t earning money here either via conducting business or signature advertising. I would argue someone with a basic understanding who is showing an interest in learning and is making progress in learning should at least achieve full membership and perhaps senior member status with a “decent” understanding and the above.
Quote
There are hundreds of thousands of people who use the forum every month, most probably won’t participate continuously for 16 months, but I would expect for at least thousands to have enough activity to be a hero.
I don't think it's realistic to expect thousands of users to earn more Merit than Activity. And I think you're off on the total number of real users, hundreds of thousands of active posters doesn't mean they're all unique users. I expect many alt accounts, and ranking up more than one account is virtually impossible (empirical evidence here).
Most people can’t rank up one account.
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I would also point out that I had extensive knowledge about bitcoin when the merit system was introduced, which probably increased the amount of merit I received. This would not be the case for the average person.
I'm pretty sure your red trust discourages people from meriting you, otherwise you'd probably have had much more by now.
Perhaps that is true. That only makes my point stronger though. I also don’t think trust should affect someone’s ability to rank up, especially considering theymos is explicitly no longer trying to cultivate a good trust list/DT list.

I do think that merit sources tend to get much more merit than most other people. Look at Vod for example, he is a merit source, but makes very few if any “objectively good” posts and nearly zero (if any) helpful posts, but he is one of the most merited people here.





Legendary - 11
Hero - 43
Senior - 108
Full - 183

I don't know that we need to change the requirements. So what if you don't get to Hero in under 2 years. You can still actively participate in all aspects of the forum. There are also a lot of resources out there to gain merit, even coming to Meta and bitching about it.
I would point out that no one said he isn’t deserving of being a legendary account but he is still not one. There were multiple merit sources who said they thought he should be a legendary but didn’t give the max merit to him.

I think the above number of people who have ranked up is too low.


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I would also point out that I had extensive knowledge about bitcoin when the merit system was introduced, which probably increased the amount of merit I received. This would not be the case for the average person.
I'm pretty sure your red trust discourages people from meriting you, otherwise you'd probably have had much more by now.

I would have to agree with that. It probably doesn't help that QS does tend to have a differing opinion with quite a few of the most generous merit givers. Which can lead to overlooking a quality post due to disagreeing with the message.

I would say this is additional evidence that the merit system is a way to get people to agree with you, and it encourages groupthink. Any merit sources that withhold merit because they disagree with what is being said, is effectively censoring the person because they are being forced to either say what they agree with or not be able to rank up.




~but I would expect for at least thousands to have enough activity to be a hero.~

That's why the merit system was implemented.  You now need to actually contribute to the forum rather than just stay logged-in for the requisite time period and spew enough off-topic shitposts to rank up.  Again, I don't know what's an acceptable number of members that the community thinks should be ranking up, but as Loyce's data shows 76 members were able to earn enough merit to reach hero.  

Now, I don't know what your idea of a "Hero" is, but I've always used the word in an rather exclusive manner.  Not to mention "Legendary."
The merit system was created to prevent spammers from being able to rank up. I think it is spilling over to also prevent legitimate users who do make an effort to contribute from ranking up.

Edit: bb code.

NOTBanned from displaying signatures until May 20, 2022, 11:26:45 PM
Don’t Plagiarize, it’s dishonest and you *will* get caught
mjglqw
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April 12, 2019, 05:22:33 PM
 #14

There are only 94 people with more merit than I have. There are hundreds of thousands of people who use the forum every month, most probably won’t participate continuously for 16 months, but I would expect for at least thousands to have enough activity to be a hero.

It just unfortunately shows how big the number of people here are solely for bounties(most probably more of altcoin bounties) and aren't even to spend a bit of time learning about bitcoin or cryptocurrencies in general. It honestly doesn't even take to be an intermediate/expert to earn a few merits from time to time, but people are complaining on how to earn them. The problem is obviously more on them, rather than being the fault of the current merit system.

amishmanish
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April 12, 2019, 05:25:10 PM
Merited by bones261 (2)
 #15

I ranked up to senior member pretty quickly back in the initial days. The starting times were a bit disappointing till I got to the thread by QuestionAuthority where he gave me 20 merits. Things started to feel much better after that. I was a regular at the forum back when nullius was breaking the records for merits and demonstrating to everyone what a great new user should be like. (The forum sure misses him i guess).

I ranked up just when the coinpayments campaign was coming to an end. While trying to fulfill the 30 weekly requirements for coinpayments, I often found myself saying the same thing over and over again. I also realized that most of my posts were only in the "Bitcoin Discussion" and "Economics" section..The main hunting ground for shitposters and Sig spammers..lol..

I felt embarrassed and felt like i had nothing to add without some real technical information. I used to frequent r/bitcoin and twitter accounts of all the devs to stay abreast of whats new. This used to help in adding to discussions. Yet, It gradually became clear to me that based on pure "discussions", A Sr. Member rank is the most that you can get to now AND the most that you should get to.

If you want to be a Hero, you must have enough technical know-how to contribute frequently to the Dev & Technical discussion. (I presently have to remain content with lurking). If you want to be a legendary, you must be a big contributor in at least one of the sections like Mining or Services or Market. That i feel is the only way now to get to Hero/ Legendary. I agree that its a lot of work but then it'll really be worth it. Of course, its quite a source of heartburn to see a lot of braindead people from the old days who get have the Hero/ Legendary status   Tongue  but that is something we cannot help. Its like all those drug suppliers and arms-dealers that must have gotten wealthy with bitcoin. It is just part of the unfair dichotomies of Bitcoin.

In short, No the merit requirements are not excessive. Increasing them for Jr. Member could be taken into consideration too. Most people who really engage eventually do get to member status. The problem with the low requirement is that it has resulted in merit-trading and alt accounts.

I think one solution could be that some percentage of merit required for ranking upto Jr. Member and Member should come from a Verified Merit Source. Verified Merit source should fulfill the following requirements:
1.) Belong to the set of people comprising DT1 member and people who have shown enough commitment towards the forum by earning, say, 250 merits.
1.) Be randomly selected from this group
2.) Anonymous in Merit History
3.) Change cyclically
A thread could be started where these members simply grant merit to new accounts. That source shouldn't show up in the merit history to ensure that people don't get bugged or start getting bribe offers.

Its fairly complicated but so is the problem. Maybe i should think of a more elegant solution..Hmm..Thinking Hat on..

Once again derailed due by "Personal" life. Trying to claw my way back

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DdmrDdmr
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April 12, 2019, 05:30:57 PM
Merited by bones261 (2)
 #16

I’ve just updated the Merit Dashboard, and make the amount of people that have ranked-up at some point, needing Merits to do so, the following:



The reading of the above table indicates that we’ve got:
-   11 Heroes have made it to Legendary
-   25 Sr. Members have made it to Hero Member.
-   13 Full Members have made it to Hero Member.
-   5 Members have made it to Hero.
-   1 Old Era Newbie has made it to Hero.
-   On aggregate, that makes 44 accounts that have ranked-up to Hero.
-   There are also 106 people that have reached Sr. Member, 185 Full Member, 3.228 Member and 9.945 Jr. Member.

As we can see, there is not much of an issue to get to Jr. Member or Member rank, at least from a numerical point of view. Anyone that makes a bit of an effort and is slightly above par can do it.
Ranking-up to Full Member and above are rather more scarce, as one would expect. Given the size of the forum it seems that numbers are smallish, although this my subjective view.

The ranking-up pipeline on the Merit Dashboard places most people still pretty far away from their next rank ...

bones261
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April 12, 2019, 05:39:58 PM
 #17

I think one solution could be that some percentage of merit required for ranking upto Jr. Member and Member should come from a Verified Merit Source. Verified Merit source should fulfill the following requirements:
1.) Belong to the set of people comprising DT1 member and people who have shown enough commitment towards the forum by earning, say, 250 merits.
1.) Be randomly selected from this group
2.) Anonymous in Merit History
3.) Change cyclically
A thread could be started where these members simply grant merit to new accounts. That source shouldn't show up in the merit history to ensure that people don't get bugged or start getting bribe offers.

Its fairly complicated but so is the problem. Maybe i should think of a more elegant solution..Hmm..Thinking Hat on..


    As one of the people who would currently qualify to be a "verified merit source," I'm not sure that I want the added responsibility of only meriting newbies. However, I believe that my current allocation of source merit allocation is probably in the top 10, if not top 5, so it would be much more work for me than many other merit sources.  I could end up giving a handful of newbie posts an insane amount of merit; however, people tend to notice when the amount of merits given is a two digit number, and I am sure the "merit abuse" allegations would crop up (although only the administrators would know who the merit source is, people could figure it out by noticng that such and so merit source isn't giving out any merits anymore.) When you say "anonymous" do you mean the merit score goes up with no other record or do you mean it will have a label like "anonymous" or "Verified Merit Source?"

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suchmoon
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April 12, 2019, 06:04:18 PM
Last edit: April 12, 2019, 06:19:01 PM by suchmoon
Merited by Foxpup (3)
 #18

There are hundreds of thousands of people who use the forum every month

 Roll Eyes

~50k users have been active in the last 30 days. That includes those who just logged in and didn't post, bounty-hunters, bots, sockpuppets, etc.

I would have to agree with that. It probably doesn't help that QS does tend to have a differing opinion with quite a few of the most generous merit givers. Which can lead to overlooking a quality post due to disagreeing with the message.

No, it has a lot more to do with posting made-up stuff like above and pretending it's a fact that supports his account-farming ideology. Also spuriously attacking users with conspiracy theories. Also his recent cringy sig-induced hyperactivity while claiming to be one of the best posters... that's not how it works. Those are not meritorious posts regardless of fancy words and legalese phrases.

Disagreeing with someone or even being an outright asshole doesn't prevent one from gaining merits, I mean look at me LOL. Being nice may help though, I mean look at LoyceV.

I would say this is additional evidence that the merit system is a way to get people to agree with you, and it encourages groupthink. Any merit sources that withhold merit because they disagree with what is being said, is effectively censoring the person because they are being forced to either say what they agree with or not be able to rank up.

Projecting as usual. Count the merits you sent to people you disagree with vs merits you received from the same people.



Still haven't seen a coherent explanation of how making it easier to rank-up would benefit the forum.

Findingnemo
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April 12, 2019, 06:48:45 PM
 #19

Since the implementation of merit system there is no changes made for the number of merits required to rank up other than Jr.rank,even theymos mentioned that there will be some tweaks on the merit system soon when it was implemented but nothing changes yet so I think he is happy with the current system so we are not going to see any changes in the requirement to rank up. Smiley

LFC_Bitcoin
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April 12, 2019, 08:43:28 PM
 #20

The Merit system was put in place for the good of the forum so no, I don’t think the Merit requirement to rank up is excessive. If you’re a good poster you WILL be able to rank up.

There are a number of self made Legendary & Hero Member accounts since the Merit system was introduced.




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