what is the "real" bitcoin, "Satoshi vision",...

[Red-Apple]

you have probably heard these terms before, but what is the "real" bitcoin?
Bitcoin is not what some site like bitcoin.com or bitcoin.org or reddit,... says is bitcoin! Bitcoin is definition of a payment network that has certain characteristics and principles that make it "Bitcoin". if one of those stops being true, then bitcoin is no longer going to be bitcoin.
so lets review two of these principles:

A decentralized network based on majority's decision using proof of work
in other words the 1 CPU 1 vote that Satoshi Nakamoto mentions in his bitcoin paper in 2008 titled Bitcoin: A Peer-to-Peer Electronic Cash System.
as a result when more than 95% of the network is doing one thing, and you do something else, you would be considered an altchain with an altcoin.



Irreversible transactions and immutable blockcahin
this is the second most important principle after decentralization. it simply states that when your transaction is in a block, nobody should be able to reverse it. this has always been true for bitcoin due to its decentralized network and distribution of mining in a way that nobody controls enough hash power that can pull a 51% attack.
but when 1 miner can easily decide to reverse a transaction that he doesn't like it shows centralization of that chain + its lack of immutability and as a result it is no longer a cryptocurrency let alone be "real bitcoin".

[tsaroz]

you have probably heard these terms before, but what is the "real" bitcoin?
Bitcoin is not what some site like bitcoin.com or bitcoin.org or reddit,... says is bitcoin! Bitcoin is definition of a payment network that has certain characteristics and principles that make it "Bitcoin". if one of those stops being true, then bitcoin is no longer going to be bitcoin.
so lets review two of these principles:

A decentralized network based on majority's decision using proof of work
in other words the 1 CPU 1 vote that Satoshi Nakamoto mentions in his bitcoin paper in 2008 titled Bitcoin: A Peer-to-Peer Electronic Cash System.
as a result when more than 95% of the network is doing one thing, and you do something else, you would be considered an altchain with an altcoin.



Irreversible transactions and immutable blockcahin
this is the second most important principle after decentralization. it simply states that when your transaction is in a block, nobody should be able to reverse it. this has always been true for bitcoin due to its decentralized network and distribution of mining in a way that nobody controls enough hash power that can pull a 51% attack.
but when 1 miner can easily decide to reverse a transaction that he doesn't like it shows centralization of that chain + its lack of immutability and as a result it is no longer a cryptocurrency let alone be "real bitcoin".

You are providing the truth but with wrong example.
The discussion about which one is the real bitcoin chain is fairly simple, the one decided by (majority of miners). That's the only and valid reason.
Bitcoincash miners came together to undo an profit made by an attacker. It's not just a miner but all miners in two of it's largest pools. They did it because they were sure it's for the good of Bitcoincash. It does not mean bitcoincash is centralised.

[hatshepsut93]

Satoshi never said that 1 CPU = one vote, in fact he predict the mining farms. And overall it's not that important what details of implementation were favored or disfavored by Satoshi - what is important is how close the software to the core ideas of Bitcoin that were presented in whitepaper. No one thought about things like Lightning Network back in 2009, yet here we are, extending Bitcoin to face new challenges.
The fact that Bcash mining is centralized is not its biggest problem - any coin can become like that under some circumstances, what is problematic of bcash is that its model is unsustainable in the long run, big blocks will cause irreparable damage to the network which turns it into inherently centralized protocol.

[Carollzinha]

The fact that Bcash mining is centralized is not its biggest problem - any coin can become like that under some circumstances, what is problematic of bcash is that its model is unsustainable in the long run, big blocks will cause irreparable damage to the network which turns it into inherently centralized protocol.

My apologize but I didn't quite understand.. you mean that these BCH big blocks will damage every coin or only the centralized coins in a long run?

[Tipstar]

The fact that Bcash mining is centralized is not its biggest problem - any coin can become like that under some circumstances, what is problematic of bcash is that its model is unsustainable in the long run, big blocks will cause irreparable damage to the network which turns it into inherently centralized protocol.

My apologize but I didn't quite understand.. you mean that these BCH big blocks will damage every coin or only the centralized coins in a long run?

Though big blocks were not as useful as they were thought to be, there's no reason for a big block to cause damage to the network. Experiment and implementations would keep on coming in crypto and they would be useful for each other. I'm not a supporter or opposer of any crypto but a fair competition and discussion would surely make all cryptos better and stronger.

[CryptoBry]

Satoshi never said that 1 CPU = one vote, in fact he predict the mining farms. And overall it's not that important what details of implementation were favored or disfavored by Satoshi - what is important is how close the software to the core ideas of Bitcoin that were presented in whitepaper. No one thought about things like Lightning Network back in 2009, yet here we are, extending Bitcoin to face new challenges.
The fact that Bcash mining is centralized is not its biggest problem - any coin can become like that under some circumstances, what is problematic of bcash is that its model is unsustainable in the long run, big blocks will cause irreparable damage to the network which turns it into inherently centralized protocol.

I could not agree more. We have to understand that bitcoin is like an ecosystem or even an organism if you wish and it is evolving to meet the current challenges it is facing. I am sure that Satoshi Nakamoto understood this reality back when he started this all and therefor he is very much open-minded to possible positive changes in the future. The most important here is that the principles of bitcoin remained the same and we should always be guided with them.

[davis196]

Your question is irrelevant.Every bitcoin user knows that BCH and all the other forked altcoins that are using the name "bitcoin" aren't bitcoins.

[CryptoBry]

Your question is irrelevant. Every bitcoin user knows that BCH and all the other forked altcoins that are using the name "bitcoin" aren't bitcoins.

They can call daisy a rose but we know better and they could not deceive especially intelligent people of the bitcoin community. So why is that forked altcoin still successful? Simply because they are good in appealing to greed and the management are doing well on this aspect. Greed is a big business in any industry and billions can be made if one is on-point with it. The only real bitcoin is, of course, bitcoin nothing more nothing less and it is not owned by Craig Wright (lol).

[Red-Apple]

Bitcoincash miners came together to undo an profit made by an attacker. It's not just a miner but all miners in two of it's largest pools. They did it because they were sure it's for the good of Bitcoincash. It does not mean bitcoincash is centralised.

it was 1 miner running 2 different pools controlling a big part of the hashrate and it was not an "attacker" because they forked it themselves on May 15 allowing spending of these transactions.

Satoshi never said that 1 CPU = one vote, in fact he predict the mining farms.

it is right there in bitcoin paper. existing of mining farms is not negating that. a mining farm is multiple CPUs which have as much vote.

The fact that Bcash mining is centralized is not its biggest problem

that is the biggest problem! it is simply giving all the power and decision making to that miner.

...
My apologize but I didn't quite understand.. you mean that these BCH big blocks will damage every coin or only the centralized coins in a long run?

he is talking about the fact that you won't be able to run a node if blocks were big (which they aren't in BCH since they are empty due to lack of usage) so eventually only big servers and maybe government agents start running nodes and then they can track and censor your transactions and that kills yet another principle of bitcoin.

[hatshepsut93]

The fact that Bcash mining is centralized is not its biggest problem - any coin can become like that under some circumstances, what is problematic of bcash is that its model is unsustainable in the long run, big blocks will cause irreparable damage to the network which turns it into inherently centralized protocol.

My apologize but I didn't quite understand.. you mean that these BCH big blocks will damage every coin or only the centralized coins in a long run?

BCH will only damage itself, it doesn't have any major influence on crypto as a whole. But it will only happen under the circumstance that big blocks will actually become full, which is actually pretty hard to achieve - for that to happen they need to have a lot of users, more than Bitcoin currently has by a factor of 5 or even 10 - and currently they barely have any users at all, and most of BCH transaction volume is fake. The more realistic scenario is that BCH will die because no one will use it rather than too much people will use it.

[jak3]

You guys are fighting like dogs. Satoshi Nakamoto only wanted to make a decentralized cryptocurrency which can solve all the problems with payment networks. Of course, there are other payment methods to like PayPal or Skrill. And many more others but Satoshi's Bitcoin was unique because he implemented and also invented the blockchain technology with it.

[xvids]

You guys are fighting like dogs. Satoshi Nakamoto only wanted to make a decentralized cryptocurrency which can solve all the problems with payment networks. Of course, there are other payment methods to like PayPal or Skrill. And many more others but Satoshi's Bitcoin was unique because he implemented and also invented the blockchain technology with it.

I couldn't agree more Satoshi Nakamoto create it for us to have a decentralized currency a currency that couldn't be controlled by the government,
Satoshi made it for us to feel the financial freedom,
And we all know that Bitcoin is only one and there is nothing more but an alt-coins.

[Nadziratel]

you have probably heard these terms before, but what is the "real" bitcoin?
Bitcoin is not what some site like bitcoin.com or bitcoin.org or reddit,... says is bitcoin! Bitcoin is definition of a payment network that has certain characteristics and principles that make it "Bitcoin". if one of those stops being true, then bitcoin is no longer going to be bitcoin.
so lets review two of these principles:

A decentralized network based on majority's decision using proof of work
in other words the 1 CPU 1 vote that Satoshi Nakamoto mentions in his bitcoin paper in 2008 titled Bitcoin: A Peer-to-Peer Electronic Cash System.
as a result when more than 95% of the network is doing one thing, and you do something else, you would be considered an altchain with an altcoin.



Irreversible transactions and immutable blockcahin
this is the second most important principle after decentralization. it simply states that when your transaction is in a block, nobody should be able to reverse it. this has always been true for bitcoin due to its decentralized network and distribution of mining in a way that nobody controls enough hash power that can pull a 51% attack.
but when 1 miner can easily decide to reverse a transaction that he doesn't like it shows centralization of that chain + its lack of immutability and as a result it is no longer a cryptocurrency let alone be "real bitcoin".

In the name of Satoshi and going through the vision words, that does not do her best. Some data may be misleading. Tron claims he's a record-breaking everyday, but Ethereum is still a better platform!

[betty11]

The real bitcoin is the one we know and that currently have the largest market dominance. The one that has no suffix after its spelling. No single miner can reverse any transaction in a block in bitcoin network, what CZ was proposing was a like a cooperation from the mining community over the stolen 7000 bitcoin from binance, although the bitcoin community expressed their anger for his statement, I think he would later apologized.

[BitBustah]

The best thing to do if you don't like what someone else is doing is to not talk about it.  The mega haters are just bringing more attention to CSW and Satoshi's Vision, they are falling right into his trap.

[sheenshane]

Thanks for sharing this but I can tell that all of the people here can understand that all of the altcoins that use bitcoin does not mean they are really bitcoins.

Satoshi's mission and vision were almost the same as Elon Musk. It's just that, he wanted to find another solution from another problem besides the problem we were facing from the financial system and that is to have a faster transaction. And that another problem to solve is to have a decentralized cryptocurrency. I can tell that RPG games influenced Satoshi's mind. Because of me as a former RPG gamer, I can so much agree that we were using those decentralized RPG game currency for our transactions with the same gamer and they will accept it.

[Ailmand]

The best thing to do if you don't like what someone else is doing is to not talk about it.  The mega haters are just bringing more attention to CSW and Satoshi's Vision, they are falling right into his trap.

There are a lot of altcoin that claims to be the real bitcoin. We all know that the only bitcoin is bitcoin core and all the fork coins are just fake bitcoin. I agree, each has their own belief just ignore what things that you don't like to read or hear. A lot of people will claim their coin is the real bitcoin.

[squatter]

You are providing the truth but with wrong example.
The discussion about which one is the real bitcoin chain is fairly simple, the one decided by (majority of miners). That's the only and valid reason.

No, miners must comply with Bitcoin's consensus rules, which are enforced by all full nodes on the network.

For example, miners could begin mining a chain that inflates mining rewards beyond 21M bitcoins. The network of full nodes, however, would ignore that hard forked chain as invalid and the mining rewards would be worthless. So, miners will only build on a chain that the Bitcoin network accepts as valid.

Bitcoincash miners came together to undo an profit made by an attacker. It's not just a miner but all miners in two of it's largest pools. They did it because they were sure it's for the good of Bitcoincash. It does not mean bitcoincash is centralised.

Effectively, it was done by two pool administrators who used their collective hash power to 51% attack Bitcoin Cash to reverse previous transactions. This does suggest Bitcoin Cash is pretty centralized since it took very little coordination to successfully attack the chain.

[Genemind]

Some people are just claiming some altcoins as Bitcoin so that they could attract investors.
Just like Craig, he's claiming to be the real Satoshi to make people believe that he's coin could strike high like Bitcoin.
Their purpose is just to deceive us but we should know that there's only one Bitcoin existing.

[pushups44]

you have probably heard these terms before, but what is the "real" bitcoin?
Bitcoin is not what some site like bitcoin.com or bitcoin.org or reddit,... says is bitcoin! Bitcoin is definition of a payment network that has certain characteristics and principles that make it "Bitcoin". if one of those stops being true, then bitcoin is no longer going to be bitcoin.
so lets review two of these principles:

A decentralized network based on majority's decision using proof of work
in other words the 1 CPU 1 vote that Satoshi Nakamoto mentions in his bitcoin paper in 2008 titled Bitcoin: A Peer-to-Peer Electronic Cash System.
as a result when more than 95% of the network is doing one thing, and you do something else, you would be considered an altchain with an altcoin.



Irreversible transactions and immutable blockcahin
this is the second most important principle after decentralization. it simply states that when your transaction is in a block, nobody should be able to reverse it. this has always been true for bitcoin due to its decentralized network and distribution of mining in a way that nobody controls enough hash power that can pull a 51% attack.
but when 1 miner can easily decide to reverse a transaction that he doesn't like it shows centralization of that chain + its lack of immutability and as a result it is no longer a cryptocurrency let alone be "real bitcoin".

Bitcoin, in my view, is fluid as an idea and construction, similar to the U.S. Constitution. So we can say the whitepaper is the Bill of Rights, but its interpretation is not fixed. The market determines the real from the fakes. Thus far, the market has determined that the real bitcoin is the coin that currently has the greatest market capitalization.