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Author Topic: Long term advance notice!  (Read 3606 times)
hv_
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June 02, 2019, 02:22:13 PM
Last edit: June 02, 2019, 05:01:08 PM by hv_
 #61

Sigh, world s financial markets and regulations are not a wish concert.

And yes, it's pretty much overdone and overregulated , totally agreed

But how can u safely and sustainable change that to a better?

Try to offend it openly by using clear and obvious illegal protocols and expect world wide adoption?

Would that ever work knowing before there are 100s of analysts and cyber risks experts sitting on every such gateway where we see they can stop things and close down every that touches law by any means?

What is the correct strategy to get Bitcoin adoption world wide?

A ) btc with shit protocol changes and dropped signatures plus 2nd layer stuff against aml checks?

B ) bch going anarcho and dark protocol

C ) bsv, stay as clean as possible and openly go the most transparent and regulation friendly road map?

Try to be analytical and make ur choice

 Grin

Edit: You can do such analysis by yourself and will magically find out Satoshi and CSW are with u and choose C

That's what is causing all that trouble we see atm

U always find one who is better https://mobile.twitter.com/CryptoBlueMoon/status/1135193572037148672

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what is this "brake pedal" you speak of?


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June 02, 2019, 10:55:43 PM
Last edit: June 03, 2019, 10:03:27 AM by vapourminer
 #62

an observation from Shelby:


Quote
Hope this is the last follow-up, because I really don’t want to be posting on this forum, but this is very important for readers. Want to make clear what our options are and what the reality of the situation really is.

Quote from: hv_ on Today at 10:22:13 AM
Sigh, world s financial markets and regulations are not a wish concert.

And yes, it's pretty much overdone and overregulated , totally agreed

But how can u safely and sustainable change that to a better?

Try to offend it openly by using clear and obvious illegal protocols and expect world wide adoption?

Would that ever work knowing before there are 100s of analysts and cyber risks experts sitting on every such gateway where we see they can stop things and close down every that touches law by any means?

My point is that there’s nothing we can do to change the fact that satism will enslave those who want to participate in the statist economy. How can one honestly expect to partake in an evil thing and not be subject to evil? Of course statism is all about defection and cheating on each other via the collective, so of course everyone (other than the devout Christian) prefers to cheat than be honest with themselves.

Instead come out of the statism and only use cryptocurrency in the non-statist economy of like-minded (probably devout “superrational” Christians, because others will be “rationally” selfish and turn against you when convenient) individuals who refuse to report transactions to and source their services and goods from the statist economy. In that case anonymity is irrelevant, e.g. refer to everything as a gift which is for example excluded from taxation in the U.S.A.. Additionally if careful about meta-data and knowing your entire community is using the same ISP, then individual identity can’t be traced on the Bitcoin blockchain.

Better on-chain anonymity might be helpful for those who come out of the Great Harlot statism (yet not absolutely necessary), but it won’t help those who don’t come out of the statism, because statist economy meta-data will be impossible to scramble sufficiently.

Given that Bitcoin’s mutability can’t be challenged, per the game theory and economics of the SegWit donations attack that is coming, we have no option of adding on-chain anonymity to the store-of-value cryptocurrency which already has the most network effects and mining adoption that can’t possibly be superseded any more:

https://medium.com/@shelby_78386/secrets-of-bitcoins-dystopian-valuation-model-cbf95efa3542

https://steemit.com/bitcoin/@anonymint/secrets-of-bitcoin-s-dystopian-valuation-model

The only competition now is potentially for a transaction volume scaling coin and for the reasons I explained on my above linked blog, the scaling coin can’t also be the hodler store-of-value coin.

And because adaptive block size is insecure (or trustless due to centralized control over parameters, which is thus insecure), it’s not even clear that a secure, trustless scaling coin can be constructed.

Quote from: hv_ on Today at 10:22:13 AM
What is the correct strategy to get Bitcoin adoption world wide?

A ) btc with shit protocol changes and dropped signatures plus 2nd layer stuff against aml checks?

B ) bch going anarcho and dark protocol

C ) bsv, stay as clean as possible and openly go the most transparent and regulation friendly road map?

Whether you like it or not, the store-of-value coin is Satoshi’s immutable v0.5.3 protocol. And this will be enforced soon with the SegWit donations attack on the Core shitcoin. Per my first post in this thread (relayed via @infofront because this is very important), Craig is apparently claiming they will initiate Satoshi’s cleverly designed defense mechanism. So Craig is playing the role of fooling those mindless bunny rabbits (http://trilema.com/2018/how-to-piss-me-the-fuck-off-a-guide/) who idolize nonsense so much that they can’t even correctly interpret what Craig is really saying. This is again how Satan is giving people their free will as he corrupts them with idolization. You have your free will to correctly interpret that invariants of the reality here, or irrationally idolize what you wish would a snowflake reality.

SUBJECT: I don’t think crypto can fix the West

I don’t think crypto can fix the West. The West must crash and burn.

So I ignore Craig’s vacuous blather about legal compliance. The West will turn batshit insane and lawless, totalitarianism will prevail.

There is absolutely nothing we can do in the cryptocosm to avert that outcome.

False hopes are not going to help us survive what is coming.

Bitcoin should resist all government interference in terms on-chain transactions. But no form of money can resist the government thugs with “rubber hoses” at the on and off-ramps.

All the cheerleading about scaling and adoption is vacuous, inapplicable nonsense. Bitcoin is being adopted as a superior gold by the wealthy who want to store their assets out-of-reach of the government. The problem is if you don’t come out of the Great Harlot system, then the government is going to find some way to take it all away.

Stop thinking about good times coming. About how many yachts you’re going to buy and living the good life. Bad times are coming. Very bad times. Prepare accordingly.
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June 03, 2019, 05:09:31 AM
 #63

an observation from Shelby:


Quote
Hope this is the last follow-up, because I really don’t want to be posting on this forum, but this is very important for readers. Want to make clear what our options are and what the reality of the situation really is.

Quote from: hv_ on Today at 10:22:13 AM
Sigh, world s financial markets and regulations are not a wish concert.

And yes, it's pretty much overdone and overregulated , totally agreed

But how can u safely and sustainable change that to a better?

Try to offend it openly by using clear and obvious illegal protocols and expect world wide adoption?

Would that ever work knowing before there are 100s of analysts and cyber risks experts sitting on every such gateway where we see they can stop things and close down every that touches law by any means?

My point is that there’s nothing we can do to change the fact that satism will enslave those who want to participate in the statist economy. How can one honestly expect to partake in an evil thing and not be subject to evil? Of course statism is all about defection and cheating on each other via the collective, so of course everyone (other than the devout Christian) prefers to cheat than be honest with themselves.

Instead come out of the statism and only use cryptocurrency in the non-statist economy of like-minded (probably devout “superrational” Christians, because others will be “rationally” selfish and turn against you when convenient) individuals who refuse to report transactions to and source their services and goods from the statist economy. In that case anonymity is irrelevant, e.g. refer to everything as a gift which is for example excluded from taxation in the U.S.A.. Additionally if careful about meta-data and knowing your entire community is using the same ISP, then individual identity can’t be traced on the Bitcoin blockchain.

Better on-chain anonymity might be helpful for those who come out of the Great Harlot statism (yet not absolutely necessary), but it won’t help those who don’t come out of the statism, because statist economy meta-data will be impossible to scramble sufficiently.

Given that Bitcoin’s mutability can’t be challenged, per the game theory and economics of the SegWit donations attack that is coming, we have no option of adding on-chain anonymity to the store-of-value cryptocurrency which already has the most network effects and mining adoption that can’t possibly be superseded any more:

https://medium.com/@shelby_78386/secrets-of-bitcoins-dystopian-valuation-model-cbf95efa3542

https://steemit.com/bitcoin/@anonymint/secrets-of-bitcoin-s-dystopian-valuation-model

The only competition now is potentially for a transaction volume scaling coin and for the reasons I explained on my above linked blog, the scaling coin can’t also be the hodler store-of-value coin.

And because adaptive block size is insecure (or trustless due to centralized control over parameters, which is thus insecure), it’s not even clear that a secure, trustless scaling coin can be constructed.

Quote from: hv_ on Today at 10:22:13 AM
What is the correct strategy to get Bitcoin adoption world wide?

A ) btc with shit protocol changes and dropped signatures plus 2nd layer stuff against aml checks?

B ) bch going anarcho and dark protocol

C ) bsv, stay as clean as possible and openly go the most transparent and regulation friendly road map?

Whether you like it or not, the store-of-value coin is Satoshi’s immutable v0.5.3 protocol. And this will be enforced soon with the SegWit donations attack on the Core shitcoin. Per my first post in this thread (relayed via @infofront because this is very important), Craig is apparently claiming they will initiate Satoshi’s cleverly designed defense mechanism. So Craig is playing the role of fooling those mindless bunny rabbits (http://trilema.com/2018/how-to-piss-me-the-fuck-off-a-guide/) who idolize nonsense so much that they can’t even correctly interpret what Craig is really saying. This is again how Satan is giving people their free will as he corrupts them with idolization. You have your free will to correctly interpret that invariants of the reality here, or irrationally idolize what you wish would a snowflake reality.

Poor try to dispute deductive arguments by falling back to ppl name calling and 'Satan' summon of fear.. lol

Shelby did better in the past


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what is this "brake pedal" you speak of?


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June 03, 2019, 10:50:04 AM
 #64

Shelby asked me to make an edit (addition) to his quote i posted above, it is the additional text starting with "SUBJECT: I don’t think crypto can fix the West"

whatever your views of religion or him personally are, he is worth paying attention to.

as far as my personal view of CSVs advance notice: "so long, and thanks for all the fish"
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June 04, 2019, 12:05:03 PM
 #65

I like how Craig Wrights starts the post with "We (I)"...
It makes me think that he believes in himself to be the GOD of bitcoin,the ultimate crypto dictator.
Freakin' megallomanic... Grin
Anyway,his plans to ruin btc went in the trash.

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June 04, 2019, 01:06:08 PM
 #66

I like how Craig Wrights starts the post with "We (I)"...
It makes me think that he believes in himself to be the GOD of bitcoin,the ultimate crypto dictator.
Freakin' megallomanic... Grin
Anyway,his plans to ruin btc went in the trash.

Have a check 18months later

 Grin

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June 04, 2019, 01:43:58 PM
Last edit: June 04, 2019, 02:03:31 PM by fabiorem
 #67

A long time ago I read that only NSA have the capabilities to break encryption on the level found in Truecrypt and Veracrypt. CSW is cooperating (and even flattering) the anglo governments for some reason, and I believe is to have help from NSA or a similar agency.

The volume where Satoshis coins are located its encrypted with Truecrypt, and the computers which CSW masked as a "mining operation" are trying to break it. They probably have a deadline which would be january 2020, when the decryption would end.

Then, he would dump one million BTC on the exchanges, for $1200 each, which would give him 1.2 billion dollars. This money he would use to pay for a 51% attack on the BTC chain. Since its illegal to dump high volumes without a notice, he is doing this notice right now, believing the decryption will succeed in january 2020. If not, he would use a second deadline by the middle of 2020, when the halving happens. Thats what I understand from his posts.

What could be done about it? Supposing he could get this money out from hundreds of exchanges (we are talking about 1.2 billion dollars) and would pay for this 51% attack, and then capture the network for himself, the best solution would be to do a hard fork, locking Satoshi addresses in the forked version as soon as CSW started moving the coins stored there. This should be done before these coins hit the exchanges, and the exchanges would need to change to the forked version too. In this way, the disaster could be prevented.

The devs would need to devise some backup plan for it, they cant just underestimate CSW and treat him like a clown, because we dont know who he might be working with for the decryption of Satoshi's wallet. I dont want to spread any FUD, just to be realistic. Also, this tale about Paul Le Roux could be an attempt to discredit bitcoin, in case the decryption fails by halving time. If Paul Le Roux was really Satoshi, they would have the password for the wallet already, as they could just torture him in prison. I dont believe this would work, as most people dont give a fuck who Satoshi was.
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June 04, 2019, 05:59:30 PM
 #68

The devs would need to devise some backup plan for it, they cant just underestimate CSW and treat him like a clown, because we dont know who he might be working with for the decryption of Satoshi's wallet. I dont want to spread any FUD, just to be realistic.

Why would you assume he has access to Satoshi's encrypted wallet in the first place? If anything is clear by now, it's that Wright had nothing to do with the creation of Bitcoin. Even if he could brute force the wallet (doubtful), I don't see how he would ever get his hands on it.

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June 04, 2019, 06:13:10 PM
 #69

The devs would need to devise some backup plan for it, they cant just underestimate CSW and treat him like a clown, because we dont know who he might be working with for the decryption of Satoshi's wallet. I dont want to spread any FUD, just to be realistic.

Why would you assume he has access to Satoshi's encrypted wallet in the first place? If anything is clear by now, it's that Wright had nothing to do with the creation of Bitcoin. Even if he could brute force the wallet (doubtful), I don't see how he would ever get his hands on it.


I didnt, I read somewhere he have it.
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June 04, 2019, 07:18:44 PM
 #70

The devs would need to devise some backup plan for it, they cant just underestimate CSW and treat him like a clown, because we dont know who he might be working with for the decryption of Satoshi's wallet. I dont want to spread any FUD, just to be realistic.

Why would you assume he has access to Satoshi's encrypted wallet in the first place? If anything is clear by now, it's that Wright had nothing to do with the creation of Bitcoin. Even if he could brute force the wallet (doubtful), I don't see how he would ever get his hands on it.

I didnt, I read somewhere he have it.

Ah, then it seems doubtful indeed. Surely Wright or the BSV camp put out that information themselves. Their coin's fundamentals seem to rely on an endless stream of rumors, FUD, and naivety about giant block sizes. This whole narrative about the Satoshi wallet fits right in.

"We're going to 51% attack Bitcoin and pump BSV with the Satoshi coins.....better dump your BTC and buy BSV before it's too late!" Cheesy

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June 04, 2019, 08:23:24 PM
 #71

You mostly know nothing in this world

https://mobile.twitter.com/cryptorebel_SV/status/1135903217034956802

Me included

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June 06, 2019, 03:54:55 AM
 #72

This message from Shelby is very interesting. The issue is even more complex than what I believe it was.

The recent versions of the core wallet are only distributing adresses starting with 3. Do anyone know if its possible to generate adresses starting with 1? Most of my stash is on those old "legacy" adresses, but I dont know if any fractions that I move from adresses starting with 3 to these old adresses would be valid (in face of what Shelby explained, assuming its true). Any suggestions?
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June 06, 2019, 06:03:57 AM
 #73

This 2018 post will be entertaining when it happens.

Capital C for capitalism. BitCoin.

FUD carrier, nonsense.
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June 06, 2019, 08:11:21 AM
 #74

He plans to sell, there are people waiting to buy. This was 6 months ago, and still price is doubled since that time. One of his announcements without realization, that speaks a lot about him. I didnt trust that he is Satoshi from the start, with his actions he just proves that more and more. i dont understand how his bsv coin still lives and who is using it.



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June 06, 2019, 10:11:54 AM
 #75

This message from Shelby is very interesting. The issue is even more complex than what I believe it was.

The recent versions of the core wallet are only distributing adresses starting with 3. Do anyone know if its possible to generate adresses starting with 1? Most of my stash is on those old "legacy" adresses, but I dont know if any fractions that I move from adresses starting with 3 to these old adresses would be valid (in face of what Shelby explained, assuming its true). Any suggestions?

Through the main Core interface it by default generates an address starting with a 3 but can check a box to generate a bc1 address. I don't see an option anyhere that allows you to generate a legacy format address. I'm not sure if there is a certain command that you can tap into to generate a legacy address, but you can always install a pre Segwit version of core that can be found here; https://bitcoin.org/bin/

Bitcoin Core clients are backwards compatible so you're most likely good to go, the only question is how safe are the older versions today.... If that's not an option then there is Electrum that you can use. They allow you to choose which address format to use.
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June 06, 2019, 03:22:48 PM
 #76

Here is a revised post from Shelby with some important edits/additions:

Quote from: Shelby Moore
Unfortunately the readers are ignoring what I am trying to explain to them. Let me try one more time to explain it more explicitly so hopefully their eyes will be opened?

Then, he would dump one million BTC on the exchanges, for $1200 each, which would give him 1.2 billion dollars. This money he would use to pay for a 51% attack on the BTC chain. Since its illegal to dump high volumes without a notice, he is doing this notice right now, believing the decryption will succeed in january 2020. If not, he would use a second deadline by the middle of 2020, when the halving happens. Thats what I understand from his posts.

Craig will only be selling some BTC to initiate the drop in the exchange price so that there’s less mining resistance to his next move as described below. He will profit on the exchanges with a huge short position and use that to initiate a pump on BSV while the following transpires…

Craig doesn’t need any additional resources to do his mining “attack”. The 3 peta-hash that they already have is sufficient to initiate the SegWit donations defense mechanism that exists on Satoshi?s v0.5.3 immutable protocol. The “attack” (actually a “poison pill” defense mechanism planted in the game theory by Satoshi) will cost them nothing and in fact generate massive profits. It will destroy the altcoin named “Bitco[i]n Core” and only Satoshi’s immutable protocol Bitcoin (aka “real Bitcoin” which is not BSV) will survive. I have been explaining this for the past two years.

Did you read the Steemit post that was linked in the following quoted comment from upthread, which explains this is more detail?

Quote from: Shelby Moore
[…]

This is the posited SegWit donations attack, with the booty piling up high in time for May 2020:

https://steemit.com/bitcoin/@anonymint/ps965c

You’re ostensibly misinterpreting what his statement means. Craig is ostensibly referring to the real Satoshi v0.5.3 protocol BTC network that will have forced the Core protocol to fork off. He means 51+% of the hashrate that was on Core’s protocol will have switched (i.e. it will not be only Craig’s hashrate given that many miners will want partake in the donations booty).

He is pointing out that until all the SegWit donations are taken (since only so many can fit into a block), the real BTC miners will not be accepting other transactions […]



[…] the best solution would be to do a hard fork, locking Satoshi addresses in the forked version as soon as CSW started moving the coins stored there. This should be done before these coins hit the exchanges, and the exchanges would need to change to the forked version too. In this way, the disaster could be prevented.

The devs would need to devise some backup plan for it […]

The exchanges that are following Core’s protocol rules are going to be on the Core fork after the initiation (possibly by Craig) of the said “defense mechanism” (that Satoshi wisely put in his game theory to prevent attempts to modify the protocol). Blockstream was funded to fool you, so the powers-that-be can take the BTC from snowflakes who think that “social consensus” is meaningful. I suggest reading the following on why snowflakes are destined to lose all their “talents” (i.e. money):

https://steemit.com/religion/@anonymint/ethics-of-religion-money-and-bitcoin

(the above is a technological and philosophical document, not just theological)

Therefore the exchanges are going to be on a fork that has a cratered hashrate and thus the duration between blocks will increase so much that congestion of the mempool will be so bad that nearly nothing will be moving on the Core chain. So nothing will be coming in or out of the exchanges until difficulty can readjust and it will take so many weeks or months (or perhaps never) for that difficulty adjustment to be reached because the chain will suddenly slow down so much.

Additionally all those who had stored their BTC in Core addresses that begin with a 3 instead of Satoshi’s legacy addresses with a 1 will lose their real BTC. They will only end up bagholding worthless Core fork tokens. And if they have any tokens on exchanges, they will lose all of them because this event is going to bankrupt all exchanges which are following the Core protocol. Isn’t that all of them?

The miners who join Craig in mining Satoshi’s v0.5.3 protocol (which had up until that point been implicitly running alongside of Core, before Core is forced to fork off when the miners start taking the SegWit donations) will receive as donations as many SegWit addresses BTC as they can fit into each block. These are donations because Satoshi’s protocol sees the Core addresses as “pay to anyone” (aka “anyone can spend”). Of course the Core protocol will fork off, but mining Satoshi’s protocol will be so much more profitable.

So Craig will be amassing his share of real BTC from these SegWit donations, along will all the other miners that join in the party to get their share. Very, very profitable.

Meanwhile:

"We're going to 51% attack Bitcoin and pump BSV with the Satoshi coins.....better dump your BTC and buy BSV before it's too late!" Cheesy

Indeed while all the snowflakes will be buying BSV thinking that is the savior from this “attack”, Craig will be ostensibly selling BSV at the peak stupidity of greater fools, and buying the real BTC. I presume what he will do is sell BSV for Tether then later use the Tether to buy real BTC once everything stabilizes and new exchanges are created (or extant exchanges that survive do a split) that honor Satoshi?s protocol instead of Core.

So everyone who is hodling their BTC in legacy addresses that begin with 1 (and if not on an exchange) are not going to lose their real BTC and also receive a free airdrop of Core shitcoins. So how to sell those Core shitcoins? The problem is the exchange won’t split your BTC into Core and Satoshi protocols fast enough.

Craig will ostensibly split his BTC before loading them on the exchange, so that he is only selling Core shitcoins on the exchange. He can split them by spending them to Core addresses while also double-spending them on a private Satoshi protocol chain that mixes them with some newly mined BTC on that private chain. That private chain will become the new Satoshi chain. IOW, he will rollback the chain slightly (maybe a few days at most). Yet I presume he will be putting all legacy address transactions in those private blocks, so those who are not transacting with SegWit will not experience any rollback.

To split our BTC, we need to get some BTC from a new block on that Satoshi chain. But the problem is we then can?t get our Core shitcoins loaded into the exchange because the Core chain will slow down so much. So I guess all we can do if we are not joined with Craig in his inner circle, is hodl the free airdrop (in addition to our real BTC) Core shitcoins and prepare to sell those shitcoins later if ever the Core chain difficulty readjusts. Anyone have any other ideas?

You mostly know nothing in this world

https://mobile.twitter.com/cryptorebel_SV/status/1135903217034956802

Me[myself] included

You apparently stopped using reality as your benchmark.

Here follows a more detailed interpretation of Craig’s recent blather:

https://steemit.com/bitcoin/@anonymint/psg83p

The entire Story ( tldr) does tell us very clear - without the Need of more deep Analysis:

the btc core BS Project / Experiment has faild - things are running into complexity - nobody wants to pick that up for years now ( excep BS)

BCH path seems to be very similar

BSV is the clean code road map that finally removes any dev midlle men - and we will not nee to talk about boring stable protocols from now on

hve all a nice day 

Carpe diem  -  understand the White Paper and mine honest.
Fix real world issues: Check out b-vote.com
The simple way is the genius way - Satoshi's Rules: humana veris _
exstasie
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June 06, 2019, 03:54:09 PM
 #77

This message from Shelby is very interesting. The issue is even more complex than what I believe it was.

No it's not. He seems like a nutjob. It's incredible that anyone is still going on about an "anyone-can-spend" attack. He obviously deeply misunderstands the incentives at work in Bitcoin.

No one cares what miners want; they will simply follow what users want. The lead-up to the Segwit fork proved that much. If miners switch to a fork where they steal everyone's coins going back 2012, nobody is going to switch to the miner's fork, LOL. Why would they? Clearly these are dishonest miners who are useless in securing a protocol.

Again, miners follow users, not the other way around. Without users, there are no transaction fees and no speculative value based on future usage. Miners will be spending massive amounts mining a completely worthless chain.

Just like they fell in line with Segwit activation, they will quickly migrate back to the "Core" chain where the vast majority of users will be. No, a bit of temporary congestion and slower block times won't cause anyone to fork to a chain where the protocol incentives obviously don't work to keep miners honest.

If the attack succeeded (LOL) it would only succeed in destroying trust in all the forks, and all of crypto.

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June 06, 2019, 06:12:48 PM
 #78

This message from Shelby is very interesting. The issue is even more complex than what I believe it was.

No it's not. He seems like a nutjob. It's incredible that anyone is still going on about an "anyone-can-spend" attack. He obviously deeply misunderstands the incentives at work in Bitcoin.

No one cares what miners want; they will simply follow what users want. The lead-up to the Segwit fork proved that much. If miners switch to a fork where they steal everyone's coins going back 2012, nobody is going to switch to the miner's fork, LOL. Why would they? Clearly these are dishonest miners who are useless in securing a protocol.

Again, miners follow users, not the other way around. Without users, there are no transaction fees and no speculative value based on future usage. Miners will be spending massive amounts mining a completely worthless chain.

Just like they fell in line with Segwit activation, they will quickly migrate back to the "Core" chain where the vast majority of users will be. No, a bit of temporary congestion and slower block times won't cause anyone to fork to a chain where the protocol incentives obviously don't work to keep miners honest.

If the attack succeeded (LOL) it would only succeed in destroying trust in all the forks, and all of crypto.


Its interesting in the way that it could lead to a PoS version of bitcoin. If the miners betray the trust of users, and steal funds from Segwit adresses, the devs will fork it, rollback the theft, and use LN to validate blocks, since LN is dependable on Segwit. This would lead to a PoS version of bitcoin.

On the other hand, we would have the Legacy mainchain keeping the same value of the forked one, due to being the longest chain in a PoW perspective (LN came only in 2017), which was not the case with BCH (which had less hashrate when it forked).

But Im probably wrong, since I dont know all the technicals about it.
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June 06, 2019, 06:32:50 PM
 #79

Its interesting in the way that it could lead to a PoS version of bitcoin. If the miners betray the trust of users, and steal funds from Segwit adresses, the devs will fork it, rollback the theft, and use LN to validate blocks, since LN is dependable on Segwit. This would lead to a PoS version of bitcoin.

On the other hand, we would have the Legacy mainchain keeping the same value of the forked one, due to being the longest chain in a PoW perspective (LN came only in 2017), which was not the case with BCH (which had less hashrate when it forked).

But Im probably wrong, since I dont know all the technicals about it.

It's simpler than that. The vast majority of nodes (and therefore users) would simply ignore such a theft. He is talking about miners attempting to steal outputs going back to the P2SH fork in 2012, not just Segwit. This is in violation of consensus rules at the node level going back years. There are hardly any nodes left on the network that would view the miners' fork as valid. Even if we're just talking about hard forking to violate Segwit, 80% of reachable nodes already enforce Segwit at this time. So the fork would simply be ignored by the Bitcoin network.

Once miners realize no one's coming and they are wasting millions of dollars mining a worthless chain, they will return to the legacy chain. There would be temporarily slower block times on the legacy chain but that's about it.

I don't think miners would risk such an obvious blunder.

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June 06, 2019, 07:28:00 PM
 #80

Quote from: Shelby
The miners who join Craig in mining Satoshi’s v0.5.3 protocol (which had up until that point been implicitly running alongside of Core, before Core is forced to fork off when the miners start taking the SegWit donations) will receive as donations as many SegWit addresses BTC as they can fit into each block. These are donations because Satoshi’s protocol sees the Core addresses as “pay to anyone” (aka “anyone can spend”). Of course the Core protocol will fork off, but mining Satoshi’s protocol will be so much more profitable.

why would mining "Satoshi’s v0.5.3 protocol" be so much more profitable? that requires mining rewards to have value but the value of these mining rewards would plummet to zero. there would be zero market demand and the airdrop to standard address users would be dumped into any existing bids. (if exchanges even listed this shitcoin at all)

why would anyone want to buy this coin or run its software? it's a fork based on stealing users money. just because it has some hash rate? that won't last long. Roll Eyes

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