The Lightning Network FAQ

[LoyceV]

I have recently decided I had to get a Lightning wallet

Why?

What are the best wallets compatible with lightning?

It depends.

Can I use the lightning network for long term storage?

This question is what made me ask "Why" you want a LN wallet. I use my LN-wallet for small, frequent payments, which is what LN can do much cheaper than on-chain Bitcoin.
However, when you're talking about long-term storage, there's absolutely no reason to do that in an open LN-channel!

[Wind_FURY]

Hi guys,

I have recently decided I had to get a Lightning wallet and wanted to hear from you guys

What are the best wallets compatible with lightning?

Can I use the lightning network for long term storage?

Thanks

I might get some criticisms, but just use BlueWallet. It's the easiest UX to get started in Lightning for newbies.

https://bluewallet.io

[LoyceV]

I might get some criticisms, but just use BlueWallet. It's the easiest UX to get started in Lightning for newbies.

I agree. But for long-term storage it's a terrible idea to use a custodial wallet (similar to using exchanges for long-term storage).

[Wind_FURY]

This tool might be useful for some of you LN "extremists".

https://tip.bigsun.xyz

The developers also need a front-end designer/developer, a volunteer.

[darosior]

Hi guys,

I have recently decided I had to get a Lightning wallet and wanted to hear from you guys

What are the best wallets compatible with lightning?

Can I use the lightning network for long term storage?

Thanks

I might get some criticisms, but just use BlueWallet. It's the easiest UX to get started in Lightning for newbies.

https://bluewallet.io

If someone wants (need?) to go as far as using a custodial wallet, ACINQ's Phoenix might be a good choice. And, at least, they tend toward removing the custodian (but for sure less toward removing the reliance on their services  )

[philboosty]

hello everyone... is it possible to use all the funds in the locked channel??

[darosior]

hello everyone... is it possible to use all the funds in the locked channel??

Hi philboosty,

You can use all the funds you locked, minus the reserve (used to maintain the incentive of both parties to not try to cheat).

[Wind_FURY]

The Wikipedia page for the Lightning Network is being considered for deletion. Why censor technical information, and how can it be saved?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning_Network

[JayJuanGee]

The Wikipedia page for the Lightning Network is being considered for deletion. Why censor technical information, and how can it be saved?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning_Network

Seems that the involved editors are merely suggesting to combine Lightning Network under bitcoin rather than to delete the information?  Might be a temporary measure, no?

[Carlton Banks]

The Wikipedia page for the Lightning Network is being considered for deletion. Why censor technical information, and how can it be saved?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning_Network

in which case, wikipedia is "not notable"


my suggestions

1. Make your screenshot as small or smaller than the way I have
2. Make the screenshot within your actual mind of wikipedia's importance commensurately smaller still
3. Stop talking about wikipedia as if it's a thing

the alternative is to allow a platform that is being redacted and censored along political lines to determine what "is" is. Take that power away from them, and they have the no such power to do any such thing

[Wind_FURY]

Possible use-case for Lightning. Viable as a trust-minimized alternative to mixing/tumbling if privacy features are developed.

Your thoughts?

[darosior]

Possible use-case for Lightning. Viable as a trust-minimized alternative to mixing/tumbling if privacy features are developed.

Your thoughts?

Viable if you never get back on chain (or spend everything on the Lightning Network)  But privacy features *are needed* a step before accessing the LN anyway, and it is not an alternative in any way.

[Wind_FURY]

Possible use-case for Lightning. Viable as a trust-minimized alternative to mixing/tumbling if privacy features are developed.

Your thoughts?

Viable if you never get back on chain (or spend everything on the Lightning Network)  But privacy features *are needed* a step before accessing the LN anyway, and it is not an alternative in any way.

Never? What/how would someone track my transactions to myself in Lightning, with privacy features enabled?

[Wind_FURY]

Trolls doesn't believe that development of privacy features are possible in Lightning. Plus I encourage bad-actors/spying-agencies to "track" Lightning transactions. They would have to stake Bitcoin and help with liquidity.

[darosior]

Possible use-case for Lightning. Viable as a trust-minimized alternative to mixing/tumbling if privacy features are developed.

Your thoughts?

Viable if you never get back on chain (or spend everything on the Lightning Network)  But privacy features *are needed* a step before accessing the LN anyway, and it is not an alternative in any way.

Never? What/how would someone track my transactions to myself in Lightning, with privacy features enabled?

I meant from the Bitcoin network (/block chain) point of view the channel is just a transaction with a P2WSH output, if you spend all your funds on the Lightning Network then it means that you locally transferred funds to your channel peer. When closing, the transaction output will belong to the peer and you effectively spend funds without the observer knowing where they were going (once again for a Bitcoin network observer, with no knowledge of the Lightning Network).
However, if you fund a channel with a so-called tainted output, close the channel with remaining funds on your side then nothing was mixed at all.

What do you mean by "with privacy features enabled" ?


PS: I didn't want to even mention it but Khaos77's message above is of course nonsense...

[LoyceV]

However, if you fund a channel with a so-called tainted output, close the channel with remaining funds on your side then nothing was mixed at all.

So you open 2 channels on different devices: 1 channel to Bob, who runs a well-connected node, and another channel to Alice, who also runs a well-connected node. From your device connected to Bob, you send funds to your device connected to Alice. After you close the channels, there is no direct blockchain connection between your transactions.
So the question is: who's going to keep track of all LN-transactions, and for how long? And although I'm not sure if LN works like this: if your channel to and from the node is not public, only Bob and Alice know the exact connection.

[darosior]

So you open 2 channels on different devices: 1 channel to Bob, who runs a well-connected node, and another channel to Alice, who also runs a well-connected node. From your device connected to Bob, you send funds to your device connected to Alice. After you close the channels, there is no direct blockchain connection between your transactions.

But you can't receive on your channel to Alice until you make some payments, and you'll be able to only receive as much as you pay. So you basically get back at spending your bitcoins on the LN.
This also assumes the output you used to fund the channel to Alice is not tainted in any way.

So the question is: who's going to keep track of all LN-transactions, and for how long?

What do you mean by LN-transactions ?
If you mean LN payments, they (normally) cannot be linked.
If you mean Bitcoin transactions opening or closing (in any way) channels, then I think already-mentioned-above companies already do.

And although I'm not sure if LN works like this: if your channel to and from the node is not public, only Bob and Alice know the exact connection.

You should not rely on unpublished channels, they are biggest (potential) privacy leaks than they seem to be (in addition to having many other downsides). (Non-related to the initial subject, but if you are interested https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lightning-rfc/pull/681)

[Wind_FURY]

Possible use-case for Lightning. Viable as a trust-minimized alternative to mixing/tumbling if privacy features are developed.

Your thoughts?

Viable if you never get back on chain (or spend everything on the Lightning Network)   But privacy features *are needed* a step before accessing the LN anyway, and it is not an alternative in any way.

Never? What/how would someone track my transactions to myself in Lightning, with privacy features enabled?

What do you mean by "with privacy features enabled" ?

I meant, isn't it possible to develop privacy features to hide sender, receiver, and amount, off-chain in the Lightning Network?

[Rath_]

I meant, isn't it possible to develop privacy features to hide sender, receiver, and amount, off-chain in the Lightning Network?

Nodes participating in the routing process don't know who initiated the transaction and what the final destination is thanks to onion routing. Transactions are not listed anywhere so they can't be tracked by outsiders. As for hiding the amount, multi-part payments have just become a real thing.

[darosior]

I meant, isn't it possible to develop privacy features to hide sender, receiver, and amount, off-chain in the Lightning Network?

Nodes participating in the routing process don't know who initiated the transaction and what the final destination is thanks to onion routing. Transactions are not listed anywhere so they can't be tracked by outsiders. As for hiding the amount, multi-part payments have just become a real thing.

For hiding amounts and CLTV deltas, C-lightning also uses shadow routing.