My Situation: Mining LTC now and After Halving. Looking like meh! Take Poll!

[Philipma1957cellphone]

I have seen some info on L5+ it does 1 watt a mg. The best from inno is the a6+ it does around 1 watt a th so 11gh would be 11 kwatts. Or 11 x 24=264 kwatts that is 9 bucks for 3.5 cent power and you cheat only 6 usd a day. This would be if you had 5x a6+ at a cost of 3000 each so you would have paid 15000 for the miners to clear 6 usd a day.  Yet the pricing in the A6+ stays at 3000 each. At six usd profit it will take 2500 days to pay the A6+ off.

[Searing]

I have seen some info on L5+ it does 1 watt a mg. The best from inno is the a6+ it does around 1 watt a th so 11gh would be 11 kwatts. Or 11 x 24=264 kwatts that is 9 bucks for 3.5 cent power and you cheat only 6 usd a day. This would be if you had 5x a6+ at a cost of 3000 each so you would have paid 15000 for the miners to clear 6 usd a day.  Yet the pricing in the A6+ stays at 3000 each. At six usd profit it will take 2500 days to pay the A6+ off.

Brings to mind another angle I forgot about from Maxumark on here in Bitcointalk.

I will preface with this. The 'rumor' is and seems to be borne out that the Litecoin L5+ was never released in the USA to consumers in general.

The 'assumption' was it was only used for Bitmain and its 'cloud mining'.

So that begs a further question, is the pump in all ASIC miners crypto prices and the pushing of pre-orders from 2-4 months and other silliness

due to the result of countries like Venezuela and North Korea and/or other states, BUYING, hash power to move into USD $$$ with sanctions, etc?

Or a more likely version of above. Venezuela using LOCAL currency to pay for 'cheap' (I think it is 1c kWh?) electric and thus mining like hell to get

around sanctions, due to the crummy fiat they have? You can expand on this and saying anyone in a high inflation country with low electric is balls

to the wall buying equipment and/or simply buying as much cloud hashing as possible from cloud miners like Bitmain, to move as much currency as they can?

But yeah, above, that is the rub.

How the hell, in a dump situation price-wise is everything ASIC equipment-wise in full boat FOMO, like we are in a pump?

It is befuddling.

I doubt above is true on cloud mining.

But in the spirit of being confused on every area of Crypto, I thought this should be mentioned.

Perhaps that is where the equipment is going? A run on cloud mining?

Brad

[nostrings]

I get free electricity but I don't think ltc has much of a future, I would rather just stick with ethereum for now.

[swogerino]

I get free electricity but I don't think ltc has much of a future, I would rather just stick with ethereum for now.

I think both coins have a future and in fact although I am mining ethereum I always exchange a big part of it to Litecoin.I always believed in this crypto but the fact is that it is stuck from some time in a low range.I think that halving will not play a big role as it has not done so in the king of cryptos,Bitcoin.

[Searing]

Just some things on mining LTC that are just not possible anymore in the USA at these prices.

Again, many people have said this on Bitcointalk, I'm hardly the first, but no LTC mining for me seems likely, no matter what the

price of electric until way into 2020 from what I can tell.

1) My Xcel Electic in the Midwest USA says that they have 10.3c kWh power. After fees/taxes/etc. When you divide your 'true'

electric bill into the total kWh used. The 'real' price for electric 'residential' is actual as of last month, $17.59c kWh. So beware of

stated electric use. Residential is out.  Electric costs, I'm still beyond screwed in the USA. The best rates in the USA for the data hall option,

I can get currently comes out between 9.5c and 10c kWh.

This is at my current data hall and when you add shipping my stuff to a new data hall at a lower rate of electric, with setup fees (usually $50 a unit).

At least in the 6-month short term, it all comes out in the wash about 9.5c-10c kWh averaged out and not worth the hassle of moving. Again, IMHO.

2) The USA the 25.7%  (tariff and import fees) until that goes away, we are sunk.

3) Thus (see above) prices for equipment is way, way too high for the current LTC and any crypto prices for the coin, IMHO.

4) the length of time for pre-order, according to Philipma1957 and others now common 120 days.

5) The lack of movement on Litecoin Development and LTC prices are in the dumps. See the below video from Voskcoin. He is brutal on LTC's prospects.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFiE4wkDvt0  I'd add to this rant that unless LTC gets Mimblewimble it is all over for this coin.

So like Voskcoin says in the above video, does not look good for long term prospects for LTC mining, no long Meh! now looks more like Groan!

So yeah, likely 2020 IF this coin can compete against BSV and BCH, as the silver to Bitcoin gold, it may be 2020 at best and/or never before I get

another LTC miner, again, if ever!

Brad

[philipma1957]

Just some things on mining LTC that are just not possible anymore in the USA at these prices.

Again, many people have said this on Bitcointalk, I'm hardly the first, but no LTC mining for me seems likely, no matter what the

price of electric until way into 2020 from what I can tell.

1) My Xcel Electic in the Midwest USA says that they have 10.3c kWh power. After fees/taxes/etc. When you divide your 'true'

electric bill into the total kWh used. The 'real' price for electric 'residential' is actual as of last month, $17.59c kWh. So beware of

stated electric use. Residential is out.  Electric costs, I'm still beyond screwed in the USA. The best rates in the USA for the data hall option,

I can get currently comes out between 9.5c and 10c kWh.

This is at my current data hall and when you add shipping my stuff to a new data hall at a lower rate of electric, with setup fees (usually $50 a unit).

At least in the 6-month short term, it all comes out in the wash about 9.5c-10c kWh averaged out and not worth the hassle of moving. Again, IMHO.

2) The USA the 25.7%  (tariff and import fees) until that goes away, we are sunk.

3) Thus (see above) prices for equipment is way, way too high for the current LTC and any crypto prices for the coin, IMHO.

4) the length of time for pre-order, according to Philipma1957 and others now common 120 days.

5) The lack of movement on Litecoin Development and LTC prices are in the dumps. See the below video from Voskcoin. He is brutal on LTC's prospects.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFiE4wkDvt0  I'd add to this rant that unless LTC gets Mimblewimble it is all over for this coin.

So like Voskcoin says in the above video, does not look good for long term prospects for LTC mining, no long Meh! now looks more like Groan!

So yeah, likely 2020 IF this coin can compete against BSV and BCH, as the silver to Bitcoin gold, it may be 2020 at best and/or never before I get

another LTC miner, again, if ever!

Brad

I point 11 gh and pay 1/2 the coins to my hosteer.

So I have 5.5 gh. For free and paid off.  When 1/2 ink happened we dropped to .16667 ltc a day from .3333 ltc a day.  We are up to .21 ltc a day.  This will go higher and diff will drop more.

The beauty of a 50 - 50 coin  deal  is I make money on losing coins like the ltc with a L3+

The downside is mining with a s17 pro as the hoster makes out on that gear.

I have to balance with some shit gear on shit coins as the gear is dirt cheap.

So some s9s and some L3+ Stick around.

  I have 700 th in modern  sha256
 I have 210 th in old sha 256
 I have 11 gh in L3+

I can be picky when I buy as we turn profit.

So I mostly now look for new gear at a decent price.  Maybe some Avalon a1066 will come soon. I hope.

I would love to get 5 of them.

[leea-1334]

Thank you for sharing that. I have never had the chance to mine good coins. I tried mining testnet before and smaller coins (plus a lot of staking POS but that does not count at all) and the experience was fun, but I can imagine how stressful it can be when you have to think of cost and profit,,, so my respect to all of you guys who even try to mine.

I think now people are bearing the pain of low price but if you can manage to hodl as much as you can, $150 is very likely IMO.

[jstefanop]

Ive obviously been in the scrypt scene for a while so ill weigh in my 2 cents.

We are repeating the 2014-2017 cycle to the tee. We are already 30% down in hash power since peak, so same equipment is now only producing 20% less litecoins than they were before the halving. The halving has not pained the big boys yet since most of them are contract based. Once those expire or its time to renew power leases all remaining huge L3 farms that dont have free power will shutdown.

Anyone that has A6s or my Apollos will be producing more Litecoin in the coming months after the halving than before by end of the year. The only farms that can operate at scale at this point are the ones running in the 1W/MH range, which is only Apollos, A6s, and Shitmains internal L5s at this point.

I know most people can't see it, but these are the glory days of mining, when you can accumulate a lot of cheap Litecoins, and we will probably be in this phase for another year if history continues to repeat itself before the next cycle starts.

Stop looking at what litecoin is worth vs fiat, and start looking at how much extra coin you are now mining off the same equipment. The only thing that matters is how many Litecoins you have, not how much they are worth today.

[Searing]

Ive obviously been in the scrypt scene for a while so ill weigh in my 2 cents.

We are repeating the 2014-2017 cycle to the tee. We are already 30% down in hash power since the peak, so the same equipment is now only producing 20% fewer litecoins than they were before the halving. The halving has not pained the big boys yet since most of them are contract based. Once those expire or its time to renew power leases all remaining huge L3 farms that don't have free power will shutdown.

Anyone that has A6s or my Apollos will be producing more Litecoin in the coming months after the halving than before by end of the year. The only farms that can operate at scale at this point are the ones running in the 1W/MH range, which is only Apollos, A6s, and Shitmains internal L5s at this point.

I know most people can't see it, but these are the glory days of mining when you can accumulate a lot of cheap Litecoins, and we will probably be in this phase for another year if history continues to repeat itself before the next cycle starts.

Stop looking at what litecoin is worth vs fiat, and start looking at how much extra coin you are now mining off the same equipment. The only thing that matters is how many Litecoins you have, not how much they are worth today.

Well. I should just HODL the LTC I have I guess.

Right now what you say is almost impossible to do mining, assuming what you say comes to pass, it is likely better just for me to sell crap in the attic (attic mining) on eBay and convert

to LTC (or whatever) then get a miner at this point.

Below is mining LTC alone on underclocked L3+'s on www.litecoinpool.org/calc

2 L3+'s to a Bitmain PSU 1600 PSU

700mh

1400 watts

10c kWh at $75.44 LTC price

Profitability Analysis
   Expected Rewards   Costs   Net Profit
24 hours   0.01590738 LTC   1.20 USD   3.36 USD    -2.16 USD
7 days   0.11135164 LTC   8.40 USD   23.52 USD   -15.12 USD
30 days   0.47722131 LTC   36.00 USD   100.80 USD -64.80 USD


above at 8c kWh at $75.44 LTC price

Profitability Analysis
   Expected Rewards   Costs   Net Profit
24 hours   0.01590738 LTC   1.20 USD   2.69 USD   -1.49 USD
7 days   0.11135164 LTC   8.40 USD   18.82 USD   -10.42 USD
30 days   0.47722131 LTC   36.00 USD   80.64 USD   -44.64 USD

at 6c kWh at $75.44 LTC price

Profitability Analysis
   Expected Rewards   Costs   Net Profit
24 hours   0.01590738 LTC   1.20 USD   2.02 USD   -0.82 USD
7 days   0.11135164 LTC   8.40 USD   14.11 USD   -5.71 USD
30 days   0.47722131 LTC   36.00 USD   60.48 USD   -24.48 USD

at 4c kWh at $75.44 LTC price

Profitability Analysis
   Expected Rewards   Costs   Net Profit
24 hours   0.01590738 LTC   1.20 USD   1.34 USD   -0.14 USD
7 days   0.11135164 LTC   8.40 USD   9.41 USD   -1.01 USD
30 days   0.47722131 LTC   36.00 USD   40.32 USD   -4.32 USD

at 3.5c kWh at $75.44 LTC price (this breaks even at 2c a day profit vs electric)

Profitability Analysis
   Expected Rewards   Costs   Net Profit
24 hours   0.01590738 LTC   1.20 USD   1.18 USD   0.02 USD
7 days   0.11135164 LTC   8.40 USD   8.23 USD   0.17 USD
30 days   0.47722131 LTC   36.00 USD   35.28 USD   0.72 USD

So hell, 3.5c kWh for 72c a month profit over electric for 2 underclocked L3+'s?

sh*t

So I understand your point on the mining of LTC, but hell, better off just selling stuff around here from the attic and 'attic mine' to eBay. A pain in the ass, but at least

if something sells on eBay I probably for the hassle would get more than 2c a friggin day!  (again at the above 3.5c kWh)

Unsure how to get such a deal on 50/50 with a hosting place. I am fairly sure, that IF the hosting place is in the red he no longer does the 50/50 at his end, that would

be silly.

As to the more better Innsilicon units, they never frigging ROI at this point at these prices and of course the good old pre-orders now at 120 days. Also, notice the same

tricks on China ETA of Jan 2020 for some. They 'rarely' get equipment out in China around Jan/Feb of whatever year with taking a week off for the Chinese New Years,

so even cutting them a break, whatever a China Manufacturer says in that Jan 2020 timeline, I'd add at least 1 month. Seems always the case from past sales in this timeline.

Again, I understand where you are coming from, price vs LTC you can get.

But it is bad enough that math does not work with equipment anymore only buying and HODL...with some risk.

(again, my previous Voskcoin video slam'ing LTC on above post)

The real question is, with I think it was 97% of code just being modified by bitcoin core devs to LTC code and the upstarts of ETH and BCH and BSV.

Perhaps this lazzie-faire way of promoting and just following BTC as it is just does not cut it anymore and LTC is losing adoption to the above BTC clones and ETH.

So unless LTC really pulls out something on github as they state and/or do Mimblewimble for privacy (something bitcoin core has refused to do) and differentiate

themselves from BTC in some manner and show some dev progress.

Well, I too was around from 2013 onward and got a lot of LTC, but ordered the KNC Titan back in the day when 'briefly' LTC was over $10 ..then I got the unit(s) and

difficulty dumped as you say and the last man standing was these 'overpriced' (12K) scrypt-pow Titan Miners. Which I mined as you say a lot of LTC (which I converted

to BTC) because all the equipment makers at that $10 to $1.80 price pulled their units..so it was pretty much the only game in town. KNC titans with flat difficulty.

My tag line for 2015 was something like 'My Never to ROI piece of sh*t overpriced KNC Titans' or some such.

So sure, I could get a big ass 11k unit again from Innsilocon or whatever, and 'hope' nothing else comes down the pike for equipment...

but the odds are long indeed at the above return for L3+'s or any LTC equipment, especially with the 25.7% tariff.

below is from

Innosilicon A4+ LTCMaster
   
Nov 2017
   
620Mh/s
   
750W
   
80db
   
Scrypt
   
-$0.77/day
Bitmain Antminer L3+ (504Mh)
   
Jun 2017
   
504Mh/s
   
800W
   
70db
   
Scrypt
   
-$1.08/day
FusionSilicon X6 Miner
   
Aug 2018
   
860Mh/s
   
1079W
   
72db
   
Scrypt
   
-$1.16/day
Bitmain Antminer L3+ (600Mh)
   
Oct 2017
   
600Mh/s
   
850W
   
75db
   
Scrypt
   
-$1.19/day
Bitmain Antminer L3++ (580Mh)
   
May 2018
   
580Mh/s
   
942W
   
76db
   
Scrypt
   
-$1.30/day
BW L21
   
Jan 2018
   
550Mh/s
   
950W
   
75db
   
Scrypt
   
-$1.37/day
Innosilicon A6+ LTCMaster
   
Mar 2019
   
2.2Gh/s
   
2100W
   
82db
   
Scrypt
   
-$1.38/day
Bitmain Antminer L3++ (596Mh)
   
May 2018
   
596Mh/s
   
1050W
   
70db
   
Scrypt
   
-$1.53/day
Innosilicon A6 LTCMaster
   
Jan 2018
   
1.23Gh/s
   
1500W
   
82db
   
Scrypt
   
-$1.55/day
Innosilicon A4 Dominator
   
Jul 2017
   
280Mh/s
   
1050W
   
75db
   
Scrypt
   
-$2.05/day

The above is from https://www.asicminervalue.com/

these are stock speeds but still sucks and at 10c kWh.

Scrypt-Pow equipment is just not possible, IMHO, at this point in time.

So I'd better see some REAL frigging github progress as Charlie Lee and LTC Foundation have stated and see Mimblewimble as they have claimed within a few months,

or I will simply call it noise.

This from my position of Moderator on www.litecointalk.io for crying out loud! This is in no way looks in any way as less than an epic cluster for LTC and

probably will determine how it survives as a legit top 25 coin in the next few months.

I'm talking before Jan of 2020 some real progress, if it is same old same old up till then, well, the price at that point will reflect this coin dying IMHO.

Brad

[Searing]

As of 8/27/2019.

This is how nuts stuff is yet for LTC/Scrypt Mining ASIC equipment.

Innsolicon A6+ with the PSU. This at 2.2gh at 2100 watts. At $3,000.00 USD.

https://www.innosilicon.com/html/a6+-miner/index.html

So using www.litecoinpool.org/calc with NO fee and payout of 103% to figure see results below:

The A6+ at 2.2gh at 2100 watts at 10c kWh at the current price of $72.79

for Litecoin. With NO underclocking/under-voltage, you get this:

                    Profitability Analysis
                           Expected Rewards          Cost     Net Profit
24 hours0.05026406 LTC   3.66 USD              5.04 USD    -1.38 USD
7 days   0.35184842 LTC   25.61 USD           35.28 USD     -9.67 USD
30 days   1.50792179 LTC   109.76 USD        151.20 USD   -41.44 USD

Innsolicon A6 with the PSU. This at 1.23gh at 1500 watts. At $2,000.00 USD.

https://www.innosilicon.com/html/a6-miner/index.html

So using www.litecoinpool.org/calc with NO fee and payout of 103% to figure below:

The A6 at 1.23 and 1500 watts at 10c kWh at the current price of $72.79

for Litecoin. With NO underclocking/under-voltage, you get this:

                      Profitability Analysis
                Expected Rewards           Costs         Net Profit
24 hours0.02810218 LTC   2.05 USD   3.60 USD   -1.55 USD
7 days   0.19671525 LTC   14.32 USD   25.20 USD   -10.88 USD
30 days   0.84306536 LTC   61.37 USD   108.00 USD -46.63 USD

This is without the coming 32.7% tariffs and import taxes in the USA!

Just thought this was so ugly, I had to share it. Also, looking at above,

if you have 1/2 of the electric costs of say 5c kWh, you still are underwater

on a 50% cut on the above in profits on this date. 8/27/19.

Yech!

Brad