[2019-08-27] Craig Wright loses Kleiman case—billions in Bitcoin awarded to Klei

[bL4nkcode]

Craig Wright loses Kleiman case—billions in Bitcoin awarded to Kleiman estate

Craig Wright lost the Kleiman case. The judge ordered Wright to part with half of his pre-2014 Bitcoin—worth over $5 billion—to the Kleiman estate, alongside considerable intellectual property

https://cryptoslate.com/craig-wright-loses-kleiman-case-billions-bitcoin-awarded/

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[bryant.coleman]

Laughable.

How the judge is going to implement this order? He has asked Wright to hand over 50% of the coins (BTC490,000) to the family of Dave Kleiman. And the fact remains that neither Wright, nor Kleiman has anything to do with all those coins. Those coins were mined by Satoshi Nakamoto, and he is a different individual who has nothing to do with these two fraudsters.

I don't think that the judge is lunatic enough to ask the Bitcoin miners to do a 51% attack and thereby transfer all these coins to wallets controlled by Wright or Kleiman. (There is no dearth of lunatic judges in the US. Darth Vader Ginsburg is a prime example). That is the only way they could recover those coins, as no one has the private keys to access those wallets. BTW, did anyone checked the exchange rates of scam coin BSV? I am expecting a 90% crash today.  

[bbc.reporter]

@bryant.coleman. I reckon that it might be a good time to speculate on doing some short selling on bitcoin SV hehe.

However, what is Craig Wright's real plan in this situation? He knows he was going to lose the case. Is he that foolish?

[nulltxmark]

This is definitely a win for Kleiman... going to be hard to come back from that...

[jseverson]

How the judge is going to implement this order? He has asked Wright to hand over 50% of the coins (BTC490,000) to the family of Dave Kleiman. And the fact remains that neither Wright, nor Kleiman has anything to do with all those coins. Those coins were mined by Satoshi Nakamoto, and he is a different individual who has nothing to do with these two fraudsters.

He can pay the USD equivalent via other sources. Civil suit awards aren't always paid upfront, so he doesn't necessarily need to hand over the BTC as per the exact wording of the ruling. I seriously doubt CSW has $5 billion to his name, so Kleiman's estate could strip him of everything he owns, and hound him endlessly afterwards.

However, what is Craig Wright's real plan in this situation? He knows he was going to lose the case. Is he that foolish?

He probably thought he could get away with it lol. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

[DooMAD]

He can pay the USD equivalent via other sources. Civil suit awards aren't always paid upfront, so he doesn't necessarily need to hand over the BTC as per the exact wording of the ruling. I seriously doubt CSW has $5 billion to his name, so Kleiman's estate could strip him of everything he owns, and hound him endlessly afterwards.

Fingers crossed that's how it unfolds.  Hopefully that would leave Wright far less disposable income for other frivolous lawsuits and make him generally less of a nuisance.  Once they take away his funding, all he has left are his tall tales.

[Carlton Banks]

I still disagree with the treatment of Craig Wright, despite him bringing the case (the idea that such a prosecution is even considered by the so-called justice system is the root of the problem, he just tried to take advantage of it)


if the world knows he's a dangerously bizarre scam artist, isn't that punishment enough? I would suggest that here in the information age, it would have been

[NewStakes]

Craig Wright loses Kleiman case—billions in Bitcoin awarded to Kleiman estate

Craig Wright lost the Kleiman case. The judge ordered Wright to part with half of his pre-2014 Bitcoin—worth over $5 billion—to the Kleiman estate, alongside considerable intellectual property

https://cryptoslate.com/craig-wright-loses-kleiman-case-billions-bitcoin-awarded/

Does this mean the court also "ruled" that Craig is Satoshi?

Edit:
"That said, the judge did not determine whether Wright was Bitcoin’s creator, Satoshi Nakamoto. Though his behavior in court certainly calls into question his claims to the title."

[cryptokwuk]

Y'all forgetting that he had to prove access to the funds earlier in the trial before they proceeded.

[1Referee]

Y'all forgetting that he had to prove access to the funds earlier in the trial before they proceeded.

He never proved having access to the funds. All he did was provide a list of addresses containing x amount of coins in total, which any noob can do.

Craig is the type of scammer to set up a watch only account in his client and pretend that these coins are his. If people are ignorant enough, they might fall for it, but I doubt that this simple cheat is something the judge has overlooked. If the judge did anyway, then that would prove how incompetent the whole system is.

The funniest part of this case is that crypto youtubers have started talking about a looming $2 billion Bitcoin dump. What a bunch of attention seekers.

[hatshepsut93]

I think there's a good chance this lawsuit was organized by Wright himself - he just paid some money to Kleimans so they sue him so that he later can tell everyone how the court has proven that he is Satoshi. This whole case should have started with determining whether the coins exist or not, but no one did that.  Just watch how in near future CWS won't go to jail, won't have to pay any fines or give any money to Kleimans.

[bryant.coleman]

I still disagree with the treatment of Craig Wright, despite him bringing the case (the idea that such a prosecution is even considered by the so-called justice system is the root of the problem, he just tried to take advantage of it)

if the world knows he's a dangerously bizarre scam artist, isn't that punishment enough? I would suggest that here in the information age, it would have been

I don't agree with you. A few months back, he pulled off a major scam with his shitcoin BSV and was able to accumulate hundreds of millions of USD in funds. First, he filed a few lawsuits against individuals who rejected his claim as the original "Satoshi Nakamoto". This crashed the BSV prices, and many of the exchanges decided to delist the coin from their platforms (the action by exchanges also look questionable now). As per reliable sources, Wright amassed a huge volume of BSV at dirt cheap rates.

Then he stepped in with his second part of the plan. He filed a patent application for BTC and Blockchain, which resulted in BSV prices shooting up by 250%. He sold most of the coins that he accumulated previously at a profit, and in the end became richer by a few hundred million USD. What he did was not exactly illegal as per the regulations. So he can't be jailed although crypto users lost huge amounts of money. But as we say, what goes around comes around. Now he is going to lose all that money that he got by cheating the users earlier. Karma is a bitch, now deal with it.

[jseverson]

The funniest part of this case is that crypto youtubers have started talking about a looming $2 billion Bitcoin dump. What a bunch of attention seekers.

CSW started this himself. In an interview, he says that KIeiman's estate will have to pay a 40% estate tax for the inheritance, meaning they're going to have to dump around 200k BTC. This is wrong though, because as the article notes in a correction, Florida has already eliminated estate taxes.

[Kakmakr]

Interesting turn of events.    I expect that Craig Wright would now turn around and say that he lost access to those private keys, because he obviously do not have that kind of money to pay to Kleiman.    Let's say he has access to that kind of money, then I would spend most of that to appeal the verdict and pay for the best representation to reverse this decision on appeal hearings. 

This is only the start of a long process and Kleiman will most probably not see a fraction of that money in the end.  Craig Wright said he would crash the Bitcoin price, well I guess it is a good time to cash out his millions now, because he is going to need that to pay for all those lawyer fees. 

[Carlton Banks]

I still disagree with the treatment of Craig Wright, despite him bringing the case (the idea that such a prosecution is even considered by the so-called justice system is the root of the problem, he just tried to take advantage of it)

if the world knows he's a dangerously bizarre scam artist, isn't that punishment enough? I would suggest that here in the information age, it would have been

I don't agree with you. A few months back,

[snip]

Now he is going to lose all that money that he got by cheating the users earlier. Karma is a bitch, now deal with it.

so, 2 wrongs make 1 right? I disagree with that


what about all the people who never did anything wrong, who have libel cases brought against them, which they lose, either unjustly or corruptly?

meanwhile the people that Wright hoodwinked with BSV (and I'm not even convinced there were that many) will get none of this settlement, while the Kleiman family will get the promise of something (and in the end nothing, as Wright doesn't own significant assets of any kind), and what for? Kleiman sounds like he was lying too, so what sort of justice is that, taking money from a fraudster, and giving it to the family of a deceased fraudster? That makes zero sense, sorry

you're justifying this excessively litigious culture that brought about Wright's come-uppence, yet simultaneously excoriating free trade and capitalism.

Scammers and getting scammed is an unfortunate part of capitalism. If all investments were enforced as 100% safe, there would be none on offer. It's always a risk, and judging the risk vs the potential reward is your responsibility and yours alone. I didn't buy any scammy ICO's, because I invested in the knowledge that led me to deduce that they are mostly scams.

[BitHodler]

This is the first time this year news coverage of CSW is actually worth reading through. We have been bombarded with so many crap articles that only helped him gain even more sympathy from his delusional supporters.

Nothing will ever be enough for CSW's supporters to distance themselves from him. All this bad publicity is helping him to play the victim card which then yields even more loyal supporters.

This case while CSW technically lost it, hasn't yielded the other parties anything since there isn't anything of significance to pay out. CSW got his much needed dose of publicity, the rest got nothing but hot air. Nice.

[bryant.coleman]

{snip}

Scammers and getting scammed is an unfortunate part of capitalism. If all investments were enforced as 100% safe, there would be none on offer. It's always a risk, and judging the risk vs the potential reward is your responsibility and yours alone. I didn't buy any scammy ICO's, because I invested in the knowledge that led me to deduce that they are mostly scams.

You can't call those users who sold BSV at that time period as scammers. After the hard-fork happened, everyone who had previously owned Bitcoin received an equivalent amount of BSV in their wallets. In my case also, I received the coins in my Blockchain.com wallet. I wasn't sure about what to do with those coins. But when Blockchain.com announced that they are ending support for BSV, I had no choice other than selling those coins at whatever prices I could manage.

[Carlton Banks]

Scammers and getting scammed is an unfortunate part of capitalism. If all investments were enforced as 100% safe, there would be none on offer. It's always a risk, and judging the risk vs the potential reward is your responsibility and yours alone. I didn't buy any scammy ICO's, because I invested in the knowledge that led me to deduce that they are mostly scams.

You can't call those users who sold BSV at that time period as scammers.

i didn't

A few months back, he pulled off a major scam with his shitcoin BSV and was able to accumulate hundreds of millions of USD in funds.

i was referring to you saying this about Wright


what has that got to do with you wanting Wright to be punished for anything, whether it's just or not, and whether or not people he deceived are compensated for their loss? It's "nothing", isn't it?

[TheIrishman]

Australian who says he invented bitcoin ordered to hand over up to $5bn

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/aug/28/australian-who-says-he-invented-bitcoin-ordered-to-hand-over-up-to-5bn

<< US court orders Craig Wright to share cryptocurrency haul with the estate of American programmer David Kleiman. >>

[bryant.coleman]

{snip}

what has that got to do with you wanting Wright to be punished for anything, whether it's just or not, and whether or not people he deceived are compensated for their loss? It's "nothing", isn't it?

All I am saying is that Wright needs to be punished. I don't care on which charges he is being punished. I agree with you, when you say that those who lost their money in the BSV scam many not receive any compensation from this judgement. And even worse, the amount is likely to go to the family of another scammer, Dave Kleiman.

My points are the following:

1. Wright tried to fool people by claiming that he is Satoshi
2. He made profits from BSV scam by triggering a pump-and-dump cycle
3. He harassed those who questioned his claim to be Satoshi, by filing lawsuits against them
4. In general, he tried to ruin the reputation of Bitcoin
5. He tried to steal someone else's invention, by filing a patent suite

I am saying that he needs to be punished for the above points. However, there are legal loopholes out there which protect Wright against these charges.