{Beware}: Google accused of giving personal data to advertisers

[Baofeng]

https://twitter.com/johnnyryan/status/1169341785241530369

Johnny Ryan the Chief policy officer of Brave Browser, and he accuses Google of:

Mr Ryan found that Google had labelled him with an identifying tracker that it fed to third-party companies that logged on to a hidden web page. The page showed no content but had a unique address that linked it to Mr Ryan’s browsing activity.

Using the tracker from Google, which is based on the user’s location and time of browsing, companies could match their profiles of Mr Ryan and his web-browsing behaviour with profiles from other companies, to target him with ads.

Mr Ryan found six separate pages pushing out his identifier after a single hour of looking at websites on Google’s Chrome browser. The identifier contained the phrase “google_push” and was sent to at least eight adtech companies.

“This practice is hidden in two ways: the most basic way is that Google creates a page that the user never sees, it’s blank, has no content, but allows ... third parties to snoop on the user and the user is none the wiser,” said Mr Ryan. “I had no idea this was happening. If I consulted my browser log, I wouldn’t have had an idea either.”

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/technology/google-accused-of-secretly-feeding-personal-data-to-advertisers-1.4007629

I'm pretty sure that we all suspected Google of doing this for many years, but this could be one of the first that a solid evidence is going to be presented to authorities. If we could somewhat stay away from the Big G then I suggest we do find ways to stop using it in my opinion.

[akram143]

We all knows that google is a company run with the funds collected from these kind of things because they are giving everything for us free and getting our personal data as the cost for it.We may change the browser but still many people going to use google as their search engine so I don't think for the normal human to stay away from using google products anymore.

[Pmalek]

Use Firefox or Brave Browser or even TOR. The new 69.0 version of Firefox comes with a built-in option to block tracking cookies.
Google is making money selling your online activity to anyone willing to pay for it.

[mk4]

In other news.. water is wet.

Bloody good investigation by Johnny Ryan though. Not only did he fire shots at Google, along with it, it's also a great low-key promotion for Brave browser.

If anyone's interested more on the accusation, I grabbed a screenshot from the cover of Financial Times.

Source: https://twitter.com/FinancialTimes/status/1169337945523937282

[rosezionjohn]

Should we expect a senate inquiry similar to what happened with Facebook? Google and die hard supporters will try to shrug this off but I hope this really blows up.

[mk4]

Should we expect a senate inquiry similar to what happened with Facebook? Google and die hard supporters will try to shrug this off but I hope this really blows up.

While Google already had one senate hearing last year[1], I sure damn hope that they get questioned and pressured a lot more. The privacy issues with Facebook and Google needs a lot more publicity. I just wish that DuckDuckGo and Gmail alternatives like Protonmail and Tutanota would step their game up. Gmail is still miles ahead of the privacy-focused email clients in terms of UI and UX.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nSHiHO6QJI

[o_e_l_e_o]

This story should really come as no surprise to anyone who has been paying the least bit of attention at any point in the last 10 years.

You are a product. User data is one of the most valuable resources in today's world. Google isn't a search engine or an email provider. Facebook isn't a social network. These companies are data harvesters and sellers. The services you use are just the front they use to harvester your data. You are their product, not their customer. Their customers are the tech giants, ad companies, governments, three letter agencies, etc., who are buying your data.

I just wish that DuckDuckGo and Gmail alternatives like Protonmail and Tutanota would step their game up. Gmail is still miles ahead of the privacy-focused email clients in terms of UI and UX.

It's all down to money. Google and Facebook look slick because they can afford to spend on development after making billions selling data. Privacy respecting companies have cut off their most lucrative income stream, and largely survive on donations or the few users who buy their premium services.

[bitmover]

I just wish that DuckDuckGo and Gmail alternatives like Protonmail and Tutanota would step their game up. Gmail is still miles ahead of the privacy-focused email clients in terms of UI and UX.

I don't agree with this on proton mail.
I am a proton mail user for years, and their service is better than Google mail. Gmail ads are becoming annoying to me, also

They are now going to launch their calendar. When that calendar is done, and if it is good and easy to use (with some automatic update like trips ) there will be no reason to keep using gmail., Imo.

The only problem is that their service is expensive. Very expensive.

Additionally, their UI is amazing, their Android app is nice and clean.

Proton mail also allows you to use an email like bitmover@pm.me for free, which is very cool.

About duckduckgo, unfortunately, it is a shitty search engine. Can't find anything there.
Maybe some customization is necessary in a search engine, such as location based results... I don't know why, but ddg is useless to me.

[mk4]

It's all down to money. Google and Facebook look slick because they can afford to spend on development after making billions selling data. Privacy respecting companies have cut off their most lucrative income stream, and largely survive on donations or the few users who buy their premium services.

Pretty much, and it's really unfortunate. It won't be impossible for these privacy-respecting service to beat Google, but it will surely be very difficult.

I don't agree with this on proton mail.
I am a proton mail user for years, and their service is better than Google mail. Gmail ads are becoming annoying to me, also

I'm also a Protonmail user for a while now. The UI/UX in itself is fine, but the hassle comes in if you control multiple email accounts(not aliases). You'd have to manually log out and login on Protonmail to switch emails, whereas in Google and Tutanota you can easily switch between accounts. This might be a limitation due to Protonmail's better security though; but I'm not sure.

[o_e_l_e_o]

We were just talking about alternative, privacy respecting search engines in another thread here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5181677.msg52370654#msg52370654. If you don't like DDG, then try checking out startpage.com and Searx.me. Startpage is simple to just visit and go. Searx offers a lot of customization options, including the possibility to set it up to just search Google on your behalf, if you want.

The UI/UX in itself is fine, but the hassle comes in if you control multiple email accounts(not aliases).

Why not use different browsers for different accounts? Or you could use containers (such as this add on from Mozilla: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/multi-account-containers/) to log in to all your emails simultaneously.
You could even set up multiple Firefox profiles for different accounts.

[Indamuck]

This is common sense to me, every big company is selling their user data.  Don't ever assume that what you do on the internet with any company will ever be private.  And even if you delete things like your facebook profile, you better believe that is still permanently stored on their database.

[Kakmakr]

There are recently a lot of incidents where large companies, like Google and Facebook are being challenged for exploiting people's online data. (The latest one, was underage kids data that was used by Facebook) https://www.unionleader.com/news/business/google-to-pay-million-to-settle-charges-it-violated-kids/article_9ade55be-59b0-5335-a4ca-fc8d480607f4.html and also https://nakedsecurity.sophos.com/2019/09/04/youtube-reportedly-to-be-fined-up-to-200m-over-coppa-investigation/

I hope people will appreciate what Johnny Ryan from the Brave Browser did by testing out their browser as a viable alternative. We need a lot more competition against the giants of this industry. 

[mk4]

Using different browsers and using containers could work, but I used to handle more than a dozen emails. And now that I'm mainly using Brave now, for the privacy features and for webdev stuff, these are not options right now. The easiest and the best(in my opinion at least) is still Gmail's and Tutanota's email switcher. It's just far more handy and convenient.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Using different browsers and using containers could work, but I used to handle more than a dozen emails. And now that I'm mainly using Brave now, for the privacy features and for webdev stuff, these are not options right now.

A quick search found a Chromium add on called SessionBox, which seems to do the same thing as container tabs in Firefox. I can't vouch for it personally as I've never used it, but might fulfil your needs.

Certainly on Firefox, a dozen accounts is no problem. Each container profile you set up will have its own sessions, own saved username and passwords, own cookies, and so forth. Once set up, changing accounts could be done in 2 clicks - right click on Protonmail bookmark, and choose which container (and therefore which already logged in account) to load.

[tbct_mt2]

In other news.. water is wet.

Bloody good investigation by Johnny Ryan though. Not only did he fire shots at Google, along with it, it's also a great low-key promotion for Brave browser.

If anyone's interested more on the accusation, I grabbed a screenshot from the cover of Financial Times.

Source: https://twitter.com/FinancialTimes/status/1169337945523937282

We have been all warned that Google Chrome browser and G-products are risky, because there is assumption that Google has shady intention to sell their users' data to companies that pay acceptable price. Whatever it is FUD or real discovery, it is important to look at it as another higher-leveled warning on risks of G-products, including Google Chrome. Two years ago, I watched a video on Ted channel that what we use on Internet collected and connected to give overview on who we are, what we do, which we prefer, all of them are potential risks for our privacy and security.

[bitmover]

I'm also a Protonmail user for a while now. The UI/UX in itself is fine, but the hassle comes in if you control multiple email accounts(not aliases). You'd have to manually log out and login on Protonmail to switch emails, whereas in Google and Tutanota you can easily switch between accounts. This might be a limitation due to Protonmail's better security though; but I'm not sure.

I have this problem as well.
But I believe they are trying to encourage us to buy the paid version, so we can create multiple emails in the same account..

I have many email accounts as well, and this is a problem. But maybe with the paid version this problem would not exist (I never tried the paid version so I don't know)

Why not use different browsers for different accounts? Or you could use containers (such as this add on from Mozilla: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/multi-account-containers/) to log in to all your emails simultaneously.
You could even set up multiple Firefox profiles for different accounts.

This would not work.
Proton mail has an auto log out feature that cannot be turned off.so after a few minutes of inactivity or if you close the tab, you are automatically logged off.

This is for our security so I doubt it will ever change...

[bitmover]

Then how do they make money without violate user's privacy (such as scan user's email, sell user's data and use advertising-model)?

There is a problem with online advertisement, which I do not pretend to solve in this post,but charging fees for an email service or surviving through donations are not the answer.

I looked again the rates of proton mail, and I believe they are reasonable, it's not expensive. 48 eur per year... It is not insignificant, but I can pay for that.
However, how many users are willing to pay? Probably people are supporting them for ideology, but for how long can they survive?

Maybe proton mail could add some advertisement without reading our emails. Maybe we could answer a few questions and get some discount at the fees, to receive a more customizable advertisement experience?

I don't know, but reading people's emails is not interesting and charging the user is also problematic.

BAT has a proposal to solve that problem of online advertisement, where you earn tokens while watching ads, and them you could donate those tokens to services you like. It is an interesting approach to a real problem.

There is also one additional problem. We are paying to download the ads that Google /Facebook make money with. Tell also make money with our data. All of that in exchange for their service. It is a very good business to them, this will probably change in the future, I guess.

[hatshepsut93]

The only problem is that their service is expensive. Very expensive.

Why not use their free tier then? In terms of privacy it's just as good as their paid plans.

Use Firefox or Brave Browser or even TOR. The new 69.0 version of Firefox comes with a built-in option to block tracking cookies.
Google is making money selling your online activity to anyone willing to pay for it.

Google still can track you if you log in into their accounts, like Gmail or Youtube, and they and other companies like Facebook or Reddit can share some data about their users with each other. I've noticed it myself that sometimes Youtube starts recommending videos about something that I've just read on reddit. And I use Firefox with some adblock, noscript and a few other addons.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Proton mail has an auto log out feature that cannot be turned off.so after a few minutes of inactivity or if you close the tab, you are automatically logged off.

Ahh, I didn't know that. Well at the very least, each container could open to a log in page with the credentials for that particular container already filled in, so it would only be one additional click (on the login button) to switch accounts.

Why not use their free tier then? In terms of privacy it's just as good as their paid plans.

I think the point he is making is that most users will use their free tier, and only a handful will pay for their premium service, which doesn't give them much revenue to continue to operate or work on new developments or improvements.

Google still can track you if you log in into their accounts, like Gmail or Youtube, and they and other companies like Facebook or Reddit can share some data about their users with each other. I've noticed it myself that sometimes Youtube starts recommending videos about something that I've just read on reddit. And I use Firefox with some adblock, noscript and a few other addons.

If you log in to a Google account, Facebook account, etc., then they are tracking everything you do online regardless of what browser you are using. You should consider at the very least using container tabs to isolate various sites - one tab for social media, one tab for all your google accounts, one tab for crypto, etc. A better option would be to use an entirely separate browser for Facebook/Google/Youtube, and another browser for everything else. An even better option is to not have a Facebook or Google account at all.

[Lucius]

Privacy has become a very expensive commodity, at a time when everyone is collecting all the possible information about every internet user. Some do it for profit only, but it should not be forgotten that all security agencies are spying internet users in ways that are largely unknown to us today.

Browsers are something that everyone uses, and therefore it is no surprise that a large company as Google have Chrome as one of their money machines. Using Chrome, YouTube or Gmail is free, but all users pays with their data, this is totally clear.

The best alternative is to use Linux as OS, and some browser such Firefox, but even then it is not 100% that someone is not spying you. It is not only about software or OS, but also about hardware we use, and this is not something what the average user can easily discover.