I'm buying a hardware wallet

[h0pens]

I have a bitcoin armary wallet with some bitcoins and coins from the forks (cash and gold). Is it possible to take that private key and import it in a trezor (or any other wallet)?  
In other case is it possible to send it to a trezor T? (I read something about wallets that doesn't support old keys that starts with 1 or 3..)

I was thinking of getting a model T and a model ONE as a backup. Is it only to take the backup seed and restore it in the model ONE? But model ONE doesn't support everything that model T does, will that work?

I was looking at ledger and trezor but I did like trezor a bit more. The key different that made me chose trezor was that it felt more secure, with an open firmwire. The big negative thing that I think is that it's mutch more expensive. Is there any other disadvances that I should think of before buy a it compared with other hardware wallets?

[Rath_]

Is it possible to take that private key and import it in a trezor (or any other wallet)?  

Hardware wallets do not support importing private keys due to security concerns. You should be able to import it in other software wallets. You can send your coins without any problems to the Trezor T once you buy it.

I was thinking of getting a model T and a model ONE as a backup. Is it only to take the backup seed and restore it in the model ONE? But model ONE doesn't support everything that model T does, will that work?

You can restore the wallet using the seed in every wallet which supports BIP39. You can restore the seed generated by Trezor T on Trezor One and vice-versa. You can also use Electrum if you lose both wallets.

Is there any other disadvances that I should think of before buy a it compared with other hardware wallets?

You should take a look at this vulnerability. You can mitigate it by using a long passphrase. Unlike Ledger, Trezor does not generate native SegWit addresses (the ones starting with bc1) in the official web interface. You will have to pair your wallet with Electrum to use them. Ledger is mostly focused on adding altcoins while Trezor has just implemented Shamir Backup. Please note that it's only supported by Trezor T. Trezor has a much better implementation of multisig than Ledger (you will see all inputs and outputs properly).

I have both Trezor One and Trezor T so I can answer any of your questions.

[HCP]

I have a bitcoin armary wallet with some bitcoins and coins from the forks (cash and gold). Is it possible to take that private key and import it in a trezor (or any other wallet)? 

Best practice would be not to import those private keys... but to sweep them, so that the coins get sent from your old keys/addresses to keys/addresses generated by the Trezor itself.

I'm not actually aware of any hardware wallets that allow you to import private keys. It would defeat the purpose of the hardware wallet using externally generated keys.

[Lucius]

The big negative thing that I think is that it's mutch more expensive. Is there any other disadvances that I should think of before buy a it compared with other hardware wallets?

If you're not in a hurry to buy hardware wallet, and you want to save some money, then you can wait for Black Friday (29 November) when both major manufacturers are likely to offer discounts as was the case in previous years.

BitCryptex has already mentioned some advantages and disadvantages to you when it comes to Trezor&Ledger, so you can decide which one is better for you. As for the price, it is on Ledger side, Nano X is €120, and Trezor T €149. For price of one Trezor T you can get Ledger backup pack (Nano X+Nano S).

[bitmover]

Trezor has a much better implementation of multisig than Ledger (you will see all inputs and outputs properly).

I think ledger live, although it is a nice software for newbies, it has its limitations.
I don't think those limitations are problematic, because if someone knows what is an input or output he will certainly be using Electrum and will ignore ledger live completely.

So, it's not trezor that has a better implementation of multisig, but trezor official software (which I doubt is better than Electrum anyway).

I think advanced users will just ignore trezor/ledger software and stick with Electrum anyway.

This trezor vulnerability is not a problem imo... The worst about trezor imo is the price, which is higher and it support less coins . I would definitely chose ledger over trezor because of that, but that's not a great issue and both are very reliable hardware wallet.

[Rath_]

So, it's not trezor that has a better implementation of multisig, but trezor official software (which I doubt is better than Electrum anyway).

No, the official Trezor web interface does not support multisig. Every hardware wallet handles multisig differently even when paired with Electrum. Ledger does not verify change outputs and does not display the fees for multisignature transactions. Also, it looks like Trezor is the only hardware wallet which verifies if the receiving address actually belongs to the multisig wallet and shows it on its screen. I am not sure about that last thing, though.

[h0pens]

Is there any other disadvances that I should think of before buy a it compared with other hardware wallets?

You should take a look at this vulnerability. You can mitigate it by using a long passphrase. Unlike Ledger, Trezor does not generate native SegWit addresses (the ones starting with bc1) in the official web interface. You will have to pair your wallet with Electrum to use them. Ledger is mostly focused on adding altcoins while Trezor has just implemented Shamir Backup. Please note that it's only supported by Trezor T. Trezor has a much better implementation of multisig than Ledger (you will see all inputs and outputs properly).

I have both Trezor One and Trezor T so I can answer any of your questions.

In case that I want to use "shamir-backup" it it then useless to buy a model one as a backup unit? Or is it possible to genereate a "normal seed" and restore it in model one and use "shamir-backup" as well? Is it possible to restore it to any wallet with "shamir-backup" (beside trezor T)? In other case it whont be any good to use "shamir-backup" if I doen't have a model one as a backup unit?

Each password in trezor is a new wallet with a new private key? But the good thing with the seed is that it restore all of my wallets? However I still need to know the passwords?
I'm not useing my coins so I don't really need segWit. But it's allways nice to have the possibility to do it since it's so expensive (or it was?) to send.

The big negative thing that I think is that it's mutch more expensive. Is there any other disadvances that I should think of before buy a it compared with other hardware wallets?

If you're not in a hurry to buy hardware wallet, and you want to save some money, then you can wait for Black Friday (29 November) when both major manufacturers are likely to offer discounts as was the case in previous years.

I will probably buy one earlier then november, thanks anyway.


Perhaps I started this tread wrong. The thing is that I want a hardware wallet, it's not needed to be trezor.. I'm a hodler and I doesn't need any good UI to manage my coins in any way. What I want is security (not more then any one else does). But what I read about model One that I liked was that it was no dangoures to use it on a computer with malmware, another thing was that I didn't like with ledger was that it isn't totaly open sourced with the firmware as trezor is. I don't think that it's any big concern (because the wallet is so popular) but those were my main reason to choose trezor (and it's always nice to have a led screen).

[Rath_]

In case that I want to use "shamir-backup" it it then useless to buy a model one as a backup unit? Or is it possible to genereate a "normal seed" and restore it in model one and use "shamir-backup" as well?

It would be useless for now. Trezor T is the only hardware wallet which supports Shamir Backup. I couldn't find any information if and when it is going to become available on Trezor One.

Is it possible to restore it to any wallet with "shamir-backup" (beside trezor T)? In other case it whont be any good to use "shamir-backup" if I doen't have a model one as a backup unit?

I don't think if there is any software supporting SLIP-0039, yet. Unfortunately, you will have to buy another Trezor T to access your coins if you decide to use Shamir Backup and lose your wallet. More wallets should start supporting it in the following months. If you decide to use a standard seed then most wallets will allow you to import your seed without any problems.

Each password in trezor is a new wallet with a new private key? But the good thing with the seed is that it restore all of my wallets? However I still need to know the passwords?

What do you mean by a password? A passphrase? Every time you enter a different passphrase, you get a different wallet. You will have to know the seed and the passphrase to access your coins in case you lost your wallet. Trezor does not store passphrases so they need to be entered after the PIN. You can learn more about passphrases here.

I'm not useing my coins so I don't really need segWit. But it's allways nice to have the possibility to do it since it's so expensive (or it was?) to send.

You should at least consider using nested SegWit (addresses starting with 3). Both of these wallets and all services support it. You will save a little on fees in the future. Fees have been low for a long time now.

[Lucius]

Perhaps I started this tread wrong. The thing is that I want a hardware wallet, it's not needed to be trezor.. I'm a hodler and I doesn't need any good UI to manage my coins in any way. What I want is security (not more then any one else does). But what I read about model One that I liked was that it was no dangoures to use it on a computer with malmware, another thing was that I didn't like with ledger was that it isn't totaly open sourced with the firmware as trezor is. I don't think that it's any big concern (because the wallet is so popular) but those were my main reason to choose trezor (and it's always nice to have a led screen).

We all want best security for our coins, but there is no such thing as 100% security, hardware wallets so far have proven to be a very safe way for storing crypto, but there is no guarantee that this will always be the case. Every hardware wallet, especially Trezor&Ledger are safe for use even on infected device, as long as the user is checking all information on hardware wallet display. The main danger is in malware which can change your sending / receiving address, but since you need to check is address match on UI and hardware wallet, it is easy to prevent such attack.

If you think Trezor is better choice go for it, you can always try Ledger in future. Maybe you can also consider to move your coins completely offline to paper wallet (be very careful if you ever do this), since you say "I'm a hodler".

[h0pens]

Each password in trezor is a new wallet with a new private key? But the good thing with the seed is that it restore all of my wallets? However I still need to know the passwords?

What do you mean by a password? A passphrase? Every time you enter a different passphrase, you get a different wallet. You will have to know the seed and the passphrase to access your coins in case you lost your wallet. Trezor does not store passphrases so they need to be entered after the PIN. You can learn more about passphrases here.

In case I need to restore it on electrum and I have a second wallet with passphrase. Is it then easy in electrum to get access of my wallets with passphrases?

I'm not useing my coins so I don't really need segWit. But it's allways nice to have the possibility to do it since it's so expensive (or it was?) to send.

You should at least consider using nested SegWit (addresses starting with 3). Both of these wallets and all services support it. You will save a little on fees in the future. Fees have been low for a long time now.

Ok I'll sure do that!

Is it possible to have 2 wallets without any passphrases? And how do you guys solve the problem if you die and your family find the seed and they need to know the passphrase(s) to access your funds? Do you store that in a different location?

Only so I understod this correctly...
If I have the device I need the pin to get into it. Inside I need my passphrases to get access to my wallets? If I buy another trezor I can use the same recovery seed to get access to the wallets with the same passphrases? and the pin on the first device isn't included in the revovery seed and it isn't needed here?
If I or anyone else only have the recovery seed then they need to know the passphrases do get access to the wallets, and that is possible to restore in electrum (or another wallet supporting BIP39)?

If you think Trezor is better choice go for it, you can always try Ledger in future. Maybe you can also consider to move your coins completely offline to paper wallet (be very careful if you ever do this), since you say "I'm a hodler".

I don't understand, what is the difference if I have paper wallets and say "I'm a hodler" compared to if I have hardware wallets and say "I'm a hodler"?

[Rath_]

In case I need to restore it on electrum and I have a second wallet with passphrase. Is it then easy in electrum to get access of my wallets with passphrases?

Yes, it will be easy. During seed recovery, you will have to select 'Extend this seed with custom words' and enter it as an additional word. You will have to create separate wallets for each passphrase in Electrum.

Is it possible to have 2 wallets without any passphrases?

No, but you can have multiple accounts within one wallet. Addresses aren't linked between accounts. You won't have to worry about remembering multiple passphrases.

If I have the device I need the pin to get into it. Inside I need my passphrases to get access to my wallets? If I buy another trezor I can use the same recovery seed to get access to the wallets with the same passphrases? and the pin on the first device isn't included in the revovery seed and it isn't needed here?

You won't need the PIN for recovery. It is used to unlock the device. After unlocking the device, you should be prompted to enter the passphrase as long as you enable this feature. If the PIN is entered incorrectly mutliple times, the device wipes itself. You will be able to recover your wallet on another Trezor using your recovery seed and the passphrase.

If I or anyone else only have the recovery seed then they need to know the passphrases do get access to the wallets, and that is possible to restore in electrum (or another wallet supporting BIP39)?

Without your passphrase, nobody will be able to access your coins even if they have your recovery seed. That's the whole point of using them.

I don't understand, what is the difference if I have paper wallets and say "I'm a hodler" compared to if I have hardware wallets and say "I'm a hodler"?

It means that you are not going to access your coins very often. Lucius suggested that a paper wallet might be a good alternative for you. Hardware wallets are designed to be used even on infected devices.

[DireWolfM14]

Is it possible to have 2 wallets without any passphrases?

No.  Like BitCryptex said, you can have multiple accounts without a passphrase, Trezor allows you up to 10 accounts per wallet, each account can generate a nearly limitless number of addresses.  If you use Electrum you can set the derivation paths which allows up to a million accounts.

And how do you guys solve the problem if you die and your family find the seed and they need to know the passphrase(s) to access your funds? Do you store that in a different location?

I keep all my backup information in one place; I keep paper backups in a fire-resistant envelope, which is stored in a fire-resistant steel safe.  My family will have access to the safe upon my demise.  I store the seed extensions (passphrases) along with the seeds, on the same piece of paper.  I'm not concerned about the security of the seeds, the only people who will ever have access to them are my kids, and I trust them.  

If I didn't want my kids to have access to the safe until I die, I could set up two or more trusts with a part of the safe's combination in each trust.  That way no one entity will have access to all information needed, but the kids will get it all once I kick the bucket.

I don't understand, what is the difference if I have paper wallets and say "I'm a hodler" compared to if I have hardware wallets and say "I'm a hodler"?

You can still be a "hodler" and own both.  A paper wallet is less practical for spending, so it's often considered the most affordable and practical way to hodl.  A hardware wallet is a very practical way to safely store coins, but still have easy access to spend them.

I have no paper wallets per se, but I do have a "cold wallet" backed-up by an extended seed I generated using Electrum on an air-gapped machine.  The seed is backed-up but doesn't exist on any electronic device, not even the air-gapped machine I used to create it.  I have the master public key (xpub) in a watch-only wallet, so I can easily check the wallet and pick out addresses to which I can send more coins.

[Pmalek]

...if you die and your family find the seed and they need to know the passphrase(s) to access your funds? Do you store that in a different location?

Prepare your family in advance for such an event especially if it's a significant amount we are talking about. If you are planning to leave your assets to your partner, parents, brother/sister teach them the basics of what they need to do to access the funds and tell them about this forum. In case something bad happens to you tell them there are users here who are ready to help but also tell them there are scammers waiting and prying for the slightest mistake. They should be careful no to disclose any private information like the seed but not paranoid not to ask questions and give the basic information.

You can store the passphrase together with your seed but I wouldn't advice you do that. If someone were to steal your seed they would also know your passphrase. Better store it elsewhere but those who inherit your assets should also know about the password.   

[h0pens]

I couldn't find anything about this in trezors Ordering and shipping FAQ.. How does the package look like? Can the postman see that it is from trezor?

[h0pens]

By the way, is it possible to play around with the model T before setting up my real wallet? As long as I don't enter the pin incorrectly to many times...

[Rath_]

I couldn't find anything about this in trezors Ordering and shipping FAQ.. How does the package look like? Can the postman see that it is from trezor?

The label on the shipping package will obviously state that it was sent from the TREZOR HQ. Trezor One box has two seals while Trezor T should have one on its USB-C port. Both devices should come without any firmware installed. You should be prompted to download it from the official Trezor website. Here you can see how the holograms should look like.

[h0pens]

I couldn't find anything about this in trezors Ordering and shipping FAQ.. How does the package look like? Can the postman see that it is from trezor?

The label on the shipping package will obviously state that it was sent from the TREZOR HQ. Trezor One box has two seals while Trezor T should have one on its USB-C port. Both devices should come without any firmware installed. You should be prompted to download it from the official Trezor website. Here you can see how the holograms should look like.

Ok the label is one thing but the main package with the trezor should be in another package? Have you all made an order to your home? It's like saying that you wil have some coins at home..

[Rath_]

Ok the label is one thing but the main package with the trezor should be in another package? Have you all made an order to your home? It's like saying that you wil have some coins at home..

They won't obviously stick the label on the box. It will be properly packed so that no one will know what is inside without opening it. I ordered it to my home because I had no other choice. You can always use a passphrase for your savings and use the default wallet as a dummy one with small amount of coins.

[DireWolfM14]

By the way, is it possible to play around with the model T before setting up my real wallet? As long as I don't enter the pin incorrectly to many times...

Yes.  You can keep resetting it to factory defaults, and the next time you initiate the Trezor it'll generate a fresh seed phrase.  You can do this as often as you like.  Use a piece of scratch paper to keep writing down the seeds while you're playing with it.

[Rath_]

Use a piece of scratch paper to keep writing down the seeds while you're playing with it.

There is no need to do that. Trezor does not force users to back up the seed right after initializing the device. A large warning is shown in the web interface if it's not backed up. Once the backup is created, it is no longer possible to display the seed. One can still run a test-recovery, though. Here's more information.