While people stare at Trumps Ukraine comments, Biden is let off the hook.

[TwitchySeal]

Do you think it's fair to say that Yanukovych was more interested in keeping Russia happy while he was president of Ukraine?

I do.  And the same probably goes for Shoken. 

Probably < a pile of other evidence. Furthermore the two ideas are not exclusive.

Do you think it's fair to say that Yanukovych was more interested in keeping Russia happy while he was president of Ukraine?

[TECSHARE]

Do you think it's fair to say that Yanukovych was more interested in keeping Russia happy while he was president of Ukraine?

I do.  And the same probably goes for Shoken. 

Probably < a pile of other evidence. Furthermore the two ideas are not exclusive.

Do you think it's fair to say that Yanukovych was more interested in keeping Russia happy while he was president of Ukraine?

I would say that it is besides the point and does not exclude other corruption. For there to be competing criminal cartels is more the norm than not. After all, his testimony is by far not the only evidence against Biden.

[TwitchySeal]

Do you think it's fair to say that Yanukovych was more interested in keeping Russia happy while he was president of Ukraine?

I do.  And the same probably goes for Shoken.  

Probably < a pile of other evidence. Furthermore the two ideas are not exclusive.

Do you think it's fair to say that Yanukovych was more interested in keeping Russia happy while he was president of Ukraine?

I would say that it is besides the point and does not exclude other corruption. For there to be competing criminal cartels is more the norm than not. After all, his testimony is by far not the only evidence against Biden.

I'm not suggesting it would make other corruption ok.

Literally just trying to figure out if you think Yanukovych was working for Russia or Ukraine. (while he was the president of Ukraine)

[TECSHARE]

I would say that it is besides the point and does not exclude other corruption. For there to be competing criminal cartels is more the norm than not. After all, his testimony is by far not the only evidence against Biden.

I'm not suggesting it would make other corruption ok.

Literally just trying to figure out if you think Yanukovych was working for Russia or Ukraine. (while he was the president of Ukraine)

Considering the close historical relationship between the two nations, and that Crimea contains Russia's only strategically critical warm water harbor, I wouldn't be surprised. Again though this is just an attempt at whataboutism to create false equivalency between the two factions and distract from the exposure of the corruption that is the topic at hand. Cue your what about Russia conspiracy theory here.

[TwitchySeal]

I would say that it is besides the point and does not exclude other corruption. For there to be competing criminal cartels is more the norm than not. After all, his testimony is by far not the only evidence against Biden.

I'm not suggesting it would make other corruption ok.

Literally just trying to figure out if you think Yanukovych was working for Russia or Ukraine. (while he was the president of Ukraine)

Considering the close historical relationship between the two nations, and that Crimea contains Russia's only strategically critical warm water harbor, I wouldn't be surprised. Again though this is just an attempt at whataboutism to create false equivalency between the two factions and distract from the exposure of the corruption that is the topic at hand. Cue your what about Russia conspiracy theory here.

I really am trying to approach this whole Ukraine thing as objectively as possible.  9 days ago I didn't know much about what Ukraine has been going through for the past 10 years.  Then I fell off a latter and found myself with a lot more time to read than I'm used to.

I think Ukraine is a great example of today's Democracy vs Authoritarian fight.  

America and our Allies are trying to liberate Ukraine and protect them from Russia taking over.  You seem to be sympathizing more with Russia.

[TECSHARE]

I really am trying to approach this whole Ukraine thing as objectively as possible.  9 days ago I didn't know much about what Ukraine has been going through for the past 10 years.  Then I fell off a latter and found myself with a lot more time to read than I'm used to.

I think Ukraine is a great example of today's Democracy vs Authoritarian fight.  

America and our Allies are trying to liberate Ukraine and protect them from Russia taking over.  You seem to be sympathizing more with Russia.

As expected, "but muh Russian collusion!"

The dems are just desperate to turn this back into more Trump/Russia narrative so they can distract from the crater that will be the democrat party after this info comes out to the general public. Unlike you, I have been watching this situation develop as it happened over the past 10 years and longer. You stroll in at the last minute, regurgitate some owned corporate media talking points, and pretend you are informed. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but you don't know shit.

[TwitchySeal]

The dems are just desperate to turn this back into more Trump/Russia narrative so they can distract from the crater that will be the democrat party after this info comes out to the general public.

What info?

You've already said there's tons of evidence.  But...of what? 

I'm not trying to attack or troll you.  The Hunter Biden $50k/month thing def looks like  there's prob something shady going on there...but, what is it?

[TECSHARE]

The dems are just desperate to turn this back into more Trump/Russia narrative so they can distract from the crater that will be the democrat party after this info comes out to the general public.

What info?

You've already said there's tons of evidence.  But...of what? 

I'm not trying to attack or troll you.  The Hunter Biden $50k/month thing def looks like  there's prob something shady going on there...but, what is it?

No, you are just trying really hard to confirm your bias. See the other related thread here.

[TwitchySeal]

The dems are just desperate to turn this back into more Trump/Russia narrative so they can distract from the crater that will be the democrat party after this info comes out to the general public.

What info?

You've already said there's tons of evidence.  But...of what?  

I'm not trying to attack or troll you.  The Hunter Biden $50k/month thing def looks like  there's prob something shady going on there...but, what is it?

No, you are just trying really hard to confirm your bias. See the other related thread here.

Are there any theories on what specifically Joe Biden was so worried about the Ukranian government finding out about his son?  Or even general?  Like, was it just about making money?  Or political?  

[TECSHARE]

The dems are just desperate to turn this back into more Trump/Russia narrative so they can distract from the crater that will be the democrat party after this info comes out to the general public.

What info?

You've already said there's tons of evidence.  But...of what?  

I'm not trying to attack or troll you.  The Hunter Biden $50k/month thing def looks like  there's prob something shady going on there...but, what is it?

No, you are just trying really hard to confirm your bias. See the other related thread here.

Are there any theories on what specifically Joe Biden was so worried about the Ukranian government finding out about his son?  Or even general?  Like, was it just about making money?  Or political?  

Burisma Holdings seems pretty obviously corrupt. Hunter Biden's level of involvement is unknown, but what is evident is he was hired in compensation for his father pressuring the Ukrainian government to pull the lead investigator going after Burisma Holdings, who coincidentally planned to also investigate his son. I would say all three apply to some degree. Please read the other thread, I would rather not repeat myself.

[Spendulus]

Also -- the prosecutor had been forced out because of his investigation??? Isn't that what we're all saying here.

Yes, that's what you're all saying here because this is an echo chamber outside of my opinion. I'm glad you at least framed it as a question, because that's what it is: a question. We don't know the answer. Of course its easy to assume that's the case if you don't like Biden.

I do agree with you about the "conflict of interest" part. As I've said before I don't know what Hunter Biden was doing there other than using his last name to make big bucks. I'm not going to say Biden's conversation was "perfect" when he bragged about having the prosecutor fired. Perhaps that will become its own investigation, if its not already. However, I don't see him being destroyed over this. If he slips in the polls, perhaps it will just be a better entrance for my man Bernie, so I actually wouldn't mind it. I just don't see that happening, however. I think there's a 90% chance he'll still be the dem nominee.

Here's where I have a problem with the Biden thing and the accusatory, retaliatory Trump attack.

Just think for a moment about the underworld of diplomacy. Many things going on there between the world's secret agencies, frantkly a lot of it for the good. Biden worked for Obama, and there was stuff going on with the Ukraine, and in the middle of it, Hunter sits on a board and gets payments. We know the public side of the story, but we don't know what was under the table.

Reality may have been very, very different than the appearances. So we should given Biden the benefit of the doubt, because of these real world factors.

And that applies 120% to Trump, also.

Wait - No it doesn't !!! Not according to the Dems !!!

Really?

[Waradlain]

The dems are just desperate to turn this back into more Trump/Russia narrative so they can distract from the crater that will be the democrat party after this info comes out to the general public.

What info?

You've already said there's tons of evidence.  But...of what?  

I'm not trying to attack or troll you.  The Hunter Biden $50k/month thing def looks like  there's prob something shady going on there...but, what is it?

No, you are just trying really hard to confirm your bias. See the other related thread here.

Are there any theories on what specifically Joe Biden was so worried about the Ukranian government finding out about his son?  Or even general?  Like, was it just about making money?  Or political?  

Heres my guess: Ukraine is one of the most corrupt countries in this Universe. When it comes to working in a large company, especially if its connected with the state there is always a reason to start worry, because you can dig up a lot of interesting things (if/when needed).

But Im more concerned about your double spaces at the beginning of sentences. Dare explani?

[Spendulus]

.....

But Im more concerned about your double spaces at the beginning of sentences. Dare explani?

If it is a constant double space, then don't worry. No secret messages are contained therein.

I would look very closely at the patterns of one who seemed to randomly vary single and double spaces at the beginnings of sentences, of course.



Just kidding...

[Waradlain]

Trump told Theresa May he doubted Russia was behind Skripal poisoning

Guys we need a doctor here. I mean srsly an old man gone wild.

[TECSHARE]

Trump told Theresa May he doubted Russia was behind Skripal poisoning

Guys we need a doctor here. I mean srsly an old man gone wild.

Anyone who believes that Russia was responsible for the Skripal attack is retarded, for several reasons. If he had information dangerous enough worth killing him over, they would have done it before he left Russia. Furthermore he had a trip planned to visit Russia shortly before the incident. Why the fuck would they attack him on UK soil and create a very public international incident when they could have just waited a week and quietly do it on their own turf? None of this narrative makes any sense, except to people who watch too many movies. This is not how intelligence agencies and assassinations work.

Attention is the opposite of what these people want, and if they get attention it is to serve a purpose. What effect did the large amount of attention generated by this incident have? Cui bono? Finally, if you know anything about Novichok, you would know if it was that, he would be dead 100%, along with first responders and bystanders. Once again, what narrative did this attack serve? It certainly didn't serve Russia.

[TwitchySeal]

If he had information dangerous enough worth killing him over, they would have done it before he left Russia.

Russia traded 3 spies (including him) for 10 spies from the UK.  This could be a reason not to kill him.

Furthermore he had a trip planned to visit Russia shortly before the incident. Why the fuck would they attack him on UK soil and create a very public international incident when they could have just waited a week and quietly do it on their own turf?

I hadn't read that, do you have a link?
Maybe there was something he was planning on doing before coming to Russia that they didn't want him to do?

What effect did the large amount of attention generated by this incident have? Cui bono?

The main reason it blew up is the guys they sent from Russia didn't kill him and got caught.

Finally, if you know anything about Novichok, you would know if it was that, he would be dead 100%, along with first responders and bystanders.

A reported case of accidental exposure of a Russian physicist to Novichok in 1987 described the following events:

He staggered out of the room, his vision seared by brilliant colors and hallucinations. He collapsed, and the KGB took him to a hospital.

By the time he arrived his breathing was labored. In another hour, his heart would have stopped. His entire nervous system was gradually ceasing to function.

The physicist was lucky. The hospital he was taken to, the Sklifosovsky Institute, includes the nation’s top center for poison treatment.

There, Dr. Yevgeny Vedernikov saved his life.

But the scientist was at the edge of death, unaware of his surroundings, for 10 days. He couldn’t walk for six months. He was dogged by depression and an inability to concentrate. He found it difficult even to read. To this day his arms are still weak, and he has never been able to return to work.

Although he survived, the gas left him with permanent disabilities.

[TECSHARE]

If he had information dangerous enough worth killing him over, they would have done it before he left Russia.

Russia traded 3 spies (including him) for 10 spies from the UK.  This could be a reason not to kill him.

Furthermore he had a trip planned to visit Russia shortly before the incident. Why the fuck would they attack him on UK soil and create a very public international incident when they could have just waited a week and quietly do it on their own turf?

I hadn't read that, do you have a link?
Maybe there was something he was planning on doing before coming to Russia that they didn't want him to do?

What effect did the large amount of attention generated by this incident have? Cui bono?

He was a Russian spy that turned on his own country.  He only had to spend a couple years in prison before the spy swap.  After the spy swap he was known to meet with intelligence officials in other countries, likely sharing his knowledge.  Perhaps the message was meant as a warning for those who might follow in his footsteps.  Even if you are traded in a spy swap and living in a safe, western country, you will still have plenty to worry about.  Also, he wouldn't be able to teach other people how things worked in Russia anymore.

Finally, if you know anything about Novichok, you would know if it was that, he would be dead 100%, along with first responders and bystanders.

A reported case of accidental exposure of a Russian physicist to Novichok in 1987 described the following events:

He staggered out of the room, his vision seared by brilliant colors and hallucinations. He collapsed, and the KGB took him to a hospital.

By the time he arrived his breathing was labored. In another hour, his heart would have stopped. His entire nervous system was gradually ceasing to function.

The physicist was lucky. The hospital he was taken to, the Sklifosovsky Institute, includes the nation’s top center for poison treatment.

There, Dr. Yevgeny Vedernikov saved his life.

But the scientist was at the edge of death, unaware of his surroundings, for 10 days. He couldn’t walk for six months. He was dogged by depression and an inability to concentrate. He found it difficult even to read. To this day his arms are still weak, and he has never been able to return to work.

Although he survived, the gas left him with permanent disabilities.

If he had information worth killing him over, he would never have been traded. Even assuming he did, how does it make sense to let him wander around the UK for years before killing him, giving him plenty of time to spill the beans? Why not kill him in Russia? Why use a rare neurotoxin almost exclusively used by Russia forming an obvious link? This is what investigators call "an orgy of evidence" and is indicative of a frame up.

Do you really believe spies don't know governments are willing to kill them? That premise is retarded and more based on TV and movies than reality. Spies enter into their line of work knowing full well they are at risk of assassination or execution, meaning killing him to "send a message" is completely asinine. The key word in your scientist's exposure example is "accidental". None of this narrative adds up, except to people that think they are Ethan Hunt.

There are however clear motives for the UK to attack Skripal, and make it look like the Russians did it.

"At the time when Pablo Miller was recruiting spies for Great Britain, Christopher Steele was the head of MI6 in Moscow.  After returning to London and retiring in 2009, Christopher Steele founded private intelligence corporation "Orbis Business Intelligence."  Allegedly, Pablo Miller, a former recruiter, curator, and now one of Skripal's friends and neighbors, got a job at Orbis.

Therefore, when Christopher Steele received an order for fabrication of the "dossier" on Trump, the fate of an unsuspecting and innocent Skripal was sealed."

https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2019/03/the_trump_dossier_and_the_poisoning_of_sergei_skripal.html

As we now know, the FISA warrant which was used to start the Trump Russia collusion investigation was completely based on the fabricated dossier created by Steele. Given their relationship, this is a glaringly obvious motive to attack him and frame it as a Russian attack. Using this method, they not only get to cover up embarrassing fabricated evidence from one of their own spies, but have a damned good excuse to ratchet up Russian sanctions.

Related: https://qz.com/1224822/a-linkedin-bio-reportedly-connects-sergei-skripal-donald-trump-and-christopher-steele/

[TwitchySeal]

If he had information worth killing him over, he would never have been traded. Even assuming he did, how does it make sense to let him wander around the UK for years before killing him, giving him plenty of time to spill the beans? Why not kill him in Russia? Do you really believe spies don't  know governments are willing to kill them? That premise is retarded and more based on TV and movies than reality.

After the spy swap he was known to meet with intelligence officials in other countries.  He may not have known any big secrets that could damage Russia, but a former Russian spy willing to share all he knows would be valuable to any country. 

Do you really believe spies don't  know governments are willing to kill them? That premise is retarded and more based on TV and movies than reality.

No, I'm sure they know that.  Both in real life and the movies.

[TECSHARE]

If he had information worth killing him over, he would never have been traded. Even assuming he did, how does it make sense to let him wander around the UK for years before killing him, giving him plenty of time to spill the beans? Why not kill him in Russia? Do you really believe spies don't  know governments are willing to kill them? That premise is retarded and more based on TV and movies than reality.

After the spy swap he was known to meet with intelligence officials in other countries.  He may not have known any big secrets that could damage Russia, but a former Russian spy willing to share all he knows would be valuable to any country.  

Do you really believe spies don't  know governments are willing to kill them? That premise is retarded and more based on TV and movies than reality.

No, I'm sure they know that.  Both in real life and the movies.

Your reasoning doesn't follow any logic. Either he has information that is dangerous to Russia and is worth killing, or not. If they know their lives are at stake, "sending a message" is not a valid or logical motive.

Video of Russia sending a message to any defecting spies.

[TwitchySeal]

If he had information worth killing him over, he would never have been traded. Even assuming he did, how does it make sense to let him wander around the UK for years before killing him, giving him plenty of time to spill the beans? Why not kill him in Russia? Do you really believe spies don't  know governments are willing to kill them? That premise is retarded and more based on TV and movies than reality.

After the spy swap he was known to meet with intelligence officials in other countries.  He may not have known any big secrets that could damage Russia, but a former Russian spy willing to share all he knows would be valuable to any country.  

Do you really believe spies don't  know governments are willing to kill them? That premise is retarded and more based on TV and movies than reality.

No, I'm sure they know that.  Both in real life and the movies.

Your reasoning doesn't follow any logic. Either he has information that is dangerous to Russia and is worth killing, or not. If they know their lives are at stake, "sending a message" is not a valid or logical motive.

Obviously I don't know what actually happened.  All we can do is speculate based on what we know.

You could absolutely be correct about Russia not being involved, although I think it's more likely that you're wrong - especially after seeing that blog you posted.  Geez.