[2019-10-29] Lebanon’s Economic Crisis Highlights Bitcoin’s Limitations

[Carlton Banks]

For a moment I thought I made a boo-boo but it seems that the so-called black rate is between 1580 and 1600 so although indeed a bit devalued it 's nothing that would be regarded as collapsed Venezuela style.
And browsing through the news it seems that they are committed to trying to keep this rate, although I'm not so sure it's the best idea.

well, what can the Lebanese treasury ministry/central bank possibly do to maintain a manipulated official rate in a barely functional controlled market if the free-market rate is falling in a functioning free-market? It's never been possible to control anywhere else this has happened, and so I agree with you, they would be wiser to abandon the peg in the calmest possible way

[Carlton Banks]

I wonder what news headlines we'll see next? Barter is better option than Bitcoin for Lebanese? Bitcoin is useless on Lebanon?

• ECONOMIC COLLAPSE: OUR NEW POLL SHOWS EATING NEIGHBORS CURES HUNGER FASTER THAN BITCOIN
• SHOCK LATEST: FIRETORCH KEEPS WOLVES FROM DOOR BETTER THAN CRYPTOCOINS
• SCIENTISTS SAY BUCKETS HOLD MORE RAIN WATER THAN BITCOIN DOES

[bbc.reporter]

It is alright to highlight bitcoin's limits because of a country's infrastructural problems.

I don't think it's alright.

It's like saying that Bitcoin is limited because you don't have electricity or an internet connection to transact. It only highlights the limitations of your local electricity provider's network and your ISP.

However, this criticism if coming from a belief that bitcoin is supposed to be the savior of the world is a mistake.

That's something you can blame news outlets for. Even if Bitcoin could be the savior of the world as you state it, then it's still up to the people to make the best of it. From what I have seen, people are not capable of seeing the value of Bitcoin and therefore they will not help themselves or their environment.

Only a few have enough sense in them to buy into Bitcoin before things in their country escalate for the worse.

Agreed. Also many people expected bitcoin to be an untraceable and anonymous cryptocoin for buying drugs. Many were disappointed that was why cryptonote was developed.

[Getmon]

I can feel that there is really a big potential for Bitcoin in Lebanon, it is just that there are factors that are beyond control.

There is really a big potential for Bitcoin not just in Lebanon but everywhere. The very big problem is that these potentials are far from reality because what they need are more than just an alternative mode of payment, much less than a digital one. What they need are the basics. In times of war and calamities, especially in countries such as Lebanon, people are not looking for advance technologies, not even money sometimes because there is nothing to buy. They are looking for the most basic of needs such as food, water, shelter, and clothing. Why is Bitcoin suddenly pushed forward as a sort of a solution?

[Saint-loup]

It is alright to highlight bitcoin's limits because of a country's infrastructural problems.

I don't think it's alright.

It's like saying that Bitcoin is limited because you don't have electricity or an internet connection to transact. It only highlights the limitations of your local electricity provider's network and your ISP.

Moreover you don't need internet to use bitcoin, and you only need very few electricity to use a smartphone or an old mobile phone. That's enough to use Bitcoin. And it's not difficult to generate enough electricity to load a smart/mobile phone.

[1Referee]

Also many people expected bitcoin to be an untraceable and anonymous cryptocoin for buying drugs. Many were disappointed that was why cryptonote was developed.

People expect a lot but know very little. Bitcoin is very transparent by nature, and there is always a trail to follow. That by default means it's not anonymous at all.

Moreover you don't need internet to use bitcoin, and you only need very few electricity to use a smartphone or an old mobile phone. That's enough to use Bitcoin. And it's not difficult to generate enough electricity to load a smart/mobile phone.

It would help if you also explain why people don't need internet to use Bitcoin.

In order to not need internet to use Bitcoin, it requires you to purchase additional hardware such as a Gotenna mesh device for example. I however doubt that most common joes getting started with Bitcoin know about these, or the satellites that Blockstream has running.

[Saint-loup]

It would help if you also explain why people don't need internet to use Bitcoin.

In order to not need internet to use Bitcoin, it requires you to purchase additional hardware such as a Gotenna mesh device for example. I however doubt that most common joes getting started with Bitcoin know about these, or the satellites that Blockstream has running.

You don't need those costly equipments. You've never given a key to someone else with funds on it? You don't need internet to give a paper wallet, an opendime  key, a tangem card to someone... Moreover gotenna mesh is only useful to reach a relay to broadcast a transaction when you are in the middle of nowhere, but if a 2G network is available you can simply send your signed raw tx by SMS to someone who's able to broadcast it. You can also sending it by fax if no mobile network is available, or by post mail...
It also exists hosted wallets controllable by sms commands.

[bbc.reporter]

Also many people expected bitcoin to be an untraceable and anonymous cryptocoin for buying drugs. Many were disappointed that was why cryptonote was developed.

People expect a lot but know very little. Bitcoin is very transparent by nature, and there is always a trail to follow. That by default means it's not anonymous at all.

That is because the people believed in those news articles about bitcoin as an untraceable and anonymous coin to use for the darkweb. The clickbait victims. I was one of those people hehehe.

You also said that you did not agree to highlight bitcoins limits because of infrastructural problems. You might be right, however, it highlights the importance and the indispensibility of paper money and commodity money.

[rodel caling]

Nope bitcoin is nothing limitations we know that only the government want to gives limits using bitcoin Bitcoin become they scared if bitcoin replace fiat money the corrupt official they can't control the digtal currency.
I believe until the have an electricity and have an internet access to mine bitcoin nobidy can stop bitcoin and there's nothing limitations. And we use bitcoin stored in the phone use for mode of  payment.

[veleten]

uhm.... another clickbait article with bitcoin in the title?
banks shuttering and a single relatively unknown car dealer that started to accept bitcoin doesn't mean that the crisis is in any shape or form connected to bitcoin
ah and the local trader's telegram group members increased from 150 to 300 , how could I have forgotten about this revolutionary event
Lebanese who are not able to send money abroad will not take extra steps to buy bitcoins and then send them abroad , especially if they never heard or dealt with bitcoins before
this article looks like the author's wishful thinking rather than news to me

[1Referee]

You don't need those costly equipments. You've never given a key to someone else with funds on it? You don't need internet to give a paper wallet, an opendime  key, a tangem card to someone...

Still, how do you get the common joes to know about them? The general train of thought is that you can't use Bitcoin without internet. Dealing with physical cash is what people in these parts of the world know to transact offline because that's what they have been doing all the time. No additional learning curve required to chew through.

You also said that you did not agree to highlight bitcoins limits because of infrastructural problems. You might be right, however, it highlights the importance and the indispensibility of paper money and commodity money.

Agreed. I'm not a fan at all of fiat, but I like what paper money is and how it can be used to circumvent various degrees of government surveillance, and the fact that it can be exchanged locally in the most peer to peer possible way. This is also why we have seen various governments already put everything to work in order to get people to adopt digital money.

[stompix]

You don't need those costly equipments. You've never given a key to someone else with funds on it?

Have you ever received a key that was supposed to have funds on it and paid for it without checking?
You're telling me that in a country on the brink of failure with no internet access you're going to deal with private keys based only on trust?
Seriously, let's be real here.

If I would have ever done this kind of deal the first thing would be to empty the address that belongs to that key, send the funds to a secure address wait for confirmation and only then pay the guy.

In order to not need internet to use Bitcoin, it requires you to purchase additional hardware such as a Gotenna mesh device for example. I however doubt that most common joes getting started with Bitcoin know about these, or the satellites that Blockstream has running.

I think that gotenna will not able to ship a hundred thousand of those in a country with no internet and communications down, nor that the people there would be willing to spend 200$ on those. You would have far worse things to worry that sending bitcoins at that point.

[Saint-loup]

You don't need those costly equipments. You've never given a key to someone else with funds on it?

Have you ever received a key that was supposed to have funds on it and paid for it without checking?
You're telling me that in a country on the brink of failure with no internet access you're going to deal with private keys based only on trust?
Seriously, let's be real here.

If I would have ever done this kind of deal the first thing would be to empty the address that belongs to that key, send the funds to a secure address wait for confirmation and only then pay the guy.

Only dishonest people will do that, and it's exactly the same thing when you do or give something to someone for a delayed payment. Your client could never pay you. It's also the same thing when you receive a cheque.

[YOSHIE]

I do not think bad of the development of Cryptocurrency or Bitcoin so far in Lebanon.
Annoying factor always happens in every corrupt country that triggers Lebanon's economic collapse today,
I am sure for the year 2020, with the resignation of the Lebanese PM, for the Reform of the economic crisis that has hit Lebanon will improve.
With the current elite government system pushing Bitcoin and the economy in Lebanon to the point of collapse.
Bitcoin for now is still very much needed by the Lebanese people to boost the economy that is currently devastated. Lebanon needs Bitcoin going forward.