Trump Impeachment Public Hearings [serious discussion]

[JollyGood]

Trump will face trial, that much is certain even if he has hired a show case of legal talent to represent him and for them to try to have the charges dismissed at the preliminary stage.

About what happens next, it is a tough one to call. Most of what any judgement will be based upon what can and cannot be admitted as evidence in a Court of law. I think it will be prudent to wait until a later date when things become clearer about the proceedings before I could comment further.

[habibruis]

At this time it is the most attractive news in the world. History says nothing will happen to him. I think Trump will get rid of the impeachment.

[mrquackquack]

Which has a higher rate of success? Craig Wright and having the keys to the 1.1 million + bitcoins or Donald Trump getting impeached?

[TwitchySeal]

Which has a higher rate of success? Craig Wright and having the keys to the 1.1 million + bitcoins or Donald Trump getting impeached?

Trump has already been impeached.

If you mean removed from office, I'd say there's a slightly higher chance of that happening than Craig Wright proving he's satoshi.

[Spendulus]

Which has a higher rate of success? Craig Wright and having the keys to the 1.1 million + bitcoins or Donald Trump getting impeached?

Trump has already been impeached.

If you mean removed from office, I'd say there's a slightly higher chance of that happening than Craig Wright proving he's satoshi.

There is a 100% certainty that Trump will be removed from office.

At the end of his 2nd term.

There's a slightly higher probability than the Craig Wright claim that at that time, the Democrats will have an improved clown show.

[TwitchySeal]

Which has a higher rate of success? Craig Wright and having the keys to the 1.1 million + bitcoins or Donald Trump getting impeached?

Trump has already been impeached.

If you mean removed from office, I'd say there's a slightly higher chance of that happening than Craig Wright proving he's satoshi.

There is a 100% certainty that Trump will be removed from office.

At the end of his 2nd term.

There's a slightly higher probability than the Craig Wright claim that at that time, the Democrats will have an improved clown show.

If he makes it to the end of his second term, and someone he despises (any democrat) wins in 2024, I wouldn't put it past him to play the 'nope that election was rigged, I'm not going anywhere' card, which would be so ugly.

I def put being Trump being convicted and removed (or he knows it's coming and resigns),  and Craig Write being vindicated both  in the 0.01 -1% range though.

[JollyGood]

Which has a higher rate of success? Craig Wright and having the keys to the 1.1 million + bitcoins or Donald Trump getting impeached?

Trump has already been impeached.

If you mean removed from office, I'd say there's a slightly higher chance of that happening than Craig Wright proving he's satoshi.

 

There is still a chance Trump could be removed from office, let us see how this drama plays out.

Maybe the US legal system will say to Trump: You're Fired!

[Viper1]

The chance of him getting thrown out of office is pretty damn slim. But, it all comes down to the public and what they do which is another reason McConnell wants to rush this through. He knows the longer it drags out, the more chance more and more of the public will want him out. Watched a video last night and at the end the guy put up phone numbers of some senators for people to call and demand witnesses. Some of the people were calling their senators. The more this drags out, the more of that will happen.

What I think will be more entertaining is once Trump is out of office. I suspect the knives of the republicans will finally come out and he will also end up in court for a hole host of things and he will no longer be "protected". It's going to make for some fantastic "entertainment".

[TwitchySeal]

The chance of him getting thrown out of office is pretty damn slim. But, it all comes down to the public and what they do which is another reason McConnell wants to rush this through. He knows the longer it drags out, the more chance more and more of the public will want him out. Watched a video last night and at the end the guy put up phone numbers of some senators for people to call and demand witnesses. Some of the people were calling their senators. The more this drags out, the more of that will happen.

The can only think of 2 scenarios where they vote to remove Trump, both are very unlikely but not impossible.

A - The life long conservatives who have been horrified by his behavior but remain quiet because he could destroy their career get together and just blind side him without telling Mitch or anyone.  Classic reality television strategy - don't let whoever you're planning on blind siding them so they don't have a chance to throw a tantrum and maybe convince one person to vote differently.

B - They get some witnesses and documents, the trial drags on, Trump gets paranoid about what they're going to say and does something really really stupid like get recorded blackmailing Boltons wife or something.

What I think will be more entertaining is once Trump is out of office. I suspect the knives of the republicans will finally come out and he will also end up in court for a hole host of things and he will no longer be "protected". It's going to make for some fantastic "entertainment".

I think it's very likely there are sealed indictments with his name on them at the SDNY offices 'do not open until Trump is out of office'.  His lawyer is already in prison for crimes that Trump was obvious co-conspirator in, he had his fraud charity shut down in NY, and I'm gonna say they probably discovered multiple other illegal things he did before taking office and are just sitting on them.


The SNL cold open was pretty hilarious, I expect Trump to dedicate a few of his 100+ tweets tomorrow on it.

Alan Dershowitz Argues for Trump Cold Open - SNL

[Viper1]

and I'm gonna say they probably discovered multiple other illegal things he did before taking office and are just sitting on them.

No doubt. He had illegal dealings with Cuba but the statute of limitations ran out on that one but I have no doubt there's many more such things.

[TwitchySeal]

and I'm gonna say they probably discovered multiple other illegal things he did before taking office and are just sitting on them.

No doubt. He had illegal dealings with Cuba but the statute of limitations ran out on that one but I have no doubt there's many more such things.

Don't know much about the Cuba stuff. but If they discover evidence of a crime thats statute of limitations would pass while he could still be in office (most financial crimes, including tax related are 6 to 10 years I think), the sealed indictment freezes it.  Just gotta convince a grand jury.

[JollyGood]

I am inclined to agree with you. Right now there seems to be a belief that whether he is removed or not he will at some point face prosecution over whatever he was up to while he was in office. I am sure various business dealing and so-on will be scrutinised and he a case for beyond reasonable will be made. Once he is no longer in office (either by forceful removal, after losing the election bid for his second term or after completing a second term) I think the things might gain traction.

As for his removal in the coming months, though it is definitely possible is also highly improbable because of the politics about party lines.

The chance of him getting thrown out of office is pretty damn slim. But, it all comes down to the public and what they do which is another reason McConnell wants to rush this through. He knows the longer it drags out, the more chance more and more of the public will want him out. Watched a video last night and at the end the guy put up phone numbers of some senators for people to call and demand witnesses. Some of the people were calling their senators. The more this drags out, the more of that will happen.

What I think will be more entertaining is once Trump is out of office. I suspect the knives of the republicans will finally come out and he will also end up in court for a hole host of things and he will no longer be "protected". It's going to make for some fantastic "entertainment".

[TwitchySeal]

Latest Fox News Poll



Same poll for Clinton in 99







 

[dupeddonk]

those polls are telling.  it seems that anyone who can be swayed has been swayed to wanting trump removed immediately.  maybe 1 or 2% wiggle room at most.  the 42-44% that have approved of him since day one will remain loyal no matter what.

have the day off so I have a chance to watch a bunch of the trial live.  it just started.

right off the bat they are saying since ukraine said there was no pressure that somehow proves there was no pressure to investigate bidens and dnc.  i dont think thats very strong.  Ukraine is in a tough spot and needs help.  if there was pressure, it would be in best interest of Ukrain to deny it since contradicting Trump would piss him off and damage their relationship.  

this Bolton news is a big wrench in Trumps defense. it seems like they will probably call witnesses and this trial will go on for a couple weeks longer than they wanted including during state of the union next week.  im glad a true conservative finally found a backbone and decided to call out Trump for lying.  any real conservative has respect for Bolton.

[Spendulus]

and I'm gonna say they probably discovered multiple other illegal things he did before taking office and are just sitting on them.

No doubt. He had illegal dealings with Cuba but the statute of limitations ran out on that one but I have no doubt there's many more such things.

Don't know much about the Cuba stuff. but If they discover evidence of a crime thats statute of limitations would pass while he could still be in office (most financial crimes, including tax related are 6 to 10 years I think), the sealed indictment freezes it.  Just gotta convince a grand jury.

There would be consequences to your political zealots keeping going on this. Might want to think about that. So far your team has made a number of very wrong decisions, both politically, economically, and from the point of view of practicality.

Wise up. Best to wise up fast, in my opinion. It's not Trump you are going to anger, it's the American people.

those polls are telling.  it seems that anyone who can be swayed has been swayed to wanting trump removed immediately.  maybe 1 or 2% wiggle room at most.  the 42-44% that have approved of him since day one will remain loyal no matter what.

have the day off so I have a chance to watch a bunch of the trial live.  it just started.

right off the bat they are saying since ukraine said there was no pressure that somehow proves there was no pressure to investigate bidens and dnc.  i dont think thats very strong.  Ukraine is in a tough spot and needs help.  if there was pressure, it would be in best interest of Ukrain to deny....

Actually it is very strong. To trump such testimony you would need actual physical evidence, such as a series of emails proving the contrary. The reason for this is suppose you have an opposing witness that says Ukraine was pressured.

Then you've got a "he said-she said" situation.

In the Senate, each Senator votes their own conscious, but the suggestion from the past is "proof beyond a reasonable doubt" is the standard.

http://congressionalresearch.com/98-990/document.php

[TwitchySeal]

There would be consequences to your political zealots keeping going on this. Might want to think about that. So far your team has made a number of very wrong decisions, both politically, economically, and from the point of view of practicality.

Wise up. Best to wise up fast, in my opinion. It's not Trump you are going to anger, it's the American people.

I'm trying to keep this thread a place to have serious discussion on the impeachment and trial, please keep the 'my team' vs 'your team' stuff, and being disrespectful out of this thread.  If you don't think that's a reasonable request, just stop posting in this thread.

To trump such testimony you would need actual physical evidence, such as a series of emails proving the contrary. The reason for this is suppose you have an opposing witness that says Ukraine was pressured.

Then you've got a "he said-she said" situation.

If Bolton testifies, and he is lying, Pompeo or Mulvaney or Trump or someone else senior in the administration could take the stand and refute his testimony.  One of them would be risking prison time though and I think if someone credible was willing to take the stand and defend Trump, they would've been called already.

[JollyGood]

There would be consequences to your political zealots keeping going on this. Might want to think about that. So far your team has made a number of very wrong decisions, both politically, economically, and from the point of view of practicality.

Wise up. Best to wise up fast, in my opinion. It's not Trump you are going to anger, it's the American people.

I'm trying to keep this thread a place to have serious discussion on the impeachment and trial, please keep the 'my team' vs 'your team' stuff, and being disrespectful out of this thread.  If you don't think that's a reasonable request, just stop posting in this thread.

To trump such testimony you would need actual physical evidence, such as a series of emails proving the contrary. The reason for this is suppose you have an opposing witness that says Ukraine was pressured.

Then you've got a "he said-she said" situation.

If Bolton testifies, and he is lying, Pompeo or Mulvaney or Trump or someone else senior in the administration could take the stand and refute his testimony.  One of them would be risking prison time though and I think if someone credible was willing to take the stand and defend Trump, they would've been called already.

Who would have thought when Trump brought Bolton out from retirement that he would one day effectively call Trump a liar in his soon to be published book? This is a massive setback for Trump and his all-start legal defence team because Bolton will be called as a witness. The prosecutors would be guilty of dereliction of duty if they did not to subpoena him because he was part of the inner circle at the time.

It is all ifs and buts at the moment at least until the real drama in Court commences and to me it seems to look like the beginning of the end for the Trump presidency.

[Spendulus]

...

Who would have thought when Trump brought Bolton out from retirement that he would one day effectively call Trump a liar in his soon to be published book? This is a massive setback for Trump and his all-start legal defence team because Bolton will be called as a witness. The prosecutors would be guilty of dereliction of duty if they did not to subpoena him because he was part of the inner circle at the time.

It is all ifs and buts at the moment at least until the real drama in Court commences and to me it seems to look like the beginning of the end for the Trump presidency.

See WHO???

"Bolton's book manuscript clears Trump of all impeachment allegations by demonstrating that the President believed Ukraine interfered in US elections. Given that belief, right or wrong, pressuring Zelensky was completely within the job description of the presidency. "

https://twitter.com/ScottAdamsSays/status/1221799382896394245

[TwitchySeal]

...

Who would have thought when Trump brought Bolton out from retirement that he would one day effectively call Trump a liar in his soon to be published book? This is a massive setback for Trump and his all-start legal defence team because Bolton will be called as a witness. The prosecutors would be guilty of dereliction of duty if they did not to subpoena him because he was part of the inner circle at the time.

It is all ifs and buts at the moment at least until the real drama in Court commences and to me it seems to look like the beginning of the end for the Trump presidency.

See WHO???

"Bolton's book manuscript clears Trump of all impeachment allegations by demonstrating that the President believed Ukraine interfered in US elections. Given that belief, right or wrong, pressuring Zelensky was completely within the job description of the presidency. "

https://twitter.com/ScottAdamsSays/status/1221799382896394245

Did the creator of Dilbert get hold of the transcript? Hopefully Trump sees this tweet and tells the GOP Senators to vote to subpoena Bolton.


Whether it's damning for the Dems or Republicans, I am super interested to hear what he has to say after all these mixed signals.

This is whole thing is more intriguing than any movie I've ever seen.

[HammaSan]

The likelihood of Trump being deposed is very small. The US economy is growing and is likely to grow even more.