BitPay must be one of the worst wallets out there!

[Kprawn]

Today a friend of mine asked me to help him install Bitpay on his Windows computer. I thought it would be a breeze, but it was a sh1t show. You

are forced to create a Microsoft account and then when you want to download the App the real sh1t starts.    He has Windows 7 installed on his

computer and guess what, BitPay requires --> http://prntscr.com/pxwn63 (minimum requirement of Windows 10 version 14316.0 or higher)

Most sites require BitPay for the payments, but if people have to go through all this sh1t to setup a wallet, I do understand why they just give up on

Bitcoin and just use credit cards and PayPal. I would much rather pull a tooth without anesthetics.. than having to go through that again. BitPay

was designed to strip you of all your anonymity.  

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

And not to mention it takes ages to download and install though the Microsoft app manager (not sure about others but it took a long time for me). I really do not like this Bitpay thing but in such service you really need them to use like hosting with namecheap. I have used them several times and always unhappy.

[Kprawn]

Sites should just post a Bitcoin address and then you deposit bitcoin into that address with a small message showing who you are on their service.

So let's say you subscribe for something, then you just create the account, say account name -- WhomBat and then send the bitcoins and then

mention your account name in the transfer. They can then verify your payment against the account name and be done with it. Nobody will know

anything about you and you can just use another address for the next payment. 

[DaveF]

Today a friend of mine asked me to help him install Bitpay on his Windows computer. I thought it would be a breeze, but it was a sh1t show. You

are forced to create a Microsoft account and then when you want to download the App the real sh1t starts.    He has Windows 7 installed on his

computer and guess what, BitPay requires --> http://prntscr.com/pxwn63 (minimum requirement of Windows 10 version 14316.0 or higher)

Most sites require BitPay for the payments, but if people have to go through all this sh1t to setup a wallet, I do understand why they just give up on

Bitcoin and just use credit cards and PayPal. I would much rather pull a tooth without anesthetics.. than having to go through that again. BitPay

was designed to strip you of all your anonymity.  

1) I just downloaded it w/o setting up a Microsoft account. They try to pressure you into it, but you can just keep clicking no.
2) Windows 7 is EOL as of January, you should not be using it for financial transactions. A lot of places are starting to block it now (90+ days out)
3) Since you are saying require bitpay for payments do you mean BIP70 payment protocol? If so there are other desktop wallets that you can use.

https://support.bitpay.com/hc/en-us/articles/115005701523-Which-wallets-work-for-a-BitPay-payment-Which-wallets-are-compatible-

-Dave

[HCP]

Most sites require BitPay for the payments, but if people have to go through all this sh1t to setup a wallet, I do understand why they just give up on

You don't have to use the Bitpay wallet to be able to make Bitpay payments... they have tried to obfuscate things with forcing the BIP70 payment protocol... but you have the option of using other BIP70 compatible wallets as mentioned above... or you can use this decoder: https://decoder.bip70.org/

In amongst a bunch of other data, it'll show you the address and amounts etc and you can just make the payment manually... just like the good ol' days before Bitpay tried to force BIP70 on everyone.

And not to mention it takes ages to download and install though the Microsoft app manager (not sure about others but it took a long time for me).

Probably related to this:

Approximate size
370.07 MB

[Kprawn]

Most sites require BitPay for the payments, but if people have to go through all this sh1t to setup a wallet, I do understand why they just give up on

You don't have to use the Bitpay wallet to be able to make Bitpay payments... they have tried to obfuscate things with forcing the BIP70 payment protocol... but you have the option of using other BIP70 compatible wallets as mentioned above... or you can use this decoder: https://decoder.bip70.org/

In amongst a bunch of other data, it'll show you the address and amounts etc and you can just make the payment manually... just like the good ol' days before Bitpay tried to force BIP70 on everyone.

And not to mention it takes ages to download and install though the Microsoft app manager (not sure about others but it took a long time for me).

Probably related to this:

Approximate size
370.07 MB

You can make the payment directly to that address, but their internal ledger system generates some kind of code or invoice that gives you proof

that you made the payment and it also validates your payment and then activate your subscription after you did the payment via their service.

So how do you make that direct payment and then trigger the whole validation thing to activate your subscription or have proof that the payment

was done? (I think most of them use this system, because it leaves a paper trail for auditing and tax purposes) 

[OROBTC]

Most sites require BitPay for the payments, but if people have to go through all this sh1t to setup a wallet, I do understand why they just give up on

You don't have to use the Bitpay wallet to be able to make Bitpay payments... they have tried to obfuscate things with forcing the BIP70 payment protocol... but you have the option of using other BIP70 compatible wallets as mentioned above... or you can use this decoder: https://decoder.bip70.org/

In amongst a bunch of other data, it'll show you the address and amounts etc and you can just make the payment manually... just like the good ol' days before Bitpay tried to force BIP70 on everyone.

And not to mention it takes ages to download and install though the Microsoft app manager (not sure about others but it took a long time for me).

Probably related to this:

Approximate size
370.07 MB

I use BitPay on my iPad, and it works OK (I have used BitPay for a couple of purchases) and was also easy to install.  Yes, they do try to lock you into their system, thanks HCP for showing a workaround.


EDIT: More BitPay comments found here:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5173083.40

[The Sceptical Chymist]

You don't have to use the Bitpay wallet to be able to make Bitpay payments

Yeah, I didn't think so because for the few purchases I've made with bitcoin BitPay was the payment processor and I didn't have to download their wallet. 

But there was one time I actually was required to use it, and I downloaded the BitPay wallet for Android--this was some months ago and I don't remember what it was for.  I do recall that the wallet sucked and that I wouldn't be using it in order to make a payment in the future.

And that was probably the last time I ever spent bitcoin on anything.  Since BitPay was never my primary wallet on my smartphone, I didn't see any good reason why I should have to use it to pay for anything.  That would require me to transfer bitcoin to it, which would incur unnecessary costs and I found that to be completely stupid.

[DaveF]

And that was probably the last time I ever spent bitcoin on anything. 

Hoarder :-)

Seriously, the only thing I really use the bitpay wallet for is loading their Visa card.
I admit turning BTC into plastic is not always a good thing. But if the merchant does not take BTC, and they are not in one of the categories that has 2x or 3x points on another one of my cards then I sometimes use that card.

-Dave

[The Sceptical Chymist]

Hoarder :-)

Ha ha ha!  Hey man, we all have different views on what bitcoin means to us, right?  I have to tell you that every freakin' time I've gotten rid of my bitcoin I've regretted it.  I'm no old school bitcoin guy by any means, but I've been into it long enough to remember when it was going for less than $200 and I wish I still had all of that bitcoin I'd bought below $1k.  

I don't own enough bitcoin to really be considered a hoarder, but I'm definitely not a big spender of it.  

Seriously, the only thing I really use the bitpay wallet for is loading their Visa card.

Huh.  I didn't even know they had a bitcoin debit card.  That's actually interesting and I thank you for mentioning it, even though I wouldn't be interested in having one myself.  I thought no one had figured out how to get Visa/MC to cooperate with using bitcoin to load funds onto a card.  Guess that's not the case.

Edit:

Bitpay isn't a wallet.

It isn't just a wallet, but this thread is basically about the BitPay wallet that they offer--not their payment processing system in general, which I've used quite a few times but their wallet only once.

[mindrust]

Bitpay isn't a wallet. They may provide some walleting features but their main operation is being a payment processor and they even suck at it sadly. Use something opensource like electrum or something similar instead of that malware. (No need to mention bitpay's main investors are Roger Ver and Jihan Wu which are enemies of bitcoin.)

[DaveF]

Huh.  I didn't even know they had a bitcoin debit card.  That's actually interesting and I thank you for mentioning it, even though I wouldn't be interested in having one myself.  I thought no one had figured out how to get Visa/MC to cooperate with using bitcoin to load funds onto a card.  Guess that's not the case.

Only US based but it's a re-loadable Visa that works quite well.
Can also get cash from an ATM.

Bitpay isn't a wallet. They may provide some walleting features but their main operation is being a payment processor and they even suck at it sadly. Use something opensource like electrum or something similar instead of that malware. (No need to mention bitpay's main investors are Roger Ver and Jihan Wu which are enemies of bitcoin.)

That's not 100% fair. It is a wallet. There are many better ones out there (and some worse) but to say it's not a wallet is pushing it.
BitPay the COMPANY is not a wallet it is as you say a payment processor 1st and foremost and a for profit company. This is why they do a lot of things the way they do.

You don't have to like the fact, but it does work for them (for now) and for many other people (for now).

And for those of us who are US based it is one of the lower fee ways to convert BTC to cash.

-Dave

[HCP]

You can make the payment directly to that address, but their internal ledger system generates some kind of code or invoice that gives you proof that you made the payment and it also validates your payment and then activate your subscription after you did the payment via their service.

So how do you make that direct payment and then trigger the whole validation thing to activate your subscription or have proof that the payment was done? (I think most of them use this system, because it leaves a paper trail for auditing and tax purposes)  

It is all triggered simply by THAT address receiving THAT many satoshi's. It has nothing to do with any special magical code or invoice... If I took that payment URL and put it into Electrum (or Bitcoin Core or any other BIP70 compatible wallet) it would still work... all they do is exactly what that website does, connects to the URL and retrieves the appropriate info (ie. what address to send to? how much to send?)

Basically, their "internal system" simply creates a unique deposit address for you to send a specific amount to (and starts a 15 minute timer)... if it detects a transaction is broadcast that pays (at least) that amount to the address within that 15 minutes, then it will become "pending". Once the transaction is actually confirmed on the blockchain (I think it's only a minimum of 1 confirmations... might be 3? ), then it's marked as "paid" and the merchant receives a confirmation from BitPay that the invoice has been paid and to do whatever they need to do (send goods, activate subscription etc).

If you need "proof" that you sent the payment... well, that's what the blockchain is for... the payment is there for all to see. I think that it's handy to decode the BitPay invoice yourself anyway, then you can see the InvoiceID's and MerchantID's, addresses and amounts etc... so you have a record of those too!



Also, Why is your post formatting all weird? With extra line breaks etc? Are you doing that on purpose?

[DaveF]

It is all triggered simply by THAT address receiving THAT many satoshi's. It has nothing to do with any special magical code or invoice... If I took that payment URL and put it into Electrum (or Bitcoin Core or any other BIP70 compatible wallet) it would still work... all they do is exactly what that website does, connects to the URL and retrieves the appropriate info (ie. what address to send to? how much to send?)

IIRC (and I could be 100% wrong on this)
It also sets the fee amount, and does not allow RBF.

What I do know:
It also allows what is somewhat useful to the merchant is that it allows for the merchant to identify some things about the invoice.

I don't like it. But I also don't think it's as bad as some people make it out to be. Kind of a necessary evil for now due to the fact that people still send 1sat fees even when the network is saturated and then bitch that it didn't clear before the end of the business day so their laptop didn't ship.

-Dave