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Author Topic: The $700m Ponzi: BitClub Network and Roger Ver. ROGER RESPONDS.  (Read 285 times)
tmfp
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December 11, 2019, 06:38:49 PM
Last edit: December 14, 2019, 12:52:52 AM by tmfp
Merited by suchmoon (7), Foxpup (4), nutildah (2), marlboroza (2), stompix (1), kotwica666 (1), tvplus006 (1), IconFirm (1)
 #1

Bitclub Network started in 2014 and this week five of their core team were arrested for wire and securities fraud.
Bitclub Network was a Ponzi scheme from the start.
They are scammers in the purest form; they created a "bitcoin mining project", sold shares in it and took the profit and investors' funds thru a Multi Level Marketing pyramid with them, the "founders", at the top.
They falsified data to appear to be profitable and made derisory payments to the "idiots" and "sheep" (as they termed their investors) from new investors' money.
Anyone who looked closely at their scheme could see this. The fact that it lasted for five years is due to a number of factors, including naive investors FOMO'd in by hi pressure salesmen, the increase in the value of Bitcoin and the lack of any oversight of crypto investment schemes.
But Bitclub Network didn't exist in a bubble. Apart from the MLM salesmen who treated crypto as the "next big thing" to mis-sell, there were a number of relationships within the growing crypto space itself, without whose complicity this fraud could not have grown to the extent that it did.
Bitclub made name dropping a marketing tool: they continually referenced BitFury, Bitmain, Genesis Mining and Roger Ver, amongst others, to position themselves as part of the "legit" Bitcoin establishment in the eyes of their newbie investors.
Let's look at the BitClub Network's relationship with Roger Ver.

TIMELINE

February 2016.

The MLM business is full of sociopathic frauds. They lie convincingly and remorselessly. They invent, evade and dissemble.
One such animal is J. Ryan Conley, a hi profile BitClub recruiter in the early days.
He tweeted



A common MLM scammer ploy, credibility by association with established figures.... "My homie Roger Ver"
Roger, not surprisingly, took exception to this and tweeted back

 

Which is perfectly reasonable.
Roger isn't unintelligent, he knew how competitive mining was and understood that a project with a hugely expensive, parasitical compensation structure would be unsustainable.
He makes that frostily clear on the CryptoShow @ 45 minutes. (Listen to Weeks' babble as much as you want to as well.)

Fast forward a year, to March 2017.
A lot has happened.
The bull run has really started and the schism between Roger and the BTC establishment is obvious. (This is a big subject, big blocks etc., and not that relevant to this thread in minutaie. Here's a contentious primer if you want one.)

Out of the blue, comes an extraordinarily humiliating (for Roger) You Tube video released by BitClub on March 26.



Why would Roger do that? Recant a perfectly reasonable opinion in such a bizarre way? They even make him read it out, like some naughty kid in school being punished!
There's a big difference between a favorable first impression of a project then subsequent cynicism, and initial logical cynicism being publically withdrawn. The latter would surely require pretty concrete proof, but we now know that there's no chance of Bitclub being able to show anyone they were legit, because it was all lies anyway.
I repeat
Why would Roger do that?

Fast forward a month, to April 26, 2017 and a BitClub affiliate video....



Left to right: Russ Medlin, BitClub Network's top guy (the redacted name on the injunction). Roger Ver. Yoshie from Bitmain.

August 1 2017
The fork.

February 1 2018

Announcement from BitClub Network (edited by me for typo)

Quote
From February 1, we will only accept Bitcoin Cash (BCH) not Bitcoin (BTC), which means that you need to purchase Bitcoin cash from a stock exchange or wallet providers to register mining pools or buy. You can also convert your existing BTC to BCH, but either way it's just BCH!

We also pay ALL commissions in Bitcoin Cash!
For example, each binary cycle pays out $ 200 (about 0.013 BTC) bitcoins and the same $ 200 will be paid in bitcoin cash (about 0.08 BCH) as of February 1st. Nothing will change, you will still get exactly the same USD value for everything, but instead of being paid in Bitcoin, it will be credited to your Bitcoin Cash Wallet.
These include Binary, Level Up, Matching Bonuses, Infinity Bonuses and all other commissions. Apart from mining, profits will continue to be paid in Bitcoin (BTC) as we continue to mine on the BTC chain and use the high fees.

June 10 2018

Roger Ver and his "long term friend?" Joby "1040" Weeks having a no eye contact strained chat on You Tube. Weeks comes out with a bs story of losing $700,000 because of a slow Bitcoin transaction.
Roger looks at his feet and then
Roger asks Weeks why is it that the majority of BitClub’s hashrate goes towards Bitcoin Core, rather than BCH. Moreover, he also asked when does Weeks expect this to change.
Weeks didn’t really provide a specific answer, but instead went on to discuss operational hurdles in regards to the exploitation of BitClub’s equipment. According to him, back then, they had $50 million worth of equipment which hadn’t been plugged in. He also shared that they are expecting to create the world’s largest mining operation, harnessing over 300 megawatts of power.

Never trust a scammer, even one you're in partnership with.




Edit: I've just read GMaxwell's Reddit post, which predates mine. No plagiarism, honest.



 


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December 11, 2019, 09:28:22 PM
 #2

No wonder.
Is there any crypto project where infamous Roger Ver is not involved in some way?
We all remember his famous MtGox speech  Roll Eyes

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December 11, 2019, 09:40:18 PM
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TMFP called this out years ago. I was along with him, knew it was a blatant scam. Glad to see they are fucked like shavers now though. Fuck Joby Weeks and all those scamming fucks. Roger is just fucking insane I guess, Idk.... Huh

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December 14, 2019, 12:51:25 AM
Last edit: December 14, 2019, 09:51:39 AM by tmfp
 #4

His first reaction to the arrests.

Quote from: Roger Ver/Memorydealers r/btc Reddit
Bitclub may or may not have been running a Ponzi scheme, but the Social Security office <snip>Ayn Rand stuff<snip>

His reaction to points raised here and here.
https://coinrivet.com/roger-ver-im-not-involved-with-bitclub-network-scam/

Quote from: Roger
“I’ve never been involved with BitClub’s business in any way,” he said.
“I’ve had dinner with them on three occasions that I can recall – twice in Tokyo, and the third I think was in Korea.
“Two of those dinners were part of a big group of people.”

The Korean dinner (as in the picture and this video) certainly was a "big group of people." Most of those people were BitClub Network "elite" (see t shirt logos and Frank Abel in the background).

Quote
Referring to images of him with BitClub’s Russ Medlin and Bitmain’s ‘Yoshie’, which are currently being circulated with veiled accusations of heavy involvement in the scheme, he says he was merely keen to promote Bitcoin Cash “to anyone who would listen”.
“Yoshie ran their mining pool and is a Bitcoin maximalist who hates Bitcoin Cash,” he explained. “Russ actually was trying to use BTC for payments for BitClub but was having understandable network congestion issues, so like everyone else I can get to listen to me, I was urging BitClub to switch everything over to BCH."
At the 26th April 2017 dinner. Ok but, of course, Bitcoin Cash didn't exist then.

Quote
Asked why he was even having dinner with Russ Medlin, Ver says he was innocently offering a helping hand to a start-up – an act of goodwill before quickly becoming suspicious of the project.

Start-up? By the April 26th 2017 Korean dinner, BitClub Network were anything but a startup.
So Roger had dinner with Medlin and then  "quickly" became suspicious of the project afterwards?? So how/why did he tweet the infamous "It will all end in tears" tweet over a year before the dinner?
Quote
He said: “I think I likely reached out to them first during the scaling war urging them to support bigger blocks with their hash rate, and then later BCH after the split had already happened.”

Or maybe you "reached out to them first" when you called them a scam, and then 'later' after agreeing to retract it, before the split, hoping for their hash support?

Quote
Soon after that meeting, the libertarian grew wary of the way BitClub was being operated, and furiously slammed them for using his image in promotional material.
“Some other BitClub fan named Ryan set up a whole fake website with my photos and fake quotes saying ‘I’m a proud BitClub member and I earn extra residual income doing Bitcoin mining with Bitclub’, or some quote like that,” he said.

"Some other BitClub fan named Ryan"....
That would be J. Ryan Conley.
He wasn't "some other fan", he was/is a serial MLM scammer who was vocally and aggressively promoting BitClub globally, boasting of his flash cars and lifestyle he was living because of it, and here he is pictured with you, all smiley smiley, in March 2017



Quote
“I was really angry because they were using my name and image to promote their product that I had nothing to do with.
When I looked into it more, I noticed they didn’t even tell their customers how much hash rate they were buying,” he recalled.
“That fake website was what inspired me to send the tweet letting the world know I have nothing to do with BitClub.”
in Feb 2016.



Quote
“I wonder how many of the people criticising me tweeted anything negative about BitClub as early as I did? I bet none,” questioned Ver.

?? By February 2016, BitClub Network was being hung out to dry as a scam all over the place, including here on this forum, where you were also posting just a few days after your tweet.

Quote
“A significant time after I had made that tweet, the BitClub guys contacted me saying they wanted to talk about big blocks or BCH – I don’t recall if it was before or after the split.
“They really wanted me to delete the tweet and argued that it was hurting their business.
In the course of our meeting, I agreed to delete the tweet for them, and it was implied that they would do more to support Big Block Bitcoin.

Quid pro Quo much?

Quote
"Deleting a tweet shouldn’t be seen as an endorsement in any way"

Publicly withdrawing the unequivocal statement that you believed a Bitcoin mining operation to be a pyramid scheme should be seen as what then?

Quote
"and I’ve never done any business with BitClub in any way.”

The thousands and thousands of coins that were distributed/stolen by BitClub thru their use of your Bitcoin Cash network, no, they weren't "business" at all.



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December 17, 2019, 09:59:33 PM
 #5

Roger Ver is now promoting another scam, apparently:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/ebpcn6/roger_partners_with_hex_scam_quadriga_ceo_body/

PIA went evil: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5203968.msg53160131#msg53160131 Unofficial & Uncensored SYSCOIN thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4748031.0    Do not trust Yobit/HitBTC/BiteBTC/coinsbit/p2pb2b/Mercatox/C-cex/Poloniex/WEX/KuCoin/LiveCoin/TheRockTrading/Bitfinex/ADAB/Okex/TradeSatoshi/Gate.io/Changelly/Freewallet.org/crex24 scam exchanges or ICO's by known scammers like HashCoins/Ambisafe/Bountyhive - they WILL scam you! Use diligence & research. Buy coins, sell coins - don't invest in stupid shit. If your questions aren't answered - don't touch it.
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December 17, 2019, 10:04:03 PM
 #6


Yeah, he's on a roll all right....
It's being discussed here...

Bitcoin.com's exchange has listed Hex

If I were Mr. Ver that's something I would have just a few wee doubts about but perhaps he's decided to go for broke and go full shit. Bitconnect and Onecoin up for a comeback next I guess.

I like that move because it makes Roger look bad within his own community. It made me kind of have some respect for the BCH community as they are against Roger shilling this flat out scam. It means that they are more than just ass lickers following their master. The main ABC dev is publicly speaking out against it, which is hilarious, mainly so with how he is partly paid by Roger.

Interesting part is that just before the listing, Richard in one of his streams said that the biggest HEX claim comes from a Bitcoin address that had nearly 2000BTC in it, then suddenly Roger Ver announces the listing on his shitcoin dot com exchange. Coincidence?  Roll Eyes

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December 18, 2019, 09:06:06 AM
 #7

Roger has a long history of scamming/associating with scams, so this comes as no surprise.
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December 20, 2019, 12:31:47 PM
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