Okay. Charge tax on bitcoin. Is this fair policy?

[duke89]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

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[Ludmilla_rose1995]

I don't think that's ridiculous. The government has set income tax according to how much is generated every month. If someone has income from bitcoin trading or other income, they will still pay income tax. What's wrong with paying taxes? We can enjoy the cleanliness of the city and the beauty of the park thanks to us paying taxes.

[samcrypto]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

That's fair and if there's a law about it then you must pay that income tax or else the government will run to you. Government needs money to run the whole country, taxation is a must but if there's a corruption then that is the time for us to say that our government is really unfair. I do pay taxes, and I'm happy because of that little money I was able to help my country grown and feed more people who are really in need. Don't think about the bad side of the government, think that your taxes are for the poor people who badly needs the support of the government.

[piebeyb]

I will support income tax if bitcoin is legalized in my country, provided that to finance the development of the country and society it doesn't matter to me, but if 20% of course I will feel heavy, if 1% I will give it to the benefit of everyone in my country, as long as there is no corrupt government and bitcoin is legalized as a payment tool, maybe I will support it if bitcoin users are charged for it
  

[Bttzed03]

~
What do you guys think?

Care to share first where you read this 20% tax? There are different kinds of taxes but basing on the rate, I would assume that the profits from bitcoin trading are classified as capital gains which are subject to capital gains tax (rates vary per country). It's hard to comment on topics like this without getting more information. 

[DdmrDdmr]

<…>

What’s pretty ridiculous is that the EU does not have at this stage a common ground on the approach. Whilst countries such as Portugal have currently got a great deal, and do not seem to be taxing crypto, and Germany is exempt if you hold your BTC for over a year, Spain is subject to a 19-23% taxation on it (for trade).

Slight differences between countries within the EU is perhaps understandable, but having discrepant considerations as to the nature of what crypto is effectively considered to be, and the discrepant criteria derived on its tax treatment, is just absurd.

[AverageGlabella]

Tax on Bitcoin depends on the country you live in but remember that the 20% is the standard tax bracket for any earnings below I think $25,000. If you have a job and then earn Bitcoin any side earnings could be taxed higher as this is implemented into some countries. If you go over a certain theshold which is usually tied to your household income which includes any other money you have made like fiat it could be taxed at 30, 40 or even 50% if you are earning hundreds of thousands every year.

For your question this is a fair policy because this is the amount that gets taxed on fiat income. Bitcoin is no different to other currencies. If you wanted to reduce the income tax on Bitcoin you would have to do the same for the others. Many of the population is looking to increase taxes on the rich and reduce the amount on poor and middle class people to close the gap further.

So many people are against tax but only a couple of them are legitimate concerns I think. One of the taxes I do not agree with is inheritance tax. When someone leaves money in their will to you all of this should probably go to you but depending on the country you live in you could be paying some hefty tax on that inheritance and the tax man will be laughing but otherwise I think tax is a good thing it usually contributes to your countries infrastructure and medicine. If you live in a third world country your tax is probably a lot lower but then the trade off is poorer living condition. It would be interesting whether this had any correlation between the two.

Slight differences between countries within the EU is perhaps understandable, but having discrepant considerations as to the nature of what crypto is effectively considered to be, and the discrepant criteria derived on its tax treatment, is just absurd.

Why do you think European countries are any different to American taxes compared to European? They are not one country and have individual laws and rules. The european countries are in a union and they decide common grounds but I don't think Bitcoin taxation should be in the discussion between countries. Germany looks the place to go if you have a large amount of Bitcoin though.

I don't think that's ridiculous. The government has set income tax according to how much is generated every month. If someone has income from bitcoin trading or other income, they will still pay income tax. What's wrong with paying taxes? We can enjoy the cleanliness of the city and the beauty of the park thanks to us paying taxes.

Taxes do get spent on the countries infrastructure but how much percentage actually goes in the back pockets of the politicians? Every country has probably had a scandal where a politician was caught spending tax money on personal items. There needs to be a decentralized or at least a transparent way of showing where tax money is being spent.

That's fair and if there's a law about it then you must pay that income tax or else the government will run to you. Government needs money to run the whole country, taxation is a must but if there's a corruption then that is the time for us to say that our government is really unfair. I do pay taxes, and I'm happy because of that little money I was able to help my country grown and feed more people who are really in need. Don't think about the bad side of the government, think that your taxes are for the poor people who badly needs the support of the government.

Does your government use your money to feed those without food? Usually the government spend tax money on fixing roads and giving money to charities. The charities are usually the ones that make soup days to the homeless or build new hospitals. In many countries you can get tax relief by donating directly to a charity and I think that might be the better option if you wanted to feed the poorer people of your country or improve the infrastructure because more of that money is probably going to get distributed without going in the pockets of politicians.

[webtricks]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

Why should government consider your Bitcoin earnings to be any different than other earnings? Here in India, government don't see profits earned from crypto trading as lottery. Rather it is considered as capital gains which can be short-term or long-term depending upon the time period. In my opinion, this is perfect treatment. The rates are also equivalent to capital gains rates. I created a detailed thread on this which is currently pinned in Indian section. It can be found here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5206607.0

[Jet Cash]

There are 3 elements here.
1. Bitcoin used as a currency for purchases.
2. Bitcoin as an non-interest earning savings mechanism
3. Speculation on the price of Bitcoin, and the receipt of interest on lans.

1. Should not be taxed, even if people make a bit of profit from it.
2. If you tax this, then you need to tax fiat as well.
3. These are trading profits, and should be taxed like any other profit source. You should be able to offset losses as well.

[BlackFor3st]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

This is ridiculous and I am wondering also if how they are going to do it, are they enforcing it via their local exchange? It will be best if you can provide some example also so we can also check whether their moves is illegal or not.

Tax is like 12% only in most of the government but most of the governments that adapt crypto currencies are not putting tax to the traders as they only ask for tax to their local exchange the same in our country.

[inanilujimi]

if in my country there is no tax that must be paid when getting results from bitcoin trading.
I think whether it's fair or not depends on which country you live in right now.
what is clear is that the losses we get from trade are not subsidized by the government.

[worle1bm]

if in my country there is no tax that must be paid when getting results from bitcoin trading.
I think whether it's fair or not depends on which country you live in right now.
what is clear is that the losses we get from trade are not subsidized by the government.

True. Even in my country we need not declare any income earned in cryptocurrencies. Government doesn't recognize cryptocurrency as any material thing, hence, we don't have to pay taxes.
Other countries may have different laws related to taxing bitcoin and it may be fair if citizens of that country are earning substantial amount of money through bitcoins.

[Darooghe]

If you ask me I say the capital gains tax is designed a way to ensure no other instrument can compete with national fiat currencies. Government's know that there is nothing stopping citizens to choose other means of exchange besides fiat if left on their own. Any asset that is not controlled by the government and that shows properties of perfect money would expose the inflation tampering of fiat currencies. Hence governments tax capital gains on non-fiat exchange instruments.

[xZork]

It is difficult to calculate the bitcoin tax if people do not sell bitcoins as fiat currencies. Bitcoin is anonymous and decentralized so no one can know the owner of bitcoin to tax.
The government can only tax the bitcoin owner when he sells bitcoin and receives money back into the account, in my country the sale of bitcoin is taxed at 10% and I think it is a moderate tax.

[garyrowe]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

Taxation is one of the major source of revenue in many countries today. As far as a person earns money such person is obliged to pay his or her taxes. If a bitcoin trader earns profits from its trading activities, he or she is duty bound to pay taxes to the Government as this will aid in development of the society. Hence taxation of crypto related activities is highly supported by me.

[gentlemand]

If you make your money trading duck billed Platypus placentas that's taxable. Why on Earth should Bitcoin be any different?

This indignance turns up here so often I suspect there'll be some humongous tax bills arriving on many a doorstep because people thought they were 'special'.

[msarro]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

The government on everything charges tax. In my country, you have to pay tax on stock trading also. So it's fine if the government is charging tax on crypto. Government's real difference with bitcoin is that bitcoin anonymous nature doesn't allow government to trace and tax the transfer of funds.

[angrybirdy]

It is fair I think.
Income tax depends on the implemented law in a certain country, if that is what states in their law, they need to abide and that is actually fair.
In our country, the income tax can increase up to 32%, if that country that you are talking charges tax on bitcoin only for 20%, that would be better compared in my country.

[btccashacc]

Our local exchange has applied the fee whether for withdrawal or trading, every transaction on the platform now has already included 10% tax I think every country has their own regulation regarding how much fee they collected from trading cryptocurrency. When your revenue is being taxed it means that you're helping your Government and the Country. Just hoping the money that they have collected is being used for the right thing, bring benefits to our community.

[bounceback]

taxation in digital currency has now become a fairly complex phenomenon, especially if related to the calculation of profits in trade or from investments, taxation on bitcoin varies greatly, although now some countries use bitcoin as a currency, while some other countries consider it an asset or commodity .
so with different treatment in each country, so the bitcoin tax also has different rules in each country.

[tsaroz]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

It's not a big deal to give some of your profit to your government as tax on your bitcoin profit. But the problem is it's hard to define what a profit in bitcoin is as there maybe many steps involved that the government may not be able to track. So, it would be much easier to tax on user trades (on exchanges) and mining of coin.

[Astvile]

It is only fair I think. You live in the country you earn money from where you live and it is your obligation to pay taxes no matter where your income comes from. And that number is still low I think because I'm sure bigger entrepreneurs and businessmen are getting charged even higher than that.
Basically you are paying for your countries development so nothing is wrong at all.

[audaciousbeing]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

20% is not on the high side at all. The concern is what the 20% will be applied on. If its on earnings, then its not fair however, if its on net profit then its fair. Using this in comparison to other forms of taxes. In most countries, company income tax is always between 25% to 35%. Personal Income tax on the otherhand, the effective is always around 15% to 20% depending on the level of income. So 20% on another form of income is not bad so far its being treated as final tax in the case of individuals if not, it would be being taxed twice on the same income and more so, tax payment is our civic duty to contribute to the development of the state.

[3la9l_kolbaCa]

taxation in digital currency has now become a fairly complex phenomenon, especially if related to the calculation of profits in trade or from investments, taxation on bitcoin varies greatly, although now some countries use bitcoin as a currency, while some other countries consider it an asset or commodity .
so with different treatment in each country, so the bitcoin tax also has different rules in each country.

Yes, it's indeed a different perspective on a desired country who allowed bitcoin transactions to operate in their place. Without the compliance of tax regulations, the local exchanges who has active business in the country will be subjected to country's law. Most rules applied on exchanges, that's we noticed transaction charges was so high on popular coins like btc and eth.

[acdc]

The 20% tax is too high and unreasonable for a certain transaction, it seems that the government is trying to attack bitcoin holders.
I think a 5 ~ 10% fee is reasonable for bitcoin transactions, in my country bitcoin is considered a commodity and it is subject to 10% tax like all other goods.

[DabsPoorVersion]

The 20% tax is too high and unreasonable for a certain transaction, it seems that the government is trying to attack bitcoin holders.
I think a 5 ~ 10% fee is reasonable for bitcoin transactions, in my country bitcoin is considered a commodity and it is subject to 10% tax like all other goods.

But the fact that it is also a currency, should be subject to income tax and not as a commodity. It is not some kind of goods so I think it is reasonable with 20%.
As your country how it sees bitcoin as a commodity, it is also good, since the country itself decides how much percentage they will implement and where they will base the tax on it. But the thing is, other countries do not see it the same as your country.

[airdnasxela]

That's the way to legalized cryptocurrency on different countries. They won't legalize it if they can't get any benefits from it. And tax is something that we shouldn't avoid. We're also the one benefiting from the taxes we pay. The tax percentage is too much for me, but I think it would still depend on the amount of transactions. The government wouldn't just ask for 20% tax fixed, it might change depending on the transactions. I don't really know because there's no law and tax on crypto here in my country but the bill is already at the senate so sooner it can be legalized in my country.

[rosezionjohn]

If you make your money trading duck billed Platypus placentas that's taxable. Why on Earth should Bitcoin be any different?

This indignance turns up here so often I suspect there'll be some humongous tax bills arriving on many a doorstep because people thought they were 'special'.

This topic has been discussed in our local board. Due to the lack of regulations pertaining to tax on cryptocurrencies, some would argue that the absence of the law means they are not subject to tax. While others would also say it is still taxable since it is still an income and all types of income are taxable unless it's stated that they're not.

I tend to agree with the second argument. I also think those who never filed their crypto profits will be required to pay sooner or later with huge penalties.

[isaac_clarke22]

If there's gonna be a tax in connection with Bitcoin, it should be just within those financial institutions that allows people to sell Bitcoin. We got SCI here in our country that is all about the industry in linked with Bitcoin.
I believe that it shouldn't be taxed though because in the end people will still sell them to fiat money, and I guess they should take into consideration to tax fiat and any centralized institutions. Leave Bitcoin as it is.

[gentlemand]

This topic has been discussed in our local board. Due to the lack of regulations pertaining to tax on cryptocurrencies, some would argue that the absence of the law means they are not subject to tax. While others would also say it is still taxable since it is still an income and all types of income are taxable unless it's stated that they're not.

I tend to agree with the second argument. I also think those who never filed their crypto profits will be required to pay sooner or later with huge penalties.

It's a totally different matter if where you live has uncertain rules. I don't. I don't think that stops people ignoring them 'because it's on the internet and I took the risk so I shouldn't have to pay'.

If I were in a place that hadn't clarified anything I'd at least hang something back just in case they ever did. It's a pretty poor show to leave people in the dark completely.

[AicecreaME]

You made me laugh on that. How would the Government put a tax on something that they can't touch, and they can't put tax on Bitcoin Trading same as for the traders because they are almost the same with freelancers, but we couldn't avoid paying taxes like paying our monthly bills, electricity, using public transportation, etc... that is tax also.

Government will never be able to put tax on crypto currency, because it is decentralized.

[Linkkoin]

This topic has been discussed in our local board. Due to the lack of regulations pertaining to tax on cryptocurrencies, some would argue that the absence of the law means they are not subject to tax. While others would also say it is still taxable since it is still an income and all types of income are taxable unless it's stated that they're not.

I tend to agree with the second argument. I also think those who never filed their crypto profits will be required to pay sooner or later with huge penalties.

This may lead to several possible outcomes, which all have a huge impact on cryptocurrencies as such:
1) If you have used cryptocurrency for buying something, you may be forced to present invoice/receipt for such action/contract. Here we can argue - should companies have in such case registered wallets working more or less in the same way as bank accounts? What about defining the cryptocurrency value for VAT purposes? With fiat currencies, these are usually foreign exchange rates as published by the central bank. In this scenario there is a slight chance, the authorities could start accepting tax payments in crypto (eg. 23% of BTC amount, not its value in eg. USD).
2) Taxation reforms - as speaking of the price itself, should taxation apply to profit made per each transaction, or annual summary? What in situation like this: you bought 10 BTC at the 2018 bottom ($4000/1BTC) and sold it at 2019 highs ($12000/1BTC), next bought at the end of the year 15 BTC for $8000 each. In this case what should be taxed? The total value of BTC at the end of the year, its price per each coin?

[keeee]

Our local exchange has applied the fee whether for withdrawal or trading, every transaction on the platform now has already included 10% tax I think every country has their own regulation regarding how much fee they collected from trading cryptocurrency. When your revenue is being taxed it means that you're helping your Government and the Country. Just hoping the money that they have collected is being used for the right thing, bring benefits to our community.

I agree with this,  actually tax is fairly thing especially when it comes to transactions.  We really need to psy some fee for there sre also working on our transaction and without them it wont be possible to transfer some cryptocurrency to wallet.

[Twentyonepaylots]

The 20% tax is too high and unreasonable for a certain transaction, it seems that the government is trying to attack bitcoin holders.
I think a 5 ~ 10% fee is reasonable for bitcoin transactions, in my country bitcoin is considered a commodity and it is subject to 10% tax like all other goods.

20% is too much. You can't even call it tax if that's what the percentage is. Taxation is only necessary for legality purposes so I don't have anything against cryptocurrency transactions being taxed or regulated, it adds more security after all. For not being outlawed, a tax of 10% is a small price to pay. But 20% is so outrageous, you might want to have it be reviewed or appealed.

[Youghoor]

Why do  some government officials have low level of thinking and understanding?  So they want to tax bitcoin miners or who?  Most government officials are always thinking of money and how to find a way to rob people of their money. Its high time we in the crypto space make these people understand that we gave them the power.

[Artemis3]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...
20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.
That means govt sees it as a lottery.
What do you guys think?

It is pointless because you can simply not declare it. It is not terribly difficult to keep a wallet hidden from the government. The only way the State may have some chance of taxation, is probably VAT since they can audit the movement of physical goods (inventories, etc), services utility bills, or an annual fee for the ownership of luxury things like property, lambos etc. Not that i particularly endorse taxes or the State...

Oh and always remember this: bitcoin never comes in or goes out from your country. Everything occurs in the blockchain, the blockchain resides in the world (anyone can run a node and be part of it).

[affandi]

Government regulations in each country seem to vary. as in my country, the government sets a 10% tax on crypto trade revenues. I think this is good, because by doing that, cryptocurrency can be well received in every country.

[huige007]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

Taxation is one of the major source of revenue in many countries today. As far as a person earns money such person is obliged to pay his or her taxes. If a bitcoin trader earns profits from its trading activities, he or she is duty bound to pay taxes to the Government as this will aid in development of the society. Hence taxation of crypto related activities is highly supported by me.

It is not possible to keep track of transactions made by the cryptocurrency in a country due to its universal nature. Many tax imposing authorities have tried to impose tax on it and the taxation guidance given by the IRS depicts it as a possessions someone hold. According to which holding Bitcoin for a longer period of time, when you are about to sell it you have to pay the capital gain.

[gentlemand]

It is pointless because you can simply not declare it.

Same goes for many other things. Tax collecting in most places is taken on trust. People cough up for the sake of a quiet life.

Unless your opsec has been peerless there's a good chance you could be retrospectively nailed. It's not the cleverest area to be indulging in tax evasion. You leave a trail of permanent droppings wherever you go and the data mining techniques are only going to get better.

[iram3130]

If you're talking about income tax then I would support this move as governments will regularize the crypto with this tax. But if you're talking about trading tax which I too have little knowledge of, then I would not support. There are many countries which accept income tax if you consider crypto as other income source and pay accordingly.

[julius caesar]

It is okay to pay taxes while earning in bitcoin. The only problem is, it loses the essence of cryptocurrency since we all know that it is decentralized. Meaning no one must control it including the government. But, if that is the only way for them to accept crypto in their country, I think that is okay. Just for the country to be able to improve their economy.

[ChrisPop]

In my opinion due to the high volatility of the bitcoin asset countries sohuld only tax Bitcoin when it is converted into a fiat currency (seen as an income) or spent on purchasing a product or service. In other words they should apply the capital gains tax. The system should be similar to holding shares or commodities. For example if you purchase a TSLA share at $400 and you sell it at $380 you will be able to deduct your capital losses and vice-versa to pay tax on your capital gains. I think that's the fairest policy. If you trade and take your profits in Bitcoin you shouldn't have to pay the tax until you sell the Bitcoin.

[BeManga]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

it's not really a bad thing if we will pay tax for bitcoin trading but only if we gain some profit
and i think they also need to add some minimum gains because small trader cant afford it
the exchange already has a fee even the withdrawal we also need to pay some fee.

[darkangel11]

It is okay to pay taxes while earning in bitcoin. The only problem is, it loses the essence of cryptocurrency since we all know that it is decentralized. Meaning no one must control it including the government. But, if that is the only way for them to accept crypto in their country, I think that is okay. Just for the country to be able to improve their economy.

It's OK to pay if paying is voluntary. It's not OK if you're being charged 30% or more by your greedy government.
I'm a supporter of fair taxation and income tax is not fair. Capital gains tax also isn't fair. You're paying for imaginary profits that were never cashed out or turned into goods.  

[Sendoku]

"Fairnes" of crypto taxation depends on the country. If it's corrupt and all the money goes into someone else's pockets, that yes, it's unfair. Though in such states this kinda corruption typically penetrates all other industries as well

[Darker45]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

I'm quite sure tax laws vary from one country to another. What is commonly shared among all countries perhaps is that income tax is being imposed to all. Which means that any income earned through legal means will be taxed. I'm afraid that includes earning from Bitcoin trading. However, there are differences on the limitations. Countries vary from one another on how much is a taxable income.

As regards Bitcoin income in particular, many countries' tax bureaus or agencies might probably find it very puzzling on how it would be computed, monitored, and assessed considering that many of them have even yet to understand what Bitcoin is. I myself am not paying taxes on my income through Bitcoin because there is not even a law regarding it. Bitcoin is not even considered a source of income.

[Wintersoldier]

Government really need the taxes from people, mainly for projects and development, and might as well consider that in investment in bitcoin, taking risk is one of the biggest fact one should consider, and that doesn't mean it seems to be a lottery for government. Imagine all of the business and jobs that earns profits are required to pay tax in relation to the amount that they earn. Bitcoin investment is much more better to hear as a job rather than a lottery which means, it is still fair to pay taxes for me.

[MAAManda]

I think making tax on trading is a common thing, but if government want to 20% Fee of our trading is a ridiculous.

[Zeke_23]

I think making tax on trading is a common thing, but if government want to 20% Fee of our trading is a ridiculous.

What's ridiculous about it, your profit in trading is considered as your income so it means that it can charge the same as the income tax.
Paying tax is everyone's responsibility, and I think that 20% is only fair since it is for the good of your country.

[Ludmilla_rose1995]

I think making tax on trading is a common thing, but if government want to 20% Fee of our trading is a ridiculous.

What's ridiculous about it, your profit in trading is considered as your income so it means that it can charge the same as the income tax.
Paying tax is everyone's responsibility, and I think that 20% is only fair since it is for the good of your country.

By paying taxes, society will benefit from public facilities and infrastructure, such as roads, bridges, schools, hospitals. In addition, taxes are also used to support Micro, Small and Medium Enterprises so the economy can continue to grow.

[bitvalak]

I think income tax is regulated in each country. And if you make money from bitcoin then it is sufficient that the total annual income requirement will be taxed, but if your income does not reach the minimum income per year then it will not be taxed. And even then depending on how much your income per year, the smaller the tax per year is also getting smaller.

[bitcoindusts]

I am ok with the government imposing tax in our crypto (Bitcoin) profit.  Government needed our taxes to improve infrastructure, maintain the order and defense of the country from any invading forces. It (tax) is use to fund the country's welfare and use for public services.

[Oilacris]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

20% tax? Thats ridiculous.How they do able to trace it up? If your country do strictly implement such taxation of crypto income then you wont have any choice but to comply if you dont like to experience problems
but honestly that 20% is pain in the a**.

So far theres no regulation regarding to that here on my country and i do still consider it lucky.

[pawanjain]

If by paying 20% tax bitcoin is getting global acceptance then I would not mind paying 20% as tax.
I know bitcoin was created to eliminate the middle man but bitcoin is not widely accepted yet.
If paying 20% gives wide acceptance to bitcoin then we should consider doing it because elevating the tax away from bitcoin can be done in the future but making bitcoin widely accepted should be our primary goal for now.

[darkangel11]

I think making tax on trading is a common thing, but if government want to 20% Fee of our trading is a ridiculous.

What's ridiculous about it, your profit in trading is considered as your income so it means that it can charge the same as the income tax.
Paying tax is everyone's responsibility, and I think that 20% is only fair since it is for the good of your country.

That's why we have so many slave driving governments that first propose 20% , then 25% then 30% but only from certain profit and then go up from there.
People like you who first agree to 20% are easy to fool into paying 30% and poor workers faced with a tax increase will always vote for the rich to bear the majority of it.
That's why we have 30% or more from certain threshold because poor people are the majority and they want the rich to be poor, just like them. They don't understand that a rich person already pays more in taxes even if all social groups pay 20% regardless of the income.
You want to be a slave, so you will be one.

[rosezionjohn]

This may lead to several possible outcomes, <...>

There are plenty of things to consider when creating tax laws for cryptocurrency transactions for sure. I would not want to speak on behalf of our lawmakers but from what I have read so far, our country will probably have one after five years 

It's a totally different matter if where you live has uncertain rules. I don't. I don't think that stops people ignoring them 'because it's on the internet and I took the risk so I shouldn't have to pay'.

Oh I see. If there's a specific law that covers tax on cryptocurrency trading profits or losses, then complaining about the tax rates won't save anyone if they don't pay the necessary tax.

If I were in a place that hadn't clarified anything I'd at least hang something back just in case they ever did. It's a pretty poor show to leave people in the dark completely.

I agree that we should have a regulation by now. It will be a mess if they start coming after people who never declared their income once a law has been passed few years from now.

[sovie]

Government will only accept taxable cryptocurrency. If crypto comes into tax net of country then government can trace many thing about the crypto like who is holding how many bitcoins, KYC etc. I dont see any harm in taxing the crypto since its an asset and government globally tax the asset.

[huige007]

I think income tax is regulated in each country. And if you make money from bitcoin then it is sufficient that the total annual income requirement will be taxed, but if your income does not reach the minimum income per year then it will not be taxed. And even then depending on how much your income per year, the smaller the tax per year is also getting smaller.

It is fair to pay tax if you have reached the minimum income per year. Paying taxes will help improve the economy of country, a stable economy will flourish better. There is no other way of calculation of tax on the income by crypto market. As it is decentralized, you cannot track easily each and every transactions made by the users. In this way you cannot made a hard and fast rule of paying taxes. 

[Lizzylove1]

The only language the government understand is tax and tax only. They have no other business than taxing the people. I currently don't pay tax on bitcoin trading in my country this is because my government is yet to study about Cryptocurrency.

[cheezcarls]

In the US, lawmakers labeled Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies as "commodities", which are subjected to taxation.

However, other countries like Singapore are making exemptions on that, as they do not tax their residents who are holding and trading some cryptos.

In my own opinion, taxes on Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies would definitely help improve the country's economy. I do know that every time you convert crypto to fiat and withdraw it to your bank account or remittance, you are subjected to income tax.

[boris singer]

20% is still a fair value limit, I am not too worried about it, the most important thing is that the state recognizes the ownership of crypto assets that I have and is able to contribute independently as a form of accountability to the state. Tax for gambling or other professional fields is even greater than that and they are fine.

[ragavancoin]

Paying Income tax on Bitcoin is fair when you have crossed the minimum amount per year as Bitcoin is not regularized in our country once it is regularized then will surely pay if tax had to be paid. Paying tax for our country is a good thing. Government has to do so many things can't manage the things alone... So if all the tax payers pay it properly then it will be a good thing for all the countries.

[johnwest]

Taxing on incomes is common in every country, the percentage might be different but the taxation system should be like that. Whatever profit you gain on bitcoin trading and convert it to fiat, 20% tax on that is a normal percentage to ask. There are countries which accept this already which is again an indirect way of regulation.

[Baoo]

From where you got these news? otherwise,  in my opinion it is not logical and acceptable if any country would make these high value of taxes for traders, 20% of tax is unbelievable to be honest.  Furthermore, the global issue that  the governments want to control everything especially what is related to financial income, they want to use  their power through exploiting the people. We have nothing to do except dealing with it, I see that Bitcoin's community are always complaining,  and trust me it does not change anything if you give some excuses and complain about your situation.

[gentlemand]

in my opinion it is not logical and acceptable if any country would make these high value of taxes for traders, 20% of tax is unbelievable to be honest. .

Why?

The chances are that wherever most of us live taxes people who trade in currencies, stocks and other financial thingies at similar rates or higher. Why should crypto get an exemption from that?

[Theb]

in my opinion it is not logical and acceptable if any country would make these high value of taxes for traders, 20% of tax is unbelievable to be honest. .

Why?

The chances are that wherever most of us live taxes people who trade in currencies, stocks and other financial thingies at similar rates or higher. Why should crypto get an exemption from that?

Yeah why is that? US citizens who have an average annual income of 40,126$ to 85,525$ have to pay a tax rate of 22% based on their earnings and suddenly if the government decides to charge nearly the same rate on Bitcoin it is unfair? Bitcoin isn't tax exempted to begin with, it is still an asset that can give you earnings by getting paid or through capital gains, not because it virtually exist it doesn't mean it is untaxable. What it seems to me right now people may have the wrong concept when it comes to Bitcoin, I don't even know where the whole idea of Bitcoin being untaxable came from since its isn't in the first place.

[gentlemand]

I don't even know where the whole idea of Bitcoin being untaxable came from since its isn't in the first place.

'Because it's on the internet'.

For most people here I'll guess this is the first taxable thing they've ever come across outside their wages and the first time they've been responsible for reporting any tax themselves. Couple that with it coming up out of nowhere and I can understand why it's surprising to some but that doesn't exonerate you from the fooking massive bill you may run up. Wilful ignorance is not a convincing defence.

[imstillthebest]

 sees as a lottery , what do you mean by that ? im so slow , i dont get that sorry  .  or you mean lottery business were also being charged high tax by the governments ? well that is quite true  .  its also true that bitcoin uses are now being taxed to some countries  . luckily still not on mine country  but im not a trader anyway so i think im still safe if ever they will approve that bill soon  . still the 20 percent tax is i think too much to some that are affected with it  . thats threatening to the crypto traders and to the crypto market     .

[20kevin20]

'Because it's on the internet'.

For most people here I'll guess this is the first taxable thing they've ever come across outside their wages and the first time they've been responsible for reporting any tax themselves. Couple that with it coming up out of nowhere and I can understand why it's surprising to some but that doesn't exonerate you from the fooking massive bill you may run up. Wilful ignorance is not a convincing defence.

True. There are some ways to somehow "escape" this event though, like Germany where taxes aren't imposed if you hold your cryptocurrencies for +1yr.

But I think the fiscal education is way too vague everywhere around the world. People just get income without even thinking they might have to pay taxes for their earnings. On the other hand though, I think there are more people knowingly and willingly ignoring the laws and going for the "I didn't even know" excuse.

[gentlemand]

True. There are some ways to somehow "escape" this event though, like Germany where taxes aren't imposed if you hold your cryptocurrencies for +1yr.

But I think the fiscal education is way too vague everywhere around the world. People just get income without even thinking they might have to pay taxes for their earnings. On the other hand though, I think there are more people knowingly and willingly ignoring the laws and going for the "I didn't even know" excuse.

Then they're toast. And there'll come a time where the tax man has a chain analysis program that pops out a giant bill for your every move in a fraction of a second.

That excuse reminds me of Lauryn Hill declaring she shouldn't have to pay her giant tax bill because she didn't choose to be born into the system she wound up in. Join the fuckin' club, honey. Funnily enough she wound up in jail.

[20kevin20]

Then they're toast. And there'll come a time where the tax man has a chain analysis program that pops out a giant bill for your every move in a fraction of a second.

That excuse reminds me of Lauryn Hill declaring she shouldn't have to pay her giant tax bill because she didn't choose to be born into the system she wound up in. Join the fuckin' club, honey. Funnily enough she wound up in jail.

I feel like the time you're talking about is way closer than we think. Transparency comes with a cost.

The excuse may sound silly, but unfortunately I don't remember a single situation out of many in which one of my friends has ever asked about/thought of paying taxes for their BTC earnings. As I said, the necessary education just isn't there (I'm speaking for my country right now, it might be different somewhere else) and people take these earnings superficially most of the time.

[philipma1957]

<…>

What’s pretty ridiculous is that the EU does not have at this stage a common ground on the approach. Whilst countries such as Portugal have currently got a great deal, and do not seem to be taxing crypto, and Germany is exempt if you hold your BTC for over a year, Spain is subject to a 19-23% taxation on it (for trade).

Slight differences between countries within the EU is perhaps understandable, but having discrepant considerations as to the nature of what crypto is effectively considered to be, and the discrepant criteria derived on its tax treatment, is just absurd.

yeah USA rules are brutal.

every trade is reportable .

so if you sell 1 btc for 140 Ltc. and the order sells in 30 pieces of one or two or three coins you need to report each one as a separate tax event.

and you never left the world of coins and entered into the world of cash.

I have some micro split trades in 2018 that took under 30:seconds to sell 1 btc into some bch.
yet the twenty mini spilts all need to be reported separately. My 2018 return has 7000 trades entries and i only did 190 trades for the year.

a fucking mess. still dealing with it.  and this year 2018 i made  no money 💴 I took a small loss.

[coolcoinz]

True. There are some ways to somehow "escape" this event though, like Germany where taxes aren't imposed if you hold your cryptocurrencies for +1yr.

But I think the fiscal education is way too vague everywhere around the world. People just get income without even thinking they might have to pay taxes for their earnings. On the other hand though, I think there are more people knowingly and willingly ignoring the laws and going for the "I didn't even know" excuse.

Then they're toast. And there'll come a time where the tax man has a chain analysis program that pops out a giant bill for your every move in a fraction of a second.

That excuse reminds me of Lauryn Hill declaring she shouldn't have to pay her giant tax bill because she didn't choose to be born into the system she wound up in. Join the fuckin' club, honey. Funnily enough she wound up in jail.

To a libertarian like me it's not that funny. Putting someone in jail because they don't want to contribute reminds me of communism where people were forced to work for the greater good of the country and those who would not contribute like avoid joining the army, landed in jail.

For me it's all about fairness. 10% would be a fair tax, but some countries try to impose 30%, or even more. In such cases the only option is to run and move somewhere else.
Being alone against the system and hiding your income will usually not end well. If they catch you, they'll make sure you're portrayed as a criminal who wants to take, but doesn't want to give. It's much better to just leave because there are still countries that treat you fair and charge 0-10% on your Bitcoin profits.

[haroonazam]

Genuine. Indeed, even in my nation we need not proclaim any salary earned in digital currencies. Government doesn't perceive digital currency as any material thing, thus, we don't need to make good on charges. Different nations may have various laws identified with exhausting bitcoin and it might be reasonable if residents of that nation are gaining significant measure of cash through bitcoins.

[Tiews223]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

I have three points on this discussion as to why I think it’s a good idea to charge taxes on bitcoins:

1. Taxation of Bitcoins enables visibility in those transactions: with this the government is able to monitor the activities of the bitcoins, their movement and the different purchases, this helps lessen the possibility of using those bitcoins in illegal activities. This lessens the possibility of terrorism, online sex trafficking etc, etc. Then again, taxes should be imposed on Bitcoins in the United States (this would highly depend on the State transactions being made and the state imposing the tax itself.)

2. These taxes will greatly contribute to the flow of the economy of the United States: taxes paid by Bitcoins in general will give life to the economy of the united States. As much as the United States has different businesses around the world, another arm of giving life to the economy is a big advantage for them. Since many of us here know that bitcoins are now a boom in the market and if we are able to make this as another source of economic flow in the United States, then we are able to utilize its purpose for us.

3. Expansion in business opportunities: if bitcoins become officially legal in all states of the United States, then there are more opportunities for business in the comfort of your own home.
 

[senin]

I noticed that certain country may charge tax on earning from Bitcoin trading...

20% tax on it. I think this is quite ridiculous.

That means govt sees it as a lottery.

What do you guys think?

Any government has the right to establish a tax on any type of activity of citizens that brings them profit. Regardless of where this profit comes from and whether the government and the state have any relation to its creation, they have the right to establish taxes on absolutely any activity.
Therefore, the surprise of some who are outraged that states do not have any relation to profits generated from cryptocurrencies, and therefore have no right to establish profits tax on it, is not true.

[Ozero]

The calculation of the tax on profits in cryptocurrency is quite logical and fair. We need to understand one simple thing: we do not pay taxes because the state helps us to make a profit, but because we live in society and in order for it to develop normally, we need to make contributions for general needs.
If we don’t want a stronger person to come to us and take our property, and sometimes our life, from us, we need to pay taxes so that someone monitors this to prevent this from happening.

[Lorence.xD]

This is a hard compromise for bitcoin, if we want it to take a step further then I think this is a necessary action to do. I can imagine government taking actions to crack down many cryptocurrencies when they are not willing to compromise, this kind of scheme has been done to many businesses, I don't know much about law and politics but I think that having the government on the good side of things is the most favorable thing for cryptocurrency industry to advance, many will resist these changes and many will witness things.

[Ozero]

The government of any state has the right to establish taxes on any activity of a citizen that brings him profit. The point is not that the government should make some efforts, create certain conveniences for this citizen to earn this profit. The government needs money for the general needs of society - the construction of roads and bridges, defense, the salary of budgetary professions, and so on. Therefore, everyone is obligated to make deductions for these common needs from any of their profits. We must pay taxes on profits in cryptocurrency, otherwise the government will take measures to prohibit the circulation of cryptocurrency, in which it, in principle, is not interested.

[suvo05]

They are charging tax means they are making bitcoin legal. There are many countries that do not have any particular law on bitcoin. In some countries like India there is an ongoing court case that will decide the future of BTC in the country. So if Gov start charging tax then traders will get the certainty that they don't have to face any legal action for holding or trading BTC.

[gentlemand]

They are charging tax means they are making bitcoin legal.

Hmm. Not sure.

There are many things that are not illegal but aren't worth bothering declaring legal either, or it's so obvious there's no need to make a declaration about it, or so obscure they can't be bothered.

There are many countries where Bitcoin is taxable but they've never made any announcement about whether it's legal or not so I guess we're expected to treat it as legal unless told otherwise. In their eyes it's just another vehicle for making profit in the currency they tax you in and all profit is taxable.

[squatter]

They are charging tax means they are making bitcoin legal.

Hmm. Not sure.

There are many things that are not illegal but aren't worth bothering declaring legal either, or it's so obvious there's no need to make a declaration about it, or so obscure they can't be bothered.

This reminds me of the case of Al Capone. He amassed a fortune from bootlegging and racketeering, but what he actually went down for was neglecting to pay taxes on his illegal income.

Tax authorities don't care where your money comes from. They just want their cut.

[kemoglo]

There are 3 elements here.
1. Bitcoin used as a currency for purchases.
2. Bitcoin as an non-interest earning savings mechanism
3. Speculation on the price of Bitcoin, and the receipt of interest on lans.

1. Should not be taxed, even if people make a bit of profit from it.
2. If you tax this, then you need to tax fiat as well.
3. These are trading profits, and should be taxed like any other profit source. You should be able to offset losses as well.

My main use of BTC is as 1. I do however pay taxes whenever I convert to FIAT, not a huge amount but still, it does feel unfair sometimes.