[VIDEO]The Empirical Proof of Bitcoin's Real Value Being Zero

[antikvark]

Derp

There are no 'Bitcoin issuers'. Maybe go back to reading the whitepaper before spewing more verbal diarrhea?

Bitcoin issuers are those who wrote the whitepaper, released the bitcoin software and launched the network.

[hv_]

Derp

There are no 'Bitcoin issuers'. Maybe go back to reading the whitepaper before spewing more verbal diarrhea?

Interesting, in the Satoshi White Paper  it says that Bitcoin s value comes from having it as a provable chain of signatures, where signatures are most critical in our internet world.

Second it calls for honest a lot.

You must be a fan of BSV, cause that's really following the white paper.

True is, any shitcoin that has no high potential of all sorts of interconnected things you need to have / transact / store onchain, just are worthless. Most are even non compliant and damned illegal.Top scam coin is XrP. Just printed security at will, no use

[TedBkgr]

Same was said for bitcoin when it was launched in 2008, those who accepted and start accumulating it are now called whales. One has the right to say anything he want for bitcoin but the point is bitcoin is a reality.

[fiulpro]

What Fundemental feature are you talking about ?
Fundem feature is actually based on the age old traditional currencies whose value would plummet soon enough , Change is the nature of nature.
This is actually a very good example of how stupid can the humans be , wasting their time on Hating bitcoins and proving the value to be zero , instead go to your computer and give us a better option , discover a good option if your think this is a failure .

[antikvark]

What Fundemental feature are you talking about ?
Fundem feature is actually based on the age old traditional currencies whose value would plummet soon enough , Change is the nature of nature.
This is actually a very good example of how stupid can the humans be , wasting their time on Hating bitcoins and proving the value to be zero , instead go to your computer and give us a better option , discover a good option if your think this is a failure .

Why would anyone hate record in a database, as this is all what Bitcon is - a digital record held in a computer. I hate nothing. I am pointing out the human stupidity of purchasing this record for thousands of dollars although it pays zero monetary or non-monetary value to its holders. On their own, all financial instruments are worthless paper or digital records. That's why their issuers must provide some payment to their holders, and it is this payment what gives them value. Bitcoin issuers pay nothing, which renders Bitcoin worthless. Giving up valuable possessions just to be the holder of worthless digital record, is a very good example of how stupid can the humans be.

[KonstantinosM]

What Fundemental feature are you talking about ?
Fundem feature is actually based on the age old traditional currencies whose value would plummet soon enough , Change is the nature of nature.
This is actually a very good example of how stupid can the humans be , wasting their time on Hating bitcoins and proving the value to be zero , instead go to your computer and give us a better option , discover a good option if your think this is a failure .

Why would anyone hate record in a database, as this is all what Bitcon is - a digital record held in a computer. I hate nothing. I am pointing out the human stupidity of purchasing this record for thousands of dollars although it pays zero monetary or non-monetary value to its holders. On their own, all financial instruments are worthless paper or digital records. That's why their issuers must provide some payment to their holders, and it is this payment what gives them value. Bitcoin issuers pay nothing, which renders Bitcoin worthless. Giving up valuable possessions just to be the holder of worthless digital record, is a very good example of how stupid can the humans be.

OK Mr. "I Hate Nothing" You're obviously taking a shit on bitcoin. You're implying that we're all idiots for holding bitcoin to have value and this is your defense: Oh I don't hate on useless bitcoin it's just a piece of software.

I'm not surprised you have 0 merits earned in this forum. I know that I and others will give merit where merit is due, even to bitcoin haters or people who have completely opposing ideologies to our own.

My only question is why? Why make this content?

Now let's rehash some points on to how bitcoin is not much different than other forms of money, and perhaps even better:


Here's how USD is created. A bank loans out $1000 using $100 of reserves. $900 created. Then the person who got the $900 gives it to someone else and he deposits $500 in the bank. The bank now can loan out another $5000.

It's all bullshit. Bitcoin may not be a physical thing but at least it can't be created using debt.

Now why do you hate on Bitcoin? Bitcoin does have inherent value as a utility. Gold is just a shiny metal and more can be mined or found.  Fiat currency is paper. Bitcoin's value is a monetary one but it also has proven scarcity so in my book it's superior to fiat and gold.

There are millions of people in the world that would give me a nice meal for some BTC I bet. And I would make someone a nice meal if they gave me some BTC. The world is still playing catch up but eventually there will be adoption. It may just take another 10-20 years.

edit: added "not" after "bitcoin may"

[antikvark]

What Fundemental feature are you talking about ?
Fundem feature is actually based on the age old traditional currencies whose value would plummet soon enough , Change is the nature of nature.
This is actually a very good example of how stupid can the humans be , wasting their time on Hating bitcoins and proving the value to be zero , instead go to your computer and give us a better option , discover a good option if your think this is a failure .

Why would anyone hate record in a database, as this is all what Bitcon is - a digital record held in a computer. I hate nothing. I am pointing out the human stupidity of purchasing this record for thousands of dollars although it pays zero monetary or non-monetary value to its holders. On their own, all financial instruments are worthless paper or digital records. That's why their issuers must provide some payment to their holders, and it is this payment what gives them value. Bitcoin issuers pay nothing, which renders Bitcoin worthless. Giving up valuable possessions just to be the holder of worthless digital record, is a very good example of how stupid can the humans be.

OK Mr. "I Hate Nothing" You're obviously taking a shit on bitcoin. You're implying that we're all idiots for holding bitcoin to have value and this is your defense: Oh I don't hate on useless bitcoin it's just a piece of software.

I'm not surprised you have 0 merits earned in this forum. I know that I and others will give merit where merit is due, even to bitcoin haters or people who have completely opposing ideologies to our own.

My only question is why? Why make this content?

Now let's rehash some points on to how bitcoin is not much different than other forms of money, and perhaps even better:


Here's how USD is created. A bank loans out $1000 using $100 of reserves. $900 created. Then the person who got the $900 gives it to someone else and he deposits $500 in the bank. The bank now can loan out another $5000.

It's all bullshit. Bitcoin may not be a physical thing but at least it can't be created using debt.

Now why do you hate on Bitcoin? Bitcoin does have inherent value as a utility. Gold is just a shiny metal and more can be mined or found.  Fiat currency is paper. Bitcoin's value is a monetary one but it also has proven scarcity so in my book it's superior to fiat and gold.

There are millions of people in the world that would give me a nice meal for some BTC I bet. And I would make someone a nice meal if they gave me some BTC. The world is still playing catch up but eventually there will be adoption. It may just take another 10-20 years.

edit: added "not" after "bitcoin may"

I am not implying that you're all idiots for holding bitcoin. I am implying that you act like idiots. Being an idiot and acting like one are two different things. Under extreme emotional pressure(greed) or due to ignorance, even intelligent people can act very idiotically. Those that would give you a nice meal for some BTC (worthless record) are good example of such behavior.

[coolcoinz]

As far as I can see the video is mostly downvoted.
I watched a few seconds and it's funny that you're giving instructions about the banking system like it was a working machine, while in fact it's a malfunctioning machine that may soon completely break down.
You say "this is how loan works, this is how colateral works, this is what banks will do if they default" No! This is what they are supposed to do but they don't. If they were working as they were intended to centuries ago there wouldn't be a Lehman Brothers collapse and Deutche Bank wouldn't be firing half of its staff.

[antikvark]

As far as I can see the video is mostly downvoted.
I watched a few seconds and it's funny that you're giving instructions about the banking system like it was a working machine, while in fact it's a malfunctioning machine that may soon completely break down.
You say "this is how loan works, this is how colateral works, this is what banks will do if they default" No! This is what they are supposed to do but they don't. If they were working as they were intended to centuries ago there wouldn't be a Lehman Brothers collapse and Deutche Bank wouldn't be firing half of its staff.

A sluggish engine is better than no engine at all. But FIAT engine is not sluggish since the majority of people do reply their loans and pledge collateral and in that way provide non-monetary payments to dollar holders. The rest of dollar holders are paid from bank's equity, since dollars are the liability of the banks.

[sana54210]

Price for bitcoins might be zero for the real world, but considering the digital world where we all survive and earn profits, we all know how valuable bitcoins is. Bitcoins have no fundamental value because it does not guarantee the payee that the payer pays and hence it might not be considered as a regulatory mean of payment outside the internet and hence it might be determined as zero value.

But, it is not the case with bitcoins as transacting with them digitally over the internet proves the proof of funds and the transactions occur at the following blocks for specific price. There are two actual worlds. First, where there is no internet and traditional payment methods overrule the markets and the second where currencies are been evolved into digital currencies. It depends on you, which world you want to survive. I choose the second.

[DannyHamilton]

I am pointing out the human stupidity of purchasing this record for thousands of dollars although it pays zero monetary or non-monetary value to its holders. On their own, all financial instruments are worthless paper or digital records. That's why their issuers must provide some payment to their holders, and it is this payment what gives them value. Bitcoin issuers pay nothing, which renders Bitcoin worthless. Giving up valuable possessions just to be the holder of worthless digital record, is a very good example of how stupid can the humans be.

Bitcoin IS a valuable possession.

Bitcoin has value just like gold has value.  It is more like a commodity than a "financial instrument".  There are no "issuers" of Bitcoin, just like there are no "issuers" of gold.

Control over Bitcoins offers value on its own, so there is no need for "some payment to holders".

[hv_]

I am pointing out the human stupidity of purchasing this record for thousands of dollars although it pays zero monetary or non-monetary value to its holders. On their own, all financial instruments are worthless paper or digital records. That's why their issuers must provide some payment to their holders, and it is this payment what gives them value. Bitcoin issuers pay nothing, which renders Bitcoin worthless. Giving up valuable possessions just to be the holder of worthless digital record, is a very good example of how stupid can the humans be.

Bitcoin IS a valuable possession.

Bitcoin has value just like gold has value.  It is more like a commodity than a "financial instrument".  There are no "issuers" of Bitcoin, just like there are no "issuers" of gold.

Control over Bitcoins offers value on its own, so there is no need for "some payment to holders".

It took gold / XAU some 100 / 1000 years to come up / be there - and stil has quite high volatility


we have Bitcoin not close to any stable value after 5 years and lots of forks in the zero sum game

(Segwit is 2 years old ... forget that)

Nothing can be said yet

[rdbase]

The linked 5-minute video provides a simple and undeniable proof that the real value of Bitcoin is zero. It does that by showing that Bitcoin lacks the fundamental feature for which all financial instruments exist in the first place, and that is to provide payment to their holders.

https://youtu.be/WSYTXmxPveY

More nonsense videos from antikvark.

Why am I not surprised.

I suggest, DO NOT WATCH HIS VIDEO.  He posts here to drive up his view count on YouTube. Watching his video just increases his ability to distribute his nonsense to more people.

I agree with you. One who comes here looking for insight about how bitcoin and the blockchain system works should not go by this video said user just posted. Because they will have misinformation given to them by one of those robotic voice instructional type videos you see posted on youtube about such things as how eggs are dangerous for you and how the government is part of the illuminati (shadow government) and is just picking at straws to be honest.
What I am saying, there is no substance to this video so avoid adding to their view count please.
It stood at 114 so those individuals have been infected with utter nonsense and pure drivel.
One can say the current financial system is a ponzi with the banks not actually hold the funds you see on the screen in your own bank account.
I liked when a rally was done to schedule everyone to try and withdraw all the funds from their bank accounts. And see if the banks can do it.
I never did hear about the result of it but would be interesting to see what the outcome was done in that one country.

[KonstantinosM]

I am not implying that you're all idiots for holding bitcoin. I am implying that you act like idiots. Being an idiot and acting like one are two different things. Under extreme emotional pressure(greed) or due to ignorance, even intelligent people can act very idiotically. Those that would give you a nice meal for some BTC (worthless record) are good example of such behavior.

So we are greedy and we act like fools.

So where is the proof that bitcoin's "Real" Value is zero?

What gives anything its "Value"

I would argue that financial value can be easily proven through the market. Even if we were all greedy fools, then bitcoin still has value.

Define the word "Empirically" and you will find that it contradicts your whole argument. Things proven empirically are things proven in the real world, not based on logic or theory.

Your argument is a theory based argument.


It's almost as old as bitcoin. You are all greedy fools and bitcoin is worthless.

But empirically I have bought and sold things using bitcoin.


I have eaten my lunch at work using bitcoin and I have worked (a little bit) for bitcoin.
Empirically bitcoin has value and that value is not zero.

If empirically the value of bitcoin was zero, you wouldn't mind giving me 100,000 Bitcoins for $100 since you'd be able to get 100,000 Bitcoins for 0 dollars.

So prove it to me. Send me 100,000 Bitcoins.

Oh what, you can't?

That's right because I just proved you to be a total "can't" no offence given to can't with a U either.

Edit:    Changed "Bitcoin'" to "Bitcoin's"
Edit 2: Changed "do" to "to" in "to be a total"

[antikvark]

I am not implying that you're all idiots for holding bitcoin. I am implying that you act like idiots. Being an idiot and acting like one are two different things. Under extreme emotional pressure(greed) or due to ignorance, even intelligent people can act very idiotically. Those that would give you a nice meal for some BTC (worthless record) are good example of such behavior.

So we are greedy and we act like fools.

So where is the proof that bitcoin's "Real" Value is zero?

What gives anything its "Value"

I would argue that financial value can be easily proven through the market. Even if we were all greedy fools, then bitcoin still has value.

Define the word "Empirically" and you will find that it contradicts your whole argument. Things proven empirically are things proven in the real world, not based on logic or theory.

Your argument is a theory based argument.


It's almost as old as bitcoin. You are all greedy fools and bitcoin is worthless.

But empirically I have bought and sold things using bitcoin.


I have eaten my lunch at work using bitcoin and I have worked (a little bit) for bitcoin.
Empirically bitcoin has value and that value is not zero.

If empirically the value of bitcoin was zero, you wouldn't mind giving me 100,000 Bitcoins for $100 since you'd be able to get 100,000 Bitcoins for 0 dollars.

So prove it to me. Send me 100,000 Bitcoins.

Oh what, you can't?

That's right because I just proved you to be a total "can't" no offence given to can't with a U either.

Edit:    Changed "Bitcoin'" to "Bitcoin's"
Edit 2: Changed "do" to "to" in "to be a total"

Your whole post is based on ignorance between market value and real value. Watch the video again.

[Kimi80]

The linked 5-minute video provides a simple and undeniable proof that the real value of Bitcoin is zero. It does that by showing that Bitcoin lacks the fundamental feature for which all financial instruments exist in the first place, and that is to provide payment to their holders.

https://youtu.be/WSYTXmxPveY

Do you believe this yourself?
Probably not, in other case you would not register on this forum.
Real value or not the truth stays the same - people were making money on it, they do and they will as long as the whole subject exists.

[shield132]

The linked 5-minute video provides a simple and undeniable proof that the real value of Bitcoin is zero. It does that by showing that Bitcoin lacks the fundamental feature for which all financial instruments exist in the first place, and that is to provide payment to their holders.

https://youtu.be/WSYTXmxPveY

Personally I don't give an attention to such videos, doesn't matter whether it will be bitcoin related or not.
What has value? Can you really tell me? What's good and what's bad? We decide it, yeah? So can 100% say the same on value. Nothing has value in reality, for lion it doesn't matter whether you give it gold or iron, food is what they are looking for and crave.
The value of gold, oil and etc, all of this is psychological factor.
If we think like the author of video, then USD has no value, it's just a piece of paper and I own 48 of them in notepaper and I have 100x such notepaper, I should be very rich. But again, value is psychological factor.

[DannyHamilton]

Your whole post is based on ignorance between market value and real value. Watch the video again.

Fortunately, Bitcoin has "real value", so market value doesn't matter.

[hv_]

Your whole post is based on ignorance between market value and real value. Watch the video again.

Fortunately, Bitcoin has "real value", so market value doesn't matter.

Segwit killed that

Price is not value btw

[DannyHamilton]

Fortunately, Bitcoin has "real value", so market value doesn't matter.

Segwit killed that

It did not.

Price is not value btw

Correct.  Bitcoin has value. Coincidentally, it also has price, but price is only an attempt by the markets to try to determine what that value might be.