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Author Topic: [CLOSED] KnC Titan Nightmare  (Read 31732 times)
elviselvis101
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October 06, 2014, 08:11:37 PM
 #261

I would like an update from anykeywhy
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Each block is stacked on top of the previous one. Adding another block to the top makes all lower blocks more difficult to remove: there is more "weight" above each block. A transaction in a block 6 blocks deep (6 confirmations) will be very difficult to remove.
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October 07, 2014, 01:49:23 PM
 #262

any news???
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October 08, 2014, 04:37:54 AM
 #263

What I dont get is why aren't all the others that invested heavily into this not kicking up a fuss, I would have expected a lot more activity since the thread got re-openend
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October 08, 2014, 06:36:17 PM
 #264

What I dont get is why aren't all the others that invested heavily into this not kicking up a fuss, I would have expected a lot more activity since the thread got re-openend

I have wrote privately to the OP many days ago, but i've never received a reply... i'm happy to have invested an irrelevant quantity of btc.

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October 08, 2014, 06:43:49 PM
 #265

This post will be updated shortly with the directions for the funds collection. (since the huge damage occurred/occurring, this time we can't anticipate the required amounts, sorry...)

So what's gonna happen to the miners if you won't sell all the shares?

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October 09, 2014, 05:38:32 AM
 #266

AKW was online last time 2 week ago. Looks like it's time to forget about our hashes.
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October 09, 2014, 07:43:14 PM
 #267

What I dont get is why aren't all the others that invested heavily into this not kicking up a fuss, I would have expected a lot more activity since the thread got re-openend

Same zero understanding here. How long do we give AKW before taking steps ?
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October 10, 2014, 11:26:52 AM
 #268

What I dont get is why aren't all the others that invested heavily into this not kicking up a fuss, I would have expected a lot more activity since the thread got re-openend

I have wrote privately to the OP many days ago, but i've never received a reply... i'm happy to have invested an irrelevant quantity of btc.

@alexrossi ...it was really-really-hard to find a former "question" in your tons of writing about your life and your friends and what you like to do in your PMs... ...anyway, we obviously can't directly refund you and, if you still haven't understood what's the BIG issue here with KfC, it is that they DON'T refund us.

__________________________________________________________________________


Please, don't blame us if crypto-currencies prices are falling during these last weeks...

__________________________________________________________________________


About the VAT, it went SUSPENDED at the moment of buying and paying, it is now due (see European laws about it) at the moment when the goods will be sent/carrier-transferred/received... still we can't figure exactly "when" but in any case this will happen sooner or later as KfC will send the titans. We had time to organize and to cooperate to solve these issues, we can't take the responsibilities and the blames at the same time simply because we haven't the cash needed to cover this "operation" instead of all the shareholders (and it's supposed we aren't obliged to) and immediately.

About the PSUs that someone keeps asking about... THE PSUs WERE NEVER BEEN INCLUDED. Titan miners NEED PSUs because they are not included by the manufacturer, you can check this pretty everywhere. To recap, we'll need the PSUs to power-on and use the titans, it's obvious...

About the order status, it is still shown as "Paid" so, not really consistent news... yesterday arrived a newsletter from KfC with just public news about the miners performances, nothing more. We have to wait while submerged by the KfC's PR sandboxes until they'll ship our miners and we'll be forced to solve the few things remaining...

About KfC late deliveries... ...what to say... ......... ...we're suffering from an incredible damage from KfC this year... that's obviously and absolutely not good and we prefer to not express any personal opinion about this publicly...

About ebay and other selling/recovering options, it's fine for us to find together a good solution to mitigate the damage... the discussion is obviously open...


About the mood... we (all) should try to cooperate and go further instead of insisting in futile and pointless polemics. Things are evolved like this as of now, it's a fact, we have to be "adult" and point forward for a positive and optimal solution that could work for all of us... we are all in the same boat, we should play together instead of against ourselves!

Please, join this discussion in a positive way and help yourself and all of us to go through this nth KfC nightmare...


Thanks and Cheers!
-akw-




P.Ss.:

"last login" timestamps doesn't really matter on our Forum... with "some" conditions you can leave sessions opened pretty "indefinitely"... Wink

We always did our best to reply to "concrete" PMs received, we are sorry if sometime we miss/forgot someone...



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October 10, 2014, 01:00:10 PM
 #269

@alexrossi ...it was really-really-hard to find a former "question" in your tons of writing about your life and your friends and what you like to do in your PMs... ...anyway, we obviously can't directly refund you and, if you still haven't understood what's the BIG issue here with KfC, it is that they DON'T refund us.

What i can say about this low quality italian-made irony? Again, happy to have invested an irrelevant quantity of btc.

Quote
About KfC late deliveries... ...what to say... ......... ...we're suffering from an incredible damage from KfC this year

You definitely deserve it, after these words (26-06-2014, 11:51:09):

Quote
il discorso ROI non ci preoccupa affatto e, soprattutto dopo le ultime notizie da KnC, non ci preoccupa nemmeno il mercato "rivale", inferiore assolutamente in termini di eventuale convenienza btc/MH/qualità/affidabilità....

For english people

Quote
ROI don't minimal worry us, and overall, after the latest news of KnC, we even don't mind the competition on ASIC scrypt, since it is absolutely lower on the btc/MH/quality/reliability ratio

Yes AKW, at least the competition has shipped those crappy pieces of hardware when they still were useful. Why not share with us a selfie with your gold plated KnC titan when you will receive it? And please, continue to support the preorder logic when at the time of the pre-order there already was in-hand scrypt stuff.. KnC desperately need your money!

Quote
that's obviously and absolutely not good and we prefer to not express any personal opinion about this publicly...

Yes, i definitely prefer your fake cheerfulness


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▀▀███████▄▄███████▀▀
▀▀▀████████▀▀▀
█████████████LEADING CRYPTO SPORTSBOOK & CASINO█████████████
MULTI
CURRENCY
1500+
CASINO GAMES
CRYPTO EXCLUSIVE
CLUBHOUSE
FAST & SECURE
PAYMENTS
.
..PLAY NOW!..
elviselvis101
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October 10, 2014, 09:08:16 PM
 #270

What I dont get is why aren't all the others that invested heavily into this not kicking up a fuss, I would have expected a lot more activity since the thread got re-openend

I have wrote privately to the OP many days ago, but i've never received a reply... i'm happy to have invested an irrelevant quantity of btc.

@alexrossi ...it was really-really-hard to find a former "question" in your tons of writing about your life and your friends and what you like to do in your PMs... ...anyway, we obviously can't directly refund you and, if you still haven't understood what's the BIG issue here with KfC, it is that they DON'T refund us.

__________________________________________________________________________


Please, don't blame us if crypto-currencies prices are falling during these last weeks...

__________________________________________________________________________


About the VAT, it went SUSPENDED at the moment of buying and paying, it is now due (see European laws about it) at the moment when the goods will be sent/carrier-transferred/received... still we can't figure exactly "when" but in any case this will happen sooner or later as KfC will send the titans. We had time to organize and to cooperate to solve these issues, we can't take the responsibilities and the blames at the same time simply because we haven't the cash needed to cover this "operation" instead of all the shareholders (and it's supposed we aren't obliged to) and immediately.

About the PSUs that someone keeps asking about... THE PSUs WERE NEVER BEEN INCLUDED. Titan miners NEED PSUs because they are not included by the manufacturer, you can check this pretty everywhere. To recap, we'll need the PSUs to power-on and use the titans, it's obvious...

About the order status, it is still shown as "Paid" so, not really consistent news... yesterday arrived a newsletter from KfC with just public news about the miners performances, nothing more. We have to wait while submerged by the KfC's PR sandboxes until they'll ship our miners and we'll be forced to solve the few things remaining...

About KfC late deliveries... ...what to say... ......... ...we're suffering from an incredible damage from KfC this year... that's obviously and absolutely not good and we prefer to not express any personal opinion about this publicly...

About ebay and other selling/recovering options, it's fine for us to find together a good solution to mitigate the damage... the discussion is obviously open...


About the mood... we (all) should try to cooperate and go further instead of insisting in futile and pointless polemics. Things are evolved like this as of now, it's a fact, we have to be "adult" and point forward for a positive and optimal solution that could work for all of us... we are all in the same boat, we should play together instead of against ourselves!

Please, join this discussion in a positive way and help yourself and all of us to go through this nth KfC nightmare...


Thanks and Cheers!
-akw-




P.Ss.:

"last login" timestamps doesn't really matter on our Forum... with "some" conditions you can leave sessions opened pretty "indefinitely"... Wink

We always did our best to reply to "concrete" PMs received, we are sorry if sometime we miss/forgot someone...






Thanks for the update, so lets work together to resolve this: first could this, Swedish attorney Magnus Daar, be an option for us;

https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/knc-titans-missed-quarter-3-deadline-refunds/
if we (you) follow the guideline ?

(I still do not understand the tax part: no vat when trading between eu companies, I never pay import tax when buying hardware from Germany, I am in Denmark.
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October 11, 2014, 11:27:08 AM
 #271


@alexrossi  Please go collect your signature campaign bonuses elsewhere, anyone already knows that you're always ready to blame others and feel "like their master" while being always and totally pointless... thanks so much for your precious collaboration.
anykeywhy (OP)
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October 11, 2014, 11:27:19 AM
 #272


Thanks for the update, so lets work together to resolve this: first could this, Swedish attorney Magnus Daar, be an option for us;

https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/knc-titans-missed-quarter-3-deadline-refunds/
if we (you) follow the guideline ?

(I still do not understand the tax part: no vat when trading between eu companies, I never pay import tax when buying hardware from Germany, I am in Denmark.


Nice catch! Thanks for the informations!

We'll contact this lawyer in the coming days, in your opinion, how much should we offer as "bounty" if he can accept our case? Something like the 10%-20% it would be good for you? Any other suggestion? Are we sure to go that way (better to vote for a majority?)?  (please continue reading)

about the "tax part": at the moment of purchasing a good (EU-EU), if you pay the VAT at the moment of buying (eg. included in price), then no other "taxes" are due. Elsewhere, if you haven't paid the VAT at the moment of buying a good, it goes "suspended" and it is due later when the good is shipped/transported/received... because it wasn't included before as a component of the final price during the sale (the VAT "isn't an asset" under control of the seller nor of the buyer)


If we'll be able to go for the legal way, we wouldn't need anymore the PSUs and we'll have to be ready to ship back the Titans once we'll receive them...

BUT, at the same time, we'll be charged by new risks and new costs... what if the legal-way doesn't succeed or become only a waste of time? The lawyer should be paid anyway, the time lost will not come back, and the residual-value of the "investment" would become a great question mark in case the legal action for some reason wouldn't help us... Unfortunately, we have to consider the bad scenario too...
Another point is that "the public faces" and the legal responsibilities for such actions will not be "technically" yours but ours... as eventually, the consequences would impact directly on us and not you...

Are we sure that wouldn't be more convenient for us to wait to receive the miners and to try to sell them in some way, in order to recover as much as we can but without adding other variable costs, risks and time? We would also avoid big-volume and unjustified bank transfers and fiat amounts that would happen in case of "legal success"... that more likely would also trig unwanted red-flags, verifications and additional taxes for us...?


We think that we should consider and ponder well the costs/risks/timings involved in both "ways", the legal one and the selling one... please, share your opinions here!


Thanks and Cheers!
-akw-

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October 11, 2014, 01:25:03 PM
 #273

BUT, at the same time, we'll be charged by new risks and new costs... what if the legal-way doesn't succeed or become only a waste of time?

Why should be a waste of time? The right to cancel a purchase is pretty clear and well explained here:

http://www.konsumentverket.se/otherlanguages/English/Consumer-rights/Right-to-cancel-a-purchase-Right-of-withdrawal/

especially:

Quote
The right of withdrawal applies from the day you receive the goods, in the case of services, the day the contract is entered into. If the seller has not informed you of the right of withdrawal, you have one year's right of withdrawal.

You are allowed to inspect the goods, and the right of withdrawal also applies if you have had to alter the goods in order to inspect them. If you have altered the goods more than was necessary, the company has a right to make a deduction when you cancel the purchase as a result of the reduction in value.

You have to send the goods back to the seller and you have to pay the return delivery costs. The seller will then refund the full amount you have paid, including delivery costs that you paid when the goods were sent to you. The refund must be made as soon as possible and within 14 days from the day you cancelled.


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ellave
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October 15, 2014, 08:15:13 PM
 #274

I am sure you are all aware but - https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/knc-class-action-investigation-into-knc-miners-mischief/
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October 18, 2014, 12:14:02 PM
 #275


"updates" so far:

- no replies received

- orders still showing as "Paid" and not "Processing"

- not so much of you joined this discussion

- on Monday we'll try to send an email again and we hope to finally get some consistent informations about these "fresh" legal actions

- You're welcome to share your opinion/ideas here and to try to involve other shareholders to do the same and join this discussion, we're all on the same boat...


Cheers!
-akw-
elviselvis101
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October 20, 2014, 10:15:23 PM
 #276


Thanks for the update, so lets work together to resolve this: first could this, Swedish attorney Magnus Daar, be an option for us;

https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/knc-titans-missed-quarter-3-deadline-refunds/
if we (you) follow the guideline ?

(I still do not understand the tax part: no vat when trading between eu companies, I never pay import tax when buying hardware from Germany, I am in Denmark.


Nice catch! Thanks for the informations!

We'll contact this lawyer in the coming days, in your opinion, how much should we offer as "bounty" if he can accept our case? Something like the 10%-20% it would be good for you? Any other suggestion? Are we sure to go that way (better to vote for a majority?)?  (please continue reading)

about the "tax part": at the moment of purchasing a good (EU-EU), if you pay the VAT at the moment of buying (eg. included in price), then no other "taxes" are due. Elsewhere, if you haven't paid the VAT at the moment of buying a good, it goes "suspended" and it is due later when the good is shipped/transported/received... because it wasn't included before as a component of the final price during the sale (the VAT "isn't an asset" under control of the seller nor of the buyer)


If we'll be able to go for the legal way, we wouldn't need anymore the PSUs and we'll have to be ready to ship back the Titans once we'll receive them...

BUT, at the same time, we'll be charged by new risks and new costs... what if the legal-way doesn't succeed or become only a waste of time? The lawyer should be paid anyway, the time lost will not come back, and the residual-value of the "investment" would become a great question mark in case the legal action for some reason wouldn't help us... Unfortunately, we have to consider the bad scenario too...
Another point is that "the public faces" and the legal responsibilities for such actions will not be "technically" yours but ours... as eventually, the consequences would impact directly on us and not you...

Are we sure that wouldn't be more convenient for us to wait to receive the miners and to try to sell them in some way, in order to recover as much as we can but without adding other variable costs, risks and time? We would also avoid big-volume and unjustified bank transfers and fiat amounts that would happen in case of "legal success"... that more likely would also trig unwanted red-flags, verifications and additional taxes for us...?


We think that we should consider and ponder well the costs/risks/timings involved in both "ways", the legal one and the selling one... please, share your opinions here!


Thanks and Cheers!
-akw-




Hi anykeywhy,

Thanks for the tax explanation, holy crap, I did not know that, it sucks. Now a refund is a much better "deal", no need for paying the tax and psu´s + somebody said the mining value is now 27 times worse than 6 month ago!?!  Now I understand your problem of going "public" in a suit , that makes this situation more messed up. My suggestion, a poll with options, fair for you and os.... can`t come up with something better right now.

Bounty to the lawyer of 20%. The return-law is the same here in Denmark, so if there is money in the company at the time of court decision, KNC will pay, but many unknowns here...

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October 26, 2014, 10:38:45 PM
 #277

just fund this site:

http://www.kncrefund.com/
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October 28, 2014, 01:14:11 AM
Last edit: October 28, 2014, 07:58:01 AM by ellave
 #278

I'm not denying the VAT payments but how come I haven't seen anyone else mention it when they talk of their titans?
 
Also I see they are now stating they will all be shipped in the next 3 weeks - http://forum.kncminer.com/forum/news-and-anouncments/65213-buckle-up-titan-speed-bump
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October 31, 2014, 01:32:04 PM
 #279


Confirmed. The new legal action was started, we hired another Law Firm and we have now to hope and cross our fingers for this bad story to resolve in a positive and maybe quick way at the end...

Even without sufficient feedback from you, we decided to take the risks involved and we paid, we'll pay and we are paying these actions against KfC until it will be possible... No moneys were contributed by shareholders of any GB, we'll recover the spent amounts on the positive ending of this story, WE HOPE!
Really a looooot of money are flowing out *thankfully* to KfC.....

Nobody can tell us a precise timing for these "actions" to complete, you should be aware that, it would need months or years to see an ending or a definitive court decision about our cases and it could also turn bad and resolve in nothing if not in a major loss for us... it's useless to create false illusions, we can't be sure of nothing at this point if not that our cases "should" be "well founded" from a legal point-of-view...

Anyway, that's the best strategy/way for trying to contain our losses and mitigate the damages occurred/occurring if not to finally have our consumer's rights protected against the KfC behavior...


*****
On a further consideration, please note that we are literally "putting our faces" and taking in first person all the responsibilities and consequences that would/could derive from these legal actions... also on your behalf!
It's really delusional to see only a few of you joining and collaborating on this discussion, or simply sharing their's ideas or support...
*****


We'll remain at disposal and we'll update you as more concrete news will be available, the PM way to trigger our attention or ask for something is always a good way to use if you don't see us active for a while... (but please do not expect high-frequency updates, unforutnately, "these things" require "some time")


We are sorry that everything went the wrong way since KfC decided to turn to the "dark-side" at our loss, please don't blame us for what is happening but let's go instead to "make some noise on Teh Internet" by saying what REALLY KfC is and how they "act" in respect of their's "loyal customers" who bring to them the resources for becoming "what they seems to be from the outside, now"...

[...]
It's shocking how they can publicly attract millions of dollars in VC investments while, at the same time, they're litterally screwing up pretty all the people and businesses who concretely supported them by giving them "a lot of advantages" by pre-paying their products... It seems that KnC is taking profits and advantages from abusing also of the fragmentation, the dispersion and the "composition" of the really small and weak "crypto-ecosystem" where a lot of personal (eg. age), regional (eg. laws) or regulatory (eg. taxes) issues adds up and too often happen on the customer side, making hard or impossible for them to protect and defend their "rights" in such complex "international" situations...
On the more, people have to forcefully take as "holy law" the statements from KfC (because they wrote "Product not Refundable" on their website) and totally give up on their conditions while hoping to save at least 1/30 of what they spent...
[...]


KfC *seems* to be a platinum member of BTCfoundation even if there isn't any proof of payment as of today... please, read carefully all the following thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=621770.msg9374929#msg9374929


That's a really awful and stressing situation as you can easily imagine, this time we'll avoid to enumerate all the implications, if you have any thought that may help, please share it!


_________________________________

On a more colorful side-note, "someone" of you is legally and personally threating us as we should be responsible of KfC faults and their delays depend from us... *BIG-LAUGH* ...what to say, that's obviously "not good for the mood"... ...unfortunately, not everybody is able to use his "so-called" brain, why we should expect they to be able to use google or to get real a life?? However, people invent everyday a new and artistic way to try to profit from others with zero efforts... it's not surprising at all that "someone" have not any truly alternative way to look for a positive income in its life than to LIE..................
__________________________________
__________________________________



thanks @elviselvis for linking this http://www.kncrefund.com/ here! Real informations are slowly reaching the surface and emerging as they really are... we'd need a way lot more NOISE to be done on this!

thanks @alexrossi for your support in the italian section, much appreciated!

___________


We're glad to see that "the tone" of the PMs is becoming more polite as the REAL news about KfC are starting to spread... thank you!

__________________________________
__________________________________




Sorry for the late and "sparse" updates and, as usual, for the bad English...   Smiley

Stay positive, have a good time & Cheers!   Smiley
-akw-

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October 31, 2014, 01:53:45 PM
 #280

I really appreciate the starting of the legal action, hope all the best for our shares, and i also apologize that i can't be more helpful with the legal action since i know it will be a very stressful thing to manage for you.

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▀▀███████▄▄███████▀▀
▀▀▀████████▀▀▀
█████████████LEADING CRYPTO SPORTSBOOK & CASINO█████████████
MULTI
CURRENCY
1500+
CASINO GAMES
CRYPTO EXCLUSIVE
CLUBHOUSE
FAST & SECURE
PAYMENTS
.
..PLAY NOW!..
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