Are newbies persecuted on this forum?

[~KiD~]

Yesterday I joined the forum, and after 1 post I got negative trust just because someone don't trust me.
How can someone say "I don't trust you!" after one post and accuse you that you are promoting a product?

I use Brave extension (chromium based) SetupVPN which is very easy to use and reliable.
Just try multiple VPN providers and choose one that fits your needs.

The thread name is: Which VPN to pick?  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5225792.0

[1714872282]

1714872282

[1714872282]

1714872282

[dkbit98]

1st post ever in bitcointalk forum:

I use Brave extension (chromium based) SetupVPN which is very easy to use and reliable.

I do not promote any product

Very easy
You are just a fake newbie, and you are not being persecuted, just NOT trusted by me.
http://archive.ph/iZHsh

Trust feedback is not permanent, and it can change...in future.

[Starlight2]

I agree with you! I'm newbies and write a simple message and it was deleted. Why? there was no ads, nothing strange. I'm just new there.

[DdmrDdmr]

<…>

That was a nice welcome to the forum indeed …

The VPN you state you are using, since it’s a Brave extension, I’d assume it’s not a proper VPN, but rather much a proxy. Regardless, that is not really the issue, nor the nature behind at this stage. I may not like your proposal (as others on the VPN thread), but that does not qualify for negative Trust in my book.

Trust feedback’s main aim is on providing feedback for economical transactions. This here does not quality as such, since it is an opinion based on "poor criteria" (as per the tagger’s criteria). If we go by poor criteria we’d probably have to tag the majority of accounts here on the forum at some point, mine included.

Now some people tag others for reasons related to scams, and here we fall on the frontier of what the Trust system covers in intent. Indeed if someone is deliberately trying to scam others, there is an economical nature under the surface, and therefore using Trust tagging is applicable in principle, providing there is solid evidence that the intent is to scam, and the intent here for me is key. Here I do not consider that you had an intent of the nature.

Tagging is also used for all sorts of other reasons, which it should not, and at some point, it would be better to have a dual system: one for economical feedback and one for other type of feedback (such as "nice guy", "dumb troll" and so forth). That nevertheless is a different matter, and we only have the current system to go with (along with the Trust Flag system which is more to the point on economic issues in principle).

It’s probably best to read the whole post I’m going to extract here, but I’m highlighting the core principle of the ratings here as per the real one above all (on the forum):

<…>
Ratings
 - Leave positive ratings if you actively think that trading with this person is safer than with a random person.
 - Leave negative ratings if you actively think that trading with the person is less safe than with a random person.
 - Unstable behavior could very occasionally be an acceptable reason for leaving negative trust, but if it looks like you're leaving negative trust due to personal disagreements, then that's inappropriate. Ratings are not for popularity contests, virtue signalling, punishing people for your idea of wrongthink, etc. <…>

Bearing that in mind, negative trust here is uncalled for in my opinion.

The main problem is that not that many people know the exact usage to apply to the Trust System, and that makes the textboxes’s content spin away from the system’s intent. There is also no real hardcore concensus on all that is applicable, regardless of what the quoted text above states.

[JeromeTash]

Nope newbies are not persecuted here. The problem is that many scammers and malicious people create accounts to trick people here so some people have trust issues.

Negative feedback is given at a personal level so you have to discuss with whoever left you feedback and prove to them you have no evil intentions. I personally wouldn't leave someone negative feedback at first glance until i am more than sure that there is malicious intent because i know how painful it is to be accused of something you are not.

[tataren]

I got the impression that if you just registered here, then you are like nobody here. So in principle it is, but I would like posts to not be deleted. For example, my post was published in the topic about Bitcoin and decentralization, here is the text:

As for me I still believe in bitcoin decentralization. Especially I believe more and more after all the events with money and banks in the world..

so what's wrong???

[dkbit98]

Bearing that in mind, negative trust here is uncalled for in my opinion.

That is your opinion, but I participated in discussion about VPN, and you did not.
He created new account with specific purpose to promote this specific shitVPN and posted 3 minutes after registration.

[DdmrDdmr]

<...>
As for me I still believe in bitcoin decentralization. Especially I believe more and more after all the events with money and banks in the world..

so what's wrong???

Your post was probably reported for "low content value" (aka spam to some extent). That is one of the main reasons for post getting deleted, and although many posts of the kind will remain undeleted, some are reported and, if the moderator agrees, will be removed.

I’d suggest to elaborate more on your opinion there. The above is a simple one-liner summary, but I’m sure if you rattle your brain a bit more you’ll come up with a better versed and argument-backed type narrative in your post.

Bottom line is that posts that are social media chat-type (Telegram,WhatsApp, and so forth) fall short here in general, as the forum is more on discussing with a wee futher depth than on social platforms.

<...>

Precisely. The forum is opinion based, and therefore we can differ. For rules and DT stuff there are hints on how they apply, and as such, I consider that @theymo’s quoted post is applicable to my standards. Again, you’re free to differ.

Note: I’ve read the VPN thread before providing the above answer, No need to participate there to gather the context I needed.

<...>But I can judge situation better than you,
and as I said my feedback can change easy if I am proven wrong

Whatever...

[Jawhead999]

I got the impression that if you just registered here, then you are like nobody here. So in principle it is, but I would like posts to not be deleted. For example, my post was published in the topic about Bitcoin and decentralization, here is the text:

As for me I still believe in bitcoin decentralization. Especially I believe more and more after all the events with money and banks in the world..

so what's wrong???

1. No zero or low value, pointless or uninteresting posts or threads. [1][e]

You shouldn't only make post just only believe, i agree, etc.
This is same example if you post only say "Bitcoin will pump to $999999999999999999999....." but you didn't say the reason or the point of your post.
Try to learn and read much more in this forum before you want to make post
You should read the rules to make you more understand https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=703657.0

[dkbit98]

Note: I’ve read the VPN thread before providing the above answer, No need to participate there to gather the context I needed.

True.
But I can judge situation better than you (in this case),
and as I said my feedback can change easy if I am proven wrong.

or ~KiD~ can just continue to use his other accounts in this forum

[Bitcoin_Arena]

This topic is best fitted for the Reputations Board so as to get more input for other DT members. OP move it there if you don't mind.

I just did a small search on the cause of conflict which is SetupVPN and while i can not confirm how good it is or endorse it. It has quite a number of users using it's extension. so if that is OP's choice then let him use it.

@dkbit98 i think there is no need of tagging OP just because he said he prefers using SetupVPN unless you have proof that they are scammers or are malicious. Remember you are of DT and every single decision you make can have a ripple effect.
If you have been very observant, look at the older members. Some even voluntarily wanted to get blacklisted from DT because of the aftermath of their earlier actions.

I always keep echoing this. If we go one tagging each and every new person here just because they mentioned or promoted a website we never used or don't know then we are headed for a bad atmosphere for genuine newbies.
Just remember that we were all newbies at one point. Let's go slow when making decisions to tag  

[dkbit98]

...

He can use whatever he wants, BUT creating new account just to promote and recommend that product - NO.
As far as I know he can be some gov. agent or spy so I will not help him to get data from all bitcointalk users.
If you want to do so be my guest.

He obviously have other accounts here, and he can use them if he wants to talk.

SetupVPN may ask you to provide personal information, such as your e-mail address, name, home address, or telephone number. We may also collect information about how you interact with SetupVPN sites and services. For example, we may use site analysis tools to retrieve information from your browser, including the site you came from, the search engine and keywords you used to find our site, the pages you view within our site, your browser add-ons, and your browser’s width and height. We may also use technologies, such as cookies, to collect information about the pages you view, the links you click, and other actions you perform on our sites and products. Additionally, we collect certain standard information that your browser sends to every website you visit, such as your IP address, browser type and language, access times, and referring Web site addresses.

So they collect your real name and address, and log everything you do while using their product. That's not a VPN, that's a surveillance program. If you are using this, I would recommend uninstalling it immediately.

[yahoo62278]

This type of feedback is unwarranted from DT period. You wanna give anything it should be a neutral rating, but giving a neg is IMO abusing the trust system. Is the VPN stealing users info or scamming someone? If so, then red tag him. If not, change to neutral.

[dkbit98]

This type of feedback is unwarranted from DT period. You wanna give anything it should be a neutral rating, but giving a neg is IMO abusing the trust system. Is the VPN stealing users info or scamming someone? If so, then red tag him. If not, change to neutral.

OK changed to neutral.

You should maybe also change a bunch of your feedback Yahoo.
Remember that you are also DT and campaign manager.
Remember Yobit campaign?

Period.

[yahoo62278]

This type of feedback is unwarranted from DT period. You wanna give anything it should be a neutral rating, but giving a neg is IMO abusing the trust system. Is the VPN stealing users info or scamming someone? If so, then red tag him. If not, change to neutral.

OK changed to neutral.

You should also change a bunch of your feedback Yahoo.
Remember that you are also DT and campaign manager.
Remember Yobit campaign?

Period.

Point out which feedbacks you feel should be changed and i'll have a look. As far as Yobit goes, you have the option to tag me, ~ me, or go on with life. I asked for community opinion before opening that particular campaign. You may or may not have posted your opinion, but those who did post(other DT members), were for a manager vs no manager.

No need to get testy man. I can take criticism without getting mad.

[dkbit98]

No need to get testy man. I can take criticism without getting mad.

I am not being mad and I can be wrong, as I said my feedback can change easily,
but more mess was created with that campaign with ripple effects.
If you trust Yobit exchange and ~KiD~ that is your choice.

For example are you being mad here or not?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=2688418

Is this Scam accusation still valid?
I was involved in similar case but I changed my feedback to neutral.

[yahoo62278]

No need to get testy man. I can take criticism without getting mad.

I am not being mad and I can be wrong, as I said my feedback can change easily,
but more mess was created with that campaign with ripple effects.
If you trust Yobit exchange and ~KiD~ that is your choice.

For example are you being mad here or not?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=2688418

Is this Scam accusation still valid?
I was involved in similar case but I changed my feedback to neutral.

We are getting off topic here, but that particular case is not the same as this 1. Roobet accepted a bet(their own coding flaw), I won the bet, they refused to pay it. They stole 9k and lost a player over it. I did not go nuts in their gambling thread and try to ruin their business. I posted a thread stating what happened, left a fair rating due to the fact they just dismissed my claim, and went on about my business.

Glad they paid you, but the case was not the same for me.

[dkbit98]

Glad they paid you, but the case was not the same for me.

Other DT members also don't agree with you, not just me.
And I did ask Roobet several times to talk with you.

Back to the ~KiD~ case:
He now has neutral feedback and I am monitoring him.
Lets see if he is a genuine innocent newbie or something else.

[YOSHIE]

What should be debated, opinions, suspicions or whatnot.

VPN: All have their own opinions.

See the boss who said it;

I use NordVPN to connect each of my home PCs on a different IP address.   It's so reliable I am on it 24x7 and don't notice any issues.

now what is the conclusion.....
Problem with SetupVPN I've seen this account that post: suggested it.

evan45245

I also hope iOS app gets released, would be so cool for a Cryptonote coin. And to use Crex if you're on chrome download the SetupVPN extension and set country to UK or any other besides US/Canada.

Then there is also https://tradeogre.com

however...

[The Sceptical Chymist]

I just did a small search on the cause of conflict which is SetupVPN and while i can not confirm how good it is or endorse it. It has quite a number of users using it's extension. so if that is OP's choice then let him use it.

I don't know anything about SetupVPN, but it doesn't sound like OP is promoting it, just giving his opinion about it (albeit in a pretty low-value post).  I don't think he should have gotten tagged for that.  It might look like he created an account for the purpose of shilling that VPN, but it could well be the first thread he saw that caught his eye.

And no, OP, newbies usually aren't given an instant red trust like you got.  As I said, I don't think you were deserving of a neg--but we'll see what the rest of the community has to say.