These Anti-KYC Stuffs Tiring Non-Techies Up

[bitcoiners98]

1. Should I give up hard-work faking my name, my number, my email, etc., and just submit into KYC stuffs to make life easier?

2. Issue-A: Having a hard time buying coins without submitting into KYC entities. If I go peer-to-peer markets, its so expensive.
Issue-B: Having a hard time cashing out without submitting into KYC entities.

3. I dont know things about hiding I.P.s, VPNs, TOR browser, coin joining, coin mixing, etc., and Im not planning to learn and use it. So I know everything about my crypto activities are traceable because Im not techie. Does that mean I should just surrender any effort to get anonymous and just submit into KYC, because its just the same (my I.P. is not hidden, etc.)?

Im in a developing country here in Asia where cryptos are not illegal I believe. Im investing/trading not much, only around $1000-$1500 back and forth, circulating in my accounts.
4. Will these KYC things (submitting my documents) do any harm on me?

Yes, I know privacy is important, but it really tires me up. With this little amount, I think I wont be of a target of hackers/bad guys (a waste of time for them). Right?

[avikz]

There are many ways to hide your identity while doing crypto trading. The best way to use decentralized exchanges or commonly what we know as DEX. There are so many DEX available in the market and I don't want to take any particular name. Do you research to find the best DEX for you to use. These are not bound by any geographical boundaries and no DEX will ask for your KYC because they don't hold your funds.

You can use coinswap features of decentralized exchanges. These are easy and you don't need to be techie to understand how it works. Just look at few youtube videos and do little research. No one can spoon-feed you here so you need to do little research before you can finalize your approach. 

But if you are really serious about your trading activities and you want to continue it for a longer time in future, it's always better to use reputable exchanges which are not decentralized. For a trading volume of $1000-$1500, you shouldn't run into any issue.

Hope this helps!

[20kevin20]

1. NO. Never give it up no matter how hard it gets. This is exactly what we should stop doing. The more people who stop giving their information away for free, the better it gets. It's intentionally all created so it gets harder for you. It gets harder if you want not to accept cookies anymore, it gets harder if you don't want to give up your information anymore etc. It's been shaped up this way for us to effectively give up completely and it's been working tremendously for them.

2. Exactly what I said: get ready to have a harder internet life. Have patience and find new ways to solve your problems without having to sell yourself to other entities. Try Bisq or Komodo's Atomic DEX. Peer-to-peer is the way to do things.

3. No! Even if you do not use Tor or other kind of IP & traffic obfuscation, not giving up your personal information is critical and much better than nothing. There are plenty of ways you can go off the grid right now and change the way you browse, transact etc. Check out Wasabi Wallet which has coinjoin and Tor integrated; you can even use hardware wallets: https://www.wasabiwallet.io/

4. Directly, most likely no. But in time, it will. Your personal information gets all submitted to different entities and one day you may find out your personal information has been stolen and sold by hackers or you've been part of who-knows-what investigation and are suspected for X crimes. Why let them get into your personal, private space? Fuck them! Stay away and protect your name, protect your ID, protect everything related to you!

Your information is worth a lot of money on the black markets. You got very used to services that offer very fast support, transactions etc but did you ever think that maybe the websites you're using aren't really free and you're fuelling them everything they need for free? Do you really think Facebook, Twitter, WhatsApp, Reddit etc are all 100% free and they're not feeding off your personal info at all? Stay off the grid as much as you can, NEVER give up!

[mk4]

It honestly depends on you and your personal risk appetite; as you're obviously going to be getting various opinions concerning this. If you're willing to take all the hassle for better privacy(which is definitely a good idea), then go with it. On the other hand, if you pay your taxes and such and keep most or all things transparent, then I personally think it would be fine. Unfortunately sometimes KYC is necessary. It's just that you shouldn't randomly throw in your documents on multiple platforms. If I personally was on the US, I'd probably just only submit to Coinbase Pro and nothing else.

^I'm pretty sure it's going to be quite controversial, but whatever.

[tsaroz]

I go with the same dilemma everyday. One of the reason why people don't want to verify their KYC is due to the uncertainty of crypto legality in the future. The current government in my country is democratic and okish but we can't be sure about the future as politics here is very uncertain. And if any government in the future banned crypto and intended to confiscate every crypto fund it's citizen have, we could be really doomed for having a verified KYC.

[Ucy]

Well, I think majority will always choose the easy way. But always bear in mind that the easy ways always have dangerous consequences. So be careful what you go for. Nobody stops you from using the current kyc. It's your choice. The minority who are cautious know the risk and would rather go for a safer kyc when it becomes available.

[Yudhisthir]

If you really want to trade anonymously, there are many DEX that don't ask questions. You can even trade ERC or TRX token by manually adding them to the appropriate dex while you can always find a like minded person to do P2P trade. Though they would be hassle and may cost you a bit more, they are the best way if you don't want to do illegal KYC.

[buwaytress]

P2P marketplaces too expensive? Which have you tried? I actually get significantly better rates from Localbitcoins when I'm patient, and the KYC there isn't too strict compared to some exchanges when it comes to smaller levels of monthly trades, which you might fit into. Or try Bisq and never KYC, set your own rates.

Personally, I've KYC'd at LBC, I trust them (not a good reason to KYC of course) and at another exchange since it's more convenient for urgent exchanges.

[o_e_l_e_o]

I dont know things about hiding I.P.s, VPNs, TOR browser, coin joining, coin mixing, etc., and Im not planning to learn and use it.

Why not? There was a point in time where everyone knew nothing about Tor, VPNs, coin mixers, etc. It doesn't take much time or effort to gain a working knowledge of these things. Why are you even asking questions regarding your security and privacy if you have already resigned yourself to never bothering to learn?

If I personally was on the US, I'd probably just only submit to Coinbase Pro and nothing else.

^I'm pretty sure it's going to be quite controversial, but whatever.

You're right on the second part.

Coinbase are shady as hell. They openly admitted that they hand out customers' details to third parties for "processing", and that some of these third parties share and sell that data with even more third parties, all without their users' knowledge and consent. They hand over customers' data to the government. They formed a partnership with a company who produce and sell privacy invading software to dictatorships and human rights abusers. I wouldn't trust them with a single satoshi, let alone all my personal details.

Or try Bisq and never KYC, set your own rates.

Pretty much this. I trade exclusively peer-to-peer, and pay less in fees than I would on a centralized exchange. Often I'm trading with people I've traded with before and trust, or if I'm trading on the forum, then the only fee I'm paying is a transaction fee of a few sats per vbyte.

[rdbase]

KYC should only be involved when an individual is looking to withdraw large sums cryptocurrency into their local funds.
If those certain individuals use these funds for organized crime then they will trace them back to the place or origin.
This being the business who sent them those funds and they would be on the hook at this point.
Just look at the case with crypto capital for example.
The numbers did add up from what they owed to the crime lords to what they were trying to hide from the court then all the sudden pulled out.

[Tipstar]

Even if you are cautious about providing KYC only to the most trusted parties, when you distribute your personal info, there's always a chance of it being used for illicit activities. Look at binance KYC hack, who would have thought KYC from a trusted exchange like binance would leak with your face? Binance did reward the people with leaked info with VIP status, but theres always a price.

[Harlot]

4. Will these KYC things (submitting my documents) do any harm on me?

Yes, I know privacy is important, but it really tires me up. With this little amount, I think I wont be of a target of hackers/bad guys (a waste of time for them). Right?

As long as you submit those KYC documents in a safe and trusted crypto exchange in your country I believe that you have nothing to worry about unless it is about hacks. Businesses in the crypto industry didn't want KYC in the first place but when the government got more involved with the crypto industry a KYC requirement for AML procedures is an inevitable thing to happen. You should be used to it by now since if we are talking about cryptos we are talking about assets and all assets market we have like stock exchanges and the forex market all of them require KYC as a standard by their SEC. Privacy shouldn't be the issue here since if you submit it on a trusted exchange they won't be spilling it out to anyone for business purposes.

[mk4]

Coinbase are shady as hell. They openly admitted that they hand out customers' details to third parties for "processing", and that some of these third parties share and sell that data with even more third parties, all without their users' knowledge and consent. They hand over customers' data to the government. They formed a partnership with a company who produce and sell privacy invading software to dictatorships and human rights abusers. I wouldn't trust them with a single satoshi, let alone all my personal details.

Welp, didn't know it was THAT bad lmao. Quite unfortunate as Coinbase surely did nailed off the UI and UX, and that Coinbase Pro is one of those exchanges that has great liquidity. Oh well.

[Chaco]

KYC is necessary only to legalize trade in the country in which the exchange is registered. But I do not pass KYC on those exchanges that require a lot of information about me. Now there are still exchanges that do not require KYC or it is formal, it is better to use them or OTC exchanges.

[Yogee]

Borrowing a sentence from the Bitcoin whitepaper, don't feed these merchants with more information that they would otherwise need. Being a bitcoiner as your username suggests, you should probably think hard before giving your personal information out of convenience.


You probably haven't read a post here that explains why KYC is useless. Here's the link to that topic https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5221497.0

Three main points from that post:
- KYC is encouraging identity theft
- KYC is encouraging scams
- KYC helps scammers stay undetected


Harlot, there is no safe centralized exchange. Perhaps you mean regulated?

[o_e_l_e_o]

As long as you submit those KYC documents in a safe and trusted crypto exchange in your country I believe that you have nothing to worry about unless it is about hacks.

How can you possibly know if an exchange can be "trusted" or not? It only becomes apparent that they are untrustworthy after all your documents have been leaked across the internet and sold on the dark web. You have absolutely no idea how many people at the exchange will have access to your documents, who those people are, how they were hired, if they have had any kind of background checks done, etc. You have absolutely no idea how many people are working for the various third party contractors, data processors, advertisers, etc. which the exchange will search your information, or their backgrounds, etc. You have no idea what kind of security system the exchange have in place, how they secure the KYC database, how they monitor access to it, how they transfer it to third parties, etc.

An exchange can look all bells and whistles on the outside, and yet still leak or sell your documents (e.g. Binance and Coinbase).

The only safe KYC is no KYC.

[UserU]

KYC is necessary only to legalize trade in the country in which the exchange is registered. But I do not pass KYC on those exchanges that require a lot of information about me. Now there are still exchanges that do not require KYC or it is formal, it is better to use them or OTC exchanges.

An image of an ID speaks alot about a person. And that's what KYC is all about.

[dothebeats]

1. Should I give up hard-work faking my name, my number, my email, etc., and just submit into KYC stuffs to make life easier?

If exchanges find out that you're faking your name and your KYC details, best they can do is freeze your assets and close your account. You're also going to be blacklisted from their exchange. If you can handle that happening to you then I guess you can still create fake names/KYC and get on with whatever you're doing.

2. Issue-A: Having a hard time buying coins without submitting into KYC entities. If I go peer-to-peer markets, its so expensive.
Issue-B: Having a hard time cashing out without submitting into KYC entities.

For the most part, exchanging your coins into cash require strict KYC as most exchanges are in compliance with what AML (anti-money laaundering) regulations they are under. You can always use bitcoin ATMs but the fees aren't worth it, IMO. Easier route is to get at least basic verification if you're not doing much trades (under $10000).

3. I dont know things about hiding I.P.s, VPNs, TOR browser, coin joining, coin mixing, etc., and Im not planning to learn and use it. So I know everything about my crypto activities are traceable because Im not techie. Does that mean I should just surrender any effort to get anonymous and just submit into KYC, because its just the same (my I.P. is not hidden, etc.)?

I've used a few coin mixing services and to tell you frankly, I'm better off without them (to each his own). I only used VPNs to watch some content that are blocked in my region and nothing else. I haven't had a single hack happened to me (apart from the bitcointalk password leaks in 15/16) albeit being connected to crypto and things about it. You'll be fine for as long as you don't do any crazy stuff on the interweb e.g. posting to much about your knowledge in crypto using your real accounts and downloading things on shady websites.

Im in a developing country here in Asia where cryptos are not illegal I believe. Im investing/trading not much, only around $1000-$1500 back and forth, circulating in my accounts.
4. Will these KYC things (submitting my documents) do any harm on me?

Nope. Read their ToS and use it against them should they do something unwanted on your details.

Yes, I know privacy is important, but it really tires me up. With this little amount, I think I wont be of a target of hackers/bad guys (a waste of time for them). Right?

Observing internet etiquette and simple privacy techniques can get you a long way with bitcoin. You don't have to be technically-inclined in order to keep yourself safe against hackers. Just don't do stupid things and you'll be fine for the most part (explained above).

[o_e_l_e_o]

If exchanges find out that you're faking your name and your KYC details, best they can do is freeze your assets and close your account.

If you've already managed to deposit or withdraw some fiat under fake credentials, the exchange in question may pass the details it has about you (such as IP addresses, bitcoin addresses, etc.) to law enforcement to cover their own asses from an AML point of view.

You can always use bitcoin ATMs but the fees aren't worth it, IMO.

Agreed, but there are other options which don't require KYC which have minimal fees, such as BISQ or localcryptos.

Nope. Read their ToS and use it against them should they do something unwanted on your details.

That sounds great in theory, but in practice most exchanges have such an all-encompassing Privacy Policy or ToS that they can essentially do anything they like with your details or documents. Take a look at https://www.coinbase.com/legal/privacy or https://www.binance.com/en/terms. The list of people they are allowed to share your information with includes pretty much everyone, from marketing agencies to data processors.

[Zionatin]

Never give your KYC to anyone. They don't need it. If a crypto-only exchange wants your KYC then stop using it. Only give your KYC so crypto to fiat transactions and only if you know the company and who runs it. Trty to use a local exchange so if something happens you can stop it.

The only time you need KYC is when you dealing with large amount of money. So large in fact that if you were making that amount you wouldn't need to launder the monety since you earning so much. $2000 a day or more uses KYC for example. Anything else is just abusing KYC. Bounties and stuff that use KYC are straight-up data mining.

Just remember someone can visit you during the night with your KYC info. Probably won't happen but knowing it is possible doesn't help me feel better. If they want your KYC then ask for theirs. If they refuse then you refuse its that easy. The exchange I use for crypto to fiat is local and the owner's identity is known thus I have no issue with their KYC.

If the entity or person asking for your KYC will not give you theirs then stay away. There is no reason to tell a stranger who you are. You taught as a child not to tell strangers where you live never mind a full ID and selfie.

If exchanges find out that you're faking your name and your KYC details, best they can do is freeze your assets and close your account.

If you've already managed to deposit or withdraw some fiat under fake credentials, the exchange in question may pass the details it has about you (such as IP addresses, bitcoin addresses, etc.) to law enforcement to cover their own asses from an AML point of view.

You can always use bitcoin ATMs but the fees aren't worth it, IMO.

Agreed, but there are other options which don't require KYC which have minimal fees, such as BISQ or localcryptos.

Nope. Read their ToS and use it against them should they do something unwanted on your details.

That sounds great in theory, but in practice most exchanges have such an all-encompassing Privacy Policy or ToS that they can essentially do anything they like with your details or documents. Take a look at https://www.coinbase.com/legal/privacy or https://www.binance.com/en/terms. The list of people they are allowed to share your information with includes pretty much everyone, from marketing agencies to data processors.

I have read them and it is scary. A legit exchange would never do such things. Coinbase is a  faceless organisation I think? Who even owns it. I will never ever use coinbase. I would rather a dangerous criminal stole my ID book then have it floating around online.