Bitcoin Forum
December 15, 2024, 08:09:43 AM *
News: Latest Bitcoin Core release: 28.0 [Torrent]
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register More  
Pages: [1]
  Print  
Author Topic: Is 51% attack a crime?  (Read 253 times)
Stedsm (OP)
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3052
Merit: 1273



View Profile
April 21, 2020, 09:36:59 PM
 #1

I've been seeing so many debates about a 51% attack as well as its costs and everything else. Now, I'd like to ask this whether it should be considered a crime that is done to potentially harm / kill the network as well as destroy BTC? Can somebody, after attacking BTC, mine all the BTC in an hour or so? Can everyone become helpless to just stop their mining operations completely whenever such a situation arise? What if the attacker decides to pull out USDT against BTC and sends his coins to an exchange? Will the exchange accept the coins? Can he even make nay money by conducting such a highly expensive operation? Will somebody be even interested in making money from this or the sole intention would just be the destruction of BTC as well as the network, and to gain Monopoly and establish the rules of centralization in crypto world?

██████████████████████
█████████████████████████
█████████████████████████
█████████████████████████
█████████████████████████
█████████████████████████
█████████████████████████
█████████████████████████
█████████████████████████
█████████████████████████
█████████████████████████
█████████████████████████
██████████████████████
.SHUFFLE.COM..███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
█████████████████████
████████████████████
██████████████████████
████████████████████
██████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
██████████████████████
██████████████████████
██████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
███████████████████████
.
...Next Generation Crypto Casino...
DarkDays
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2030
Merit: 1189


View Profile
April 21, 2020, 09:53:56 PM
 #2

I would personally say it's not a crime.

Most blockchains and their surrounding communities adhere to the principles of code is law. If the code allows people to subvert the network by gaining a majority of the hashrate, then so be it.

Worst case scenario, they'll re-org a few blocks and then there will be a chain split and they'll be free to do what they want with their forked chain.

Sure, people will lose money, but that's what they signed up to while using that coin.
khaled0111
Legendary
*
Online Online

Activity: 2744
Merit: 3096


Top Crypto Casino


View Profile WWW
April 21, 2020, 10:37:42 PM
 #3

A 51% attack may cause damage to the network but the attackers will not be able to get coins out of thin air.
It's similar to a denial of service attack. It can disrupt normal activity of the network but will not be beneficial for the attackers.
The cost of a 51% is way higher than the finanicial benifit for attackers. It will be a waste of resources that could be more profitable in mining with integrity.

It's hard to tell whether such an attack is legal or not since bitcoin is a decentralised system and not yet regulated in many countries.

cryptomaniac_xxx
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 1722
Merit: 613


DGbet.fun - Crypto Sportsbook


View Profile
April 21, 2020, 11:23:20 PM
 #4

I've been seeing so many debates about a 51% attack as well as its costs and everything else. Now, I'd like to ask this whether it should be considered a crime that is done to potentially harm / kill the network as well as destroy BTC?
It is a crime? categorically No. But the question is what incentives those actors will get after a 51%.

Can somebody, after attacking BTC, mine all the BTC in an hour or so?

Do you mean double spend?

Can everyone become helpless to just stop their mining operations completely whenever such a situation arise?

Theoretically, yes, we can be helpless, let's say that the bad actors have 10 long and the normal and true blockchain is 9 long.

What if the attacker decides to pull out USDT against BTC and sends his coins to an exchange? Will the exchange accept the coins? Can he even make nay money by conducting such a highly expensive operation? Will somebody be even interested in making money from this or the sole intention would just be the destruction of BTC as well as the network, and to gain Monopoly and establish the rules of centralization in crypto world?

Exchanges specially with fast confirmations times are the first to be vulnerable to this kind of attacks. It could be the sole purpose is to disrupt the network and at the same time make money. However, it is not that easy, you need to have the hardware needed, labor, electricity of course. So this kind of attack is not sustainable in the long run, in my opinion.

pooya87
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3668
Merit: 11107


Crypto Swap Exchange


View Profile
April 22, 2020, 03:55:10 AM
 #5

it depends on how you define the 51% attack.
if it is defined as only having higher amount of hashrate and reversing some blocks, then i don't see anything illegal in that. not to mention that it would be how the protocol is defined.
but if it is defined as making a large trade with someone and then using the hashrate to reverse that transaction and successfully double spend that, then it is a crime because by then there would be an individual who was directly damaged by the attacker's actions and since there was a trade (which needs to be in millions to justify the attack and such trades have some paperwork) they can sue that attacker.

none of it will kill or destroy bitcoin though.

█▀▀▀











█▄▄▄
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
e
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
█████████████
████████████▄███
██▐███████▄█████▀
█████████▄████▀
███▐████▄███▀
████▐██████▀
█████▀█████
███████████▄
████████████▄
██▄█████▀█████▄
▄█████████▀█████▀
███████████▀██▀
████▀█████████
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
c.h.
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
▀▀▀█











▄▄▄█
▄██████▄▄▄
█████████████▄▄
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███░░█████████
███▌▐█████████
█████████████
███████████▀
██████████▀
████████▀
▀██▀▀
SatsLife
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 797
Merit: 519



View Profile WWW
April 22, 2020, 04:11:18 AM
 #6

Is printing more money a crime? Not if done by the central bank.

So, double spending should indeed be a crime. It's essentially counterfeit.

The only other reason to do a 51% attack would be to destroy the chain.





hatshepsut93
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3038
Merit: 2162


View Profile
April 22, 2020, 04:25:47 AM
 #7


Can somebody, after attacking BTC, mine all the BTC in an hour or so?

It's a common misconception to think that 51% attack gives the attackers some god-level powers over the network. 51% actually only allows attackers to revert transactions by forking the blockchain from the earlier block, they can choose to mine empty blocks to effectively DDOS the network, or they can choose to censor certain addresses by refusing to include their transactions and forking whenever other miners do so. 51% attack can't change the rules of the network or do anything that breaks the rules, period.

So, is it a crime? The censorship attack would be the most unlikely to prosecuted as a crime, the DDOS is generally a crime, but I doubt it would viewed like that by authorities, but the last one, the double spending would have very high chances to being prosecuted if it will result in millions of dollars worth of coins being stolen. Authorities already go after Bitcoin thieves, and double-spending is just a type of robbery.
Kahan848
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 23
Merit: 2


View Profile
April 22, 2020, 02:20:19 PM
 #8

51% attack will be so costly that only a government of a big country can pull this off to destroy BTC
witcher_sense
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2464
Merit: 4419


🔐BitcoinMessage.Tools🔑


View Profile WWW
April 22, 2020, 03:40:27 PM
 #9

Many believe that 51% attack is not a crime, it's rather a good way for attacker to become little poorer. If he is stupid enough to spend millions of dollars to buy huge amounts of electrical energy, getting nothing in return then let him do that. On the other hand, the approach, which he uses to obtain that amount of electricity, might involve criminal activity. If attacker uses threats, murder, tortures, etc to convince miners play his game then it is becoming a pure crime.

█▀▀▀











█▄▄▄
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
e
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
█████████████
████████████▄███
██▐███████▄█████▀
█████████▄████▀
███▐████▄███▀
████▐██████▀
█████▀█████
███████████▄
████████████▄
██▄█████▀█████▄
▄█████████▀█████▀
███████████▀██▀
████▀█████████
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀
c.h.
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
▀▀▀█











▄▄▄█
▄██████▄▄▄
█████████████▄▄
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███████████████
███░░█████████
███▌▐█████████
█████████████
███████████▀
██████████▀
████████▀
▀██▀▀
Ucy
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 2716
Merit: 403


Compare rates on different exchanges & swap.


View Profile
April 22, 2020, 03:44:10 PM
 #10

Will just focus on the main question "is 51% attack a crime? "

Well, the action of the attacker will not only affect the Bitcoin network, it will also affect lots of people. It'll take away their hard earned valuable coins.
 The attacker could actually be punished by the law if caught and judged in a country with just law. Imagine a government not judging a confirmed thief or economic saboteur for whatever reason. That is not justice.

████████████████████                                                    OrangeFren.com                                                ████████████████████
instant KYC-free exchange comparison
████████████████████     Clearnet and onion available #kycfree + (prepaid Visa & Mastercard)     ████████████████████
Ifra24
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 308
Merit: 171


jalannya dipotong sama orang


View Profile
April 22, 2020, 04:04:16 PM
 #11

51% attack will be so costly that only a government of a big country can pull this off to destroy BTC
Yes this is correct. Looking at the total bitcoin currently in circulation as many as 18,339,725 BTC. If denominated in dollars, $ 130,393,610,777.50 at current prices. If counted 51% then there are around $ 66,500,741,496.3 or around 9,353,259.75 BTC. I think it is very difficult to bring down BTC, as long as special values and consensus are still trusted.

Source: https://www.bitcoinblockhalf.com/

███████████████████████████
██████████▄▄███▄▄██████████
████████▄█████████▄████████
██████▄█████████████▄██████
███████████████████████████
███████████████████████████
█████▄███████████████▄█████
███████████████████████████
█████▀███████████████▀█████
███████▀███████████▀███████
█████████▀███████▀█████████
███████████▀███▀███████████
███████████████████████████
.
.BITAMP..
   BITAMP BITCOIN WALLET   
Easy to use, client-side, &
open-source Bitcoin wallet
███████████████████████████
████████▄▄▄▀▀▀▀▀▄▄▄████████
████▄▀▀▀   ▄▄█▄▄   ▀▀▀▄████
█████ ▀▄▄▀▀     ▀▀▄▄▀ █████
█████  █    ███    █  █████
█████  █   ▄███▄   █  █████
█████  █  ███████  █  █████
████▀▄ ▀▄ ███████ ▄▀ ▄▀████
█████▀▄ ▀▄       ▄▀ ▄▀█████
██████▀▄  ▀▄▄ ▄▄▀  ▄▀██████
████████▀▄   █   ▄▀████████
██████████▀▀▄▄▄▀▀██████████
███████████████████████████
███████████████████████████
███████████████████████████
███████████████████████████
████▄▀▀▀▄  ▄███▄  ▄▀▀▀▄████
█████   █ ▐█████▌ █   █████
███▄▄▀ ▀▄  ▀███▀  ▄▀ ▀▄▄███
██      ▄██▀▀▀██▄      ███
██     ███▄███ ███     ███
███▄▄▄▄ █████▄▄████ ▄▄▄▄███
█████████████▄█████████████
███████████████████████████
███████████████████████████
███████████████████████████
███████████████████████████
█████████████████▄▄▄▄█▄████
███████████████████████▀███
█████▀▀▀▀██▀▀▀▀▀▄▄████████
███████▄▀  ▄█▄█▄  ▀▄███████
██████▄▀   █    █  ▀▄██████
███████    █▀▀▀▀▄   ███████
██████▀▄   █    █  ▄▀██████
███████▀▄  ▀█▀█▀  ▄▀███████
████████▀▀▄▄▄▄▄██▄▄▄▄█████
███▄███████████████████████
████▀█▀▀▀▀█████████████████
███████████████████████████
|SECURE
ANONYMOUS
INSTANT
dothebeats
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3808
Merit: 1355


View Profile
April 22, 2020, 06:52:29 PM
 #12

BTC is a decentralized network unprotected by such damages. I don't think there are laws in which miners and other people holding bitcoin are being protected by such direct attacks to the network, but if the courts rule this as economic sabotage or damage to properties or something along the lines, there is a possibility that the perpetrator of the attack to be tried or even put behind bars. But generally, there are no known laws concerning bitcoin and 51% attack in general. Heck, anyone can do it, but the resources needed to do it isn't a joke and is pretty much demanding on its own accord that it's not really worth doing it.

█████████████████████████████████
████████▀▀█▀▀█▀▀█▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀████████
████████▄▄█▄▄█▄▄██████████▀██████
█████░░█░░█░░█░░████████████▀████
██▀▀█▀▀█▀▀█▀▀█▀▀██████████████▀██
██▄▄█▄▄█▄▄█▄▄█▄▄█▄▄▄▄▄▄██████████
██░░█░░█░░███████████████████████
██▀▀█▀▀█▀▀███████████████████████
██▄▄█▄▄█▄▄███████████████████████
██░░█░░█░░███████████████████████
██▀▀█▀▀█▀▀██████████▄▄▄██████████
██▄▄█▄▄█▄▄███████████████████████
██░░█░░█░░███████████████████████
██████
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██████
████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████
 Crypto Marketing Agency
By AB de Royse

████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████
██████
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██████
██████
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██████
██████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████
WIN $50 FREE RAFFLE
Community Giveaway

██████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████████
██████
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██
██████
████████████████████████
██
██████████████████████
██████████████████▀▀████
██████████████▀▀░░░░████
██████████▀▀░░░▄▀░░▐████
██████▀▀░░░░▄█▀░░░░█████
████▄▄░░░▄██▀░░░░░▐█████
████████░█▀░░░░░░░██████
████████▌▐░░▄░░░░▐██████
█████████░▄███▄░░███████
████████████████████████
████████████████████████
████████████████████████
figmentofmyass
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1652
Merit: 1483



View Profile
April 22, 2020, 09:45:37 PM
 #13

a 51% attack that double spends appears to violate the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act. i think even a mere censorship attack would qualify based on that legal theory.

whether it's enforceable is another matter. it carries a prison sentence of up to 10 years per count, and victims could sue for damages, but this is all theoretical. it's never been done, and the legal theory has never been tested in court. i assume the discovery process would be an absolute nightmare.

gentlemand
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2604
Merit: 3056


Welt Am Draht


View Profile
April 22, 2020, 10:05:01 PM
 #14

A lot of the time it's to fuck exchanges so is there is a law in there somewhere that's fraud related? Though the actual attack itself may not be in that scenario but they're using it to carry out an intentional and malicious act that causes a financial loss. I'd be seriously impressed if someone who did it could ever be found but it's an interesting question.
stompix
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3108
Merit: 6643


Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform


View Profile
April 22, 2020, 10:46:49 PM
 #15

Can somebody, after attacking BTC, mine all the BTC in an hour or so?
No
Can everyone become helpless to just stop their mining operations completely whenever such a situation arise?
No
Will somebody be even interested in making money from this or the sole intention would just be the destruction of BTC as well as the network, and to gain Monopoly and establish the rules of centralization in crypto world?
It's a f* up world, so yeah, there might be people interested in it.

Yes this is correct. Looking at the total bitcoin currently in circulation as many as 18,339,725 BTC. If denominated in dollars, $ 130,393,610,777.50 at current prices. If counted 51% then there are around $ 66,500,741,496.3 or around 9,353,259.75 BTC. I think it is very difficult to bring down BTC, as long as special values and consensus are still trusted.

Hmm, you have something like 0.0051% of an idea what a 51% attack refers to, right?  Grin
It has nothing to do with price or currently mined coins, it's about the hashrate of the network.

a 51% attack that double spends appears to violate the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act. i think even a mere censorship attack would qualify based on that legal theory.
whether it's enforceable is another matter.

Since it's a US Act, good luck trying to use it, immediately after Missouri wins its case with China over the virus.
And who would be the culprit, an anonymous pool, the miners that provided the power?
The one that "hacked" or hacked the pool?

Even if caught, I have a feeling he will enjoy a lot of frappuccinos before getting two years in jail and then sightseeing around Tokyo, like the last guy that was in trouble over fraud.


..Stake.com..   ▄████████████████████████████████████▄
   ██ ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄            ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄ ██  ▄████▄
   ██ ▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀ ██████████ ▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀ ██  ██████
   ██ ██████████ ██      ██ ██████████ ██   ▀██▀
   ██ ██      ██ ██████  ██ ██      ██ ██    ██
   ██ ██████  ██ █████  ███ ██████  ██ ████▄ ██
   ██ █████  ███ ████  ████ █████  ███ ████████
   ██ ████  ████ ██████████ ████  ████ ████▀
   ██ ██████████ ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄ ██████████ ██
   ██            ▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀            ██ 
   ▀█████████▀ ▄████████████▄ ▀█████████▀
  ▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄███  ██  ██  ███▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄
 ██████████████████████████████████████████
▄▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▄
█  ▄▀▄             █▀▀█▀▄▄
█  █▀█             █  ▐  ▐▌
█       ▄██▄       █  ▌  █
█     ▄██████▄     █  ▌ ▐▌
█    ██████████    █ ▐  █
█   ▐██████████▌   █ ▐ ▐▌
█    ▀▀██████▀▀    █ ▌ █
█     ▄▄▄██▄▄▄     █ ▌▐▌
█                  █▐ █
█                  █▐▐▌
█                  █▐█
▀▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▀█
▄▄█████████▄▄
▄██▀▀▀▀█████▀▀▀▀██▄
▄█▀       ▐█▌       ▀█▄
██         ▐█▌         ██
████▄     ▄█████▄     ▄████
████████▄███████████▄████████
███▀    █████████████    ▀███
██       ███████████       ██
▀█▄       █████████       ▄█▀
▀█▄    ▄██▀▀▀▀▀▀▀██▄  ▄▄▄█▀
▀███████         ███████▀
▀█████▄       ▄█████▀
▀▀▀███▄▄▄███▀▀▀
..PLAY NOW..
hatshepsut93
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3038
Merit: 2162


View Profile
April 22, 2020, 11:25:50 PM
 #16

a 51% attack that double spends appears to violate the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act. i think even a mere censorship attack would qualify based on that legal theory.

whether it's enforceable is another matter. it carries a prison sentence of up to 10 years per count, and victims could sue for damages, but this is all theoretical. it's never been done, and the legal theory has never been tested in court. i assume the discovery process would be an absolute nightmare.

I have big doubts that anyone would bother to investigate a censorship attack, the authorities wouldn't even clearly see who is the victim, who is the culprit, what was the damage, and Bitcoin is a decentralized network, not a company that can go to court. In case with double spend, there will be a clear victim - an exchange or other service that lost millions of dollars worth of coins, and the attacker that made and then reversed a transaction.
TravelMug
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 2856
Merit: 875



View Profile
April 23, 2020, 12:10:25 AM
 #17

51% attack will be so costly that only a government of a big country can pull this off to destroy BTC

Well it if costly for them why would they pulled that stunt? Doesn't make sense, also I don't think that the resources will be enough to go long term.

a 51% attack that double spends appears to violate the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act. i think even a mere censorship attack would qualify based on that legal theory.

whether it's enforceable is another matter. it carries a prison sentence of up to 10 years per count, and victims could sue for damages, but this is all theoretical. it's never been done, and the legal theory has never been tested in court. i assume the discovery process would be an absolute nightmare.

I have big doubts that anyone would bother to investigate a censorship attack, the authorities wouldn't even clearly see who is the victim, who is the culprit, what was the damage, and Bitcoin is a decentralized network, not a company that can go to court. In case with double spend, there will be a clear victim - an exchange or other service that lost millions of dollars worth of coins, and the attacker that made and then reversed a transaction.

I agree, I don't think that any governing body will investigate 51% attack unless a country was really affected by it to consider this as an economic sabotage. Exchanges will surely be the victim here and might chase and sue the bad actors behind in the court in case of double spend.

For all intent and purposes, lets look at Bitcoin Gold Blockchain Hit by 51% Attack Leading to $70K Double Spend

 
█▄
R


▀▀██████▄▄
████████████████
▀█████▀▀▀█████
████████▌███▐████
▄█████▄▄▄█████
████████████████
▄▄██████▀▀
LLBIT▀█ 
  TH#1 SOLANA CASINO  
████████████▄
▀▀██████▀▀███
██▄▄▀▀▄▄████
████████████
██████████
███▀████████
▄▄█████████
████████████
████████████
████████████
████████████
█████████████
████████████▀
████████████▄
▀▀▀▀▀▀▀██████
████████████
███████████
██▄█████████
████▄███████
████████████
█░▀▀████████
▀▀██████████
█████▄█████
████▀▄▀████
▄▄▄▄▄▄▄██████
████████████▀
........5,000+........
GAMES
 
......INSTANT......
WITHDRAWALS
..........HUGE..........
REWARDS
 
............VIP............
PROGRAM
 .
   PLAY NOW    
Leonardo7
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 686
Merit: 15


View Profile
April 23, 2020, 12:59:05 AM
 #18

Why will anyone who successfully complete a 51% attack, not double-spend by reversing the block? this is a crime because of the losses that will be incurred by victims of the transactions. I was thinking they will take charge of the network cause lots of transactions to be unconfirmed like we saw in 2017 when bitcoin fee became very expensive.
Pages: [1]
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!