Derivation Path

[blue Snow]

Code:

https://learnmeabitcoin.com/technical/images/derivation-paths/levels.png

Thank You!. Thread has been updated.

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[blue Snow]

I tried copy-paste iancoleman/bip39 derivation path to electrum wallet then get a different address.

here derivation path, m/84'/0'/1'/0

I'm confused then remove the last number /0 to be m/84'/0'/1' and done that worked, I got the same address on electrum wallet.

The big question for me is how to get the same address when derivation path like this, m/84'/0'/1'/1 ??
Yes, I tried and for sure got the different address. I tried with colon m/84'/0'/1'/1', same result, I still got the different address.

then tried many ways, change sit each other, with or without the colon.

is the bug on the electrum wallet (4.1.5)?

[o_e_l_e_o]

No, it's not a bug.

Any BIP39 derivation path you enter in to Electrum will have /x/y appended to the end as it generates addresses. x will be 0 or 1 depending if the address is receiving or change respectively, and y will start at 0 and increment by 1 with each subsequent address. If you import m/84'/0'/0' to Electrum, then:

The first receiving address will be at path m/84'/0'/0'/0/0
The second receiving address will be at path m/84'/0'/0'/0/1
The third receiving address will be at path m/84'/0'/0'/0/2

The first change address will be at path m/84'/0'/0'/1/0
The second change address will be at path m/84'/0'/0'/1/1

And so on. Therefore, if you import m/84'/0'/1'/1 to Electrum, the first address Electrum generates will be at m/84'/0'/1'/1/0/0.

If you want the first address Ian Coleman generates at m/84'/0'/1'/1 to show up in Electrum (which will be at m/84'/0'/1'/1/0), then import m/84'/0'/1' and look at the first change address.

[blue Snow]

And so on. Therefore, if you import m/84'/0'/1'/1 to Electrum, the first address Electrum generates will be at m/84'/0'/1'/1/0/0.

If you want the first address Ian Coleman generates at m/84'/0'/1'/1 to show up in Electrum (which will be at m/84'/0'/1'/1/0),

I Still got a different address, try many times times with remove colon, add 0, change sit.

m/84'/0'/1'/1/0/0
m/84'/0'/1'/1/0
m/84'/0'/1'/0/1
m/84'/0'/1'/0'/1
m/84'/0'/1'/1'/0/0
m/84'/0'/1'/1'/0

BIP39 - emotion razor cheap bread tank view twenty lens silent banana arch fish

BIP32 Derivation Path: m/84'/0'/1'/1



here on electrum;



That was complex for me, this is my real problem, I have the bip39 seed and private key (m/84'/0'/3'/2). I bought a new hardware wallet and want to connect to electrum, I tried it many days but didn't get any way to get my address on electrum.

[SquirrelJulietGarden]

HD Wallets Explained: From High Level to Nuts and Bolts

[pooya87]

There is an extra zero (and possibly the last 1) at the end.
When you are entering the path to derive multiple keys you shouldn't enter the derivation path of a single key.
m/84'/0'/1'/1/0 is the path of the first child key.
You want to enter the path of the derived master child key which is at m/84'/0'/1'/1/
then the wallet derives m/84'/0'/1'/1/0 and m/84'/0'/1'/1/1 and m/84'/0'/1'/1/2 and so on as the actual child keys.

Electrum should also be able to search and find the correct derivation path on its own if the wallet you are importing was ever used.

[o_e_l_e_o]

-snip-

You are importing the wrong derivation path to Electrum. As I said in my earlier post, your derivation path for Electrum should be m/84'/0'/1'. The change addresses Electrum displays at this derivation path will match the receiving addresses you have generated on Ian Coleman. I have just tested this myself.

Whatever BIP39 derivation path you import in to Electrum, Electrum will add /x/y on the end.
Whatever BIP32 derivation path you have on Ian Coleman, Ian Coleman will add /y on the end.
This is the reason for your confusion.

I have the bip39 seed and private key (m/84'/0'/3'/2). I bought a new hardware wallet and want to connect to electrum, I tried it many days but didn't get any way to get my address on electrum.

The derivation path m/84'/0'/3'/2 is non-standard and does not follow BIP39. The 4th number should only ever be 0 or 1 (corresponding to receiving or change addresses respectively), and there should be 5 numbers in total, not 4. How and with which wallet did you generate a key at this path?

Which hardware wallet are you trying to connect with Electrum? You shouldn't be importing external seeds to hardware wallets since it negates the whole point of the seed being generated on a secure environment (the hardware wallet itself). I would set up a brand new wallet using your hardware device, and then sweep all the funds from that individual private key to your new hardware protected wallet.

[blue Snow]

There is an extra zero (and possibly the last 1) at the end.

I still got different address.

m/84'/0'/1'/1/0
m/84'/0'/1'/1/1

Electrum should also be able to search and find the correct derivation path on its own if the wallet you are importing was ever used.

yes for sure. but, when connecting to hardware wallet Detect Existing Accounts button is dissapear.

-snip-

You are importing the wrong derivation path to Electrum. As I said in my earlier post, your derivation path for Electrum should be m/84'/0'/1'. The change addresses Electrum displays at this derivation path will match the receiving addresses you have generated on Ian Coleman. I have just tested this myself.

my derivation path m/84'/0'/1'/1 and still got different address when importing m/84'/0'/1'

Which hardware wallet are you trying to connect with Electrum? You shouldn't be importing external seeds to hardware wallets since it negates the whole point of the seed being generated on a secure environment (the hardware wallet itself). I would set up a brand new wallet using your hardware device, and then sweep all the funds from that individual private key to your new hardware protected wallet.

Ledger Nano S, I don't import anything anything.

[o_e_l_e_o]

I still got different address.

m/84'/0'/1'/1/0
m/84'/0'/1'/1/1

As I said above, those are not the correct derivation paths. You need to use m/84'/0'/1'.

See below:


These address match the address you have generated in this post using Ian Coleman.

Ledger Nano S, I don't import anything anything.

So create a brand new wallet using your Ledger Nano, then use an offline version of Ian Coleman to import your old seed phrase and obtain the private key at your non-standard derivation path, import that private key in to a wallet of your choice (again, preferably offline for maximum security) and send all the funds to your new hardware wallet.

[blue Snow]

I still got different address.

m/84'/0'/1'/1/0
m/84'/0'/1'/1/1

As I said above, those are not the correct derivation paths. You need to use m/84'/0'/1'.

See below:


These address match the address you have generated in this post using Ian Coleman.

Ledger Nano S, I don't import anything anything.

So create a brand new wallet using your Ledger Nano, then use an offline version of Ian Coleman to import your old seed phrase and obtain the private key at your non-standard derivation path, import that private key in to a wallet of your choice (again, preferably offline for maximum security) and send all the funds to your new hardware wallet.

Look like I'm missing looking for change address, I just look at first address.
so, m/84'/0'/3'/2 non standar derivation path i must changed.

[o_e_l_e_o]

so, m/84'/0'/3'/2 non standar derivation path i must changed.

Yes. As far as I am aware, there is no way to import a seed phrase and with this derivation path in to Electrum without manually editing the source code, since it does not follow the BIP39 schematics. Again, where did you create this path and with which wallet? Do you have a known seed phrase with funds on this path?

[blue Snow]

Again, where did you create this path and with which wallet? Do you have a known seed phrase with funds on this path?

I have the seed for the first time on Ledger and was written down in my paper either. with the seed, I used Iancoleman with another computer (never connect to the internet) to get the address, private key, and that path m/84'/0'/3'/2.  I know the private key, I used mainly on electrum.

I was just confused to use ledger on electrum ( I never used ledger live - only the first time to install bitcoin application - then removed), and I never used the ledger for the transaction either (that look like my ledger only for storing the seed).

with that seed I'm split my balance into another path m/84'/0'/1'/1, m/84'/0'/2'/2, m/84'/0'/3'/2 ... get the address and keep private key, I haven't a problem with those all, I write down all the detail, and just confused to connect with those path.


derivation path over 1 is not standard, for example, m/84'/0'/2'/1 ?, we must be careful about that.


so

m/84'/0'/1'/0 - this is the first 20 address on electrum (no.1-20),
when path m/84'/0'/1'/1 the next 20 address (change address-yellow mark-no 21 until number 40),
when path m/84'/0'/1'/2 my assumtion hidden address on electrum (no.41 until number 60), correct me if i wrong.

[o_e_l_e_o]

with the seed, I used Iancoleman with another computer (never connect to the internet) to get the address, private key, and that path m/84'/0'/3'/2.

So, just to be clear, you set up a new wallet using your Ledger Nano linked to Electrum, then took the seed of that wallet, entered it in to Ian Coleman, spun up this weird derivation path, and sent coins to it? Unless you are completely certain that you have properly airgapped the computer you used, then I would consider that seed phrase compromised.

with that seed I'm split my balance into another path m/84'/0'/1'/1, m/84'/0'/2'/2, m/84'/0'/3'/2 ... get the address and keep private key, I haven't a problem with those all, I write down all the detail, and just confused to connect with those path.

The only one of those three paths which will be recoverable using your Ledger Nano and Electrum will be the first one, following the steps I gave above. The other two do not follow the BIP44 standard and so are not recoverable using either Electrum or Ledger Live. I'm not sure of any software which will connect to a Ledger Nano and let you open wallets at arbitrary paths like these. If it were me, I would be importing those private keys to an airgapped Electrum wallet and sending the funds on them back to my hardware wallet under a standard derivation path.

In future, if you want a different account, then open a new wallet with the same Ledger Nano and Electrum, only changing the third number in the derivation path. For example, m/84'/0'/1', m/84'/0'/2', m/84'/0'/3', and so on.

derivation path over 1 is not standard, for example, m/84'/0'/2'/1 ?, we must be careful about that.

A full derivation path for a specific address might look like this: m/84'/0'/2'/1/0. This is broken down as follows:

84 - Purpose. Essentially tells us that it will be a segwit address.
0 - Coin type. Bitcoin main chain (i.e. not testnet).
2 - Account. The third account.
1 - Change. 0 for receiving, 1 for change.
0 - Address index. The first address.

So, when you create a new wallet (which is an account), you should only specify the first three numbers - m/84'/0'/2', in this case. The last two numbers are different for every address in that wallet.

m/84'/0'/1'/0 - this is the first 20 address on electrum (no.1-20)

Almost. m/84'/0'/1'/0/0 through m/84'/0'/1'/0/19 will be the first 20 addresses in the second account.

when path m/84'/0'/1'/1 the next 20 address (change address-yellow mark-no 21 until number 40)

m/84'/0'/1'/1/0 through m/84'/0'/1'/1/19 will be the first 20 change addresses in the second account.

when path m/84'/0'/1'/2 my assumtion hidden address on electrum (no.41 until number 60), correct me if i wrong.

Electrum will never generate addresses at this path, since as explained above, it is non standard.

[blue Snow]

So, just to be clear, you set up a new wallet using your Ledger Nano linked to Electrum, then took the seed of that wallet, entered it in to Ian Coleman, spun up this weird derivation path, and sent coins to it? Unless you are completely certain that you have properly airgapped the computer you used, then I would consider that seed phrase compromised.

yes, I sent it to the address. and the computer which never connected to the internet.

All fixed now, I have generated a new address on Ledger (with an additional passphrase) using electrum offline and with standard path either, I will use this: m/84'/0'/1', m/84'/0'/2', m/84'/0'/3',, for split my balance because I won't be pilling up only 1 address.

Thanks for explaining much.

[blue Snow]

Basic in update taproot network
I have updated the thread by adding the p2tr derivation path:> https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0086.mediawiki

Code:

BIP 86: m/86'/0'/0'/0/0

For the purpose-path level it uses 86'. The rest of the levels are used as defined in BIPs 44, 49, and 84

[canudinho]

if you didn't change it you got different address, you will panic.

Hello Sir, please help: Just didn't payed attention on the derivation path of my electrum wallet once i created it. It is a standard wallet, nothing additional.
-> Suppose i have to recover it someday, i should go with m/0'/0 derivation path once asked, and my funds gonna be there?  

Best regards

[Charles-Tim]

-> Suppose i have to recover it someday, i should go with m/0'/0 derivation path once asked, and my funds gonna be there?  

For standard wallet, the derivation path is m/0' which you have mentioned. But Electrum will do that for you automatically. You can also use Bluewallet which will generate the funded address derivation path automatically.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Just didn't payed attention on the derivation path of my electrum wallet once i created it. It is a standard wallet, nothing additional.

Open your wallet, click on "Wallet" in the top bar, then "Information". Your derivation path will be displayed at the bottom of this box.

For a standard segwit Electrum seed phrase, it will be m/0'.
If you have imported a BIP39 seed phrase from elsewhere, it will be m/84'/0'/0' for a standard segwit wallet.

Suppose i have to recover it someday, i should go with m/0'/0 derivation path once asked, and my funds gonna be there?

If it's an Electrum seed phrase you don't need to worry about the derivation path. Electrum will only ever recover a single wallet at a preset derivation path for each of its seed phrases.