Anybody here trying to live bankless (using Bitcoin / cryptocurrencies)?

[coinfinger]

That was the main idea, not to make bitcoin the only currency out there, it was to make an alternative. Nobody should try to go bankless, banks are still needed, but bitcoin could be used at least to tell the banks that if they do too much wrong we have an alternative right now.

For decades banks had no competition and people had to put their money with the banks, all of our money worldwide was with banks and that was just not okay, with bitcoin we could go bankless if we want to, and many people are putting some of their money to bitcoin as well. This way we could tell the banks "I may need you for some stuff so you have my survival money, but my investments could go out of the bank, so be careful" and thats quite important leverage to have against the banks.

[Yatsan]

Would be a hard thing to do at this early point wherein cryptos are still facing issues and it is not widely accepted to most of the countries making it quite impossible to live only with it, without fiat, especially in a country wherein most of the people are using the traditional currency. In the future this could be possible but that doesn't mean that rest is assured given that things could co-exist, as long as there are governments which would prefer using fiat over digital ones.

To be honest, I really want to live without a bank, and I want to use bitcoin for payment. But it is prohibited to use bitcoin as payment
by the government in my country, so I still use the bank. It's hard to live without using a bank, I hope in the future bitcoin is legalized
as a global currency. So that my country can accept bitcoin as payment. I have try to use bitcoin to buy items from abroad on the internet.
It feels so good.

It is technically legal but that is different from being accepted, so it is mainly neutral to some countries. Many people do prefer using Bitcoin as an investment in order to make profit as time passes by, due to the volatlity of its market value. My observations is that, those people who are not into cryptos that much, are the ones using Bitcoin and other cryptos to buy things online especially from one country to another one. And those who are that into cryptos, are the ones using it in a profitable way which is quite ironic.

[BitcoinTurk]

1) Do you use centralized payment services like Bitcoin-filled prepaid cards?
- Unfortunately, it's been a long time since I used this type of service.
2) Is LN for you already an option?
- No.
3) How do you manage the volatility risk? For example, do you use stablecoins, options or a centralized fiat wallet?
- I usually get rid of volatility by choosing stable crypto coins.
4) What about DeFi?
- Something that I haven't done much research on, but as far as I learned, has the power to change the financial system.
5) Do you get some kind of loans outside the banking system, for example, via P2P services?
- No, I am so glad that I did not need to borrow money from banks or such services.
6) Instead of using banking services, do you have to rely a lot on (fiat) cash?
- No, I do not trust the use of fiat money in banking transactions.

I wanted to answer the questions, although there are some concise answers.

[fiulpro]

Hello ,
This is amazing seeing this post and knowing that there is some people out there who have taken cryptocurrencies to another level.
This would do a lot of good , if you go and ask the shopkeeper for the payment options in cryptocurrencies you are actually going to make sure they learn something new that day and increase the reach of the Crypto community.
Unfortunately see for the day to day activities , I prefer buying stuff from the small farmers , since during this time they are very badly affected , plus you know the quality of their products is better than market.
Therefore I don't think I would be using cryptocurrencies we a means of payment anytime soon before quarantine.

[countryfree]

I'm really surprised nobody's talking about getting paid.
I guess that if you're a dishwasher at a restaurant, you may get paid in cash, but that isn't possible if you have a normal job, or run a business.

[okala]

Our banking system are fraudulent and bitcoin is only system that brings justice and fairness to our transactions. Bank only think of themselves and do not have the interest of the populace at heart. I am ready to reject the present system we have for bitcoin.

[Gheka]

Our banking system are fraudulent and bitcoin is only system that brings justice and fairness to our transactions. Bank only think of themselves and do not have the interest of the populace at heart. I am ready to reject the present system we have for bitcoin.

Well, banks really only give us the slightest benefits when storing our money and encourage us to deposit money into their vaults, they use our assets for purposes to invest and make the most profit but even if we understand this problem, we can't get rid of them because in this new age, banking is always needed for all levels of society, we need it to transfer money, store and create the most convenient. Bitcoin and crypto can bring a greater fairness but speaking of safety and legality, plus the popularity of the platform, it still can't compete

[roberthays]

Being 'bankless' can be quite difficult. I've not encountered issues receiving wages from clients for the past few years via Cryptocurrency so effectively not needing a bank to store funds however, as some have pointed out here, you'll end up requiring a bank if you want to purchase property etc.

[lumeire]

Being 'bankless' can be quite difficult. I've not encountered issues receiving wages from clients for the past few years via Cryptocurrency so effectively not needing a bank to store funds however, as some have pointed out here, you'll end up requiring a bank if you want to purchase property etc.

Not even property, most of the times when you are asking for a loan or for financing anything you will definitely need to have a bank account otherwise you can't get a loan. And also for cashing out my Crypto holdings I need a bank as I do cashout using an exchange and not p2p or in person trades as I feel safe and anonymous while using these methods rather than dealing in person physically. So other than these reasons I don't think I will need banks at all.

[sana54210]

The moment banks in our country made it forced to have bank accounts for salaries there was really nothing we could do to win the argument over being bankless. Companies literally have to send your salary to your bank account, that is forced legally, you can't pay people their salary to their hands or to anywhere they want or in bitcoin or whatever, no!

You have to pay the salary to their bank account. That is seriously fucked up but that is how banks convinced the governments to have all the money in the bank accounts as much as possible and gave the people some debit cards instead. This way government would know all the money in the banks and how they are doing and so forth. Basically banks are back pockets of our politicians and it is really not something that helps the people.

[d5000]

I'm really surprised nobody's talking about getting paid.
I guess that if you're a dishwasher at a restaurant, you may get paid in cash, but that isn't possible if you have a normal job, or run a business.

It is not totally impossible, above all if you work in the crypto sector. But I agree it's complicated to run a business in most economic sectors if you don't offer "standard" payment options like credit card or bank wire.

If living bankless using Bitcoin was more popular, this could be a niche for payment processor services - they could allow businesses to outsource the acceptance of typical fiat payment options. These companies could take any payment in fiat and transform it into Bitcoin or a stablecoin. But I guess the market for this kind of services is still not big enough. At least I haven't seen this kind of service* - Bitcoin payment processors like Coingate or Bitpay mostly work the other way around, accepting Bitcoin for you and transforming it into fiat. If someone knows any it's appreciated if you post it here in this thread.

*It is possible that something like Neteller could be an option here. They seem to offer a payment processing solution for businesses/merchants which supports several payment methods, and they have an option to convert fiat into Bitcoin. But on their site there isn't much information about the merchant solution they offer - you have to contact their sales department for that.

[Genemind]

If I could only do that during this pandemic situation then it will be a lot better for me but it's hard since most establishments in our place aren't accepting cryptocurrencies yet so I have no choice but to use fiat through banks. I'm also receiving a fiat out of my job so I can't live without banks for now. If most merchants and business establishments would accept Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies, I'm sure that it will be easy for us to live in a cashless society.

[wozzek23]

That's really interesting and I have tried to do it a few times but it is not possible. It doesn't really work in my country. The only places I can make use of Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies, spend them, send and receive is only online. But when it comes to making use of it locally, nah you wouldn't be able to do that.

Although from what I have seen online, there are countries where you are more likely to find a lot of means for you to make use of your Bitcoin locally. But for where I live, I have never seen a single person or shop that is accepting cryptocurrencies as payment, they always need their cash or you make a transfer with your card or bank app.

[btc78]

While i really wanted to be but i have no option because i need to at least use Fiat in my daily living,i need banks to cash out from my crypto profit so the thing is Bank and crypto is my life now.

i want to be cashless and bankless living but this is not possible for now,maybe in future when everything in my country is accepting crypto as payment.

[Reatim]

If everyone of us can live like this for sure we will choose a bankless life but lets admit the fact that majority of cryptonians needed banks as this is not their desire but they have no choice .

Imagine if you are living in 3rd world country and you need Fiat,those money remittances that allows us to convert Bitcoin to Fiat requires Big fees while using bank accounts is lesser.

Maybe we can make this right in future,when crypto is already adopted by the world and can be in the market for everything that we wanted to purchase or even services that we might need by chance.

[LogitechMouse]

When I learned crypto and the basics of it, I said that I will use this in the future.

That is when I was still learning the basics of it. I'm not a fan of using banks TBH. I don't have that much transactions since I'm working as an employee in the past 2 years and I got my salary on hand and not on banks but there are times that I use it but once or twice every 2-3 months something like that.

When I knew that Banks hated crypto, I said to myself that I will not use banks that much and until now I'm not using it unless I need to withdraw my funds. Living bankless around the world right now would be hard since many are still using banks and many are using banks to withdraw their funds. The sole purpose of banks for me is for withdrawing purposes and not for putting my funds there. I know that keeping some cash for emergency funds like what is happening right now is good but I will just give it to my couple since she has a bank account and I don't want to hold one for myself. Living bankless would be possible but it would take decades or even centuries before it will happen.

[Vannie12]

Going bankless is provocative though I think bitcoins still have a long way before that happens. Also, as we need to consider the fact that in the near future, cryptocurrencies will need proper regulation, if not, it will all go to waste.

If things will go as we want it to be, we will surely have fees that I think we will not be glad about.
Would you think cryptocurrencies more pros than cons compared to banks.
Volatility is another thing to consider.

More thoughts and opinions as we learn from it.

[d5000]

Okay, to write a little summary: The proportion of "bankless" people seems to be still tiny. Well, excluding those who always lived mostly with cash, above all in the so-called "lesser developed countries". But only two people answered basically that they tried to live cashless using Bitcoin or other cryptocurrencies, or planned to do so.

It's obviously a problem that most people writing in this sub-forum are maybe not demographically the social group for whom "bankless living" is easy to realize.

About the obstacles from "bankless living" (using Bitcoin instead of cash), the following seem to be the most prominent:

- Tax payment
- Services payment
- Regulation (e.g. "prohibitions" to use cryptocurrencies for payments)
- General acceptance of cryptocurrencies for payments
- Payment of salaries
- Small market size (for businesses)

Volatility, which I consider the biggest problem personally, has been mentioned seldomly in the thread. This may have to do with that volatility operates mostly in the "background" of the problems that were mentionated - for example, it is related to the meager merchant acceptance, because those not being able to afford to do risk management themselves rely on (potentially costly) payment processor services.

I'll leave the thread open a while more, but will close it if no more substantial opinions are added and the same arguments are repeated over and over. Instead, I am still interested to read posts about experiences about living bankless and using at least partially cryptocurrencies for payments.

[NotATether]

I'm the guy who voted "I already live completely bankless". We've been doing this for almost eight years now, it's not like we can't get a bank account here but it is easier to pay everyone in cash, lots of convenience stores, bakeries and other shops do not take credit cards or bank transfers, but certain stores like ones that sell electricity and mobile topup have an arsenal of handheld ATMs which can in theory take credit cards but nobody uses them for that, sellers just use the ATM to pay for things like water bills and then get paid in cash. Even salaries here are paid in cash. I have personally seen people collecting large bundles of their cash, instead of a credit card. Mobile apps that physically deliver stuff to you also take cash, the handler collects it.

I haven't seen anyone use a credit card here but that could be due to me not going out much. Cryptocurrency payments for anything local are completely out of the question, but this is a non-issue for me because I keep my bitcoin separate from our cash assets anyway. Also, using any altcoin for payment purposes is a waste, as they are accepted at less places than bitcoin.

Is there room for improvement? Yes. Currently I can't buy most online services because they only take cards, which I don't have. I've been exploring using virtual debit cards to pay for these things but they only work if the service hasn't blocked those cards, so I've been looking into "anonymous" debit cards, where the card owner is someone you meet online, and people willing to provide this service (there is at least one of them here on Bitcointalk). All of the above loaded with bitcoin.

So in short I am living bankless but it's not fun not being able to buy stuff you want, eventually I will load a debit card with a minimal amount of BTC for payment purposes.

[cheezcarls]

If I had a crypto card with me, it’s possible for me to go bankless. There are countless crypto cards out there such as Coinbase, Crypterium, BTSE, etc. Here in the Philippines, I use GCash and it’s a centralised mobile app not connected to any banks and not into crypto. It’s possible for me to go bankless with them because they had a GCash Mastercard where I can withdraw my funds anywhere in the world. However, my limits would increase up to P500,000 in Philippine peso if I link it with an existing bank account.

I’ll try to order a crypto card to be shipped to my doorstep one day, and would try withdraw my funds to any bank since I mostly store my savings into crypto and not in banks.