UK rules will hit loot boxes games hard - as they’re turning kids into gamblers.

[Juggy777]

The Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport (UK) will start gathering evidence to classify loot boxes game’s under the gambling laws, as they feel that these games are turning UK kids into future gamblers.

In case you don’t know what loot boxes are then in simple terms they’re upgrades that you can buy after you have installed the game, but you won’t know what kind of upgrades you’ll get, hence there’s an element of chance involved.

Lastly if UK decides to reclassify loot boxes game’s under the gambling laws then they’re going to hurt a industry worth $23 billion, but I feel that they’ll right to do it as it’ll help many kids who otherwise would have developed gambling addiction symptoms at a young age.

Loot boxes allow players to spend money on in-game rewards such as special characters or equipment, without knowing what they will get.

Games with loot box mechanics have long proven controversial, with critics and gamers alleging similarities to gambling and warning of their appeal to younger audiences. Some players have shared stories of their own descents into unwittingly addictive behaviour, including the UK player who discovered via GDPR that he had spent over $10,000 in just two years.

Sources:

https://www.theguardian.com/games/2020/jun/07/uk-could-class-loot-boxes-as-gambling-to-protect-children

https://www.theguardian.com/games/2018/aug/17/video-game-loot-boxes-addictive-and-a-form-of-simulated-gambling-senate-inquiry-told

[plvbob0070]

I don't consider this as gambling because the players or the kids don't earn any money as a reward whenever they will spend money on that game. Because for me, gambling is risking something valuable in exchange for getting something valuable. But since they reward they will get will only be useful in that game, I don't think it's gambling. I mean a lot of games also offer rewards if you will spend money on that game.

But if this game is mostly for kids and minors, I don't think they should also require such offers like that because where do kids get the money? However, I also understand that the government is just trying to protect the kids in any future harm if this game is really addicting. Parents also play an important role and they should be the first ones to guide and monitor their children when using gadgets.

[tokeweed]

Hey Juggy.  Just a suggestion.  Why don't you start a thread titled 'Random Gambling News' and post them in one thread.  I think lots of people would be interested in the news concerning gambling in these parts.  And the gambling section is already very cluttered with gambling news threads.

If you don't want to start it, can I? 

[20kevin20]

Well, parents should guide their own Children at the first place so they will not ended up a broken gambler. In my place, there’s a lot of game addict and most of them are Children who spend the rest of the day playing with their phones. Its really alarming, and this kind of government action is good as long as the intention is to protect the players, developer should also be more concern to the players and not just about collecting money.

Parents probably don't even know that the most recent top-tier games have turned into money-stripping pay-to-win ones. The GTA V Online casino speaks for itself - this is a problem most parents have no idea of unless they spend their time trying to understand what kind of games their kids are playing. You have to keep up with the gaming world to know what's up with a game system.

CoD: Modern Warfare, the recent free-to-play one, has this system of loot crates and being f2p probably brings in a lot of money .. mostly from kids borrowing their parents' credit cards to get some "games". Good to know that a government has had their attention on these systems because they've basically camouflaged gambling into these stupid crates that most of the times only leave kids disappointed anyway.

I don't consider this as gambling because the players or the kids don't earn any money as a reward whenever they will spend money on that game. Because for me, gambling is risking something valuable in exchange for getting something valuable. But since they reward they will get will only be useful in that game, I don't think it's gambling. I mean a lot of games also offer rewards if you will spend money on that game.

You're right, it's not gambling - it's even worse. You spend cash to get fake currencies to receive in-game weapon skins or decals through a mechanism similar to gambling.. and can't even cash out. In other words, you lose any way you take it besides having some pixels on a game that will not be played anymore within 1-2 years. It's honestly horrible and so many children are spending too much money on it - think Fortnite.

[South Park]

I don't consider this as gambling because the players or the kids don't earn any money as a reward whenever they will spend money on that game. Because for me, gambling is risking something valuable in exchange for getting something valuable. But since they reward they will get will only be useful in that game, I don't think it's gambling. I mean a lot of games also offer rewards if you will spend money on that game.

But if this game is mostly for kids and minors, I don't think they should also require such offers like that because where do kids get the money? However, I also understand that the government is just trying to protect the kids in any future harm if this game is really addicting. Parents also play an important role and they should be the first ones to guide and monitor their children when using gadgets.

Each person can have their opinion but to me this is clearly gambling, they are using their money in something which is basically a game of chance and even if the reward is not that great for people like us that could not be interested in the game itself it is for the kids to the point that they are willing to spend money in order to try to get a particular item or upgrade, now if this mechanic did not brought a lot of revenue then most likely governments will leave it alone but the fact that it is generating such great revenue as the OP states in fact plays against it.

[Reid]

I was just going to ask what loot boxes are until I read more.  
Thank you for not forgetting to input the meaning of it.

So, it is more like a mystery box?
Does this happen in an MMORPG game?
It's addictive opening those kinds of items. It could be compared also to OVB of Ragnarok. Better because it was looted from monsters.
If not, buy it with zenny's. (in-game money)

[arallmuus]

-snipped-

Doesnt this could means the other way that the Government is actually trying to squeeze some money from the gaming industry?   AFAIK any gambling site or classified as gambling needs to pay taxes to operate in UK. While it is true that some kids might be spending alot of their age, alot of grownup spend alot of money in loot boxes as well .

Anyway They could just change the loot boxes to avoid this so instead of loot boxes , player will get specific type of equipment for X price. That wont be classified as gambling again ( check the highlighted part )

Loot boxes allow players to spend money on in-game rewards such as special characters or equipment, without knowing what they will get.

I think lots of people would be interested in the news concerning gambling in these parts.  And the gambling section is already very cluttered with gambling news threads.

Hence this is why this section exist

If you don't want to start it, can I?  

Would be such a messy thread if in one thread people throw in 10 random gambling news then everyone just state their opinion without actually addressing to which topic they are actually commenting

[smyslov]

The Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport (UK) will start gathering evidence to classify loot boxes game’s under the gambling laws, as they feel that these games are turning UK kids into future gamblers.

In case you don’t know what loot boxes are then in simple terms they’re upgrades that you can buy after you have installed the game, but you won’t know what kind of upgrades you’ll get, hence there’s an element of chance involved.

Lastly if UK decides to reclassify loot boxes game’s under the gambling laws then they’re going to hurt a industry worth $23 billion, but I feel that they’ll right to do it as it’ll help many kids who otherwise would have developed gambling addiction symptoms at a young age.

Gaming sites or business don;t want to classify their games as a form of gambling because no prize money is involved but kids and adults are spending to get those upgrades because they need these to beef up their games, they might change their program so they will not be classified as gambling or they will lose clients and markets.

If this is a multi billion dollar industry, the revenue will dwindle because of the new classification.

[goaldigger]

Not a real gambling though many are spending money just to buy the things that they want to improve their characters and some games already have their own casinos like the GTA. This is good because it can prevent the Children from spending too much on the things that they don’t really need.

I was just going to ask what loot boxes are until I read more. 
Thank you for not forgetting to input the meaning of it.

So, it is more like a mystery box?
Does this happen in an MMORPG game?
It's addictive opening those kinds of items. It could be compared also to OVB of Ragnarok. Better because it was looted from monsters.
If not, buy it with zenny's. (in-game money)

Those are the items available on the market place of the specific games where you have to spend more if you want precious items. Ragnarok is lit, its good but you don’t actually need to spend that much on a game.

[Botnake]

Hey Juggy.  Just a suggestion.  Why don't you start a thread titled 'Random Gambling News' and post them in one thread.  I think lots of people would be interested in the news concerning gambling in these parts.  And the gambling section is already very cluttered with gambling news threads.

That's a good suggestion too but it's up to OP.
IMO, putting a specific title on a certain news would also help us to monitor the thread for a specific news only, as long the discussion is on topic, I think it's not a problem, but then again, that's your initiative, you can make your own and just let the mods to decide on what they do.

personally, I like this kind of information thread than those general questions or topic that we have discuss in the past already and we are just getting redundant answers.

Sorry to butt in though I'm not ask, but I just give my opinion anyway.


Going back to the topic, yes, that is correct, for me, what is important is our children than and their future, so they should not start gambling while they are still a kid. Based on my personal experience, I have a kid who always plays for Mobile Legend and she ask some money to me to buy some "SKINS", so that might drive some kids to steal money if their parents won't give them as they want to remain competitive in the game and likes to have a good rank. 

ps. I am not a full time online gamer, so I am not so familiar with the terms.

[maydna]

I think the games were not wrong because their purposes are not trying to turn UK kids to become a gambler in the future. It was the parent's jobs always to watch and take care of their kids, so they don't turn become a gambler.

We cannot blame the similar and the other gambling games because we know that gambling is not for kids and if somehow, the kids become a gambler, that will be a responsibility from people who lived with that kids. Kids need to be controlled and watched, so they don't choose the wrong way in the future, and that will be a job for their parents and the other member of the family.

[Finestream]

I think the games were not wrong because their purposes are not trying to turn UK kids to become a gambler in the future. It was the parent's jobs always to watch and take care of their kids, so they don't turn become a gambler.

You said it right, in every game, there is always a warning and these days, anyone can play online games and not just kids.
We can also use gambling as a good example, though most gambling sites now put a warning in the site that in order to gamble, you need to be 18 years old and above but if a minor would play and will disregard the warning, he can still play, so I agree that it should be the parents responsibility.

We cannot blame the similar and the other gambling games because we know that gambling is not for kids and if somehow, the kids become a gambler, that will be a responsibility from people who lived with that kids. Kids need to be controlled and watched, so they don't choose the wrong way in the future, and that will be a job for their parents and the other member of the family.

Blaming a game or a business for the failure of the parents to monitor their kids is wrong, so we have the same opinion and stance on this matter.

[cabron]

Almost look like a kid's game but with the element of gambling. Just a surprise that they'd gonna get every loot box. This could start a gambling habit for kids indeed.
I wasn't aware of this loot box until this news. Good for the UK government.

If you don't want to start it, can I? 

Would be such a messy thread if in one thread people throw in 10 random gambling news then everyone just state their opinion without actually addressing to which topic they are actually commenting

I'm also in favor of not creating a thread all of the news, it will be a mess when everyone doesn't really quote which they are replying to. Most of the users will just post in the thread and anyone reading a message will have to trace back which post he refers to.

[Genemind]

Whether there are  no rules or laws to abide in regards to gambling children's early hobbies, mentality, vices, and etc. all depends on how parents teach and guide them as they grow. I am exposed to gambling as I grow with my family who are really gambling addicts, but with proper guidance, I didn't develop any gambling addiction or problem. Children should be thought about the value of money, how hard to earn them and the importance of knowing how to habdle finance at young age. Being a responsible parent at young age, where growth and adaptation is really critical is a must. Even with a law governing or preventing children from having gambling issues at young age, without proper parental guidance this law will not do much.

[slaman29]

I for one heartily support any move to ban loot boxes, or in fact any kind of pay to win concept, which is really the bane of all gaming. I'm not against paying. I think people should still pay to play, otherwise game developers have no income, but the whole idea of lootboxes and micro payments is really turning kids into addicts. They actually do steal and lie to get money to get those, I know it happens to my young cousins!

[peter0425]

Probably profit is not their priority on this matter, they just want to protect the Children and to prevent those abuse developer to collect money on a silly games.

Well, parents should guide their own Children at the first place so they will not ended up a broken gambler. In my place, there’s a lot of game addict and most of them are Children who spend the rest of the day playing with their phones. Its really alarming, and this kind of government action is good as long as the intention is to protect the players, developer should also be more concern to the players and not just about collecting money.

Got your point and that is correct,Parents must be responsible about what path their children must go,they need to at least focus about the behavior of their children regarding gambling because The government are doing their part to prevent kids to become another future gamblers.

and this is a good initiative from their government and must be implemented in other country as well.

[Reid]

I for one heartily support any move to ban loot boxes, or in fact any kind of pay to win concept, which is really the bane of all gaming. I'm not against paying. I think people should still pay to play, otherwise game developers have no income, but the whole idea of lootboxes and micro payments is really turning kids into addicts. They actually do steal and lie to get money to get those, I know it happens to my young cousins!

What I don't like now is the concept of pay to be the strongest. 
I have played some game that had good styles which can still balance the game without superpowers.
Although they are giving VIP features to enhance your speed in-game.
Albion is one of that, but it was a long time ago. I think they are now free to play.

Stay with the VIP feature. Keep the game where newbies won't be left in the dark. I think that could make the game be played longer.
Those loot boxes are not a good idea.
Let them grind too using events for more fun. Not just opening boxes the whole day. 

[cabron]

I for one heartily support any move to ban loot boxes, or in fact any kind of pay to win concept, which is really the bane of all gaming. I'm not against paying. I think people should still pay to play, otherwise game developers have no income, but the whole idea of lootboxes and micro payments is really turning kids into addicts. They actually do steal and lie to get money to get those, I know it happens to my young cousins!

Adult men also do it when they have nothing else to bet. First, they sell their properties. And when there is nothing to sell, they steal, and the next thing you knew they already sold their mother's corpse just to have something to bet.   Kids understood the concept of risking in the game like this lootbox. Its just the start of the habit till they eventually grow to bet more and forget school in the end.

[michellee]

Whether there are  no rules or laws to abide in regards to gambling children's early hobbies, mentality, vices, and etc. all depends on how parents teach and guide them as they grow. I am exposed to gambling as I grow with my family who are really gambling addicts, but with proper guidance, I didn't develop any gambling addiction or problem. Children should be thought about the value of money, how hard to earn them and the importance of knowing how to habdle finance at young age. Being a responsible parent at young age, where growth and adaptation is really critical is a must. Even with a law governing or preventing children from having gambling issues at young age, without proper parental guidance this law will not do much.

I agree with that. Maybe the government don't want to see the young kids become a gambler when they grow up so they will make regulations to control that. But as you say we need to teach and guide them, and we do not need to introduce gambling to them because, in their ages, they only want to play and have fun while they learn many things. Maybe the government needs to check on every parent who has kids and see how they educate their children so that can be a consideration for the government to make a law for gambling.

[dothebeats]

It's not really the gaming industry's fault if a child will gamble their way up to their special items or skins. Perhaps the parents should reinforce an iron hand when it comes to the child's gaming habits and also prevent them from using their credit cards unsolicited. Most of the cases wherein a child is able to gamble is because their parents' card is just lying around and can be readily used. Anyway, if parents would allow their children to actually play, but limit their hours, perhaps this could work. Or games should be more strict in terms of spending real money for in-game items. They can even go so far as to imposing strict KYC to prevent people from spending money without getting their info verified but maybe that's just me.