BitDice.me Investors unite

[pascal257]

I've already written in the official BitDice Topic, but since it gets filled with nonesense I thought I started a new topic dedicated to my fellow investors.

The worrisome points start to pile up and I was wondering what other investors are thinking, or maybe get some comments from BitDice management itself.

Problems with BitDice as a company

1. The last quarterly report published on medium was from 02/26 for Q4 2019. I was expecting another report in may for Q1 2020, but there are no notes about a delay or why it wasn't posted for over a month.
2. No or slow development. Just to pick an example, according to the ICO prospectus roadmap we should have Sports Betting in Q2 2018. It's 2 years later now and there's not even a preview for Sports Betting. As far as I know at least 80% of the features promised for 2018 aren't implemented yet.
3. Total wagered tapered off since ICO. It appears like all marketing affords have stopped since the ICO. BitDice had around BTC10k wagered from 10/1/17 until today. For reference: From 1/1/17 to 10/1/17 it had BTC44k wagered... Thats 4 times the wager in just 9 months.

And this is just to mention a few points off the top of my head. Maybe you can add more to the discussion?

Problems with the tokens or how token holders get screwed

1. The token entitles only in profit participation. The invested assets no longer belong to the token owners. (which is a stark shift compared to earlier investements where you could redeem your money).
2. In the whitepaper they state that the money invested was to be used for:
"25% of the funds will be kept in vault as reserve. At BitDice’s discretion and dependent on market conditions, some portion of reserves can be used to buy out tokens on the secondary market to reduce public float"
"10% of the funds will be used for promotion and marketing purposes."
"25% of the funds will be used by BitDice Casino to fund capital expenditures related to platform development and business expansion. It will primarily consist of:

    Compensating the development team for enhancing BitDice functionality, applying new technology and integrating gambling providers into the platform.
    Developing its own unique and provably fair games on top of the old ones.
    Acquiring necessary licenses to be able to operate with fiat currencies as a traditional gambling entity across as many regions as possible.
    Paying legal fees to bring the whole business structure into full compliance with regulatory framework.

"40% of the funds will be stored as the casino’s house bankroll to pay out winning bets and bonuses to the players on the whole array of games presented"

3. Now, if you take a look at their quarterly reports you can read things like:
"Higher expenditures have been related to business expansion activities such as finalizing integration of fiat payment systems, expanding to new markets of Southeast Asia, and strengthening presence in social media."
"The majority of the cost was attributed to team salaries and legal fees associated with ongoing process of obtaining a license:"

The result:
These expenditures reduce the distributable profit quite significantly. Which means that token holders (at least those participating in the ICO) pay twice. Once for the token itself and then via the reduced profit.
And just to reiterate: In the whitepaper/prospectus they clearly calculated the dividend with 70% of the profits. There's no mention of running costs.

I can live with the abysmal performance of bitdice, but I don't like getting ripped off.
Either they pay the above mentioned expense from the ICO proceeding and fully distribute the profits. Or they pay all expenditures from the net profits, but in turn treat the tokens like shares in the company.

The last point is vitally important in the case of closing the company. Let's assume in 2 years the team decides that the company wasn't profitable anymore and that they want to close it. The tokens would be worthless at that point, although the assets from the ICO are mainly still there, probably beeing distributed among the team.
One might even say that this creates an incentive to running the company into the ground...


If you want to read up on what I've been referring to:
Here is the original prospectus of the ICO: https://web.archive.org/web/20171105093415/https://ico.bitdice.me/prospectus_en.pdf
Here are some stats about BitDice: https://dicesites.com/bitdiceme

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[joksim299]

Excellent posts, short and concise. Easy to understand for everybody.
For the reasons you mentioned I created scam accusation thread against BitDice, but I received as you can see here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5224823 only few answers, for public and BitDice team everything is excellent or even better after ICO.
In that thread they mentioned that they spend big % of ICO proceedings to open bank account and at the end it failed, they still do not have bank account.
Its easy to realize that they do not follow their white paper and are using funds for bumped up legal expenses.

[Bajank]

as we know all gambling projects are not always running smoothly but in the end it is not in line with the expectations of everyone

[joksim299]

as we know all gambling projects are not always running smoothly but in the end it is not in line with the expectations of everyone

No this is different, we cannot expect anything when they failed badly.

[DarkStar_]

2. No or slow development. Just to pick an example, according to the ICO prospectus roadmap we should have Sports Betting in Q2 2018. It's 2 years later now and there's not even a preview for Sports Betting. As far as I know at least 80% of the features promised for 2018 aren't implemented yet.

Sportsbook exists and has existed for probably almost a year now. You need to be logged in to see it, but it's there.

[joksim299]

2. No or slow development. Just to pick an example, according to the ICO prospectus roadmap we should have Sports Betting in Q2 2018. It's 2 years later now and there's not even a preview for Sports Betting. As far as I know at least 80% of the features promised for 2018 aren't implemented yet.

Sportsbook exists and has existed for probably almost a year now. You need to be logged in to see it, but it's there.

It is not working for awhile, at least for me.

[DarkStar_]

2. No or slow development. Just to pick an example, according to the ICO prospectus roadmap we should have Sports Betting in Q2 2018. It's 2 years later now and there's not even a preview for Sports Betting. As far as I know at least 80% of the features promised for 2018 aren't implemented yet.

Sportsbook exists and has existed for probably almost a year now. You need to be logged in to see it, but it's there.

It is not working for awhile, at least for me.

https://i.imgur.com/VTGvTX1.png?1

It breaks every so often (I believe the issue is on BitDice's end and not their provider) but it does/did work. Here's a bet placed two days ago:

[kolloh]

Sportsbook is currently working. There was a temporary issue due to the provider making a change without informing BitDice, but it was fixed as soon as Bitdice was informed of the issue.

I've already written in the official BitDice Topic, but since it gets filled with nonesense I thought I started a new topic dedicated to my fellow investors.

There is a discord channel for investors where progress and information is being relayed to investors. If you are not already a member, I recommend you join for the most up to date information and you can ask questions there as well.

You can join the discord channel at https://discord.gg/EkGbYrH

[Juggy777]

2. No or slow development. Just to pick an example, according to the ICO prospectus roadmap we should have Sports Betting in Q2 2018. It's 2 years later now and there's not even a preview for Sports Betting. As far as I know at least 80% of the features promised for 2018 aren't implemented yet.

Sportsbook exists and has existed for probably almost a year now. You need to be logged in to see it, but it's there.

It is not working for awhile, at least for me.

https://i.imgur.com/VTGvTX1.png?1

It breaks every so often (I believe the issue is on BitDice's end and not their provider) but it does/did work. Here's a bet placed two days ago:

Sportsbook is currently working. There was a temporary issue due to the provider making a change without informing BitDice, but it was fixed as soon as Bitdice was informed of the issue.

I've already written in the official BitDice Topic, but since it gets filled with nonesense I thought I started a new topic dedicated to my fellow investors.

There is a discord channel for investors where progress and information is being relayed to investors. If you are not already a member, I recommend you join for the most up to date information and you can ask questions there as well.

You can join the discord channel at https://discord.gg/EkGbYrH

@DarkStar_ yea at times their sportsbook does go down but just a clarification for all that this happens only when their provider makes a sudden change and fails to inform them, and this has been confirmed by them in their chats and @kolloh statements above too confirm this.

@jokism299 @pascal257 you’ll won’t have to wait much longer now to see the development at Bitdice, and further Alex has also confirmed that new competitions will be launching prior and post the new sites launch, hence if you two really care for the site then how about suggesting some good competition ideas in the main Ann thread?.

To answer the questions in a few previous posts - there are various contests planned to be held before the launch of the fully revamped BitDice website (and, of course, after the launch too).

The aforementioned contests will indeed include more wager competitions.

Speaking about contests, what other types of events you would like us to run in support of the launch of BitDice 5.0? Please feel free to share your thoughts in this thread.

[dogedice.me]

@DarkStar_ yea at times their sportsbook does go down but just a clarification for all that this happens only when their provider makes a sudden change and fails to inform them, and this has been confirmed by them in their chats and @kolloh statements above too confirm this.

That is true, Sportsbook downtime mostly happens due to various amendments our partners do on their side.

Normally we do get notifications from them prior to the maintenance period, but unfortunately, that doesn't happen all the time.

[joksim299]

@DarkStar_ yea at times their sportsbook does go down but just a clarification for all that this happens only when their provider makes a sudden change and fails to inform them, and this has been confirmed by them in their chats and @kolloh statements above too confirm this.

That is true, Sportsbook downtime mostly happens due to various amendments our partners do on their side.

Normally we do get notifications from them prior to the maintenance period, but unfortunately, that doesn't happen all the time.

10,000,000$ collected from the ICO did the opposite thing and demotivated Bitdice (Alex) to work full time on the project. Nothing can convince me that he is really interested in the project, since ICO everything stopped, site is almost dead, only few minor updates and that is it. If you run into trouble or need help, you must wait for long periods to get it. Alex is only looking for a way to legitimately spend investors funds on servers, legal matter and staff salaries and make investors whole. All marketing efforts stopped after ICO.
It is pretty disappointing how people make them do not notice quite obvious things when you give them few bucks for signature or some other freebie, they do not have empathy at all.
Even after they update site. I won't recommend it to anybody, future can't be much brighter than past in Bitdice case.