How about restricting low rank people from opening new topics

[Emitdama]

Last 2 weeks, I noticed lost of topics got deleted and then I learned these are most common here as low value/repeated  topics/discussions are being removed continuously.

I do choose the topics more carefully still I find my count varies time to time. It is really disappointing to see after writing posts up to the level of feeling pain on my mind.

Any possible solution for this year long existing problem?

I guess if newbies and few other low rank members will be restricted to get approval on their topic, we may somehow solve the hassles of frequent removal of topics.

Even not across all boards of this forum, restrictions of few discussion boards may help many active posters here.

Instead of catching low quality topics, now Mods may need to work on approving new/innovative/needed topics.

[People do get notification on deletion of their own post. They must feel responsible for their inappropriate post. But, disappearance of a topic itself where one poster has contributed with all efforts and time, is definitely not the poster's mistake hence I think this needs to be addressed as early as possible .]

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[pokeronlinestatus]

How about high rank forum member opens repeated or low quality topics?

I guess mods do remove a topic after they receive reports against that topic. There are 100s are topic being launched everyday so mods work load will go wild levels as per your idea.

[ChuckBuck]

No, I think we should not implement restrictions   There is a topic that has talked about the same issue before, and it has come to the conclusion that we should not prevent or make any difference.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5231786.0
The content looks a little different but the problem is similar, on topics created by newbie or brand new. Personally, I still believe that we should keep the freedom of all users here. If you feel uncomfortable when a post is deleted, don't post to the thread, just skip and report it   What motivates you to post on bullshit topics that will be deleted?

So, if you are worrying on post count for your campaigns, I guess you do not need to.

You may be right, except that this guy is not currently in any signature campaign 

[Emitdama]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5231786.0

I understand that topic is all about the people who talk to themselves. Just dealing with newbies, these topics cannot be the same.

What motivates you to post on bullshit topics that will be deleted?

I am not capable of identifying a bullshit topic but I do believe mods are. Why not Mods go working in a manner reacting to such topics well before even launched rather than allowing shit topics for days?

I still believe that we should keep the freedom of all users here.

They can still enjoy all the freedom if they are having a reason for a topic to be launched. Just delaying the launch of a topic cannot impact level of freedom IMO.

[actmyname]

I am not capable of identifying a bullshit topic but I do believe mods are. Why not Mods go working in a manner reacting to such topics well before even launched rather than allowing shit topics for days?

Volume of threads that are not going to be deleted is much higher than the volume of threads that are going to be deleted. Rather than do something that affects the entire sample space to satiate only a subset within that field, moderation can instead be focused on reported topics. From an efficiency standpoint, I don't see the point of any Newbie jail equivalents.

From an administrative standpoint, it's not going to happen because theymos doesn't like those restrictions.

[mindrust]

No need. The mods are great at deleting the spam threads.

I don't know if we already have it but maybe put a 10 minutes cooldown between the created topics when the spam goes through the roof.

There are newly created accounts that belong to the projects and they'll want to create an ANN thread immediately.

If you don't give them that, they'll produce more spam just to get ranked or won't even bother with it and leave the forum. Either of these options are not good for the forum.

[BIT-BENDER]

there are an awful lot of newbie restrictions, and I don't want the forum to be unwelcoming to good newbies.

Some newbie are setting good paths for themselves, a restriction on that rank would be harsh on them,. They sometimes need to try new topics to learn, -to get a hang of it- the newbie rank is a preliminary rank -to those newbie that want to see it as that- to get them ready.

But if you're incapable of posting anything worthwhile, then you will never rank up, and you shouldn't: this isn't the forum for you.

There are -newbies/low rank trashbag posters that will never rank up until they make themselves useful, I just ignore such post from such people,

[ChuckBuck]

What motivates you to post on bullshit topics that will be deleted?

How many topic are posted on this forum every day? this forum is free for everyone. Let's think about who will spend all their time reading all the posts and score some points for them? No one, the mod will not take the time to do it, they just need to check the posts that have been reported. And, what if you want to post an topic and you have to wait hours and hours for it to be approved and displayed? No, you will not want that to happen.
How much time do you spend reading an topic? If you regularly encounter deleted posts, you should have more experience to avoid repetition, right? At least spend a little more time reading and understanding what it is talking about  
Just ignore or report, nothing difficult 

[LeGaulois]

When you're used surfing the forum, you know which thread will be deleted, which will be full of shits and which will be spammed with links, etc. (And when you read a topic you know which post to avoid to read, just by reading the username's poster)

Newbie/low-rank people shouldn't be restricted to open new topics. Imagine someone new to Bitcoin and joining the forum because he has a question to ask, he won't be able, simply

Not a good way to attract people. There is also a social effect doing it, some users may not feel considered as others, while we should all be equal

...
There are -newbies/low rank trashbag posters that will never rank up until they make themselves useful, I just ignore such post from such people,
...

We don't ask to people to be 'useful', but just to be normal, it's just a forum. We don't need thousands of dick suckers to do blowjobs and posting useless threads about useless things

[bakasabo]

If you suggest to restrict low ranks from creating topics, what rank should have that opportunity?
And what about cooper members? Than there is almost to use from that rank?
Think as well about project representatives (real ones) - they must rank up, before they are able to represent their project ? That is totally nonsense.

[suchmoon]

Just report shitty threads and don't worry if it's a newbie or a 5000-merit legendary.

Newbies need to be able to create threads, for example for ban appeals or just to ask dumb newbie questions. What's the point of being a newbie if one can't publicly embarrass themselves with a stupid thread on the wrong board.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

From an administrative standpoint, it's not going to happen because theymos doesn't like those restrictions.

And as evidence of that, I'd point out that this suggestion has been made multiple times over the last few years and Theymos has never acted on it.  I recall lots of discussion about newbie restrictions before the merit system got implemented, and although he never weighed in on the subject, Theymos never changed the ability to start threads for noobs--creating the merit system was restriction enough for them, I think.

On the other hand, I don't think I was opposed to the idea last time it was brought up.  Things used to be so much worse, but it's still basically the case that most of the crap threads and posts come from newcomers shitposting for campaigns/bounties, and they'll often start threads with topics that have been done to death (like gold vs. bitcoin). 

[TheGodson]

There already is a thread that only allows higher ranked members to post. It is located in the Ivory Tower section under serious discussion. The content there tends to be better overall and spam isn't really found at all.

[ChuckBuck]

...and Theymos has never acted on it....

And I believe he was right to ignore it. Simply because he wants everyone to be as free as possible, this forum shouldn't be like a prison for newbies 

On the other hand, I don't think I was opposed to the idea last time it was brought up.  Things used to be so much worse, but it's still basically the case that most of the crap threads and posts come from newcomers shitposting for campaigns/bounties, and they'll often start threads with topics that have been done to death (like gold vs. bitcoin). 

If I remember correctly, the closest topic was created by Lucius, we were there, there were common ideas  the answers like this keep repeating, and the topics like this will repeat in the future, a never ending circle 

[Little Mouse]

Why most of the people join here? To get solution of their problem and discuss about problem they face. If low ranked users are restricted, how will they share their problem? You are requesting for a feature which will damage the purpose of a forum.

[hosseinimr93]

As already stated in previous posts, newbies should be able to open a new topic for asking their questions and the best thing we can do is to report their posts in the case they break the rules.

There is no doubt high percentage of spams come from newbies and that's why theymos has created the patrol page to make it easy for other members and moderators to review their posts.

If you care about spam made by newbies, you can use the patrol page to see all posts made by newbies and report spams.

You can also use the link below to exclude posts made in bounties.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=recent;patrol;nobounty

[hilariousandco]

I guess if newbies and few other low rank members will be restricted to get approval on their topic, we may somehow solve the hassles of frequent removal of topics.

I've suggested this in the past. I don't think it would be a bad thing if all new users are essentially shadowbanned until a mod has approved their post or account. It would at least get rid of bots pretty effectively.

[acroman08]

I presented a similar Idea last year about restricting newbies account that creates mostly topics and nothing more(most probably an alt of someone trying to reach the signature quota) but I was told theymos doesn't want to restrict newbies into posting what they want even if its an alt or not and the only way to restrict them in a way is to report the thread if you think the thread is just a spam or has no value. and to be honest, as I became an active member again last year I can't deny that there are helpful threads created by a newbie and I see why theymos is firm on his views as to why he doesn't want to restrict newbies to creating their topics.

[Henri Cartier]

It is not good to restrict all the Newbies to open a new topic because many Newbies come here to ask their doubts or questions by starting a topic. If they are restricted, how do they clear their doubts? Beginners and help section is mainly for the new users to ask their queries. Due to spammers, restricting other genuine newbies is not good.

If you find any posts that look spam, you can report that topic. Moderators will validate if the topic created is for spamming or not.

People do get notification on deletion of their own post. They must feel responsible for their inappropriate post. But, disappearance of a topic itself where one poster has contributed with all efforts and time, is definitely not the poster's mistake hence I think this needs to be addressed as early as possible .]

The topics will not disappear simply if the thread that is posted has any flaws or against the forum rules, then only it will be deleted. You can see the reason for the post deletion in your PM.

[hd49728]

there are an awful lot of newbie restrictions, and I don't want the forum to be unwelcoming to good newbies.

The admin has his core idea to give newbies as less restrictions as possible and he also want to build up the forum as a place for freedom, free of talk and discussions.

Newbies can sometimes bring amazing posts and topics, so please don't restrict them on that. Some newbies can contribute things that more valuable than many higher rank members.

Most of newbies are real newbies so they can talk funny stuffs but they are free to do this.

Part of newbies are from bump services (that almost dead) and farms. They can try to spam, talk some funny things and beg for merits. You can report them and get more records for your report history.

A minor part of newbies are only newbies on the forum because their ranks but they are not newbies in crypto. Don't restrict them to participate in and contribute for the forum.

[Little Mouse]

I've suggested this in the past. I don't think it would be a bad thing if all new users are essentially shadowbanned until a mod has approved their post or account. It would at least get rid of bots pretty effectively.

You will lose them if it takes days to approve the post. In addition with spam replies, moderating posts and approving topic will be a huge pain for the moderators. Now if some of the newbies post get approved with delay the chance of losing them is high. I'm sharing my personal experience based on facebook group. Can you share link of that discussion?

[aioc]

Last 2 weeks, I noticed lost of topics got deleted and then I learned these are most common here as low value/repeated  topics/discussions are being removed continuously.

I do choose the topics more carefully still I find my count varies time to time. It is really disappointing to see after writing posts up to the level of feeling pain on my mind.

Why generalize people, in the past I have 6 of my  topics and posts deleted and I have no problem with that, if you think that topic and some posts are out of direction you are free to report, moderators already has a lot of works considering the huge number of posts and threads created, just do your share and report bad posts.

[Krislaw]

Last 2 weeks, I noticed lost of topics got deleted and then I learned these are most common here as low value/repeated  topics/discussions are being removed continuously.

I do choose the topics more carefully still I find my count varies time to time. It is really disappointing to see after writing posts up to the level of feeling pain on my mind.

Any possible solution for this year long existing problem?

I guess if newbies and few other low rank members will be restricted to get approval on their topic, we may somehow solve the hassles of frequent removal of topics.

And if there's restriction, do you think newbies that are willing to contribute to the forum will want to stay?
Like you have said, repeated or low value post are the ones getting deleted here, if you notice reduction in your post count, then it's due to one of the reasons you stated. Moderators are only doing their part. There are lot of reports they deal with every minute/hour.

[TheUltraElite]

Report the thread, not the newbie. As simple as that. Multiple reports coming on the same thread creator will bring in some more restrictions and thus give the mods the warrant to ban/nuke the user.

Restricting someone from creating new threads is against what a forum is. A forum is a place for discussion and keeping aside the fact that this forum has a problem of repetitive topics which is unique to the problems of this forum, it would be a discriminatory practice for the new members who are joining.

There are bots, I agree. But the way to fight them is to report their posts. No need to engage them at all, let mods do their job and we do our part.

[Findingnemo]

First of all why someone have to post on such threads? Even if you are giving valid replies it will be deleted when it gets reluctant.

Newbies should not be restricted from creating threads because literally newbies are the one who needs to ask any queries, if we stop them then who is going to ask queries for legendaries to answer them?

[FIFA worldcup]

I guess if newbies and few other low rank members will be restricted to get approval on their topic, we may somehow solve the hassles of frequent removal of topics.

Upto which forum members do you consider are low rank except Newbies ? I am a member and i sometimes open thread even in Meta to discuss or ask something which is totally relevant so you consider Newbie, Jr Member and Member low ranked, then i will be denied to this, which is not right.

Secondly, if you say that Newbies should not be allowed to post a thread then we must know that all the Newbies does not come here to post and discuss things. Few of them only make the account to advertise their services and sites. Restricting them will be indirectly denying them to post their services.

[ranochigo]

Newbie jail was a thing in the earlier stages of the forum. Newbies were previously only allowed to post in one specific section and was allowed to post in the other parts of the forum after a specified number of posts. Needless to say, it did help with the spam by limiting it to a section but given that bounties, ICOs and signature programs were not popular back then, the effects wasn't very significant.

By limiting the topics that those with a lower rank can post in, they would probably just spam up the forum with replies until they are allowed to open new topics. I imagine that account trading could also rise due to this.

[Asuspawer09]

First of all why someone have to post on such threads? Even if you are giving valid replies it will be deleted when it gets reluctant.

Newbies should not be restricted from creating threads because literally newbies are the one who needs to ask any queries, if we stop them then who is going to ask queries for legendaries to answer them?

Yeah, I guess newbies ask a lot of question more often than high ranks, most of the time they don't know a lot of things they are going to post here in the forum to get some answers from the other experience which is a good thing and that is how it supposed to work or its the goal of the forum.

I think it's not necessary to restrict them from posting new topics if they broke the rules they are going to be banned for days or even permabanned and its already enough.

Also, we could just report it to moderator if we see that something is wrong.

[Shimmiry]

I've suggested this in the past. I don't think it would be a bad thing if all new users are essentially shadowbanned until a mod has approved their post or account. It would at least get rid of bots pretty effectively.

You will lose them if it takes days to approve the post. In addition with spam replies, moderating posts and approving topic will be a huge pain for the moderators...

Why would we lose them? Waiting for a publishing approval is far the best option to get rid of newbie's repetitive/duplicated and/or trash posting. I've also saw recently that there are a lot of newbie topic makers in which is too cliche to ask, most likely on the Bitcoin Discussion board, Meta, and Beginner's and Help (pretty understandable). And if they are really skillful and motivated enough, why wouldn't they wait?

Maybe if a newbie post approval isn't acceptable by other users and the administration, I think it would be better if their post were limited by 500 characters. This isn't a hard thing to do especially if they really are browsing and trying to gain knowledge in the forum. In that case, they will be forced to make their post lengthy and with length comes ofcourse numerous ideas to be built. Though it's kinda harsh to the new comers, it would somehow strengthen the quality of the forum.

[LoyceV]

First of all why someone have to post on such threads?

Here's one reason:
http://loyce.club/archive/posts/5469/54692723.html
http://loyce.club/archive/posts/5469/54692565.html
http://loyce.club/archive/posts/5469/54692560.html
http://loyce.club/archive/posts/5469/54692556.html

[Nellayar]

How about those newbies who are conducting bounty programs? those who have a question regarding to the forum or crypto? Don`t make it a whole. We have different purposes why we are here. And if there will become a restriction from posting or opening a new topic, it may have a discrimination in rank in this forum. We are all free here to post, but we must have all the responsibility to put a non copy pasted and repeated post.

Not all newbies I have seen are spamming the post by their repetitive question which is answerable. There are some who are putting much effort in their post. Therefore, do not make it as a whole.

[Lordhermes]

there are an awful lot of newbie restrictions, and I don't want the forum to be unwelcoming to good newbies.

Restrictions of newbies from participating here is against the rules of this forum as theymos is not in support of it. Some newbies are good questionnaires and beneficial quality posters, so will would really miss out on this if they're restricted.

But if you're incapable of posting anything worthwhile, then you will never rank up, and you shouldn't: this isn't the forum for you.

Everyone needs to rank up here, the only way to do so is to be a quality poster, contribute positively for the betterment of the forum, failure to exhibit such results to inability to rank up AMD shouldn't be ranked up at all.

[NavI_027]

How about those newbies who are conducting bounty programs? those who have a question regarding to the forum or crypto? Don`t make it a whole. We have different purposes why we are here.

I want to emphasize something but no offense dude, this is just my opinion .

There's no problem with those newbies who make thread to ask questions as long as it is not generic to the highest level (e.g. "what is bitcoin?", "who is satodhi?" etc.). But with regards to newbies who came here just to join bounties and do nothing except posting social media reports everyday? Nah I barely agree with that. I am not against to them or the bounty itself because I understand that advertising works that way, but honestly I find such act unhealthy. I can't help but to feel annoyed every time I bump into someone's history and see nothing but twitter and fb links tsk. What seems right now is that those members are like robots who just came here to work and not to learn. Sad but true .

Nevertheless, I am still against on prohibiting newbies on creating topics because it compromises the freedom of speech. I guess the least we can do to maintain the cleanliness of our forum not only depends on our mods since we can also do something. Let's be more active on reporting useless posts.

[Pmalek]

I am not capable of identifying a bullshit topic but I do believe mods are.

New users should not be restricted from joining the forum or asking questions, and creating their own topics. Bitcoin is for everyone and the forum where Bitcoin is discussed should be available to whoever wants to join.

Try to be careful where you post to avoid getting your posts deleted if the thread gets trashed. Avoid threads that add nothing new to the discussion and topics that have been discussed over and over again. If most posts have derailed far off-topic from the original OP, and nobody is discussing the OP anymore, that's a topic to avoid.

[noorman0]

_snip_
But with regards to newbies who came here just to join bounties and do nothing except posting social media reports everyday? Nah I barely agree with that. I am not against to them or the bounty itself because I understand that advertising works that way, but honestly I find such act unhealthy. I can't help but to feel annoyed every time I bump into someone's history and see nothing but twitter and fb links tsk. What seems right now is that those members are like robots who just came here to work and not to learn. Sad but true .

That's the most disturbing, and in fact, bounty hunters will almost never create new topics.
I have a different point of view about "low rank".
And I would think many times to restrict low ranks or new users to create topics if possible like them : 1,2, 3, 4

It would be better to make a few limits on them: 1, 2, 3

[Harlot]

Newbies have to start somewhere right? If several of their posts gets deleted frequently they themselves will know what the problem is and they can either as other members here in the forum or find out for themselves why their posts are getting deleted most of the time. They'll try to improve of themselves by having this kind of mistakes and will try to do better next time so their topics that they are really interested in won't be deleted. Simply restricting them for posting more topics won't let them learn anything from it since it doesn't guarantee anything about the improvement of their post.

[ReiMomo]

I extremely disagree with restricting newbies to open new topics, they had a right to ask, and WE higher rank will help them as much we can do.

If they posted a topic in a wrong board/section WE can correct them, if they will not abide by the rules in the forum without knowing them, WE can advise them. If they posted that against forum rules and spamming thread just like what happened yesterday there's a bunch of newbies posted with their scam ref links, WE can report them and moderators will do the rest.

This how our bitcoin community group will works, helping each other in a legal way. But we don't tolerate bad habits that maybe will harm the forum someday. Newbies are welcome to our community because that's the reason why satoshi made this community and we are all here starting with a scratch as a newbie.

[Eureka_07]

I guess if newbies and few other low rank members will be restricted to get approval on their topic, we may somehow solve the hassles of frequent removal of topics.

Even not across all boards of this forum, restrictions of few discussion boards may help many active posters here.

The forum could not really do that. Restricting lower members to start new topic is a bad move to do for a forum. It is not actually a kind way to moderate the posts here. If it is implemented, it will be a bad image for the forum.
And there are actually new users that are asking and creating topics because they do have some business to discuss.
Restricting will not work.

[bystandposter]

I guess if newbies and few other low rank members will be restricted to get approval on their topic, we may somehow solve the hassles of frequent removal of topics.

Even not across all boards of this forum, restrictions of few discussion boards may help many active posters here.

The forum could not really do that. Restricting lower members to start new topic is a bad move to do for a forum. It is not actually a kind way to moderate the posts here. If it is implemented, it will be a bad image for the forum.
And there are actually new users that are asking and creating topics because they do have some business to discuss.
Restricting will not work.

I agree with you as a new member, I don't like the idea of not allowing new users to create threads. A lot of people like me come here to ask questions occasionally on things they're stuck on. It doesn't really make sense to deny that.

[JohnBitCo]

I guess if newbies and few other low rank members will be restricted to get approval on their topic, we may somehow solve the hassles of frequent removal of topics.

Even not across all boards of this forum, restrictions of few discussion boards may help many active posters here.

The forum could not really do that. Restricting lower members to start new topic is a bad move to do for a forum. It is not actually a kind way to moderate the posts here. If it is implemented, it will be a bad image for the forum.
And there are actually new users that are asking and creating topics because they do have some business to discuss.
Restricting will not work.

I agree with you as a new member, I don't like the idea of not allowing new users to create threads. A lot of people like me come here to ask questions occasionally on things they're stuck on. It doesn't really make sense to deny that.

Why not first try to search on the topic or issue on which you need help, rather then directly creating the a new thread about it ?
If you have a habit of searching, you can find a lot of information and you do not need to create a new thread for the things which are already discussed number of times.

[actmyname]

Why not first try to search on the topic or issue on which you need help, rather then directly creating the a new thread about it ?

Newbies will probably have some difficulty using the search system, but I do agree that it should be used more often. If we establish a smoother transition to board members onto the use of search over thread creation then perhaps you'll see a better cultural shift. I do think, though, that sometimes the threads that are being made are just spam threads. You do often see those typical generic vague question threads in Bitcoin Discussion, Trading Discussion, Economics, etc.