How to know if gambling sites are legit?

[biopiclags]

How can we verify that a gambling site is legit? Is there a verified list of non-scam websites, or how can we check. With online games it seems pretty easy to fake the results and cause the players to lose on purpose from the perspective of the website owner.

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[actmyname]

Provably fair mechanisms allow for you to verify the bets yourself: what happens is that you are given a hash (encrypted message) of what the website may use to create the result of the specific bet you are placing. For example, I know that Primedice uses a server seed/client seed system where you're given a hashed server seed and where you can input your own client seed: this gives you the option to make sure that you are not being manipulated or that your bets are not being changed in any way to lean in the site's favor.

I would recommend looking into it - it's a pretty cool part of cryptography.

[biopiclags]

Thank you for your quick response. I have heard the term provable fair thrown around on these sites, but I cant actually find a way to verify it. I don't really understand how this hash-system actually PROVES that it's legit though. Theres no link with my crash game crashing at "5x" multiplier, and the random characters that is included in a hash.

[actmyname]

Thank you for your quick response. I have heard the term provable fair thrown around on these sites, but I cant actually find a way to verify it. I don't really understand how this hash-system actually PROVES that it's legit though. Theres no link with my crash game crashing at "5x" multiplier, and the random characters that is included in a hash.

A lot of websites will have a "verify" box or something similar on their platform where you can check to see if a bet is, in fact, fair accordingly to their policy.  Which website have you been playing on, by the way? This will give us an opportunity to better direct you towards the option.

A few sites will lay out the open-source code for you to see how the bet results are generated, which is another useful way to verify the provably fairness.

[biopiclags]

I've played on a few, for example bitcasino, roobet, fortunejack. I see the provably fair buttons and they do show seeds and hashes, but I am unable to use these to confirm that it is legit. What do I do once I get the seed? Sorry to ask again but I still dont understand how the see server/client sided proves it's legit. I know you're right but I want to understand for my knowledge. I'm not particularly computer savy when it comes to code.

[hatshepsut93]

actmyname covered the problem of bet verification, but it's only one of the many things that you have to worry about. There can be phishing sites that copy the existing legit sites, there can be entirely fake sites that allow you deposit and play, but don't allow you to withdraw, a legit site can one day commit an exit scam and so on.

Try using some crypto gambling review sites or doing your own research on this forum's Gambling section, look at the sites with the longest history and best reputation. And generally, avoid storing too much coins in your casino accounts.

[actmyname]

I've played on a few, for example bitcasino, roobet, fortunejack. I see the provably fair buttons and they do show seeds and hashes, but I am unable to use these to confirm that it is legit. What do I do once I get the seed? Sorry to ask again but I still dont understand how the see server/client sided proves it's legit. I know you're right but I want to understand for my knowledge. I'm not particularly computer savy when it comes to code.

I believe these sites should have a "provably fair" section where you can check for the site's advice regarding the topic. I haven't played on any of these sites yet so I'm unfamiliar, but if someone else wants to chime in with direct explanations then they should do so.

If they have some source code, you should be able to pull it up and use an online compiler - or hopefully one they provide on-site - to just run the verification on your own. As long as the result aligns with the server and client seed you were provided (hopefully with a nonce or some other randomization), the bet was provably fair.

[chmod755]

Maybe it's a typo and it should say "Probably fair"  

If they have some source code, you should be able to pull it up and use an online compiler - or hopefully one they provide on-site - to just run the verification on your own. As long as the result aligns with the server and client seed you were provided (hopefully with a nonce or some other randomization), the bet was provably fair.

I found an old link to verify satoshidice.com games: https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/4609/how-can-a-wager-with-satoshidice-be-proven-to-be-fair

[biopiclags]

actmyname covered the problem of bet verification, but it's only one of the many things that you have to worry about. There can be phishing sites that copy the existing legit sites, there can be entirely fake sites that allow you deposit and play, but don't allow you to withdraw, a legit site can one day commit an exit scam and so on.

Try using some crypto gambling review sites or doing your own research on this forum's Gambling section, look at the sites with the longest history and best reputation. And generally, avoid storing too much coins in your casino accounts.

I appreciate the tips to watch out for the phishing sites out there, I was not aware that there are sites that will allow you to deposit and not withdraw.

Maybe it's a typo and it should say "Probably fair" 

If they have some source code, you should be able to pull it up and use an online compiler - or hopefully one they provide on-site - to just run the verification on your own. As long as the result aligns with the server and client seed you were provided (hopefully with a nonce or some other randomization), the bet was provably fair.

I found an old link to verify satoshidice.com games: https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/4609/how-can-a-wager-with-satoshidice-be-proven-to-be-fair

Haha maybe . Thank you as well for the link, didn't think of consulting resources outside of these forums.

[Ryker1]

Well, my suggestion is to stay on the gambling discussion board if you want to know the mechanism about gambling and how it works. There are certain gambling discussions there that perhaps you will learn about provably fair in gambling sites. You can hit the search box engine and find a specific topic that you wanted to know. For example, these two threads explain very well how to check fairness and how to verify every bet in a particular casino.
^{[1] https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5235045.0}  made by Tytanowy Janusz ^{[well said]
[2] https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5227525.0}  made by webtricks ^{[it is simple but it is explained very well]}

[actmyname]

Maybe it's a typo and it should say "Probably fair"  

Let's be honest here: if you're running a casino, you're not really out to 'help' people necessarily. It's the creation of a zero-sum game. And when certain casino owners get particularly overzealous (999Dice, looking at you) the provably fair mechanisms may start having some issues.

Users should just be very aware of how the systems work and what can affect the actual fairness of games. I haven't written anything on when 'provably fair' is problematic since that is something for when you are more cognizant of how provably fair gambling actually works.

[gentlemand]

Gambling sites are one of the more solid areas of the crypto space. There are enough with long track records to be able to choose somewhere legit. Go for somewhere long established and extensively reviewed and you'll be fine. If they were screwing users the users would be extremely vocal about it. There is absolutely no need to select somewhere unknown.

I'd be more interested in whether I got paid should I win a reasonable amount. There seem to be a few cases where people have trouble with that.

[hd49728]

Maybe it's a typo and it should say "Probably fair"  

No. It is provably fair, exactly. Provably fair is a basic characteristic of a good casino that guarantee they don't cheat their users.

You should learn about what is provably fair: https://cryptogambling.org/. It is a provably fair provider and you can read some technical documents on provably fair on the site.

[Dash2712]

Be aware even with provably fair script, some casinos can force client seeds on users. In games where more than one player play (e.g Crash), house may have a mechanism of generating results with the client seeds of 2-3 players in every round instead of all players. Now more than provably fair script, the process of picking those 2-3 client seeds is more important. If house picks the seeds of first 2 players then it is possible that game is rigged because even if house allows players to change client seed, not all players change it and since only first 2 seeds will be taken into consideration, it is very much possible that players who entered client seed manually will not be considered because it takes time to change seed and player who are going with default seed with place bet instantly.

[Lordhermes]

Most of the times people get scammed trying to find out the legit casino and gambling site. I would have suggested that such user should do a thorough research before jumping in the place a bet. There are many factors to consider before doing placing bet on a site you haven't played before.
-Withdrawal and deposit issues.
-Bonuses when depositing.
-Fake results, I prefer soccer gambling platform so bettors can check results on livescores to avoid results posed by the system.

[gentlemand]

Apart from the above suggestions, I would recommend to check the profile of bitcoin of gambling site if exist. Trusting review sites are risky most of the times but if they are here for long ago, that's good and you can trust them.

I would never trust any review site related to crypto. They're all junk pieces of clickbait shit. This forum is enough. If a service is used by enough people there'll be a thread on it here. The total lack of mention of it on here is a definite red flag.

[QueenVera]

There are many factors to consider before doing placing bet on a site you haven't played before.
-Withdrawal and deposit issues.
-Bonuses when depositing.
-Fake results,

A gambling site with scamming intention can make their sportbook look legit until they're ready to perform an exit scam with gamblers and investor funds. So although your suggestion could go a long way in preventing scams, still gamblers shouldn't only rely on them but with the suggestion already mentioned above in combinations with yours will be a perfect combination to help prevent regretting patronizing scamming gambling site.

[Lucius]

I'd be more interested in whether I got paid should I win a reasonable amount. There seem to be a few cases where people have trouble with that.

Few is not really a word that accurately describes the problem of those who win a larger amount and then get a blocked or frozen account instead of a prize. Of course, it should be taken into account that some players deserve it because they use dirty methods and try to cheat the casino, but there are cases when the casino simply plays dirty because it is difficult or almost impossible to prove who is honest and who is a dirty player.


biopiclags, I think that Scam Accusations is a good source of information that can help you decide which gambling site you should consider as legitimate and which do not behave very professionally.

[gentlemand]

Few is not really a word that accurately describes the problem of those who win a larger amount and then get a blocked or frozen account instead of a prize. Of course, it should be taken into account that some players deserve it because they use dirty methods and try to cheat the casino, but there are cases when the casino simply plays dirty because it is difficult or almost impossible to prove who is honest and who is a dirty player.

Is that quite a common occurrence then?

biopiclags, I think that Scam Accusations is a good source of information that can help you decide which gambling site you should consider as legitimate and which do not behave very professionally.

That's a start but we all know how quick people are to scream 'scam' when even the slightest detail doesn't go their way. If the site itself is on such a thread being an asshole that's rather more compelling.