SwitchPoker.com - Adds Bitcoin Deposits!

[notme]

NO.  They are speaking out for freedom against an oppressive regime.

Pretty much.  Although it's purely profit motivated and not some altruistic move, it still has the same effect.  As a US citizen, I am absolutely appalled by what our nation and government does most of the time.  One of the main reasons I am permanently emigrating to Australia.  On behalf of intellectually and morally mature citizens of America, I apologize for our behavior.

But, on the flip side... Fulltilt poker was a giant, festering, money grubbing, cheating, lying sack of corporate shit and I am glad they got smashed. 

You're appalled that they would possibly try and protect american's from what are generally regarded as corrupt and illegal business and business practices, and then go on to name one company that was notably corrupt and ethically bankrupt and still say it's bad that the government could possibly want to shut them down.

Banning something doesn't help you regulate it.  It just pushes it further out of the reach of the law.

[1714055153]

1714055153

[DeathAndTaxes]

You're appalled that they would possibly try and protect american's from what are generally regarded as corrupt and illegal business and business practices, and then go on to name one company that was notably corrupt and ethically bankrupt and still say it's bad that the government could possibly want to shut them down.

The only entity more corrupt that Full Tilt Poker in this scenario is the US govt.

1) Full Tilt Poker and other off shore sites only exist because the US govt tries to legislate morality.  Given the choice between playing at a Nevada Gaming commission licensed poker room or "some rock I never heard of " licensed (wink wink -> bag of cash) poker room the choice is clear.

2) The US govt created the financial success of companies like FTP by driving all the money offshore where they could neither regulate nor control it.

3) Even then the US govt didn't give two craps about protecting the players.  They shutdown FTP to continue the moral crusade again "sin industries".

4) If the govt cared about protecting players they would simply make online poker legal and regulated in the US.  Brick & Mortar poker rooms are required to segregate player funds and are subject to suprise audits by state gaming boards.  Ever heard of a US physical casino losing player funds or not being able to pay all chips in full.  No?  The reason why is it is more profitable to be "legit" then try to cut corners w/ state gaming board looking over your shoulder.

In essence the govt made their very problem they "solved" and at tremendous expense to both taxpayers and banks (who just pass those costs on to consumers/taxpayers).  Even worse it isn't "solved" for every FTP they killed 4 new poker rooms spring up.  Kinda like how drugs are just as available after a 30 year "war on drugs" (yet another attack on sin industries).

So sorry not going to give the utterly corrupt and hypocritical US govt a pass on this one.

[Inaba]

NO.  They are speaking out for freedom against an oppressive regime.

Pretty much.  Although it's purely profit motivated and not some altruistic move, it still has the same effect.  As a US citizen, I am absolutely appalled by what our nation and government does most of the time.  One of the main reasons I am permanently emigrating to Australia.  On behalf of intellectually and morally mature citizens of America, I apologize for our behavior.

But, on the flip side... Fulltilt poker was a giant, festering, money grubbing, cheating, lying sack of corporate shit and I am glad they got smashed.  

You're appalled that they would possibly try and protect american's from what are generally regarded as corrupt and illegal business and business practices, and then go on to name one company that was notably corrupt and ethically bankrupt and still say it's bad that the government could possibly want to shut them down.

Most of the business practices they shut down are illegal only in the US.  They routinely apply misguided, ignorant, insulting, unwanted, unreasonable, irrational laws to countries and businesses that do not fall under their jursidiction. They then pressure outside entities through various means to get those questionable "laws" applied to the businesses they want shut down.  

Now that I've risen to your bait, let me explain why your statement is a straw man.

You knew, or at least should have known (by the fact that I intentionally singled out FTP at the end), that my statement was applied in a much more broad sense than just to FTP.  In this specific context, you could apply to just only poker, online gambling, or even areas of interest outside of online gambling, but in either case(s) you did not and chose to apply it to FTP specifically - there's your straw man.  

That said, yes, I am absolutely appalled that we, the US, tries to apply our idiotic views on morality on other nations while we can't even get a handle on our own.  I am appalled by the religious right that seems to be in a dominant position applying their fundamental views on my as a citizen of a supposedly free country and especially on others who are NOT citizens.  At least I, as a citizen, can choose to not be a citizen of a morally bankrupt, governmentally corrupt country.  Others, in other countries, don't even have that luxury.  In the case of online poker sites, as has already been said, Lotto is legal in just about all 50 states, which is gambling in it's purest form - yet poker isn't?  

In this specific context, my problem is with the fact that the government presses these "war on X" under the guise of protecting people or morality, when in fact it's purely driven by greed of the players involved, or worse, by the religious right thinking they need to press their laughable, socially juvenile, imaginary friend views on everyone else.  In either case, don't press the laws as some upstanding push for morality or decency... admit the reasons behind doing it.  The government won't admit the reasons because the people would rebel if the law makers, lobbyests, etc... admitted openly it was purely for profit.  Instead they have to hide behind lies and facades to push their agenda.  THAT is morally bankrupt.  THAT is corrupt.  THAT is ethically bankrupt.  

They did not shut down FTP to protect Americans from anything - they shut down FTP because they were competition and they weren't getting their cut of the pie.  Just look to Lotto for your proof - the government gets a large portion of that largess, so it's "legal."

[BitcoinPorn]

This is big news.  Someone needs to get on top of making this, but a US version.  Gambling is going to keep Bitcoin afloat if people will get on top of it quicker.   I think maybe some of these people who created these BTC gambling sites should start approaching the established big name poker sites to see if deals can be worked out.  Sell your companies to them for the greater good of Bitcoin.

[DeathAndTaxes]

This is big news.  Someone needs to get on top of making this, but a US version.  Gambling is going to keep Bitcoin afloat if people will get on top of it quicker.   I think maybe some of these people who created these BTC gambling sites should start approaching the established big name poker sites to see if deals can be worked out.  Sell your companies to them for the greater good of Bitcoin.

You can use Switch Poker from the US just use a VPN.  If you think any real company is going to advertise it is open for US players in violation of the UIGEA think again.

The long arm of the DOJ is something most companies don't want to mess with.  Party Poker closed access to US players.  Full Tilt Poker and PokerStars didn't.  They did fine until the DOJ decide to seize hundreds of millions of dollars and slap them w/ multi billion dollar lawsuits as well as request US courts forfeit all assets used in or were the direct result of the crimes (in reim forfeiture).

PokerStars will likely survive ... barely.  The fact they used segregated accounts and had sufficient liquidity helped them survive that massive blow to their cashflow.  Full Tilt Poker will survive in name only with original investors wipe out (which they should be the thieving bastards). 

Thinking any well capitalized company will advertise "Open to US players in direction violation of federal law" is a pipe dream.  Hopefully in the future the UIGEA will be repealed until then there are VPN services.   

[julz]

It's great to see a pre-existing poker site add Bitcoin support.

I've tried this out, and the exchange rates between BTC and Euro seem pretty reasonable.
It allows you to convert between Euro and BTC at will.

I think they really need to be a bit more transparent on fees and exchange rates though - it's pretty much try it and see what you get at the moment.
I just got 1.15 BTC for 2.23 Euro  when the mtgoxEUR was 1.91

They use bitcoin247.com for the deposit/exchange service. I haven't seen much written about them here, and I can't see an entry for them in bitcoincharts but so far so good.

Also a warning.. although you can deposit as little as 3BTC  - the minimum you can withdraw is 20BTC

I don't think there's really a good excuse for that given that BTC is so easy to transfer. It's simply a tactic to make you gamble your remaining money away, and I hope that competitors will come along who allow you to withdraw your bitcents, and force switchpoker to match this policy.

Edit: It also seems to me that you could purchase BTC by Visa using this system. I haven't tried it - but I don't see why it wouldn't work. They allow up to 500Euro visa deposit.

[DeathAndTaxes]

I think it is baby steps.  Remember this isn't a "bitcoin company" which has been using Bitcoin from Day 1 and is a fatantical supporter.  This is an online gaming company who seems bitcoin as a potential competitive advantage.

I would expect (hope) that over time their Bitcoin interface improves.  I see no reason once a company becomes use to Bitcoin that they can't allow direct transfers to/from private wallet and w/ lower minimums.

[Inaba]

You don't even need a VPN.  When you sign up, just give you country of residence as something other than the US.  I've already won 30 Euro with a 10 BTC deposit.  The fish are large at Switchpoker.

[DeathAndTaxes]

You don't even need a VPN.  When you sign up, just give you country of residence as something other than the US.  I've already won 30 Euro with a 10 BTC deposit.  The fish are large at Switchpoker.

Interesting.  I assumed they would (like every other poker room) be using some geo-location databases to filter US players.  Might check it out tonight.

[Inaba]

Nope... at least not so far.  Kinda nice you can play it on your smartphone, too, since it's all web driven... but the interface is kind of clunky, sadly.

[Herodes]

Just wondering, can you play SN&G or tournaments with switchpoker? (Didn't bother to check the site, but just asked in case anyone reading this thread knew)

[bracek]

They did not shut down FTP to protect Americans from anything - they shut down FTP because they were competition and they weren't getting their cut of the pie.  Just look to Lotto for your proof - the government gets a large portion of that largess, so it's "legal."

lotto is ok because it depletes you of your money (your purchasing and voting power)
from that POV poker is also ok,
but problem with poker is that it makes you smarter, raises your level of awareness,
and they surely don't want THAT in their backyard,
therefore, it is illegal...

[btc_artist]

There are hundreds of thousands of ways to waste money, poker is not the only option.  Why doesn't the US gov't just ban LIFE?

[notme]

There are hundreds of thousands of ways to waste money, poker is not the only option.  Why doesn't the US gov't just ban LIFE?

Because LIFE is for patenting.

[ssaCEO]

Stick with your Bitcoin poker room of choice... whether it's us, or Seals or BTCOnTilt, we need you support. Word is SwitchPoker only cashes out during business hours, sometimes 24+ hours later, and has a minimum $20 withdrawal.

Anyone outside the US can come on StrikeSapphire, day or night, and play in a freeroll; they open up as soon as the last freeroll started and you can open six windows at the same time. They're cheap - about 0.5 BTC each - but only take 4 players to start. Come support us. We need the xo luv.

And our software, which is original, is a hell of a lot nicer.

[BitcoinPorn]

There are hundreds of thousands of ways to waste money, poker is not the only option.  Why doesn't the US gov't just ban LIFE?

Because they make their money the 'legal' state run lotto gambling way, no need to allow everyone to play multiple games to lose their money and have fun with it, the US enjoys the slowly killing our citizens with a weekly drawing to ensure there is only one winner a week, rather than many in a day.

[Inaba]

Well, Seals uses the Poker Mavens software, which I absolutely detest.  There is something fishy about the software - not only on Seals, but any site I've ever used that has Poker Mavens, there's some janky shit that happens with the cards.  Normally I would chalk it up to me being a crappy player that night or some other, explainable reason... however somehow I always manage to turn a profit at other places, but never on a Poker Mavens backed site... and it's happened on multiple different sites that run Poker Mavens as their poker room back end... so I've pretty much settled on avoiding any site with Poker Mavens.

[btc_artist]

Well, Seals uses the Poker Mavens software, which I absolutely detest.  There is something fishy about the software - not only on Seals, but any site I've ever used that has Poker Mavens, there's some janky shit that happens with the cards.  Normally I would chalk it up to me being a crappy player that night or some other, explainable reason... however somehow I always manage to turn a profit at other places, but never on a Poker Mavens backed site... and it's happened on multiple different sites that run Poker Mavens as their poker room back end... so I've pretty much settled on avoiding any site with Poker Mavens.

I'd love to hear freemoney's take on this.  Perhaps he'd also be willing to switch software.  I don't like Poker Mavens because it's flash and won't work on an iPhone (unless you jailbreak).

[Gabi]

Next time buy a decent phone that run things

[btc_artist]

Next time buy a decent phone that run things

Not getting into that one.   I dislike flash for many reasons, I really had no need to mention Apple.