Verifying Provably Fair b.s.

[Ucy]

This was just discussed at one casino as well earlier today, I won't say names, but I think there is a misconception about what provably fair means. RNG systems that people respect and acknowledge aren't the same as PF. PF should mean you can verify on your own without relying on 3rd party sites.

That's what I am talking about. Provably Fair is very missleading, a large part of the players understands by it something, which is actually not meant and weighs itself in false security.
The problem here is that this can be exploited by casinos, which may scam their players(no payout of larger amounts, ...). It is enough to write "We are provably fair" on the website and you will get an unjustified trust advance.

Therefore I think OP has a point, do we have a 3rd party site that we can verify if the result of a certain site is really provably fair?
I'm still interested with it though I mostly focus on sports betting where it's not really necessary as games can be fix or not, I just have to be at the right side.

If you mean football betting (which is actually part of sports-betting), then I don't really see the need for the typical provable fair feature used mostly for random-based bettings whose betting outcomes are determined by the system you are betting on... And you'll have to worry about the possibility of results of winners getting changed.

Normally you are issued a ticket after betting on sports/football as proof, which makes your true result getting changed by the betting sites hard...Though it's possible that betting sites would wrongly dispute the tickets of true winners  and refusing to accept that they are the true winners when they come to claim their prize. I guess this is where provable fair could be used to avoid that kind of situation, maybe by hashing the tickets before they are giving to bettors?

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[wildan88]

i was kinda curious too i've been verifying it too i read some post about when he try to verify it on the casino's built in verifier a hash come but when he tried to a third party verifier the result is different.

[webtricks]

I am also curious about this one because I saw that there are many platforms that are saying that they offer a probably fair script but it will be good if a normal
gambler can verify it whether they are telling the truth or not.

So third party application will be very helpful if there is willing to create a platform that will verify their script. I will be looking forward if there will be available in the future.

Your wait it over, as I promised on the first page of this thread, btcgosu has already come up with the biggest third-party provably fair verification tool. It is currently covering 25 casinos and 49 games.

Here's the link: https://www.btcgosu.com/tools/provably-fair-verifier/

Can't see the casino or game you were looking for in the tool? No problem, you can request addition of unlisted casinos/games in this thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5262141.0 and same will get added in the tool in near future.

[Lakai01]

Your wait it over, as I promised on the first page of this thread, btcgosu has already come up with the biggest third-party provably fair verification tool. It is currently covering 25 casinos and 49 games.

Legendary
In the text BTCGosu should emphasize the

By using this tool, you will be able to check if your bets placed on various crypto casinos are legitimate

in my opinion even better. Don't let anybody get the idea that this would protect him/her from scams just because BTCGosus Verifier shows a positive result.

As already mentioned, "provable fair" is too often confused with "won't scam me" ...

Otherwise: Top work, I like the Verifier very much!

[webtricks]

In the text BTCGosu should emphasize the

By using this tool, you will be able to check if your bets placed on various crypto casinos are legitimate

in my opinion even better. Don't let anybody get the idea that this would protect him/her from scams just because BTCGosus Verifier shows a positive result.

As already mentioned, "provable fair" is too often confused with "won't scam me" ...

You are absolutely right. There is a difference between 'cheating' and 'scamming'. This tool will only verify that the casino is not cheating you by showing manipulated bet results. However, you should take due-diligence before depositing money on a casino because even though casino is provably-fair, it can scam by not paying you or come up with some shitty rule to ban your account.

But wait, btcgosu get that covered too! @efialtis has posted some top-notch reviews of the popular casinos on btcgosu and he's adding new periodically. These reviews can be taken into consideration for the process of due-diligence and picking right casino for you, more here: https://www.btcgosu.com/

[efialtis]

Your wait it over, as I promised on the first page of this thread, btcgosu has already come up with the biggest third-party provably fair verification tool. It is currently covering 25 casinos and 49 games.

Legendary
In the text BTCGosu should emphasize the

By using this tool, you will be able to check if your bets placed on various crypto casinos are legitimate

in my opinion even better. Don't let anybody get the idea that this would protect him/her from scams just because BTCGosus Verifier shows a positive result.

As already mentioned, "provable fair" is too often confused with "won't scam me" ...

Otherwise: Top work, I like the Verifier very much!

I have added a box stating that not cheating by manipulating bets doesn't automatically mean a casino can't be shady and scam people.

[Lakai01]

I have added a box stating that not cheating by manipulating bets doesn't automatically mean a casino can't be shady and scam people.

Splendid, thank you very much efialtis!

You are absolutely right. There is a difference between 'cheating' and 'scamming'. This tool will only verify that the casino is not cheating you by showing manipulated bet results. However, you should take due-diligence before depositing money on a casino because even though casino is provably-fair, it can scam by not paying you or come up with some shitty rule to ban your account.

Right, that's exactly what I mean. Unfortunately, you see too often postings on Bitcointalk where scams are excluded, because one page is "provably fair". This leads to a false sense of security and is even abused by casinos that have the pure intention to scam. Unfortunately, very few players actually deal with what "provably fair" means and try to verify their bets although it is VERY easy to do (and got even more easier now thanks to BTCGosu )

[Saint-loup]

I am also curious about this one because I saw that there are many platforms that are saying that they offer a probably fair script but it will be good if a normal
gambler can verify it whether they are telling the truth or not.

So third party application will be very helpful if there is willing to create a platform that will verify their script. I will be looking forward if there will be available in the future.

Generally it's quite easy to verify if the provably fair game is ok. And unlike cryptos related things you can use tools(sha, hmac calculators,...) from the web for that, because the datas to be sent are not critical. So I think it's better for people to verify themselves, they can learn how the game works and what are their real chances to win, thanks to that.