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Author Topic: Betting on bitcoin against Central Bank Digital Currencies  (Read 416 times)
ilovealtcoins
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September 07, 2020, 09:40:12 AM
 #21

I would choose digital banking because it helps to promote the monetary system in the developed country, but investing I would choose bitcoin.
The reason: more transparency means less money laundering and congestion, better system liquidity, etc.
Bitcoin was launched in 2009, and Satoshi quickly mined himself 2 million bitcoins before releasing the source code to anyone. Those who owned the first bitcoins became rich. The latecomers are at higher risk. Bitcoin has more speculative and manipulative value in the market as people have seen bulls and bears in history. I would choose Bitcoin to invest in because it has long term value.

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September 07, 2020, 11:35:04 AM
 #22

It's not a debate, CBDC changes nothing. It's still state-issued money that was made to maintain the status-quo.
 

As a payment system, CBDC will gain more adoption compared to a decentralized system which is bitcoin, digital or paper money, still bitcoin will always lag behind as digital currencies made by government will always gain the trust of the people even though we may say that the government might not be able to run our economy effectively.


Of course, but if you need an opt-out mechanism, or you need a self-sovereign, censorship-resistant currency, you know where to go. Cool

Quote

Bitcoin is the separation of money and state, and your back-up/fall back once the state loses control of the economic and monetary system.


I don't think so because in order for bitcoin to gain adoption, we need the government to regulate it, it doesn't matter if they are different (centralized vs decentralized) as in the end, no such thing exist in this world especially about finances that are exempted from regulation.


You don't think so? Can the government print more of Bitcoin's supply at will like they do with fiat? Can the government stop my transaction? Can the government take my coins from me?

Plus I'm not talking about adoption, that will come in the right time, with or without regulation. It can't stopped.

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September 07, 2020, 11:51:45 AM
 #23

CBDCs are still a concept and its' too early to proclaim their domination,but I'm pretty sure that 90% of the people will accept them.
The vast majority of the people are just conformists,they will follow the rules and accept every BS that is introduced by their governments/central banks.
Being a "Bitcoiner" means that you are not a part of the financially uneducated conformists and you are aware about the BS fiat money banking system.The true "bitcoiners" and supporters of a truly decentralized financial system will always remain a minority.


I guess so, but the only real question right now is when will these Governments will implement their own CBDC which I presume would have unwanted repercussions towards its respective economy.

Until then we could just only speculate with different ideas on how people would react to such radical changes, especially on those who don't trust their own Governments. Imho.
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September 07, 2020, 02:17:47 PM
 #24

Great points, and for the uninitiated, it might not make much issue... in fact, I know some people actually feel safer putting their money in a centralized entity. All for understandable reasons... I myself don't go all in on Bitcoin, can't afford to, I am not alone in this world so I also have to trust at least 2 governments via their bank guarantee scheme =)
People can not avoid to use fiat in their lives. Paper fiat or coming CBDC, we can not avoid to use them but I agree with you that in any nations, choose the most trusted banks to use and at least chose 2 banks (a basic of decentralization, even when use banks try to diversify to at least 2 banks). Big and trusted bank can be compromised and destroyed inside that we don't know till the day it announces a bankcruptcy.

I don't go all in on Bitcoin, same as you. Because as said, I need some amount of fiat to use, and to manage risk. Investment in bitcoin should be made with free money that we don't have plans to use in near future. Beyond bitcoin, another fund in fiat for emergencies.

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September 07, 2020, 02:53:27 PM
 #25

Many Banks will soon start investing in crypto, realizing that fiat currencies are losing ground.
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September 07, 2020, 03:07:45 PM
 #26

Many Banks will soon start investing in crypto, realizing that fiat currencies are losing ground.

I believe they rather invest in blockchain technology and create their own cryptocurrency instead than adopting the existing one.  This way bank have full control of the released token.



Well, I think Central Bank has Bitcoin in their mind but they are too proud to accept that it is superior than their current Digital finance system once fully developed.  Central Bank may adopt Bitcoin but it will not let Bitcoin control the finance system.  In short, Central banks will ride the popularity of Bitcoin with ulterior motive of taking control of its ecosystem if not its blockchain.

In conclusion, Central bank had its say when it comes to financial system because they have the authority.  There is no way Bitcoin can compete with them when it comes to authority.  But Bitcoin will definitely have an effect on how central banks shape the future of financial system.




You don't think so? Can the government print more of Bitcoin's supply at will like they do with fiat? Can the government stop my transaction? Can the government take my coins from me?

They can't print more BTC but they can create another cryptocurrency according to their likings.

Plus I'm not talking about adoption, that will come in the right time, with or without regulation. It can't stopped.

I definitely agree on this part but without regulation, it will take more time to be adopted.  And when it is adopted, government will find ways to regulate it.
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September 07, 2020, 03:13:01 PM
 #27

I think Bitcoin is a safer bet. Centralized cryptocurrencies are neither trustworthy in the eyes of people nor revolutionary enough. They are boring: too stable and much like fiat, but you have to learn how to use cryptos. If fiat crashes, I don't think the centralized coins will survive. If it doesn't, there's no need for them (debit cards with fiat are just fine). Moreover, it seems that the govs are cautious when it comes to cryptos with centralization and regulation, and if they are not certain, there's no reason for people to be. Bitcoin will not necessarily crash if fiat crashes, and the fact that its price and supply cannot be controlled by any particular institution seems reassuring to me.

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September 07, 2020, 03:31:17 PM
 #28

If only some people will try BTC to know how bitcoin is tested and trusted, they will like to bet with bitcoin than central bank.I think central bank is centralized,it can cause go slow in the market at anytime, because it's control by the government,while bitcoin is decentralized,is  not control by government.
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September 07, 2020, 03:42:36 PM
 #29

To be honest, I definitely prefer use Bitcoin when compared to CBDC, there are several reasons why I prefer use Bitcoin.
It is clear that I chose Bitcoin because as long as it is decentralized, the total Bitcoin supply is limited and most importantly
transparent. But most of the people around the world, would prefer CBDC which has support from the government.
 

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September 07, 2020, 05:04:40 PM
 #30

To be honest, I'm afraid the average person might just use what the government officially issues. And whether or not governments would fully do away with bills and coins, the replacement is actually no better. Digital fiat currencies make monitoring of transactions easier on the part of the authorities.

But if only the average Joe is concerned even a little bit of his privacy and freedom. If he is at least moderately critical of how the financial system is being ran on the basis of a handful of people's faulty decisions, he might be very grateful Bitcoin is an open option.  
We will have to wait and see, currently there is no much point for governments releasing their own coins because most people will not use them and the few that could like us will not adopt them because we know those coins are going to be even worse than their fiat counterparts, so they need something to bait people, above it was suggested that governments could seduce people with free money and that is definitely a possibility.

However it does not matter what they do if people like us keep supporting bitcoin then they will always have to face a competitor they cannot kill and that has characteristics that are superior to their fiat making it an attractive investment option for those do not believe the fiat currencies can last much longer.

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September 07, 2020, 07:59:08 PM
 #31

     Well, if you really think about it, bitcoin is the winner here if we talk about the long run. It's pretty logical since we can all see the flaws of the fiat we use wherever you are in the world. Although bitcoin has flaws of it's own, if you really are careful and if your country really does allow crypto currencies, then bitcoin truly is the better bet. But hey, that's just me and my view. Just saying that with the things happening in the world today, I trust bitcoins more than fiat.

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September 07, 2020, 08:05:43 PM
 #32

I find it very interesting  as we have been taking about how banks will struggle due to continues printing of money especially to bail out the pandemic.
What changes it will achieve when a central bank currency goes digital, nothing happen if the country is still printing out money in any form, i am not going to compare between the central banks and the cryptocurrency space as both has different applications and i started using a decentralized currency for my freedom and privacy which i will never get in a centralized currency and both has its advantages and disadvantages.

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September 08, 2020, 06:25:39 AM
 #33

People can not avoid to use fiat in their lives. Paper fiat or coming CBDC, we can not avoid to use them but I agree with you that in any nations, choose the most trusted banks to use and at least chose 2 banks (a basic of decentralization, even when use banks try to diversify to at least 2 banks). Big and trusted bank can be compromised and destroyed inside that we don't know till the day it announces a bankcruptcy.

I don't go all in on Bitcoin, same as you. Because as said, I need some amount of fiat to use, and to manage risk. Investment in bitcoin should be made with free money that we don't have plans to use in near future. Beyond bitcoin, another fund in fiat for emergencies.

Yeah, that's how I'm spreading my risk. 2 banks in my home country, and one in my resident country, across 3 currencies (my home, euro and dollars). I could still be f*cked but I'm more confident of a free bank insurance scheme than anything else right now. And then of course I have my Bitcoin, which I have the least confidence in (during my lifetime).

As I said, it'd be very different if I were alone in this life but well, we have to live in reality, and we can't gamble with the lives of others...

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September 08, 2020, 07:47:06 AM
 #34

I find it very interesting  as we have been taking about how banks will struggle due to continues printing of money especially to bail out the pandemic.
What changes it will achieve when a central bank currency goes digital, nothing happen if the country is still printing out money in any form, i am not going to compare between the central banks and the cryptocurrency space as both has different applications and i started using a decentralized currency for my freedom and privacy which i will never get in a centralized currency and both has its advantages and disadvantages.

You'll enjoy that freedom and privacy now but in the long run when massive adoption happens, all transactions will become subject to regulation by the government. What I'm saying is not how it's use because we know they are both digital currencies and CBDC is even better as it's centralized, meaning, it's faster and you might enjoy a small fee compared to using bitcoin, what I am emphasizing is its value in the long run, real value because inflation will hit us but bitcoin will remain to a coin that is good to hedge that inflation.

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September 09, 2020, 10:27:15 AM
 #35



You don't think so? Can the government print more of Bitcoin's supply at will like they do with fiat? Can the government stop my transaction? Can the government take my coins from me?

They can't print more BTC but they can create another cryptocurrency according to their likings.


That was the point, they can create CBDCs, but it wouldn't be having the hard-money properties of Bitcoin, and it would be under centralized control. What would be the point of it?

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Plus I'm not talking about adoption, that will come in the right time, with or without regulation. It can't stopped.

I definitely agree on this part but without regulation, it will take more time to be adopted.  And when it is adopted, government will find ways to regulate it.


Regulation is not equal to adoption. It can't be censored, it can't be taken from you, and it can't be controlled by the government.

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September 09, 2020, 10:56:08 AM
 #36

I'm more favored to the implementation of CBDC in the long run BUT that doesn't mean that I'm against BTC growing in the long term. More people would probably rather experience less hassle and fewer problems when concerning finance, and asking for a central body to do everything for you seems like a chance they can't pass out on. The problem here is about privacy, but if most payments were made were only related to, for example, paying bills, taxes, etc., then CBDC is still the best bet. You can then use BTC whenever you want to as a free option. It's like both currencies being used interchangeably, but without any issue or problem with them coexisting together, which is probably wishful thinking in my part.

We may talk trash all we want about how CBDC makes our privacy non-existent, but it is an issue of advantages and disadvantages as most have said, with CBDC mainly being used for security reasons. Not that I'm saying people use BTC to do bad stuff all the time, but it isn't an issue that we can avoid and it can completely happen.

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September 10, 2020, 08:21:17 AM
 #37

I'm more favored to the implementation of CBDC in the long run BUT that doesn't mean that I'm against BTC growing in the long term. More people would probably rather experience less hassle and fewer problems when concerning finance, and asking for a central body to do everything for you seems like a chance they can't pass out on. The problem here is about privacy, but if most payments were made were only related to, for example, paying bills, taxes, etc., then CBDC is still the best bet. You can then use BTC whenever you want to as a free option. It's like both currencies being used interchangeably, but without any issue or problem with them coexisting together, which is probably wishful thinking in my part.

We may talk trash all we want about how CBDC makes our privacy non-existent, but it is an issue of advantages and disadvantages as most have said, with CBDC mainly being used for security reasons. Not that I'm saying people use BTC to do bad stuff all the time, but it isn't an issue that we can avoid and it can completely happen.


OK, but what would be the difference? What's the point of CBDC? Convience? We already have debit cards, and money-apps. Central Bank issued currencies ARE digital.

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September 12, 2020, 02:18:40 PM
 #38

To be honest, I'm afraid the average person might just use what the government officially issues. And whether or not governments would fully do away with bills and coins, the replacement is actually no better. Digital fiat currencies make monitoring of transactions easier on the part of the authorities.

But if only the average Joe is concerned even a little bit of his privacy and freedom. If he is at least moderately critical of how the financial system is being ran on the basis of a handful of people's faulty decisions, he might be very grateful Bitcoin is an open option. 

yes i think for the average guy if given the choice between using a govt backed CBDC as opposed to Bitcoin most people will simply use the CBDC. The fact is that most people really don't care all that much about their digital privacy ( case in point the the whole  PRISIM situation which most people seem to have forgotten about andhas been largely swept under the rug)  and will always pick the option that their local and central governments tell them to use. The fact that you would most likely be able to make and receive official payments ( taxes, state subsidies/ benefits etc.) in the CBDC rather than Bitcoin will IMO play a large part in its adoption.

Bitcoin of course will still be used by most people who do value their privacy, but i think it will take a very large failure on the part of the state for the average guy to truly understand the benefits provided by Bitcoin.

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September 12, 2020, 05:40:17 PM
 #39

I would say Bitcoin is the better bet here, especially for the long-term. Unlike BTC, central bank digital currencies  can easily be artificially be devalued by powers with ulterior motives. It makes better sense to invest in decentralized currencies like BTC.

True, but how many people are going to be able to see through the attempts of governments to deceive them? Governments are seeing that this market is not going to disappear and that they do not have the weapons to destroy it, so they are doing the next best thing which is to try to subvert it, they are going to release their own coins so they can deceive people to adopt them and think that they have a new form of money that is better than their fiat.

But the truth is that those coins are going to be even worse than their fiat, a centralized cryptocurrency is the opposite of what Satoshi Nakamoto was trying to achieve and instead of bringing us freedom it will give total power to governments.

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September 13, 2020, 11:42:08 AM
 #40

I would say Bitcoin is the better bet here, especially for the long-term. Unlike BTC, central bank digital currencies  can easily be artificially be devalued by powers with ulterior motives. It makes better sense to invest in decentralized currencies like BTC.

True, but how many people are going to be able to see through the attempts of governments to deceive them? Governments are seeing that this market is not going to disappear and that they do not have the weapons to destroy it, so they are doing the next best thing which is to try to subvert it, they are going to release their own coins so they can deceive people to adopt them and think that they have a new form of money that is better than their fiat.

But the truth is that those coins are going to be even worse than their fiat, a centralized cryptocurrency is the opposite of what Satoshi Nakamoto was trying to achieve and instead of bringing us freedom it will give total power to governments.

Yes using a CBDC just seems like a horrible option and will only allow states to monitor your activities more efficiently and  this is completely contrary to why most people use Bitcoin today . You are better off using plain cash.

That being said i still feel that if a State forces their CBDC down the throats of people either through incentives ( airdropped money/ state subsidies etc) or threats  ( would depend on the country as to what method is used) a lot of people will just end up giving in and using the CBDC.

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