Nano Ledger S Seed and Nano Ledger S Recovery

[jerry0]

Hey all.  As some of you know in my previous thread, my nano ledger S did not turn on anymore and I was out of the country and did not have my seed.  I recently came back to the US and do have a new ledger nano s and have to look for the recovery seed.



Now can someone tell me the exact instructions to do this? 



The first thing I said was... when i first connect it to my laptop, should i immediately restore with my seed... or should i create a new seed and a new account so to speak... then i just writer that new seed down anyways and a new pin... then intentionally put the wrong pin three times to reset the device... then enter my old seed... to recover my coins from my not working old nano ledger s?  I say this because in case my nano ledger s was tampered somehow... then creating a new seed and putting wrong pin three times reset the device... then from now on... anything i do whether its restore an old seed or create a new seed... well that would be safe?




There is no harm in taking this step right?  Now after I do this... when i connect the new nano ledger so to my laptop, do I need ledger live opened during the recovery process?  I don't believe so right?  Thus everytime is typed on the nano ledger s physically with those buttons while connected to my laptop?



Now... in this recovery process... do i need to create a brand new pin?  My old pin is useless right?  But it would ask me to create a brand new pin before i enter my old nano ledger s seed?  Would it be fine typing in my old pin for this or better securitywise to do a new one?



Now after i type in the last word of the seed, i click next right?  Now if its correct, I assume it will show a check mark and confirm?  But if not, what will it show?  Also if it shows correct, then I open ledger live and it would then show the coins there?  Or would i need to create a new ledger live account for this?  I assume not right since its the same seed? 


But I need to open ledger live for it to show the amount of coins i have right?



Can someone tell me in simple steps on doing this process?  I'm very nervous now so wanted to ask all this before I do the process.


Thanks.

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

Hey all.  As some of you know in my previous thread, my nano ledger S did not turn on anymore and I was out of the country and did not have my seed.  I recently came back to the US and do have a new ledger nano s and have to look for the recovery seed.
tldr;

Find the seed and just follow the steps of restore ledger wallet. Their website should have instructions. If you have your seeds okay then you are fine.

EditL I should be saying restore. Anyway, the complete instructions are here
https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/360005434914-Restore-from-recovery-phrase

[Lucius]

The first thing I said was... when i first connect it to my laptop, should i immediately restore with my seed... or should i create a new seed and a new account so to speak...

Since you are not an expert who will disassemble the device and check all the components to check their authenticity, all you have to do is connect the new Nano S and select the recovery option/that you already have a seed - and enter that same seed into your new device. There is no need to reset the new device.

do I need ledger live opened during the recovery process?  I don't believe so right?

You do not need Ledger Live or any other interface, the seed is entered exclusively via hardware wallet buttons.

Now... in this recovery process... do i need to create a brand new pin?  My old pin is useless right?  But it would ask me to create a brand new pin before i enter my old nano ledger s seed?  Would it be fine typing in my old pin for this or better securitywise to do a new one?

You can set your old PIN or choose new, your old PIN is in no way related to seed words.

Now after i type in the last word of the seed, i click next right?  Now if its correct, I assume it will show a check mark and confirm?  But if not, what will it show?  Also if it shows correct, then I open ledger live and it would then show the coins there?  Or would i need to create a new ledger live account for this?  I assume not right since its the same seed?  

I am not sure if Nano S will ask you to confirm some words from your seed since you are just making recovery, but when you done with recovery process just open Ledger Live and download coin apps you want via Ledger Live manager.

Can someone tell me in simple steps on doing this process?  I'm very nervous now so wanted to ask all this before I do the process.

It is a process that can be done in less than 10 minutes (I say this from personal experience), and there is no need for nervousness or paranoia. On the link posted by BitcoinGirl.Club you even have a video tutorial, everything is clearly shown.

[jerry0]

Hi well i cannot disassemble the device.  But is there any harm is creating a new seed with a new pin for the new account, then put wrong pin three times to reset it... just in case?  Like if it was somehow tampered... well at least creating a new seed might do something to it as oppose to first thing I do is enter my old seed?


But it will ask me to create a new pin before I enter my recovery phrase right?



Well I wanted to know what happens on the screen right after i type in the last word in my seed... so I won't get any surprises.  Like does it show check mark which goes okay the seed is correct.  I already have ledger live on my laptop though?  It has the accounts already added previously.  The only thing is I have not updated ledger live in a while.  But the moment I open ledger live... after the recovery process, it should show my coins like normal?  For example right now if i was to open ledger live, I open program, then enter my ledger live password, then i see my coins.  I do the same right after recovery right and coins will be there?



I have done this process before a while back with electrum and that was not an issue with my electrum seed.



But I never tested my nano ledger s seed... which is why I'm nervous.  



So it's like after i type in the last word of my seed then click okay or next... I wanted to know like what is the first thing the screen shows when its confirmed correct or not not correct etc.



Thanks.

[Lucius]

Hi well i cannot disassemble the device.  But is there any harm is creating a new seed with a new pin for the new account, then put wrong pin three times to reset it... just in case?  Like if it was somehow tampered... well at least creating a new seed might do something to it as oppose to first thing I do is enter my old seed?

Resetting the device after generating a new seed will not help if someone has messed with what is inside the device - this is only necessary if you buy a used device that already has a pregenerated seed.

Well I wanted to know what happens on the screen right after i type in the last word in my seed... so I won't get any surprises.  Like does it show check mark which goes okay the seed is correct.  I already have ledger live on my laptop though?  It has the accounts already added previously.  The only thing is I have not updated ledger live in a while.  But the moment I open ledger live... after the recovery process, it should show my coins like normal?  For example right now if i was to open ledger live, I open program, then enter my ledger live password, then i see my coins.  I do the same right after recovery right and coins will be there?

Whether the device asks you to confirm a few seed words after input or not is completely irrelevant - but if you look video from link, it will not ask you to confirm anything - your device will be ready for use. As I write in post above, you will still need to add coin apps via Ledger Live manager - since your new Nano S need them to communicates with Ledger Live or Electrum.

But I never tested my nano ledger s seed... which is why I'm nervous.  

Until you do the recovery you will not know if you have the correct seed, so instead of asking the same questions over and over again, get to work and do what needs to be done.

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

Talking about tempering the device. How it works? @Lucius

If someone really can manipulate a device and it gives the same seed after resetting then there is something to worry about it. The whole hardware wallet industry will be at question I guess.

[jerry0]

Okay so wouldn't it not hurt... creating a new seed twice before restoring it if you say the same seed shows up twice?


Example activate it like its a new device.  Put in a new pin and it gives the seed.  Then enter it wrong three times to reset it.  Then activate like a new device to get a completely new seed and put in new pin.  Then enter it wrong three times to reset it.


Now.. put in the old nano ledger s phrase and see if it restores the coins from the old nano ledger.  Would that anyway help?  You say if its tampered, nothing matters... but doing this... you could see if generating a new seed twice... could test if it gives you the same seed?  Again i want to reset it before i put in my old seed to try. 

[khaled0111]

But I never tested my nano ledger s seed... which is why I'm nervous.  

Don't be. Creating a new wallet or recovering a new one on Ledger is a straightforward process.

But it will ask me to create a new pin before I enter my recovery phrase right?

That's correct, the first thing you have to do is to set a pin for your wallet.

Well I wanted to know what happens on the screen right after i type in the last word in my seed... so I won't get any surprises.  Like does it show check mark which goes okay the seed is correct.

If you enter a valid seed, after validating the last word, your device will automtically detect it and will show something like "processing". If you see this it means recovering your wallet was successful.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Would that anyway help?  You say if its tampered, nothing matters... but doing this... you could see if generating a new seed twice... could test if it gives you the same seed?  Again i want to reset it before i put in my old seed to try.

It will make no difference.

Once you initialize the device for the first time and update it using Ledger Live, Ledger Live verifies that the device is genuine. Any tampering with the device would have to be sophisticated enough to bypass Ledger's verification process (no such tampering is known to exist), and therefore would be more than sophisticated enough to bypass you resetting the device a couple of times.

Similarly, even if someone had managed to program it to spit out the same seed phrase every time, that makes no difference to you since you are not going to use the seed phrase it generates, but rather import your own.

If you want to reset it a couple of times because it will make you feel better then go ahead, no harm will come of it, but you won't actually be achieving anything.

[jerry0]

Hey all.  So i connected the new nano ledger so to my laptop.  I decided to just create a new seed.  I put in a new pin and wrote down the new seed... but of course i wont need this one since i just did it to set it up first... then reset it.


So right now... should i enter my pin wrong three times to reset it?  But i could also go to settings in my nano ledger s and click on reset all?  Both does the same thing?


Then once I do this, scroll for recovery and type in my old nano ledger S seed correct?  Im going very slowly with this and not wanting to make any single mistake and precaution.

[jerry0]

Would that anyway help?  You say if its tampered, nothing matters... but doing this... you could see if generating a new seed twice... could test if it gives you the same seed?  Again i want to reset it before i put in my old seed to try.

It will make no difference.

Once you initialize the device for the first time and update it using Ledger Live, Ledger Live verifies that the device is genuine. Any tampering with the device would have to be sophisticated enough to bypass Ledger's verification process (no such tampering is known to exist), and therefore would be more than sophisticated enough to bypass you resetting the device a couple of times.

Similarly, even if someone had managed to program it to spit out the same seed phrase every time, that makes no difference to you since you are not going to use the seed phrase it generates, but rather import your own.

If you want to reset it a couple of times because it will make you feel better then go ahead, no harm will come of it, but you won't actually be achieving anything.

To add to my last post... after I did this, I removed my nano ledger s from my laptop.  I then opened ledger live and put in the ledger live password, and well you do see the old nano ledger coins as you expect since i been checking the ledger live app every few days to see if my coins are there and it is.  I also then right updated ledger live to the latest update... i haven't done so in a while.


So right on ledger live updated, I see my old nano ledger coins as usual.



So right now... close ledger live?  Then connect my ledger nano s to my laptop... and after typing in correct pin... then go to options to reset device right?  Or just intentionally put pin wrong three times?


Then look for the option of recovery phrase?  Then type in my old nano ledger S seed right?  Then it would show processing... then if correct it would say okay.  Then open ledger live and put ledger live password and then it would show my old nano coins like usual and my new nano ledger s connected to it?


Because right now... i should not have ledger live opened... then connect my new nano ledger so it with the right pin right?  Because if i do... then wouldn't it show my new nano ledger s and all the old nano ledger s coins gone?



Thus i want right now whenever i open ledger live, it show the old coins i have in my old nano ledger s?





Okay i know im taking this very very slow.



Also there is no point of me resetting it once... then create a new seed to make sure the second seed that this nano ledger s generates doesn't generate the exact same seed as the first seed right?  Is there any harm in it?

[o_e_l_e_o]

So right now... close ledger live?  Then connect my ledger nano s to my laptop... and after typing in correct pin... then go to options to reset device right?  Or just intentionally put pin wrong three times?

It makes no difference, both achieve the same thing.

Because if i do... then wouldn't it show my new nano ledger s and all the old nano ledger s coins gone?

It doesn't matter what Ledger Live shows. Your coins are not stored on Ledger Live. Your coins are not even stored on your Ledger Nano. All it stores are your keys. If you have the correct seed phrase, you can always recover your coins, even if you uninstall and reinstall Ledger Live.

Also there is no point of me resetting it once... then create a new seed to make sure the second seed that this nano ledger s generates doesn't generate the exact same seed as the first seed right?  Is there any harm in it?

No, there is no harm but also no real benefit.

You are massively over thinking this. Just update to the latest firmware, reset the device, and recover your seed phrase.

[HCP]

You are massively over thinking this.

Quote for truth...

Seriously jerry0, it's good that you're being cautious, but you are wayyyyyyyyyyyy overthinking all this. Just follow the instructions on the Ledger website (or that came with the device) to restore your device.

Refer: https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/360005434914-Restore-from-recovery-phrase


After you have reset the device (or the very first time you plug it in), it'll give you the "Welcome to Ledger Nano S" screen with the "Restore from recovery phrase" option, simply select that, enter your 24 word seed and you're set.

That's all there is to it.

[jerry0]

Hi yes i overthink a lot about this.  Again this device always got me nervous. 


So right now while not having ledger live opened, connect my ledger so to my laptop, put correct pin... then go to settings and click reset all right?


Again, yes im taking very very slow with this.

[jerry0]

So right now.



Close ledger live


Connect new ledger s to my laptop - enter correct pin - then go to options and click reset device


Then look for option to recovery phrase?  Click on that and it will tell me to type in my old nano ledger s seed right?  I remember you told me there was an option to check if you recovery phrase was correct but that is not it right?  Its something you need to download install?


Then once i type in the old seed just wait.


Then assuming its correct, open ledger live and it will show the same coins?




These are the exact steps I have to do now right?  Thank you.

[o_e_l_e_o]

How to reset your device: https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/360017582434

Connect your Ledger, type in the PIN, choose to Settings -> Security -> Reset all.

Once you've done that, how to restore from your recovery phrase: https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/360005434914

Reconnect Ledger, choose Restore from recovery phrase, enter new PIN, confirm new PIN, enter your seed phrase.

You can do all that with Ledger Live closed. Once you've done all that, open Ledger Live, connect up your device, and set up your accounts.

[jerry0]

Is it fine using the same pin as the old nano ledger s?


Also im typing my words now.  I notice after i type like the first two letters of each word, you see words appear and then you right button click it until you find it?  I thought you had to manually type each letter of each word?  Can anyone here confirm this is how it is?  I thought you had to manually type each letter of each word in the whole seed?

[o_e_l_e_o]

Is it fine using the same pin as the old nano ledger s?

Yes.

Can anyone here confirm this is how it is?

This is normal.

[jerry0]

Okay im freaked out right now.  As im typing in my seed for all the words, as i went halfway or so, one of the words i wrote down the first two letter, it does not show the exact word for that number.


Does this mean my seed is incorrect?  I am pretty sure i wrote it correctly and even wrote it twice.  

[HCP]

Also im typing my words now.  I notice after i type like the first two letters of each word, you see words appear and then you right button click it until you find it?  I thought you had to manually type each letter of each word?  Can anyone here confirm this is how it is?  I thought you had to manually type each letter of each word in the whole seed?

They did that to speed up the recovery process. Saves a LOT of clicking

Okay im freaked out right now.  As im typing in my seed for all the words, as i went halfway or so, one of the words i wrote down the first two letter, it does not show the exact word for that number.

Does this mean my seed is incorrect?  I am pretty sure i wrote it correctly and even wrote it twice.  

Have you checked if that word is in the BIP39 wordlist? Refer: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0039/english.txt

If it isn't, you wrote the word down incorrectly.

Can you keep typing in letters? or can you only select words at this point?