Government can seize company reserve Bitcoin?

[GreatArkansas]

About the recent trend on Bitcoin which some companies started to buy Bitcoins and make it as the company's reserve. Recent was the Square company.

So my purpose of this thread is to talk about the companies that have Bitcoin as company reserve.

Is the government can seize or they have the right for those Bitcoins they bought? If ever there will be some serious violations on the low for any companies that owns Bitcoin as company reserve?


Here, we can see some of the companies that already owned Bitcoin : Bitcoin Treasuries in Publicly Traded Companies

[hd49728]

If one stock investor decides to make investment into stock of a company because it starts or has bitcoin investment or has part of company reserve in bitcoin, that investor is totally make bad decision.

I don't know how government can seize bitcoin (it is impossible). Governments can only arrest company owners and take their bitcoin private keys. It is not direct way to seize bitcoin reserve.

Your questions reminds that bitcoiners must choose non custodial wallets to use and to store their bitcoin investment. Rely on other companies for bitcoin investment or use custodial wallet is bad and probably brings troublesome.

[Fundamentals Of]

Why the questions?

1. Bitcoin is unseizable.
2. Of course they have the full rights over the Bitcoins they legally acquired, and out of their own legally-acquired money. Bitcoin is unlike fiat and other things which cannot really be owned. The Bitcoins that they own are 100% theirs. They have total control and ownership of their Bitcoins.
3. If there were violations then these companies must have already be warned or asked not to get involved with it.

[DdmrDdmr]

<…>

I figure the scenario here is to be interpreted from a legal standpoint. As such, corporate reserves in Bitcoin should logically only be held where it is clearly supported by the regulations, and I figure that those on the list of Bitcoin Treasuries in in Public Traded Companies has got that covered (the list has expanded from six entries in your other post, to fifteen now). Besides that, corporations are submitted to procedures, as I figure MicroStrategy’s Form 8-K filling pursues. Corporations lacking that legal framework, that venture to hold some of their reserves in Bitcoin, may be exposing themselves to unnecessary risks.

The Bitcoins acquired need to also be of legal nature in origin, otherwise they’re viable to being seized. Now if a given country were to declare Bitcoin illegal overnight (worst case scenario), one would expect that the corporations could liquidate their Bitcoin reserves in a speedy manner, avoiding being accused of illegal tenancy. A bit far-fetched though if the regulations are properly founded and assessed, but not all countries are alike in that sense.

[mk4]

1. Bitcoin is unseizable.

It's only unseizable in a way that the government wouldn't even know that you have bitcoin if you take your privacy seriously; that, or you could make some excuse that you've lost your bitcoin one way or another(see: boating accident).

As for these public companies though? Knowing that needed to publicize their bitcoin purchases? The bitcoin is "unseizable" until the government threatens to fine them or put them to jail.

[mezzaluna]

About the recent trend on Bitcoin which some companies started to buy Bitcoins and make it as the company's reserve. Recent was the Square company.

So my purpose of this thread is to talk about the companies that have Bitcoin as company reserve.

Is the government can seize or they have the right for those Bitcoins they bought? If ever there will be some serious violations on the low for any companies that owns Bitcoin as company reserve?


Here, we can see some of the companies that already owned Bitcoin : Bitcoin Treasuries in Publicly Traded Companies

That is some bad news. They are just straight up robbed of their finances. Its possible for the government to step up if they are within Government property since they can seize foreign or unknown items BUT Bitcoin is a currency within the Internet. It just sounds like they know what is happening and straight up robbed them. That also depends on the type of government they are running within their country. A communist state might be the worst kind to have Bitcoin (imo).

[mk4]

That is some bad news. They are just straight up robbed of their finances. Its possible for the government to step up if they are within Government property since they can seize foreign or unknown items BUT Bitcoin is a currency within the Internet. It just sounds like they know what is happening and straight up robbed them. That also depends on the type of government they are running within their country. A communist state might be the worst kind to have Bitcoin (imo).

Who robbed who? Nothing happened yet. OP was just asking a hypothetical question. The BitcoinTreasury website only shows the current public companies that allocated some of their cash on bitcoin; it's not a list of amounts of bitcoin that the government stole lol.

[avikz]

About the recent trend on Bitcoin which some companies started to buy Bitcoins and make it as the company's reserve. Recent was the Square company.

So my purpose of this thread is to talk about the companies that have Bitcoin as company reserve.

Is the government can seize or they have the right for those Bitcoins they bought? If ever there will be some serious violations on the low for any companies that owns Bitcoin as company reserve?


Here, we can see some of the companies that already owned Bitcoin : Bitcoin Treasuries in Publicly Traded Companies

Government can seize anything from a company - be it their real estate or even bitcoin under the appropriate section of the law. However, such kind of thing only happens if a company violates some serious laws or fails to pay back its lenders. Since bitcoins are kept as a reserve cash, that's seizeable too because these bitcoins are classified as "assets" in the books!

[Upgrade00]

Is the government can seize or they have the right for those Bitcoins they bought? If ever there will be some serious violations on the low for any companies that owns Bitcoin as company reserve?

The first question has been answered already, and I agree with the other suggestions, legally it is possible to seize assets owned by a company, in such cases the company directors cannot hide behind plausible deniability, but can deny being in control of the bitcoins at that point, although this would need a lot of covering up as I guess the cold storage address would be recorded in their books even though they're not public.

On the second question, it would depend on the adoption of Bitcoin and the countries those companies are registered in. Although, the decentralized nature of Bitcoin gives such companies a lot of wiggle room.

[imteaz]

I think, Govt will  never seize any company just because their reserve is crypto currenices. It has to do with other factors, such as money laundaring, fraud, etc However, you can not answer this queston as Govt will always find some way to nail you down. Specially, If the company belong to USA, then yes they might seize your crypto assets.

[Gozie51]

Government can't seize your coin rather they can ban and restrict the use or acquisition of it in that country. If you have coins already in your wallet before a ban or seizure exercise, it will still remain in your wallet and you can make use of it if you leave that country. That is saying the seizure can only be effective if you still in the country. That is for an individual but the government can seize a company's asset if they have gone against the rule of the country.

[Asuspawer09]

Definitely, the government cannot just seize these bitcoins as long as owning bitcoin in their country is legal. Having something illegal in the companies could turn out differently though. Companies could do whatever they want so having a bitcoin as reserved is not gonna be a problem.

But it seems risky buying or using bitcoin as a company, that might be a big profit at some point but could also go wrong in the future. A lot of unexpected things could happen who knows if bitcoin is going to be the future of currency it could be something that is more high-tech than bitcoin could emerge.

[DarkDays]

I do not think that the governments will give themselves the right to seize company's reserves of BTC. This in itself will be a massive violation of the law and put a lot of investors at risk, and I don't think governments will want to thread on that at all.

While they could bring forward accusations that companies only did it to escape corporation tax etc but the evidence that they'll seize their BTC funded reserves is immutable.

What I think the governments are thinking about is how to respond to this, and it seems that one way the British government at least is working out is how to join this crypto momentum, in particular creating a central reserve of crypto (source here).
Now that's an interesting feed to keep a close eye on.

[Twentyonepaylots]

1. Bitcoin is unseizable.

As much as I think of bitcoin as only powered by fiat, government can seize bitcoin as it is stated one's company's asset, again it is a fiat in form of digital currency.

2. Of course they have the full rights over the Bitcoins they legally acquired, and out of their own legally-acquired money. Bitcoin is unlike fiat and other things which cannot really be owned. The Bitcoins that they own are 100% theirs. They have total control and ownership of their Bitcoins.

" Bitcoin cannot be really owned" I think you are confuse with bitcoin not being a tangible so you called it that way. But in reality they own it as you have said they also have the full right over their owned bitcoin.

3. If there were violations then these companies must have already be warned or asked not to get involved with it.

Depends on the degree, if it is crime related let's say fraud or scam, then I guess government will take what they legally own for investigation.

[stompix]

I don't know how government can seize bitcoin (it is impossible). Governments can only arrest company owners and take their bitcoin private keys. It is not direct way to seize bitcoin reserve.

1. Bitcoin is unseizable.

Government can't seize your coin

Definitely, the government cannot just seize these bitcoins as long as owning bitcoin in their country is legal.

You realize that the US has already seized thousands of bitcoins till now and even sold them in auctions, right?

Is the government can seize or they have the right for those Bitcoins they bought? If ever there will be some serious violations on the low for any companies that owns Bitcoin as company reserve?

If the judge decides so, depending on the reason why the yes, everything will be seized, take for example Madoff case when houses in France were seized also, if the coins are listed as an asset they will be seized with no much hassle, but first there must be a reason for it. For the second part, if BTC becomes illegal it will have to be though a law, a legal amendment, and in the new regulation banning ownership of crypto, there will be all the details of what companies or investment funds that held till that point cryptos fully legally should do or are obliged to do from now on.

[Pffrt]

I think it depends on the country's policy on cryptocurrency. If crypto is legal there, there's no way they can seize the bitcoin unless they are investing in BTC in illegal way or to avoid the taxes. Company has their right to make investment decision and if the investment is okay with country laws and regulations, they can't seize BTC. They can only look for the total holding with BTC when there will be tax calculation for the company.

[20kevin20]

Authorities do not have any backdoor or access to your wallet. Your bank could be ordered to close or freeze your account - the choice and necessary power is at the authority's tip of the finger. But as long as your gov knows you're holding cryptocurrencies as an individual/company and they want to take it away from you, good luck getting away from that.

As long as the laws allow them to seize an asset from you and they feel like it's necessary to do so, no matter if the asset is decentralized or not.. it's going to happen.

[serjent05]

We are talking about a company here and this company for sure is legally bound.  If the government sees that these companies are doing illegal activities, then for sure they have the authority, if given by the court, to seize any company's asset and that includes the company's Bitcoin reserve.

[Oilacris]

About the recent trend on Bitcoin which some companies started to buy Bitcoins and make it as the company's reserve. Recent was the Square company.
So my purpose of this thread is to talk about the companies that have Bitcoin as company reserve.
Is the government can seize or they have the right for those Bitcoins they bought? If ever there will be some serious violations on the low for any companies that owns Bitcoin as company reserve?

Seizing it literrally: NO
Making some issues: YES

We know that government can really fuck up everybody when it comes to legal matters and for this issue then theres no way government can seize out a companies reserve in bitcoin.

Unless if they do had some problems about taxes and other obligations then they would really be sued out and will face up charges or violations which will really be penalized
but on literal side of things where those holdings converted cant really be stolen or confiscate out.

[pixie85]

They can't take it from you but they can make you give it anyway. That's their power.

If a company wants to operate legally it has to report all their purchases for tax purposes. The Bitcoin purchase will be there - on paper. If they go bankrupt or became liable for something the authorities can demand they pay a fine or compensate other parties and then they'll have to sell their coins to cover that or have their homes put on auction.

You can have private coins stashed somewhere. They won't be able to get them but they'll take everything else from you and then you'll have to sell your bitcoins to buy food and pay your bills.