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Author Topic: [ANN] bitsburg - Peer-to-Peer (P2P) Bitcoin Trading  (Read 301 times)
bitsburgIO
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October 19, 2020, 06:06:05 PM
Last edit: October 21, 2020, 05:21:35 PM by bitsburgIO
Merited by Coolcryptovator (2)
 #1


Buy and sell Bitcoin on an exchange that respects your privacy.

✔️ Peer-to-Peer (P2P)
✔️ Low fees and high limits
✔️ A variety of payment methods and currencies
✔️ Local and worldwide trade partners
✔️ Escrow to protect your coins and money
✔️ Anonymous, no identity verification (no KYC)
✔️ Feedback system
✔️ Shared wallet
✔️ Simple, clean and secure
✔️ Earn money (affiliate program)

Peer-to-Peer (P2P) Bitcoin Trading

bitsburg is a global Peer-to-Peer (P2P) Bitcoin Trading platform. Simply browse offers or post your own to buy Bitcoin from or sell Bitcoin to other users with low fees and high limits. Choose from a variety of payment methods (including Cash, Bank transfer, Money transfer, Online Wallet, Cryptocurrency, Debit Card, Gift Card and Goods) and currencies. Find trade partners near you or worldwide to communicate and trade with them Peer-To-Peer while we act as escrow to protect your coins and money.

Stay anonymous

Stay healthy, stay at home if necessary, but also stay anonymous. Cryptocurrencies are not meant to be regulated which is why we don't ask you to verify your identity (no KYC) unlike most other exchanges do. You may come up with a pseudonym and can build up a good reputation with the help of our feedback system.

Shared wallet

bitsburg also comes with a shared wallet functionality. Although we suggest not keeping too much funds in a web wallet you can also receive and send payments using our platform. When sending Bitcoin from a shared wallet they are not necessarily sent from your own address which makes it hard to trace you and thus is a real alternative to mixing services.

Security focused

We try our best to improve our platform by adding new features while also providing a simple and clean interface. Nonetheless, our main focus is security. We always keep all our software up-to-date and use the latest technologies as well as established methods to protect your funds. Our developers are experienced in security vulnerabilities and the biggest parts of funds is kept in different coldwallets.

Earn money

You are not a trader? No problem. You can still earn money on bitsburg by taking part in the affiliate program. By doing so you help us growing which everyone in the cryptospace can profit from and thus we give you back a part of the revenue in return.



Compare

Our goal is to provide an alternative to big players such as LocalBitcoins and Paxful which both come with a lot of restrictions and recently also KYC.

bitsburgLocalBitcoinsPaxful

Blocked regions

None

New York, Russia

New York

Deposit altcoins

Via CoinSwitch

Only BTC

BTC and USDT

Withdrawal fees

₿0.0004 to external wallets, internal transactions are free

Depends on the current usage rate of the Bitcoin blockchain

Up to ₿0.0005 to external wallets, up to 1% for internal transactions

Deposit fees

None

Varies on how congested the Bitcoin blockchain is

None

Limits

USD1,000,000 per trade

USD1,000 in total without KYC

USD10,000 per trade

Local trades

Yes

No

Yes

Know Your Customer (KYC)

No

Phone verification, address verification and identity verification

Phone verification, address verification and identity verification

Required bond

No

No

₿0.1

Coin Locking

To prevent coin lockers, sellers decide when they fund a trade and thus who they want to trade with

Immediately

Immediately



Links

Website: https://www.bitsburg.io/
Discord: https://discord.gg/NkUFfWs
Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/user/bitsburgIO
Telegram: https://telegram.me/bitsburg



We kindly ask you to refrain from scam accusations only because we are a new project and/or anonymous. We're trying to build trust in these early stages and should you have any question for which you can't find the answer in the Frequently Asked Questions, post them here or get in touch with us via our contact form or community channels.

You don't have to make a deposit to publish offers, so feel free to try it out. It doesn't cost you anything but you might find new trade partners and thus profit from our service. Especially now that Russia blocked LocalBitcoins once again, our platform could become very useful for many people.
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October 23, 2020, 03:37:28 PM
Merited by LoyceV (6)
 #2

✔️ Escrow to protect your coins and money
Care to explain in detail how the escrow system works on your platform?
- I couldn't find anything on your "FAQ" page.

How can I trust you if I don't know who you are?

You probably also don't know who Satoshi Nakamoto is but still you trust Bitcoin, don't you? We believe that we don't necessary have to do without anonymity to build trust. In cryptospace it is important to put trust into projects themselves rather than putting trust in the people behind those.
~Snipped~
IMHO, trusting a crypto-currency and its creator is way different than trusting an unknown team behind a platform that deals with users' money.

Why is the deposit/withdrawal taking so long?

Like on most platforms we require a certain amount of confirmations before we count your deposit as completed. This is a necessary step to prevent double spends.
That certain amount is how many exactly?

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October 23, 2020, 06:43:39 PM
 #3

Thank you for your questions.

Care to explain in detail how the escrow system works on your platform?
- I couldn't find anything on your "FAQ" page.
When a new trade starts the buyer and the seller can first communicate with each other. As long as the trade is not funded by the seller a warning is shown to the buyer suggesting not to make the payment yet. If both parties agree with the trade conditions the seller can fund the trade whereby the Bitcoin amount requested by the buyer gets locked. Once this happened the seller can't cancel the trade anymore. In the next step the buyer has to make the payment and mark the trade as paid. Now the seller can release the Bitcoin to the buyer. The buyer can still cancel the trade or in case of a conflict a dispute can be opened by both parties to invite a moderator who will help clarifying the situation.

We will definitely add this to the FAQ.

IMHO, trusting a crypto-currency and its creator is way different than trusting an unknown team behind a platform that deals with users' money.
We hope that our customres can understand why it's important for us to stay anonymous and we know that it makes it hard building trust. Trust is something we have to earn over the next months and years. As stated in the FAQ we suggest not keeping more BTC in the wallet than needed to complete a specific trade. This is a golden rule that applies to all exchanges, including bitsburg. What makes bitsburg different than exchanges like LocalBitcoins and Paxful is that you only need BTC in your wallet if you want to fund a trade while browsing and posting offers as well as starting trades is always possible.

That certain amount is how many exactly?

Currently we wait for 3 confirmations. We will add this to the FAQ, too.
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October 23, 2020, 09:31:25 PM
 #4

Who is holding private keys for addresses generated and used on your website?
I guess you have the full control, but you tell us we should be our own banks Smiley

Closed source website that you been working for long time like you say, but purchased domain only few days ago does not look so trustwothy.

Quote
Domain Name: BITSBURG.IO
Registry Domain ID: D503300001183888401-LRMS
Registrar WHOIS Server: whois.namecheap.com
Registrar URL: www.namecheap.com
Updated Date: 2020-10-14T15:12:59Z
Creation Date: 2020-04-21T17:04:38Z
Registry Expiry Date: 2021-04-21T17:04:38Z
Registrar Registration Expiration Date:
https://www.whois.com/whois/bitsburg.io

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LoyceV
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October 24, 2020, 08:29:32 AM
 #5

How can I trust you if I don't know who you are?

You probably also don't know who Satoshi Nakamoto is but still you trust Bitcoin, don't you? We believe that we don't necessary have to do without anonymity to build trust. In cryptospace it is important to put trust into projects themselves rather than putting trust in the people behind those.
~Snipped~
IMHO, trusting a crypto-currency and its creator is way different than trusting an unknown team behind a platform that deals with users' money.
You don't even have to trust Satoshi Nakamoto to trust Bitcoin. Even Satoshi himself can't steal my Bitcoins.

We kindly ask you to refrain from scam accusations only because we are a new project and/or anonymous.
That's not really encouraging.

Quote
We're trying to build trust in these early stages
So you know you have no reputation, and yet you're offering "to escrow" funds up to "USD1,000,000 per trade".
How can you convince me this isn't created to be an exit scam? There's no point using an escrow that isn't highly trusted by both parties.

We hope that our customres can understand why it's important for us to stay anonymous
I'd like you to explain to me why it's important for you to stay anonymous. I can think of several reasons myself, and none of them make you look good.

You may come up with a pseudonym and can build up a good reputation with the help of our feedback system.
How are you going to prevent trust farming? Both users were last active one second apart.

Every click on an offer or Feedback opens a new tab. That's annoying.

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October 24, 2020, 12:15:10 PM
 #6

Who is holding private keys for addresses generated and used on your website?
I guess you have the full control, but you tell us we should be our own banks Smiley
As stated on our home page we use a shared wallet for our users. That means that your balance isn't connected to a specific address. Would we give users access to the private keys, they could spend the bitcoins and still have the balance in their account to withdraw from other wallets. By telling you to be your own bank we ask you to not use our platform to hold big amount of Bitcoin.

Closed source website that you been working for long time like you say, but purchased domain only few days ago does not look so trustwothy.

Quote
Domain Name: BITSBURG.IO
Registry Domain ID: D503300001183888401-LRMS
Registrar WHOIS Server: whois.namecheap.com
Registrar URL: www.namecheap.com
Updated Date: 2020-10-14T15:12:59Z
Creation Date: 2020-04-21T17:04:38Z
Registry Expiry Date: 2021-04-21T17:04:38Z
Registrar Registration Expiration Date:
https://www.whois.com/whois/bitsburg.io

We started to work on the project nearly a year ago. A few months after we began development we registered the domain name. You might have mixed up the update and creation date here, the domain was created on April 21st which is a few months ago.

You don't even have to trust Satoshi Nakamoto to trust Bitcoin. Even Satoshi himself can't steal my Bitcoins.
People still put trust into his vision and bitsburg is our vision of a non-regulated and anonymous exchange. Our platform is an alternative to others which people learned to trust over the years. The next months will show if people put this trust in our project, too. Just think about all the anonymous mixing services where people also put trust into.

That's not really encouraging.
We noticed that most new projects, especially these who provide an anonymous service, get accused of planning a scam. Unfortunately, many people here are very toxic against new members and don't want to give them a chance. We are just asking for this chance.

So you know you have no reputation, and yet you're offering "to escrow" funds up to "USD1,000,000 per trade".
How can you convince me this isn't created to be an exit scam? There's no point using an escrow that isn't highly trusted by both parties.
We provide an alternative to other platforms with a lot of restrictions. The low maximum amount per trade is one restriction on other platforms. We don't ask anyone to complete such big trades on our platform, we also handle small transactions below $1. If you read our FAQ you will notice that we suggest our customers to not deposit a big amount of Bitcoin if not needed. As you clearly state, we're not highly trusted yet but that can change in the future after we handled a lot of small transactions first.

I'd like you to explain to me why it's important for you to stay anonymous. I can think of several reasons myself, and none of them make you look good
It's obvious that we have to stay anonymous to offer a service that doesn't require KYC, isn't it? Also keep in mind that our shared wallet functionality can be used to mix coins once there's enough traffic on our platform. Do you want to say that providing a privacy focused project automatically makes one not look good? There's so many people who are against KYC, we provide a solution. Isn't it only fair that both parties are allowed to protect their identity?

How are you going to prevent trust farming? Both users were last active one second apart.
There will always be those who farm/trade trust. This will surely happen on bitsburg as well as on other Peer-to-Peer exchanges. We're planning to add an additional trust flag for reputated members, for example for high ranked Bitcointalk members.

Every click on an offer or Feedback opens a new tab. That's annoying.
Thank you very much for your feedback. In this early stage we need as much feedback as possible. Waiting for more feedback now and then we might change this.
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October 24, 2020, 03:54:15 PM
 #7

People still put trust into his vision and bitsburg is our vision of a non-regulated and anonymous exchange.
You should really stop comparing yourself to Satoshi Wink

Quote
We noticed that most new projects, especially these who provide an anonymous service, get accused of planning a scam.
Why do you think that is? Many "projects" I've seen here are literally created to scam.

Quote
Unfortunately, many people here are very toxic against new members and don't want to give them a chance.
Calling people toxic in your third post is also something I've seen scammers do when someone calls them out. New users have to prove their trustworthyness, and even then I've seen several users exit scam the moment they had the chance.

Quote
Isn't it only fair that both parties are allowed to protect their identity?
If one of the parties is asking the other party to trust them, it seems reasonable to at least know who you're dealing with.

Quote
We're planning to add an additional trust flag for reputated members, for example for high ranked Bitcointalk members.
Please add a signed message from an old staked address if you do this. It's safe to assume anyone claiming to be me on any other platform isn't me!



From your terms:
Quote
If you find any link on our Website that is offensive for any reason, you are free to contact and inform us any moment.
I'm offended by this statement. Please remove it.

Quote
Nothing in this disclaimer will: limit or exclude our or your liability for death or personal injury
Why did you copy this from about half a million websites that use the same disclaimer? I don't think this is very useful to add.

Quote
exclude any of our or your liabilities that may not be excluded under applicable law
Which law (in which country) is applicable?

How are you going to charge a 1% trading fee if someone uses your platform to set up a P2P IRL sale (say for a million USD)?

GDPR Data Protection Rights
Why do you specifically mention a law made in the EUSSR?

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October 24, 2020, 04:32:04 PM
 #8

You should really stop comparing yourself to Satoshi Wink
We didn't ever compare us to Satoshi and it's also not our intention. We're sorry if you misunderstand something.

Why do you think that is? Many "projects" I've seen here are literally created to scam.
There's always scam projects, doesn't make all of them a scam. We don't see the problem kindly asking to refrain from baseless accusations.

Calling people toxic in your third post is also something I've seen scammers do when someone calls them out. New users have to prove their trustworthyness, and even then I've seen several users exit scam the moment they had the chance.
It's our experience on this forum and we're just being honest about a serious problem with new projects. The fact that you have personally seen scammers do something doesn't make everyone who does the exact same thing a scammer, does it? There's also non scammers who call others toxic.

We already agreed that we have to prove our trustworthyness but this will take time of course.

If one of the parties is asking the other party to trust them, it seems reasonable to at least know who you're dealing with.
We already stated why we must stay anonymous. Feel free to make suggestions on how to run a Peer-to-Peer exchange without asking for KYC if not staying anonymous.

Please add a signed message from an old staked address if you do this. It's safe to assume anyone claiming to be me on any other platform isn't me!
Will definitely add a verification process for this. Thank you for this suggestion.

I'm offended by this statement. Please remove it.
No clue what you're trying to tell us here.

Why did you copy this from about half a million websites that use the same disclaimer? I don't think this is very useful to add.
These are standard terms and we don't see how it could harm to have them.

Which law (in which country) is applicable?
Refers to the country the user lives in.

How are you going to charge a 1% trading fee if someone uses your platform to set up a P2P IRL sale (say for a million USD)?
Escrow also works with IRL sales. Of course, users can also complete these trades without escrow in which case we obviously don't charge the trading fee. Our platform is free to use if one just wants to find trade partners.

Why do you specifically mention a law made in the EUSSR?
You will find this on many websites, no matter where they are located. Again these are standard terms and it doesn't harm to have them.
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October 26, 2020, 05:53:07 PM
 #9

Here is My Honest Review:
The website Seems fine. it loaded smoothly and quickly. it has SSL certificate. so I'll give it a pass.
the Key features and comparison you've stated above and in the website are making it attractive too for new users, (I hope they are  actually as, as they stated)  there are 7 Registered users total so far. which is low comparing to the launch date of 19 OCT. but you can make it better with proper marketing and promotions.
I don't see any Twitter and Facebook links. so I would advise you to create them. and do some Social media marketing. you can run a signature campaign in this forum also to increase popularity.
I'll keep  an eye on your thread to follow the progress. I might join it sometime.
Best of Luck.
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October 27, 2020, 04:59:47 PM
Last edit: November 06, 2020, 01:27:21 PM by bitsburgIO
 #10

Thank you very much for your review!

We agree in all points. We'll definitely work on our marketing and promotions to gain more traffic. We're a rather small team at the moment, the more social/community channels we have to manage the more work it is and the slower we're able to respond. Currently we prefer to be represented on less platforms but offer better support. We're planing to hire an additional community manager though and then add more platforms such as Twitter and Facebook. Social media marketing is indeed interesting and we're currently also reviewing ad networks (Coinzilla, Cointraffic and bitmedia). A signature campaign is already planned, we're currently discussing it and reviewing different managers for it. We received a lot of requests concerning marketing, one of them is a reputated campaign manager on this forum. Hopefully we can work something out soon.

We're also thinking about airdrops and/or contests.

Edit: Signature campaign is live!
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November 07, 2020, 09:35:59 AM
 #11

A serious company will always make its company data public and accessible to a user. The website only shows the communication details. It could be a really easy way to make money and run away.
I also cannot understand Escrow service in these types of constructions. Maybe the operator can tell a bit more about her company and also publish this additional company data on the website.
When everything is legal, you have nothing to hide. By the way, if you search on Google for Bitsburg, you are nowhere. That is also not a good sign.

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November 07, 2020, 11:29:43 AM
 #12

Thank you for the feedback.

A serious company will always make its company data public and accessible to a user. The website only shows the communication details. It could be a really easy way to make money and run away.
I also cannot understand Escrow service in these types of constructions. Maybe the operator can tell a bit more about her company and also publish this additional company data on the website.
When everything is legal, you have nothing to hide.
This is basically the same concerns which have already been mentioned, so we can only give you the same answer again. One of the main reasons why we also stay anonymous is that we don't ask for identity verification (no KYC).

if you search on Google for Bitsburg, you are nowhere. That is also not a good sign.
It's not surprising. We're still at the beginning. We just started our signature campaign with Coolcryptovator yesterday. We're already planning the next promotion moves, so this will hopefully change soon.
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November 07, 2020, 07:28:56 PM
 #13

Thank you for the feedback.

A serious company will always make its company data public and accessible to a user. The website only shows the communication details. It could be a really easy way to make money and run away.
I also cannot understand Escrow service in these types of constructions. Maybe the operator can tell a bit more about her company and also publish this additional company data on the website.
When everything is legal, you have nothing to hide.
This is basically the same concerns which have already been mentioned, so we can only give you the same answer again. One of the main reasons why we also stay anonymous is that we don't ask for identity verification (no KYC).

if you search on Google for Bitsburg, you are nowhere. That is also not a good sign.
It's not surprising. We're still at the beginning. We just started our signature campaign with Coolcryptovator yesterday. We're already planning the next promotion moves, so this will hopefully change soon.

I think you don't have the right to be fully anonymous in managing a peer to peer platform unless you are using a decentralised code that has been verifed audits and reviews. I don't know Satoshi and i may not trust him in person but i trust the technology he took part to build, and as you are still at beginning how to verify and quickly trust your product if i don't even know who are you.


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November 08, 2020, 01:38:44 PM
Last edit: November 09, 2020, 07:18:03 PM by bitsburgIO
 #14

Thank you for your feedback!

I think you don't have the right to be fully anonymous in managing a peer to peer platform unless you are using a decentralised code that has been verifed audits and reviews. I don't know Satoshi and i may not trust him in person but i trust the technology he took part to build, and as you are still at beginning how to verify and quickly trust your product if i don't even know who are you.
We totally understand your concerns but, unfortunately, it's just the same in other words again. We already said that time will show whether people trust us or not. We're not begging for trust, we actually clearly stated in several posts and also in our FAQ that we're aware how hard it will be for us to build this trust. But this shall not be our biggest problem, we're patient.

Edit:
Keep in mind that creating an offer on our platform doesn't require making a deposit before unlike you must on Localbitcoins and Paxful. And using escrow is optional if both parties agree, though it's highly suggested to use it. This basically allows new users to try out our platform without the need to trust us.
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November 08, 2020, 05:27:18 PM
 #15

When I look at the comparison table with similar services, I am pleasantly surprised that this could be an alternative to localbitcoin. The only thing that bothers me is the service is brand new and not that many deals have run on the platform. But in whole it would suit me. In any case, I will remember the website and will keep an eye on it

JACS|JUST ANOTHER
COMMUNICATIONS
STACK
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November 09, 2020, 07:11:13 PM
 #16

Thank you!

The signature campaign already brings more attention and traffic to our site. We're now planning to launch other campaigns as well.
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November 16, 2020, 01:41:28 AM
 #17

Bitsburg P2P marketplace has some competitive difference from LocalBitcoins and Paxful:
- No KYC
- No bond
- The trade limit per trade is very high: the table in OP presents it is limited at $ 1,000,000 per trade

I don't understand that no bond and how the Bitsburg marketplace can protect traders (sellers and buyers) ?

The signature campaign already brings more attention and traffic to our site. We're now planning to launch other campaigns as well.
How long do you plan to run the Bitsburg campaign?

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November 16, 2020, 11:16:55 AM
Merited by Coolcryptovator (1)
 #18

The signature campaign already brings more attention and traffic to our site. We're now planning to launch other campaigns as well.
How long do you plan to run the Bitsburg campaign?
Coolcryptovator has received 0.43BTC funding to run the Bitsburg signature campaign.

10x Sr - 0.004x10 = 0.04
10x Hero / Legen 0.006x10 = 0.06

So the total per week spent is 0.1B (sorry if wrong)

So maybe this campaign will run in 4 weeks that hasn't been decided if the Bitsburg team extend back in this signature campaign.

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bitsburgIO
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November 16, 2020, 08:32:48 PM
 #19

Thank you for your questions.

I don't understand that no bond and how the Bitsburg marketplace can protect traders (sellers and buyers) ?
In addition to the trade amount needed for escrow, Paxful asks for a bond and locks it for a week. Although we understand that they only try to minimize the risk with certain payment methods, this bond is in no relation to the trade amount. We don't think we do our customers any good if we lock such a high of BTC for no reason.

What we do to protect sellers and buyers is offering an escrow system. User funds are stored in safe cold wallets.

How long do you plan to run the Bitsburg campaign?
$crypto$ is right about this. It will run for 4 weeks, then we do some analyzing and maybe we will run another one or another type of campaign.
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